Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five
Between when I posted and when I read your replies, I finally heard a human voice though I missed what they were saying because I'd walked away from my radio for a moment.

If I buy "The ARRL Extra Class License Manual" (10th edition) and decide I'd rather go for General, would I have any issue continuing to use the same book? Is the additional material for extra class added in discrete locations on or integrated though the text?

I was able to get things programmed in using a cable from Amazon to my UV-5R and Chirp, and it seemed to program just fine, so maybe it's easier to get running with the 5R instead of 5RA. Programming it from the keypad was somewhat more hit or miss.

Thanks for the quick responses.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

eddiewalker
Apr 28, 2004

Arrrr ye landlubber
Tech, General and Extra are the 3 US license tiers. They all have separate question pools, each increasing in difficulty. You have to pass them in order.

poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five

eddiewalker posted:

Tech, General and Extra are the 3 US license tiers. They all have separate question pools, each increasing in difficulty. You have to pass them in order.

Sorry, I should rephrase my question: Is it difficult to parse out the sections of The ARRL Extra Class License Manual that aren't applicable to to the other two classes? I know the question pools are different but if an extra ten bucks for the Extra manual means I could study for any of the three exams, I'd rather grab that than the Technician or General manual.

eddiewalker
Apr 28, 2004

Arrrr ye landlubber
There's not a lot of overlap, in my opinion. Take some practice tests and see for yourself. I like AA9PW's.

poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five

eddiewalker posted:

There's not a lot of overlap, in my opinion. Take some practice tests and see for yourself. I like AA9PW's.

Thanks for the heads up about AA9PW. I feel pretty good after taking the Technician practice exam and looking through the Extra class exam makes me think the Extra class manual will cover things that are fascinating, but I shouldn't make that my first manual purchase.

Thanks for your patience with me.

Edit: I bit the bullet and ordered the Technician and General class licenses. I think I'll try to get both, if I can, in December, but I should probably wait on Extra as previously suggested.

poeticoddity fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Sep 5, 2013

SiB
May 6, 2005

Beccara posted:

Crossposting from the SW thread as I'm also looking at getting my ticket in HAM aswell:


So I'm down in little old NZ and am pretty keen to pick up some DX RTTY/PSK and maybe the odd SSB Voice, I dont have a lot of cash to invest in antennas and whatnot so I was wondering if there is a band I should be aiming for to pick up digital modes like RTTY? Instinct tells me something like 80m would reach me better in the upper north island.

I have a decent outside are to string an antenna up so size isn't much of an issue

I'm still new to this but I use PSK on 20m all the time. 14.070. Using a 33 foot long wire dipole and 25 watts max.

Beccara
Feb 3, 2005

SiB posted:

I'm still new to this but I use PSK on 20m all the time. 14.070. Using a 33 foot long wire dipole and 25 watts max.



Cheers, I have my exam on Sunday so fingers crossed. I'm good with the power/volts/ohms/amps side of things and the bands but the block diagrams of a TX or RX path get me out every time

manero
Jan 30, 2006

So I've got this going on with HRD, my TS590, my laptop and my imac, which is functioning as my external display via mini displayport.



It might be a little bit hard to see, but I've got noise at 60hz, and every 60hz after that. It goes away as soon as I unplug from the imac, which leads me to believe the imac's power supply is either malfunctioning, or just noisy and transmitting the noise back up the displayport cable. I tried some ferrite beads on the displayport cable but that didn't help.

TS-590S -- USB --> macbook pro -- Displayport --> iMac

I'm guessing either replace the imac's power supply, or ditch the imac altogether as an external display? Any other ideas for mitigating this noise?

MisterOblivious
Mar 17, 2010

by sebmojo
That sounds an awful lot like a ground loop.
Have you tried the laptop on battery power?

manero
Jan 30, 2006

MisterOblivious posted:

That sounds an awful lot like a ground loop.
Have you tried the laptop on battery power?

Yep- no difference. It goes away as soon as I unplug my laptop from the iMac.

I've read a bunch of stuff online about my specific iMac with faulty power supplies, so I was starting to go down that route.

The only other things I could think of are to try a normal monitor, or temporarily disconnect my station ground and see if that eliminates the loop.

Thanks for the suggestion!

Beccara
Feb 3, 2005
:toot: I passed!

Jonny 290
May 5, 2005



[ASK] me about OS/2 Warp
Rest in Peace, Wayne Green, W2NSD.

http://www.eham.net/articles/30866

A legend exits.

eddiewalker
Apr 28, 2004

Arrrr ye landlubber
I leave a radio on 146.52 in my car pretty much all the time. It's quieter than a repeater and I have much more interesting random chats.

But today was weird. I heard a kid's voice barely breaking squelch, so I dropped my call. No response. A few miles later I tried again. Kid responds, "what was that?"

Adult man answers, "Someone else is trying to use our channel."

"What do they want?"

"Just ignore them."

Not a peep either station for the rest of my regular 20 minute drive.

...what in the hell.

Dijkstra
May 21, 2002

Jonny 290 posted:

Rest in Peace, Wayne Green, W2NSD.

http://www.eham.net/articles/30866

A legend exits.

Lots of super-smart and pioneering old timers are starting to kick the bucket, it really sucks.

eddiewalker posted:

I leave a radio on 146.52 in my car pretty much all the time. It's quieter than a repeater and I have much more interesting random chats.

But today was weird. I heard a kid's voice barely breaking squelch, so I dropped my call. No response. A few miles later I tried again. Kid responds, "what was that?"

Adult man answers, "Someone else is trying to use our channel."

"What do they want?"

"Just ignore them."

Not a peep either station for the rest of my regular 20 minute drive.

...what in the hell.

Probably some kid got into daddy's shack. Best thing to do is ignore it.

Totally Reasonable
Jan 8, 2008

aaag mirrors

Dijkstra posted:

Probably some kid got into daddy's shack. Best thing to do is ignore it.

I wouldn't be too sure. I hear a lot of 70cm/2m traffic that is clearly unlicensed, as well as FRS/GMRS channels being used by non type-approved radios.

Proliferation of those $40 HTs seems to be nearing critical mass.

People Stew
Dec 5, 2003

Totally Reasonable posted:

I wouldn't be too sure. I hear a lot of 70cm/2m traffic that is clearly unlicensed, as well as FRS/GMRS channels being used by non type-approved radios.

Proliferation of those $40 HTs seems to be nearing critical mass.

I live somewhat close to the freeway and I've picked up traffic on 146.52 that was pretty obviously not licensed. No calls being given, etc. I think the only traffic I've ever actually heard on 146.52 has been this way. I've never heard anyone actually calling on it, from home or on the road.

eddiewalker
Apr 28, 2004

Arrrr ye landlubber
If you're operating unlicensed, why would you pick that frequency? It's not an even number or a band edge or anything.

The Third Man
Nov 5, 2005

I know how much you like ponies so I got you a ponies avatar bro
Is the handbook for taking the technician exam in the OP still relevant? It looks like there was a new edition published in 2010, but did that much change in the intervening 4 years or so since the previous edition was recommended?

eddiewalker
Apr 28, 2004

Arrrr ye landlubber
There's a new question pool every 4 years. A lot of things will be the same, but there's no reason to study off an old pool since the FCC provides the exact questions in their exact wording.

"The Technician class (Element 2) Pool is effective July 1, 2010 and is valid until June 30, 2014."

Enilev
Jun 11, 2001

Domesticated
Hand-soldering a cable to connect my HT to a 9600 baud TNC might be the geekiest thing I've even done. I ordered a TinyTrak4, but I didn't want to spend $20 extra on a cable that would've required a bulky cigarette lighter plug or PowerPole connector, when I just just run it off a 9V battery. The TNC should show up in the mail tomorrow, so hopefully it works and I can get it running quickly.

Mostly, I plan on using it for APRS beaconing when I'm doing things like hiking. And I'm going to try to hit the ISS next time there's a good pass. But the local ARES group is big on packet, so I'll probably try some of that. The software they use for reporting is definitely in the "Greybeards running Windows 95" category. There's basic BBS software underneath everything, but they have this elaborate system of forms that live on top of it, and that are generated with HTML from a time before CSS.

And while I'm on the topic, why are PowerPole connectors so popular in amateur radio? They seem a lot bulkier and less useful than other connectors. SAE connectors, for example, are smaller and don't have the possibility of mixing up the polarity.

Vir
Dec 14, 2007

Does it tickle when your Body Thetans flap their wings, eh Beatrice?

eddiewalker posted:

If you're operating unlicensed, why would you pick that frequency? It's not an even number or a band edge or anything.
Maybe it started out with some guys who wanted to be heard by us hams in case they needed help. In a true emergency, you won't need a license after all. And then perhaps it spread to the "down with the man, live in the woods, hoard ALL the corn, government out of my air" types.

Enilev posted:

And while I'm on the topic, why are PowerPole connectors so popular in amateur radio? They seem a lot bulkier and less useful than other connectors. SAE connectors, for example, are smaller and don't have the possibility of mixing up the polarity.
If you make them correctly, you won't mix up the polarity of powerpoles when you use them, so in practice an SAE would be like a powerpole with one pin exposed. This might be fine in a vehicle where you're absolutely sure that ground is negative, but not so nice if you come across one of those positive ground vehicles.

Mainly though, it's about picking a standard and sticking to it. It's not that it's infinitely better than the alternatives. Molex connectors almost became standard earlier, not the harddrive power type, but the type found on the back of some radios; the main problems with that is that it's not hermaphroditic and a bit more complicated to wire.

I put a piece of insulation in the round hole between the plastic bricks, and that keeps them from ever moving apart. And if you come across some guy who forgot the "red up right" rule, it's still pretty easy to fix it.

Vir fucked around with this message at 10:10 on Sep 18, 2013

fordan
Mar 9, 2009

Clue: Zero

eddiewalker posted:

If you're operating unlicensed, why would you pick that frequency? It's not an even number or a band edge or anything.

Might have been preprogrammed into the call button many radios have since it is the national simplex calling frequency.

Dijkstra
May 21, 2002

Ten Tec 506 Rebel Trip Report
(Open Source ChipKIT32-based QRP rig)



So this started shipping on Sept. 9, and a bunch of us got ours last week. Here are some observations.

It comes from Ten Tec with no accessories, so you need to wire up a 2.1mm jack to supply ~12v. There are also jacks for a key, headphones, a USB port (on the ChipKIT32) and a BNC antenna jack.

The receiver is absolutely fantastic for a $200 radio. Way better than the TenTec 4020 that I have. It has three selectable tuning steps and three bandwidths.

Stock the rig does not support iambic or single-lever keying, only a straight key. However I coded a keyer routine for it which I will get to in a minute. The QSK is great.

Out of the box it will support a HD44780-compatible LCD display using 4 bits, more on this in a minute. Right now it will work on 40m or 20m, and is manually switched by jumpers on the RF board, so you have to take the cover off to switch bands.

Dev stuff:

Myself and a couple of other guys have been collaborating to add features. I rewrote the TX routine and added an Iambic Mode A/B keyer function last weekend. It will detect whether a straight key or a paddle is plugged in, and adjust the keying functionality accordingly. It will also take analog input as a speed control. You can also fix the speed in software if you want.

Someone else added support for some more displays:

I2C 1602
I2C SSD1306 OLED

Things we're working on in the near future:

-More display support (especially LED ones I think)
-A Beacon feature
-Some type of relay board for the band/filter switching so switching bands can be done in software.
-Possibly adding another band filter block to the above relay board if it works out.

The SW band switching feature will be really cool, because you currently have to change 5 jumpers to switch bands. One jumper is a digital input to the board to specify the band, the others just set band filters. So theoretically you can re-provision the input pin as a digital output, and have it control some relays that will switch the filter jumpers as needed.

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009
Probation
Can't post for 17 hours!
That looks pretty drat awesome.

I can't wait to see what people come up with doing on this platform. Makes me wish I'd gotten into Arduino hacking sooner.

Dijkstra
May 21, 2002

Motronic posted:

That looks pretty drat awesome.

I can't wait to see what people come up with doing on this platform. Makes me wish I'd gotten into Arduino hacking sooner.

This is my first foray into Arduino/chipKIT etc. Never too late to get started.

Hibbie
May 10, 2013

The name 'Tonic Wine' does not imply health giving or medicinal properties.

Dijkstra posted:

Ten Tec 506 Rebel Trip Report
(Open Source ChipKIT32-based QRP rig)



So this started shipping on Sept. 9, and a bunch of us got ours last week. Here are some observations.

It comes from Ten Tec with no accessories, so you need to wire up a 2.1mm jack to supply ~12v. There are also jacks for a key, headphones, a USB port (on the ChipKIT32) and a BNC antenna jack.

The receiver is absolutely fantastic for a $200 radio. Way better than the TenTec 4020 that I have. It has three selectable tuning steps and three bandwidths.

Stock the rig does not support iambic or single-lever keying, only a straight key. However I coded a keyer routine for it which I will get to in a minute. The QSK is great.

Out of the box it will support a HD44780-compatible LCD display using 4 bits, more on this in a minute. Right now it will work on 40m or 20m, and is manually switched by jumpers on the RF board, so you have to take the cover off to switch bands.

Dev stuff:

Myself and a couple of other guys have been collaborating to add features. I rewrote the TX routine and added an Iambic Mode A/B keyer function last weekend. It will detect whether a straight key or a paddle is plugged in, and adjust the keying functionality accordingly. It will also take analog input as a speed control. You can also fix the speed in software if you want.

Someone else added support for some more displays:

I2C 1602
I2C SSD1306 OLED

Things we're working on in the near future:

-More display support (especially LED ones I think)
-A Beacon feature
-Some type of relay board for the band/filter switching so switching bands can be done in software.
-Possibly adding another band filter block to the above relay board if it works out.

The SW band switching feature will be really cool, because you currently have to change 5 jumpers to switch bands. One jumper is a digital input to the board to specify the band, the others just set band filters. So theoretically you can re-provision the input pin as a digital output, and have it control some relays that will switch the filter jumpers as needed.

This looks amazing - awesome work.

Unfortunately, I'm not much of a CW type - do you know of anything similar for SSB as I'm a data whore? I've never seen anything for data at QRP levels. I'm not opposed to doing the work since theoretically I'm a qualified electronic engineer, but I can never be bothered tinkering after working with circuits and trunked radio all day.

Dijkstra
May 21, 2002

Hibbie posted:

This looks amazing - awesome work.

Unfortunately, I'm not much of a CW type - do you know of anything similar for SSB as I'm a data whore? I've never seen anything for data at QRP levels. I'm not opposed to doing the work since theoretically I'm a qualified electronic engineer, but I can never be bothered tinkering after working with circuits and trunked radio all day.

Thanks.

I know how you feel, the only reason I hack on C/C++ code by night is because it isn't SQL. I do SQL/MDX poo poo all day.

However, right now there really isn't anything else like this on the market that I know of. That said, the rig has a DDS so unless I'm mistaken getting audio is really just a matter of building/getting an audio board and coding it up for input/sampling. I'm new to arduino etc. but I think there's already shield that will sample audio. There may be some library incompatibilities between Arduino and ChipKIT but they can probably be worked out.

Anyway, it's probably a matter of time before someone starts working on that, might as well be you!

Hibbie
May 10, 2013

The name 'Tonic Wine' does not imply health giving or medicinal properties.
Hmmmmmmmm, Interesting.

I've was playing with some APRS stuff with a few other guys a while back (as all ham radio applications suck) and we farted out: https://github.com/gordonjcp/aprsmap although it needs a pile of work done.

Given I'm about to start work over in the UAE for about 2 months, I might take an arduino and some MSP430s with me and see what I can fiddle together with bits of wire and asm.

Dijkstra
May 21, 2002

Good luck overseas.

Oh yeah, the "defacto" upstream github for this is here:

https://github.com/pstyle/Tentec506

I say "defacto" because this is so new and everything is kind of unorganized. But the few of us actually familiar with open source projects are forking off that.

A couple of months ago there was a discussion on where to have a code repo etc. once the rig came out and only like four people understood why using Yahoo groups as a code repo/SCM tool was dumb, if that tells you anything. We probably need to do a better job of using includes instead of putting everything in line to be honest, but everything is just getting off the ground.

Right now it feels like most of the people are developing on their own and maybe sharing bits and pieces, or just doing what they want and not sharing anything. I'm hoping that by getting a lot of code on github the thing will take off with the maker/open source community more.

Jack Purdum (W9NMT) has written a number of programming books and he is sharing the drafts of his new book with anyone who asks to checkout and test his sample code etc. So that's pretty cool too.

Hibbie
May 10, 2013

The name 'Tonic Wine' does not imply health giving or medicinal properties.
Haha, that sounds like a typical amateur radio situation!

Yeah, it might be an idea to have a single 'unofficial' repo with 4-5 maintainers on github and then just have people issue pull requests as and when... the pace of development will be fairly slow, as with all things radio.

As for overseas, I'm beginning the commissioning of structured cable in buildings and radio systems in the UAE - for a guy from Scotland, the weather's going to be awful. Especially when I'm testing mechanical and electrical completion of folded dipole stacks on top of a 90m radio tower in the middle of the desert. I'm going to be so burned for that entire commissioning period!

Dijkstra
May 21, 2002

So here's a pretty good article about ham radio and attracting hackers/makers/experimenters etc.

http://hackaday.com/2013/09/23/guest-rant-ham-radio-hackers-paradise/

Crankit
Feb 7, 2011

HE WATCHES
Can someone explain transmitter damage, if a guy transmits without an antenna connected I understand that can cause damage to the finals, what is it that causes damage?

If the radio is a 100W radio and and it's only set to 10W will transmitting into no load, or a short still damage it?

One guy at the club explained it was like a short circuit in house wiring, where more current is drawn than should be and it over heats the finals, that kinda makes sense in a short circuit situation but what about other impedance mismatches?

Pham Nuwen
Oct 30, 2010



Dijkstra posted:

So here's a pretty good article about ham radio and attracting hackers/makers/experimenters etc.

http://hackaday.com/2013/09/23/guest-rant-ham-radio-hackers-paradise/

I always come back to "great, now what do I do with it?"

The electronics/physics aspects of amateur radio are interesting and fun but it's hard to tell someone they should spend hundreds of dollars on something purely to get it all set up. Because once you *do* get it set up, you get to talk to greybeards about their ailments.

Ham radio could be actually useful if the FCC actually allowed technology that might make it useful, like encrypted data. Without it, you end up talking to greybeards about their ailments in text. If we could actually encrypt data, there's this possibility for actual interesting store-and-forward messaging systems, useful IP-over-radio, etc.

It's sad, but I've honestly never heard anyone talking on radio about anything except their radio gear or their ailments. Remote control over amateur radio is pretty cool, but that's a very specialized situation.

Sorry for the negativity, I just feel like all the ham radio people are so desperate to get people interested and keep the hobby alive, but have little interest in actually changing anything to make it more attractive. Encryption would be a drat good start...

eddiewalker
Apr 28, 2004

Arrrr ye landlubber
If traffic is encrypted, how do you ensure its non commercial, or not an exclusive system that discourages new users? There's only so much spectrum to go around.

Pham Nuwen
Oct 30, 2010



eddiewalker posted:

If traffic is encrypted, how do you ensure its non commercial, or not an exclusive system that discourages new users? There's only so much spectrum to go around.

I know, but drat... It doesn't matter how much spectrum there is if nobody cares to use it because there's nothing useful to be done. "I'm running a Kenwood at 50W on a dipole how about you" gets pretty dull pretty quick.

Edit: also, we already have an exclusive system that discourages new users, it's the greybeards who love to talk about what useless layabout shitheels kids these days are, ruining the hobby bahgawd with their Jap radios.

eddiewalker
Apr 28, 2004

Arrrr ye landlubber
How about some un-retired users sub-bands?

longview
Dec 25, 2006

heh.

Crankit posted:

Can someone explain transmitter damage, if a guy transmits without an antenna connected I understand that can cause damage to the finals, what is it that causes damage?

If the radio is a 100W radio and and it's only set to 10W will transmitting into no load, or a short still damage it?

One guy at the club explained it was like a short circuit in house wiring, where more current is drawn than should be and it over heats the finals, that kinda makes sense in a short circuit situation but what about other impedance mismatches?

I think there's several ways for a PA to be damaged from an open antenna port, one way is for a nearly infinite VSWR to develop between the PA output driver and the antenna connector, causing the power to be reflected back to the PA and (potentially, most likely according to murphy) overheating it. I think this is primarily a concern for VHF and up since that wire connection is very short compared to HF waves. If you start putting 30-100m of open ended coax at the other end then it would be a concern even for HF.

HF radios usually use output transformers to deliver the needed voltage to drive a 50 ohm coax, it's very likely that the transformer will saturate with no load on the output and present a DC short to the output transistors. This is probably what kills a HF radio with no antenna connected.

10W short from a 100W rig might kill it, depending on how quick and responsive the power limiter is and if the designers bothered to protect against it. I have a FDK 10W VHF station that's rated for continuous full power into 40:1 SWR, but my FT-747 blew the PA in a millisecond after I accidentally had the MOX pressed.

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009
Probation
Can't post for 17 hours!

Pham Nuwen posted:

If we could actually encrypt data, there's this possibility for actual interesting store-and-forward messaging systems, useful IP-over-radio, etc.

Exactly what do you need encryption for to create any of those things?

Dijkstra
May 21, 2002

Pham Nuwen posted:

I know, but drat... It doesn't matter how much spectrum there is if nobody cares to use it because there's nothing useful to be done. "I'm running a Kenwood at 50W on a dipole how about you" gets pretty dull pretty quick.

Edit: also, we already have an exclusive system that discourages new users, it's the greybeards who love to talk about what useless layabout shitheels kids these days are, ruining the hobby bahgawd with their Jap radios.

Have you ever tried spinning the dial and finding someone else to talk to?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Pham Nuwen
Oct 30, 2010



Motronic posted:

Exactly what do you need encryption for to create any of those things?

Plaintext authentication sucks.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply