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Arquinsiel posted:As fast as any other marine? Slow as balls compared to genestealers. They'll basically have to change some things up to make it a fun FPS. Character size being one of those things. Honestly they should just copy the Left For Dead model and let jerks like me play as genestealers.
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Oct 18, 2013 00:58
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Back when they actually distinguished them by movement rate Genestealers weren't actually all that much faster, and as long as you can learn where the vents etc are on a map and it's mostly corridors a good team will be able to just churn on through.
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Oct 18, 2013 00:59
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Arquinsiel posted:As fast as any other marine? Bit off topic but have you played Space Marine? The multi player did a really good job of balancing super power armour and the weapons. I'm not sure how fun an FPS would be if you're an invincible but slow moving bulk of armour.
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Oct 18, 2013 01:46
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I remember a passage in Void Stalker where Talos and the crew note that Terminator Armour isn't slow--it's actually pretty fast and light for its bulk (internal servos), but you're sort of stuck in this weird, hunched posture. Can anyone confirm? I only borrowed my friend's copy.
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Oct 18, 2013 02:25
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Schneider Heim posted:I remember a passage in Void Stalker where Talos and the crew note that Terminator Armour isn't slow--it's actually pretty fast and light for its bulk (internal servos), but you're sort of stuck in this weird, hunched posture. Can anyone confirm? I only borrowed my friend's copy. That's how I remember interpreting it also.
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Oct 18, 2013 02:38
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Funnily enough ADB wrote the opposite in The Emperor's Gift. Hyperion objects to wearing Terminator armor for the fight on Armageddon, because his standard armor offers better mobility. He would totally have died if he hadn't worn Terminator armor.
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Oct 18, 2013 02:43
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Schneider Heim posted:I remember a passage in Void Stalker where Talos and the crew note that Terminator Armour isn't slow--it's actually pretty fast and light for its bulk (internal servos), but you're sort of stuck in this weird, hunched posture. Can anyone confirm? I only borrowed my friend's copy. With Terminator Armour, I thought you could really only go forwards, towards the enemy, not strafe say side to side or go backwards. I think you can charge forward with it but you aren't able to dodge attacks.
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Oct 18, 2013 02:45
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Tactical Dreadnaught Armour is as fast as regular power armor but bulkier and less maneuverable - that is not to say a user can't demonstrate dexterity ie. in close quarters combat, but the size and way it's built by necessity constrict various ranges of motion (so does regular power armour, to a degree). In regards to Grey Knight Strike Teams and their power armour, they also lose their personal teleporters.
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Oct 18, 2013 02:53
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Kegslayer posted:Bit off topic but have you played Space Marine? The multi player did a really good job of balancing super power armour and the weapons.
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Oct 18, 2013 03:05
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For whatever it's worth, in the tabletop game, Terminator models move at the same speed as power armored ones, and strike with the same speed and dexterity (initiative and weapon skill) in close combat, all else being equal. The one major difference where tactical maneuverability is concerned is that they can't Sweeping Advance (which is basically when you run down an enemy squad that just broke and ran from you in close combat). Also, they can move and fire heavy weapons without penalty, and/or charge after firing said heavy weapons. If one were to try to reverse engineer their fluff attributes from these mechanical abstractions--which may or may not be a great idea, but I'm just saying--the conclusion is that there's a negligible difference in arm movement or in overall speed over a given distance, but that individuals in Terminator armor have greater inertia--they cannot accelerate as fast or as nimbly as power armor. As far as Void Stalker goes, I don't think that's inconsistent with this approach (though I'd have to reread it)--Talos finds it easy to move in the Terminator armor, but of course that's just his subjective impression of the effort he's putting into it, not the armor's overall actual nimbleness. 
JerryLee fucked around with this message at 04:05 on Oct 18, 2013 |
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Oct 18, 2013 03:58
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Arquinsiel posted:I have played it, it was rather awesome. I felt that it did 40k well enough for my inner 12 year old to be happy. Do we have any numbers on how well that game performed? I thought it was great, and would love a sequel, but I'm sure I recall reading it bombed, sales-wise.
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Oct 18, 2013 04:09
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Aries posted:Do we have any numbers on how well that game performed? I thought it was great, and would love a sequel, but I'm sure I recall reading it bombed, sales-wise. EDIT: vvv well congratulations on being jaded about people disliking things I guess?  vvv
PrBacterio fucked around with this message at 06:14 on Oct 18, 2013 |
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Oct 18, 2013 05:52
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Congratulations on not liking a thing on the internet.
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Oct 18, 2013 06:06
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VanSandman posted:Funnily enough ADB wrote the opposite in The Emperor's Gift. Hyperion objects to wearing Terminator armor for the fight on Armageddon, because his standard armor offers better mobility. I like to take the bolded part as yet more evidence of Hyperion being a loving idiot. A bit late but thanks to shadowhand for the image artwork, those are pretty damned cool.
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Oct 18, 2013 06:14
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VanSandman posted:Funnily enough ADB wrote the opposite in The Emperor's Gift. Hyperion objects to wearing Terminator armor for the fight on Armageddon, because his standard armor offers better mobility. I think thats because his standard armor had the warp pack on it that allowed him to teleport short distances. If he wore Termenator on the ship they found he would have been lost to the void when the daemon threw him out a hole in the ship.
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Oct 18, 2013 06:39
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See Logan grimnar in emperors gift moving like lightning and putting his axe through the head of agrey knight master. One of my favourite black library moments.
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Oct 18, 2013 07:56
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Big Willy Style posted:See Logan grimnar in emperors gift moving like lightning and putting his axe through the head of agrey knight master. I probably posted this in here before, but Bjorn's response to the usage of "God-Emperor" is equally awesome. That and his whole "Why the gently caress are you bowing?" thing. For pure satisfaction, nothing beats Horus's "Show me your real face" incident, especially after reading Betrayer.
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Oct 18, 2013 08:08
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Vorenus posted:For pure satisfaction, nothing beats Horus's "Show me your real face" incident, especially after reading Betrayer. Which book is this bit in?
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Oct 18, 2013 08:15
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Vorenus posted:I like to take the bolded part as yet more evidence of Hyperion being a loving idiot. Hyperion's justicar/squad leader is actually the one to ask about this. I don't think it's ever stated, but I got the feeling that they generally assumed that since there's no armor in the entire loving galaxy that will stand up to a single hit from Angron they might as well be comfortable when they die.
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Oct 18, 2013 08:27
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Khizan posted:Hyperion's justicar/squad leader is actually the one to ask about this. I don't think it's ever stated, but I got the feeling that they generally assumed that since there's no armor in the entire loving galaxy that will stand up to a single hit from Angron they might as well be comfortable when they die. I'm sure Uriel Ventris' plot armor could take a hit or ten.
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Oct 18, 2013 09:27
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VanSandman posted:Which book is this bit in? Khizan posted:Hyperion's justicar/squad leader is actually the one to ask about this. I don't think it's ever stated, but I got the feeling that they generally assumed that since there's no armor in the entire loving galaxy that will stand up to a single hit from Angron they might as well be comfortable when they die. I was more referring to him being an intensely irritating character.
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Oct 18, 2013 09:42
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Vorenus posted:I'm pretty certain it's Fear To Tread, but I could be wrong. He was a bit of a poo poo when he was younger too, and didn't exactly get a chance to grow up. Speaking of which, did ADB ever talk about what consultation he had with Abnett about using one of the latter's creations?
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Oct 18, 2013 10:26
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PrBacterio posted:God I hope so because I felt that game sucked unbelievable amounts of rear end, but then I hate on-rails shooters (or games that require you to slavishly follow whatever predetermined course the developers decided you should follow, instead of just letting you play) in general. You could do basically NOTHING yourself in this game; it was all, walk to the next sequence point => let the sequence play while basically pushing buttons in whatever order to make the encounter go away => rinse => repeat. I hoped after the amount of ridicule that was heaped on "Ryse" after E3, that maybe some backlash was starting to build against this kind of bs pseudo "game" that is exemplified by it, but apparently not. Multiplayer was where that game was at and it did a really good job of distinguishing and balancing the various classes (Tactical/Assault/Devastator). Space Marine wasn't an FPS but if they could replicate the same sort of feel it'd pretty much be an awesome game.
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Oct 18, 2013 11:27
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PrBacterio posted:God I hope so because I felt that game sucked unbelievable amounts of rear end, but then I hate on-rails shooters (or games that require you to slavishly follow whatever predetermined course the developers decided you should follow, instead of just letting you play) in general. You could do basically NOTHING yourself in this game; it was all, walk to the next sequence point => let the sequence play while basically pushing buttons in whatever order to make the encounter go away => rinse => repeat. I hoped after the amount of ridicule that was heaped on "Ryse" after E3, that maybe some backlash was starting to build against this kind of bs pseudo "game" that is exemplified by it, but apparently not. I was mad that linear story based shooter was a linear story based shooter too, bro. TheStampede fucked around with this message at 13:32 on Oct 18, 2013 |
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Oct 18, 2013 13:27
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Kegslayer posted:Multiplayer was where that game was at and it did a really good job of distinguishing and balancing the various classes (Tactical/Assault/Devastator). Space Marine wasn't an FPS but if they could replicate the same sort of feel it'd pretty much be an awesome game. This is very true. Multiplayer worked great and had a lot of viable classes/builds to chose from. A couple of questions; 1: Some people here seem to dislike the Ultramarines quite a bit. Any reason behind this? I just got to 'Know no fear' and they seem likable enough (but I'm a sucker for the good guys). 2: There's a lot of lore/fluff regarding the Horus Heresy and the general history of the universe. Have you guys gotten it all from the various wiki-sites, dedicated to WH40K? Or is it from White Dwarf or some such?
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Oct 18, 2013 13:55
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Blacktoll posted:Its by no means a great game. Or even 'good' by any standards. However, they captured the feel and atmosphere of something close to 40k. There is no doubt that the game oozes a strange style and I think that with proper direction, the developers of E.Y.E. could produce a very grimdark 40k FPS. I think that all the 40k games that have been produced so far have been rather light-hearted and I think a proper darker-themed game would be nice. You capture E.Y.E pretty well. It loving excreted atmosphere and had a lot of cool stylistic choices. Then the gameplay was just kind of... Meh, with a few good ideas. I liked it enough I'd be very interested in what they make of a 40k game, though. Or if they ever get a proper budget.
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Oct 18, 2013 13:59
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ElPedro posted:This is very true. Multiplayer worked great and had a lot of viable classes/builds to chose from. 1: Because they're GW's pet chapter. They are the exemplar of Space Marines according to them. Authors like Graeme Macneil and Matt Ward have managed to write them so shittily it has cause disdain to crystalize for them. 2. Books, WD, Online wikis, etc.
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Oct 18, 2013 14:05
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ElPedro posted:This is very true. Multiplayer worked great and had a lot of viable classes/builds to chose from. Did we play the same game? I won't deny that multiplayer was a lot of fun. But that was only when the thing worked. The matchmaking and peer-to-peer set-up made most games a laggy mess. Targets frequently became invincible or teleported around. I know I was shot through plenty of walls when I played. If it had worked properly people would probably still be playing it. The survival mode managed to avoid most of the same issues, but it was limited to 4 players and not 16 like the regular multiplayer. It was less likely to get stuck playing with someone with a bad connection which would manage to slow the game down for everyone. I enjoyed Space Marine a lot. I just wish the multiplayer had been more stable. 
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Oct 18, 2013 14:20
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ElPedro posted:2: There's a lot of lore/fluff regarding the Horus Heresy and the general history of the universe. Have you guys gotten it all from the various wiki-sites, dedicated to WH40K? Or is it from White Dwarf or some such?
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Oct 18, 2013 14:31
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The attitude concerning the Ultramarines actually seems dramatically improved compared to when I was more active around 3rd edition. Back then they had little to no redeeming factors, and the Battle for Macragge box set was one of the only ones around. This led to a lot of space marine players choosing ultramarines, particularly new players who were younger.
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Oct 18, 2013 14:32
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Yeah, MP was great the 1 in 4 times when the lag wasn't ridiculous from p2ping with a host on the other side of the world. Oh, and it deleted my unlock progress. Twice. The SP was pretty fun too, up until they put the bits in with the psycher+IG combos that forced you to sit behind cover and plink away. The final boss encounter and ending were pretty lame too. Still, busting up huge mobs of orks in the first 1/3 or so of the game was a blast.
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Oct 18, 2013 14:33
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PrBacterio posted:I hate on-rails shooters (or games that require you to slavishly follow whatever predetermined course the developers decided you should follow, instead of just letting you play) in general. You could do basically NOTHING yourself in this game; it was all, walk to the next sequence point => let the sequence play while basically pushing buttons in whatever order to make the encounter go away => rinse => repeat. Fair enough that you didn't like the game, but this is a bizarre critique. What kind of (single-player) shooter is not on rails? Any shooter I can think of in recent memory, from BioShock Infinity to Dishonoured to Tomb Raider to Call of Duty, demands you follow the path set by the developer. Any freedom you feel is very, very shallow (hence the point of the original BioShock's twist); collect more resources, see a few things, uncover a few more narrative puzzle pieces, but eventually it boils down to "you have to go here and do this". Only games like Minecraft are really exempt from that criticism. In the context of being a 40K licence and a third-person action shooter, I enjoyed Space Marine as an unabashed tribute to bolter porn, and on veteran difficulty it was a solid challenge. Plus, as others have commented, multiplayer was fantastic fun (when it worked...).
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Oct 18, 2013 14:43
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The greatest disappointment for me was the Titan. They really hype up how important that thing is, then when you see it you get a bland construct of the same poo-brown color as the rest of the Forge World, lumbering down a corridor. That is what everyone is fussing about? I was hoping for some real Pacific Rim moments.
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Oct 18, 2013 14:45
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Think ADB will write more about Angorn's giant rear end sword? Between Betrayer and Emperor's Gift he's written the beginning and end of the weapon.
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Oct 18, 2013 15:06
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Khizan posted:Hyperion's justicar/squad leader is actually the one to ask about this. I don't think it's ever stated, but I got the feeling that they generally assumed that since there's no armor in the entire loving galaxy that will stand up to a single hit from Angron they might as well be comfortable when they die. Safety Factor posted:Did we play the same game? I won't deny that multiplayer was a lot of fun. But that was only when the thing worked. The matchmaking and peer-to-peer set-up made most games a laggy mess. Targets frequently became invincible or teleported around. I know I was shot through plenty of walls when I played. If it had worked properly people would probably still be playing it. The survival mode managed to avoid most of the same issues, but it was limited to 4 players and not 16 like the regular multiplayer. It was less likely to get stuck playing with someone with a bad connection which would manage to slow the game down for everyone.
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Oct 18, 2013 15:20
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Arquinsiel posted:Wait... they changed it so that they weren't Terminators that fought Angron now? Ugh, fukkin GW. Nah, everyone wears terminator armour still, Hyperion basically says he prefers mobility, and the Captain responds with if you can survive a second more it'll be worth it. Or something.
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Oct 18, 2013 15:46
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Yep. There ain't nothin' wrong with that battle of armageddon sequence and we all know it. It is by far the greatest  section of any BL book, and until "and then the emperor killed horus and it was totally loving sweet" it will remain so.edit: looking back on my posts in this thread, it's 50% "go read flashman" and 50% "rarrr the battle for armageddon is 40k as gently caress" lenoon fucked around with this message at 16:15 on Oct 18, 2013 |
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Oct 18, 2013 16:12
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That scene was great but I hated how abruptly it ended. The sword breaks and it cuts to the aftermath where we're told Angron died on his way back to his home planet.
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Oct 18, 2013 16:48
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Kegslayer posted:Bit off topic but have you played Space Marine? The multi player did a really good job of balancing super power armour and the weapons. A lot of the limitations of the game were probably due to THQ's death spiral. I know I had a lot of fun with the multiplayer. The single player stuff could have stood for some improvement but the atmosphere and sounds were great. Relic also did a nice job with Lt. Mira given how seldom you might see a woman play a major role in a WH40k story.
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Oct 18, 2013 16:59
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Space Marine was the best space man dress up doll simulator.
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Oct 18, 2013 17:04
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