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ArchangeI posted:Yeah but Tropers are the kind of authors who write to show their own intellectual superiority, and that includes sperging out about technology. It is ironic that they fail to see technology in SF as a storytelling tool rather than an end unto itself. "I'm really into world building" is the writing equivalent of being he ideas guy. A ton of Tropers just sit around making up details for things like hovering flatscreens or super strength but never asking what relevance those things have to their story or you know, actually writing the story.
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Sep 23, 2013 07:22
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Since we're talking dystopias, I went and looked up Margaret Atwood on TVTropes, figuring that there'd be an entertaining amount of  'Margaret Atwood was MEEEEEEEAN to science fiction!!!' What I found was ... interestingly different from what I'd expected.Looking at Oryx and Crake, the book involving all the , their 'Literature' page is actually pretty normal (ie dumb but unremarkable): http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Literature/OryxAndCrake?from=Main.OryxAndCrake ...and some of the tropers seem to like it. quote:Although it's being foreshadowed very explicitly all along, when the revelation comes, it still hits you like a punch in the gut and a kick in the nuts. Repetitively tautologous, and oddly assuming that all readers of one of the world's most popular feminist novelists must be in possession of testicles, but still, sounds like they like it. The most you get is in the YMMV bit, which is basically like the list of tropes on the Literature page only shorter: quote:Anvilicious: Playing God is not a good idea. 'Sci Fi Ghetto' is all the commentary that whole fracas gets. But their page on that is, as they would say, Unintentionally Hilarious: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SciFiGhetto quote:A lot of this has to do with snobbery. A (somewhat contradictory) perception about science fiction in general is that it is somehow both too complex for mainstream audiences with 'simple' tastes and yet simultaneously not literary and sophisticated enough for critics and academics. It's a pretty articulate and reasonable piece of writing, really. But dear author, if you recognise that formulaic rubbish and spergy sci-dumps are a bad thing, what are you doing on TVTropes? Run, run while you still can! Also, I had a look at Atwood's most famous dystopia, The Handmaid's Tale. Again, no , just a list of tropes. I guess tropes really do conquer all there. Including this one:quote:Happiness in Slavery: Some women like the lifestyle of a Handmaid. No. No they don't. This is unsupported by a single line of the text. Oh, TVTropes, don't stop sneaking in your creepy fantasies by the back door. (Or do, please.)
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Sep 23, 2013 08:52
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Apple Tree posted:No. No they don't. This is unsupported by a single line of the text. Oh, TVTropes, don't stop sneaking in your creepy fantasies by the back door. (Or do, please.) Shockingly enough, the Happiness in Slavery page isn't terrible, mostly by virtue of being very dry. The few examples tabs I opened do seem to follow the usual TVT law of "write huge weird rambly paragraphs about things you like," so you get big chunks about Warhammer 40K, the TARDIS in Doctor Who, and so on and so forth. There's also a reference to hypnotism-fetish porn under Web Originals, because of course there is. EDIT: And then I realized the page had a goddamn "Religion" tab, which has a few reasonable-enough Biblical examples and then this eminently tasteful paragraph: Stay classy, TVT posted:Some religions preach that submission and obedience to God is good and leads to happiness. Islam is perhaps most well-known for this. The word "Islam" comes from the root word "S-L-M", the word for peace, "salam" is derived from it. The common Arabic name Abdallah/Abdullah means "servant of God" or "slave of God". Let's explicitly throw devout followers of Islam (and, uh, the other religions of the book, but ignore that) onto the same trope page as Renfield and hypnotized sex slaves! That isn't creepy at all! Antivehicular fucked around with this message at 09:22 on Sep 23, 2013 |
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Sep 23, 2013 09:18
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Venusian Weasel posted:Tropers, it seems, aren't really comfortable with language, even if it's their own. The words of the trope make sense when applied here, but when I went to the trope page, I got the distinct feeling that the trope describes something completely different. Or maybe it isn't. The concept is so poorly worded I guess it can mean anything! Not a good thing when you're writing a dictionary of tropes!  HEGEL CURES THESES posted:Edit: That thread was a single page long, and I didn't see very much "flailing." Did she delete a lot of stuff? Sham bam bamina! fucked around with this message at 11:41 on Sep 23, 2013 |
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Sep 23, 2013 11:39
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Sham bam bamina! posted:Troper wants to turn a Norse saga into a steampunk YA novel. Flails desperately when she realizes that she'll need a miracle for it to not be poo poo, fails to take the hint and abandon her worthless idea. I think you may have missed this from that thread.  Pay attention to the username.
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Sep 23, 2013 12:02
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quote:To play devil's advocate for a moment, I can think of one positive expression associated with the Handmaids -- the minor Handmaid who is proud of having borne a (doomed) child to term. Then again, I can't remember if the positivity is expressed by the character herself, and even if it was, the satisfaction obviously came from successful childbearing making her life potentially less hideous and not any real happiness with her servitude. Janine, right? But no, that doesn't support the tropers' case. Janine's story runs: - Bullied and tormented in the Red Center until she breaks and starts blaming herself for being gang-raped. (Whether she was or not; Offred notes that it's wise to invent such stories, but that with Janine it might be true.) - Pregnant, and goes for a walk. Other Handmaids reckon that she's showing off, but it's the smugness of someone who's got a foothold over other equally oppressed women, in a mind that's already traumatised. - Has the baby. Ends the labour weeping helplessly. It seems healthy. Later is found not to be, and something unnamed happens to it. - Last seen at the Particicution, completely spaced-out and insane. So ... nah. Even the 'pride' is the pride of a confused and broken individual. The only alternative bit of happiness is when Offred, asked if she's happy by some passing tourists, says quietly 'Yes, we are very happy,' because she knows she'll be arrested and probably killed if she doesn't. So yay, happiness in slavery! Because check this out: this is what you get if you put 'slavery' into the TVTropes search:  Note the order. 'Happiness in Slavery' comes at the top of the list. And at number four. And at number seven. It's okay, there's no such thing as notability! 
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Sep 23, 2013 13:02
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Djeser posted:From a thread entitled 'Wizarding School - NOT a Harry Potter rip-off': In an effort to not rip-off Harry Potter, my work of terrible fiction shall instead, rip-off The Worst Witch in a hilarious demonstration of literary irony. Striking Yak posted:
This sums up the most basic problem with everything on TVTropes. That rule about notability could very well be re-written to be "There's no such thing as notability unless we can make references to whatever obscure anime bullshit we watched this week." Tropers are hugely reductionist in their approach to every work of fiction - not just because they're trying to reduce them down to a list of tropes with terribly witty names, but because they're almost always desperately trying to crowbar in something that they can use to link things to their favourite anime's page. Usually the one they created themselves and are now desperately trying to link (or wick, in troper parlance) to as many other things as possible so as to stroke their e-peen whenever they look at the 'Related' page. Which is why you have huge amounts of text devoted to describing the minutiae of life in Magical Girl Anime #68546 and huge amounts of time and space to discussing tropes relating about the height of socks/stockings in these things and articles about major works of actual literature tend to be short as well as poorly written. And why the trope about the tendency in fiction for the main villain's lieutenant to betray him is named after a transforming robot from an 80s cartoon series intended to sell toys rather than after any of the numerous examples from classical literature. Venusian Weasel posted:
Also a pretty fundamental issue with TVT. The titles of the majority of tropes are either trying too hard to be funny, a reference to some obscure thing/character that happens in anime/manga writing or a mangled mess of  that fail to succinctly convey what the trope is. Which in turn leads to the mess that is YKTTW and Lost and Found as newcomers to the site search for things and fail to find them, only to try and cruft together their very own versions. Which will often slide through because no one else can find the exact trope that already exists because of the terrible name it had and lo! the site continues to fractally spawn more and more tropes which are in essence identical. Like the 500 different types of Gay Furry Mexican Badasses. In Trenchcoats.Also, you just know somebody named Happiness In Slavery that because they thought that naming a trope after a Nine Inch Nails song was deep and edgy.
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Sep 23, 2013 13:52
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Happiness In Slavery page posted:One girl who you liberate from slavers asks you if you're her master now. If you take her on, she'll become a housekeeper at your estate. (You can also tell her that she has to "do anything you want," but the game doesn't let you take that to its logical conclusion.) The last three words link to the Sex Slave page. And of course there is a Sex Slave page. gently caress you, TVTropes.
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Sep 23, 2013 14:06
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troublegum posted:This sums up the most basic problem with everything on TVTropes. That rule about notability could very well be re-written to be "There's no such thing as notability unless we can make references to whatever obscure anime bullshit we watched this week." Tropers are hugely reductionist in their approach to every work of fiction - not just because they're trying to reduce them down to a list of tropes with terribly witty names, but because they're almost always desperately trying to crowbar in something that they can use to link things to their favourite anime's page. Usually the one they created themselves and are now desperately trying to link (or wick, in troper parlance) to as many other things as possible so as to stroke their e-peen whenever they look at the 'Related' page. I'm pretty sure somebody pointed out (either in the last thread or the one before it) that TV Tropes only really made the shift from being a fansite for Joss Whedon and other genre shows to what it is now when Wikipedia made this really big effort to get rid of a lot of anime fancruft from its pages several years ago. In any case, I definitely remember when Fast Eddie wanted to rename "Nakama" and remove the pages for some rather questionable anime series, there was more than one poster who acted like they were being personally betrayed because "anime fans made this site what it is" (which is probably true, but likely not in the way he means).
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Sep 23, 2013 14:47
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Metal Loaf posted:I'm pretty sure somebody pointed out (either in the last thread or the one before it) that TV Tropes only really made the shift from being a fansite for Joss Whedon and other genre shows to what it is now when Wikipedia made this really big effort to get rid of a lot of anime fancruft from its pages several years ago. Which raises the question: why don't they just build an anime-specific fan site? Why keep moving from place to place instead of just setting something of your own up? Or is there a big anime equivalent that I just don't know about? Any anime viewers got an answer?
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Sep 23, 2013 15:14
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Apple Tree posted:Or is there a big anime equivalent that I just don't know about? TVTropes? 
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Sep 23, 2013 15:19
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my dad posted:TVTropes? I mean an officially anime site, not a stealth anime site. Are anime fans creating their own places, or do they just keep moving in and changing other places?
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Sep 23, 2013 15:29
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Apple Tree posted:Which raises the question: why don't they just build an anime-specific fan site? Why keep moving from place to place instead of just setting something of your own up? Have you met Tropers? These are some of the laziest people on the internet.
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Sep 23, 2013 16:01
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Apple Tree posted:I mean an officially anime site, not a stealth anime site. Are anime fans creating their own places, or do they just keep moving in and changing other places? That would require a weeaboo actually being able to code. And weeaboos are even less capable of anything useful than insufferable spergbots like the average troper. Spergbots actually know HTML.
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Sep 23, 2013 16:01
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I got the curious impulse to see what the word 'weeaboo' turned up in TVTropes. No trope, but they have 'weeaboo stories'. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13126093050A24184400&page=9) This, I swear, is the first thing I hit: quote:When trying to explain why inserting broken Japanese words into her sentances is considered annoying or "lauging AT you" funny, explain to her what she thinks of someone of a foreigner speaking broken English. Because people who don't speak English are weird! On the whole, the impression I get from that thread is that 'weeaboo' is to TVTropes what 'fundamentalist' is to religious extremists: anyone who's more extreme than you.
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Sep 23, 2013 16:29
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Thinky Whale posted:The last three words link to the Sex Slave page. And of course there is a Sex Slave page. "But no you see she's HAPPY in sla- " 
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Sep 23, 2013 16:54
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Yeah, it gets bad when you try to search TVTropes for serious subjects, doesn't it? But they can't be hosed-up about everything, surely? Let's see what 'domestic abuse' turns up... quote:Double Standard Abuse Female On Male OH FOR gently caress'S SAKE. 
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Sep 23, 2013 17:16
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You know, you guys have a real tendency to play up the weird bits, something a casual reader could honestly miss, it's not really-Apple Tree posted:It's surprising how often the author won't think to have the man under attack perform some legsweep or judo move on the woman and then just run away, thus never putting his hands on the woman and sparing them both the humiliation. what
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Sep 23, 2013 17:30
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DStecks posted:You know, you guys have a real tendency to play up the weird bits, something a casual reader could honestly miss, it's not really- You see, it's okay to be violent against women as long as you don't literally hit them with your fists. 
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Sep 23, 2013 17:33
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A Fancy 400 lbs posted:You see, it's okay to be violent against women as long as you don't literally hit them with your fists. The only proper way to win this scenario is to have a lady on your side, so she may counter-act any lady attacks (while you run the gently caress away). Or just loving run away and tip over trash cans and poo poo to block her pursuit? Or any number of other non-violent ways? Remember wild ladies are dangerous, and never should be approached alone. Tropers, on the other hand, should never be approached at all.
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Sep 23, 2013 18:31
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DStecks posted:I'd argue that Deconstruction still has worth as a term, since it describes a very specific phenomenon that reoccurs in media, which occurs for a very specific purpose, which is the exact definition of a trope. It's something that does deserve a unique word, and "deconstruction" happens to be a fairly good metaphorical description of what's going on in the work. Except it doesn't, because no one except TV Tropes cares about TV Tropes, and none of the examples they cited are even intended to do what they claim a "Deconstruction" is. Madoka is not "realistic" magical girls, it's a magical girl story aimed at a different audience from the norm for that genre. Evangelion is half mecha show, half emotional outlet for a guy who was crazy-depressed and messed up when he was writing it. Watchmen is Alan Moore writing superheroes as he writes, well, basically everything else (and not even superheroes he created; the company got the rights to a bunch of other people's characters, such as the Question, and wanted Moore to write something about them, but his original script was so self-contained and final they had him make up some new ones so they could keep using the other ones). No one (except tropers) goes out and says "I'm going to write how this totally fictional and impossible thing would really happen", because that's stupid. And that's assuming you take the "best" meaning of Deconstruction they use; remember, they also use it to mean literally anything remotely dark, even describing things as "dark to the point of Deconstruction". The term is useless and effectively meaningless, and defending it is silly because it offers nothing useful to anyone. Edit: Meanwhile, on the content front, I don't have anything new, but I can elaborate on one of the OP's events. The Colonel McBadass stuff, it's even crazier than the OP makes it sound. It started when, in one of the past threads, we found a TVT thread where a bunch of people were arguing about statutory rape with Lolacat, who was, again, fifteen at the time. All the others were male and, presumably, adults. McBadass's posts stood out in particular, as he was calling her "biased" and other stuff. I went on a mini-rant in the topic, thread moved on, and that was it. Until a month or two later (or maybe a week or two, my memory of these things isn't great), when someone in here posted that video that's now in the topic (or, well, the original, which is now taken down). For some reason, this guy decided not only to respond to someone talking about him on another forum, but he did so through a YouTube video, and then didn't even send it to the person in question (I wouldn't have known about it if not for the thread). I never posted on TV Tropes or anything, so it was one of the instances where the poop came to touch us. Almost literally; another one of his videos was of him flipping off the camera with a finger that was caked in what may well have been poo poo. I'll see if I can find links to that whole thing, or summarize it, for people who weren't there for it or who want to revisit that "magical" time. Edit again: As for the misogyny above, yeah, that's... That's pretty standard for . Every so often I'll think of some pop culture thing or bit of trivia I'm curious about, and if I can't find it on Wikipedia or something, I'll go check TVT, thinking that I can just check the page for what I'm thinking of and get out. Each and every time I find something repulsive, like people lusting (and describing it as such, via their "Perverse Sexual Lust" trope) after the girls from Harvest Moon. It's like that Lewis Black bit about candy corn.
Roland Jones fucked around with this message at 21:12 on Sep 23, 2013 |
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Sep 23, 2013 20:55
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Roland Jones posted:Except it doesn't, because no one except TV Tropes cares about TV Tropes, and none of the examples they cited are even intended to do what they claim a "Deconstruction" is. Madoka is not "realistic" magical girls, it's a magical girl story aimed at a different audience from the norm for that genre. Evangelion is half mecha show, half emotional outlet for a guy who was crazy-depressed and messed up when he was writing it. Watchmen is Alan Moore writing superheroes as he writes, well, basically everything else (and not even superheroes he created; the company got the rights to a bunch of other people's characters, such as the Question, and wanted Moore to write something about them, but his original script was so self-contained and final they had him make up some new ones so they could keep using the other ones). On the other hand, George R.R. Martin deliberately set out to take apart medieval fantasy cliches in A Song of Ice and Fire, by placing them within a more realistic context. So there are some legitimate examples of TVTropes-style "deconstruction" out there. I do agree, however, that Tropers don't seem to have any grasp what their own term even means, rendering it essentially useless. For instance: quote:Diablo deconstructs Demon Slaying with a butcher's knife; sure, the heroes defeat Eldritch Abominations, but they end up going insane themselves from the trauma and horrors they saw while fighting the things, their action end up going exactly in the direction the Demons wanted, the cities and kingdom they try to save end up mostly slaughtered (Tristram, that the hero was attempting to save in the first opus, ends up destroyed anyway in Diablo II) and Angels, for most, don't give a crap as long as they are not reached. Diablo doesn't "deconstruct" anything; it's a standard gothic horror story, played pretty much completely straight.
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Sep 23, 2013 21:43
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Apple Tree posted:Janine, right? But no, that doesn't support the tropers' case. Janine's story runs: Oh, believe me, we're on the same page. I don't think Janine's story really implies that she was happy, let alone any of the other Handmaids, but it just came to mind as the one tiny shred of evidence that an idiot might seize on to make the argument. Like I posted earlier, the big problem with the TVTropes pages for anything with any level of challenge is that they don't have the skills to properly understand it, so you get "analysis" that anyone with half a brain can see is wrong.
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Sep 23, 2013 21:46
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Roland Jones posted:Except it doesn't, because no one except TV Tropes cares about TV Tropes, and none of the examples they cited are even intended to do what they claim a "Deconstruction" is. Madoka is not "realistic" magical girls, it's a magical girl story aimed at a different audience from the norm for that genre. Evangelion is half mecha show, half emotional outlet for a guy who was crazy-depressed and messed up when he was writing it. Watchmen is Alan Moore writing superheroes as he writes, well, basically everything else. You realize that you can equivocate away literally any literary device like that? "Star Wars doesn't utilize the Hero's Journey, George Lucas was just emulating the sci-fi shows from his childhood." DaveWoo posted:I do agree, however, that Tropers don't seem to have any grasp what their own term even means, rendering it essentially useless. This, though, is a 100% accurate summation of the situation.
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Sep 23, 2013 22:02
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DaveWoo posted:On the other hand, George R.R. Martin deliberately set out to take apart medieval fantasy cliches in A Song of Ice and Fire, by placing them within a more realistic context. So there are some legitimate examples of TVTropes-style "deconstruction" out there. No one is denying that what tropers call deconstruction is a legitimate artistic direction you can go in, but the point is that "deconstruction" is perhaps not the best term to describe it. I think "challenging genre conventions" might be better. At least that would avoid the confusion with that other deconstruction.
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Sep 23, 2013 22:19
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DaveWoo posted:On the other hand, George R.R. Martin deliberately set out to take apart medieval fantasy cliches in A Song of Ice and Fire, by placing them within a more realistic context. . Given how full of those books are, I'm not sure that really supports the legitimacy argument.It's not equivocating away a definition to say 'these authors didn't have challenging cliches as their major priority', it's making a distinction. If you call something a 'deconstruction' in this sense, you're implying authorial intent. In most cases, that intent probably isn't there, which is relevant - and if it is, odds seem to be above average that somebody's going to be loving an underage girl. 
Apple Tree fucked around with this message at 22:56 on Sep 23, 2013 |
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Sep 23, 2013 22:48
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To get off of lit nerds whining about tropers using a word wrong, here's "Your Post-Apocalyptic Badass Look".quote:Let's face it, kiddies: Whenever some sort of worldwide disaster occurs in fiction, you can be sure that the main characters will gain, at minimum, four levels in badass. Naturally, this requires a wardrobe change as well. So what's yours? quote:Apocalypse Type: Hostile alien invasion It's a shame tropers don't read or they might have read about more interesting apocalypses than alien/zombie/monster/warzone.
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Sep 23, 2013 22:52
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Djeser posted:To get off of lit nerds whining about tropers using a word wrong, here's "Your Post-Apocalyptic Badass Look". Oh, God, the list of weapon names on the last one is cracking me up. Falchion! Tyrfing! Libra! ... Vladimir? ... Paul? Clearly it's time for me to write our generation's finest apocalyptic novel, "Me and (My Submachine Gun Named) Bobby McGee."
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Sep 23, 2013 23:00
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Djeser posted:To get off of lit nerds whining about tropers using a word wrong, here's "Your Post-Apocalyptic Badass Look". In what world would it make any sense to be wearing a big heavy coat everywhere? And don't say "because storage" because trenchcoats are pathetic for that, if you actually want to haul anything, you'd use a drat backpack. Swords, also, very stupid. Little to no use besides combat, and in that capacity have been obsolete since before the Holy Roman Empire fell. They're also very heavy. You'd think a self-respecting apocalypse-conscious nerd would have read the Zombie Survival Guide, but I guess survival is secondary to looking like a cyberpunk 12-year old's idea of "badass".
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Sep 23, 2013 23:02
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Antivehicular posted:Oh, God, the list of weapon names on the last one is cracking me up. Falchion! Tyrfing! Libra! ... Vladimir? ... Paul? Clearly it's time for me to write our generation's finest apocalyptic novel, "Me and (My Submachine Gun Named) Bobby McGee." DStecks beat me to this, and I don't know why this bugs me the most, but the fact that she shaved her head bald for "aerodynamics" and yet she wears pants with a ton of pockets and a leather longcoat (with optional hood) just drives me up the wall.
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Sep 23, 2013 23:06
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Yes a black fedora, that surely will be effective protection in a firefight. The vultures picking over your corpse will certainly be impressed!
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Sep 23, 2013 23:44
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Literally Kermit posted:Yes a black fedora, that surely will be effective protection in a firefight. The vultures picking over your corpse will certainly be impressed! I think the true use of the fedora is to distract the aliens/zombies/Nazis/etc. They look at it, start laughing uncontrollably, and you stab them with your (jet black) spatha! Genius! 
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Sep 24, 2013 01:02
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Antivehicular posted:Falchion! Tyrfing! Libra! If I didn't know better I'd say this is a Fire Emblem reference. Falchion is the personal sword of the first game's main character, Marth, and Tyrfing is the sword of the 4th game's dude. Libra is the name of an axe-wielding monk in the 13th game as well.
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Sep 24, 2013 01:08
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:If I didn't know better I'd say this is a Fire Emblem reference. Falchion is the personal sword of the first game's main character, Marth, and Tyrfing is the sword of the 4th game's dude. Libra is the name of an axe-wielding monk in the 13th game as well. That's exactly right. In addition, all of these names are found in the 13th game, Fire Emblem: Awakening. Strangely, that game is a lightning rod for the attention of creeps. It could be because there is a character who's a 1000-year-old dragon in a little girl's body. I'm not kidding.
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Sep 24, 2013 01:20
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ddinkins112 posted:That's exactly right. In addition, all of these names are found in the 13th game, Fire Emblem: Awakening. Strangely, that game is a lightning rod for the attention of creeps. It could be because there is a character who's a 1000-year-old dragon in a little girl's body. I'm not kidding. That's a thing in a lot of FE games - admittedly, a lot better dressed than Nowi in those - so it's got to be something else. I'd wager it's somewhere between the Avatar character being a built-in self-insert and the extensive support/marriage system encouraging shippers like nothing else. After that, I'd like to have something interesting to post, but the trope page for FE13 is the usual banality. quote:Zettai Ryouiki: All of the women. The T&A is modest and realistic on everyone (except Aversa), but all the women except Lissa (who wears a dress) have it. Thus far, the biggest examples are males, in the form of Chrom and Marth, who score a grade-A! And their forums thread is for the entire series and seems dominated by gameplay chat. Well, down that path lies boredom.
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Sep 24, 2013 03:01
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The problem is that unlike every other Fire Emblem game Awakening is really popular and not a cult hit like the others. Some of the articles and comments I read after it came out were loving obnoxious because of the amount of people who acted like they knew anything about the series at all when this was likely their first game. The amount of people playing it while allowing characters to Permadie or using Fred at the exclusion of everyone else is ridiculous. Am I a FE hipster?
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Sep 24, 2013 03:08
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LeafyOrb posted:The problem is that unlike every other Fire Emblem game Awakening is really popular and not a cult hit like the others. Some of the articles and comments I read after it came out were loving obnoxious because of the amount of people who acted like they knew anything about the series at all when this was likely their first game. The amount of people playing it while allowing characters to Permadie or using Fred at the exclusion of everyone else is ridiculous. Perhaps. But so am I. Allowing a character to die is a disgusting breach of FE Protocol!
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Sep 24, 2013 03:35
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:That's a thing in a lot of FE games - admittedly, a lot better dressed than Nowi in those - so it's got to be something else. I'd wager it's somewhere between the Avatar character being a built-in self-insert and the extensive support/marriage system encouraging shippers like nothing else. The "small sexualized girl actually a 1000 year old demon/vampire/whatever" is actually a very common anime trope. I watched a lot of anime as a an awkward puberty-stricken adolescent.
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Sep 24, 2013 04:04
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quote:Weapons: Two long steel swords (named "Falchion" and "Tyrfing") used to cut flesh, a pitchfork (named "Vladimir") used for stabbing and long-range attacks, a steel axe (named "Libra") used for cutting into hard surfaces, and an emergency handgun (named "Paul") used for shooting. Also skilled with any pipe she comes across, and can fight hand-to-hand in dire situations. I love the idea that when we're basically living on fear and scraps because aliens have taken over civilization, the first thing we're going to do is go back to making swords. I mean, we're all on the run from aliens, but we'll definitely have time to pick up some steel and forge it into amazing looking swords with cool names. After reading this thread, it seems to me like they are using tropes more as "anything that appears in more than one work of fiction." Some of the things I've seen linked seem more like "topics" than "tropes." Like, I don't understand how "domestic abuse" can be a trope. But hey, let's see what they have to say about it: quote:Domestic abuse, defined as physical or emotional abuse between members of a romantic relationship, is a recurring comedy trope throughout history. Why this is so is somewhat understandable- after all, physical and verbal abuse between characters is funny, and characters often find themselves in romantic relationships. Haha, so true, people abusing each other is hilarious. I'm still not getting this "trope" so let's look at examples ... they just list every example of some sort of abuse that appears anywhere, and the vast majority of them are not comic examples. I guess it is a wiki, but on this page you can really tell it was put together by bunches of different people with different points of view so it comes out totally disjointed and not very coherent. Also at the end there is a "Real Life" section. How can something in real life be a trope? It's just a weird collection of random facts, examples of a couple of celebrities who were abusers and then a public service section giving numbers to call if you are a victim. I don't really get this site at all.
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Sep 24, 2013 04:22
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Toriori posted:The "small sexualized girl actually a 1000 year old demon/vampire/whatever" is actually a very common anime trope. Despite the awful, awful name they gave it (No, really), I'm actually amazed at what the (short, thankfully exampleless) page says. TvTropes posted:There are Moe characters whose youth and innocence attract a fanbase of sexual lust in spite of an author's intentions and then there are characters who are meant to appeal to Lolicon tastes. That's what we call paedopandering and it is a bad thing. Good job, whoever wrote that. You're slightly less of a terrible person than most of the people on that site.  Wait, what's the last bit on that page say? TvTropes also posted:Finally, this trope is also more often than not played for drama as well; the stigma of being a "forbidden object of lust" trapped in a "child's" body when one is an adult with sexual desires is a veritable goldmine of angst-driven drama and plot. Goddamit, TvTropes. 
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Sep 24, 2013 04:26
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