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Did the first day of my MSF course today. So far riding around on motorcycles is super fun and not so hard, but hanging my helmet on the bar end so that it doesn't fall off and hit the ground is very hard.  The weather was perfect for riding though, sunny and got up to about 70. Can't wait to go bike shopping. So far nothing really exciting as most of the people have some (or a lot) of experience with motorcycles, just one guy who even after 4-5 hours of riding couldn't really get launching in first gear without stalling down. Looking forward to this box U-turn I've read so much about tomorrow.Am I supposed to keep my left hand covering the clutch all the time when I'm riding? They said not to keep my right hand over the front brake and that makes sense because it's harder to operate the throttle and a panic grab may not be the best plan. I'm coming from a lot of mountain biking so I'm trying to figure out what to do with/about my habit which is to keep 2 fingers on both levers at all times. 3 of the people in my class out of 8 have motorcycles and are apparently riding them around without a license, in 2 cases for many years. Is this common? That seems really weird to me.
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Oct 19, 2013 23:20
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| # ? May 28, 2024 18:45 |
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HiggsBoson81 posted:Did the first day of my MSF course today. So far riding around on motorcycles is super fun and not so hard, but hanging my helmet on the bar end so that it doesn't fall off and hit the ground is very hard. Keep your helmet on the ground, makes it harder to drop. Cover the clutch only on the first 2 or 3 exercises. Once you feel comfortable, then just wrap your hand around the grip and use the clutch as needed. It's very (all too) common for people to ride around for years without a license. In the small town in Wisconsin where I taught, there were guys and gals that had been riding for 20 - 30 years and never bothered to get a license. Most of those folks never rode outside the county(bar hopping, one guy had bought a bike brand new in 1988 and when he took the MSF in 2010 to get his license he had put a grand total of 3K miles on the bike). When you're letting the clutch out and it's just starting to get into the friction zone and your barely moving along, freeze your clutch hand(left) and slow count to 3 as you feed it small (fairly small) amounts of throttle. At the end of "3" you should have enough power fed in and enough speed to slowly let the clutch out the rest of the way. (doesn't always work deoending ont he bike, you might need to let the clutch out more, feed more throttle, count a hair longer) Don't stress the U-turn area, it's a very good skill to have and shows good control of the motorcycle, but it's not a life saving skill. If you're comfortable slipping the clutch and feeding power while in the friction zone try the exercise in second gear(especially if your on a single cylinder bike) it helps keep the bike pitching back and forth if you over use the throttle. You'll need to feed a bit more power into the bike though when going around. If you're a light weight (I'll say under 180 pounds, you should almost be able to do the exercise at idle.) Good luck.
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Oct 20, 2013 00:40
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1-dont hang that helmet from the bars. Set it on the ground or hang it from the passenger pegs. My instructor railed on us any time we got caught doing this due to unseen damage. 2-you don't need to cover the brakes or clutch. 3-the box is fun. Make you you look at the exit, adjust your weight, and with decent clutch control you'll be just fine. 4-who knows what is common. The general population is tarded and I would not be surprised is many ride for years with no motorbike endorsement.
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Oct 20, 2013 00:44
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HiggsBoson81 posted:I'm coming from a lot of mountain biking so I'm trying to figure out what to do with/about my habit which is to keep 2 fingers on both levers at all times. I was doing this in my MSF also, and also because of mountain biking. I'm just so used to riding around with a couple fingers resting on the brake lever, and braking with just 2 fingers, which the MSF instructor had to remind me not to do.
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Oct 20, 2013 00:54
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Yup, happened to me too, for the same reason. Took a little while to untrain that habit.
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Oct 20, 2013 01:10
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I don't think I've ever hit the brake with more than two fingers but YMMV. Also I find it funny that the MSF course moderately contradicts the NYS Motorcycle learners manual. The instructors tell you not to hold a hand over the brake when you know you're going to have to stop, the NYS manual tells you to cover the brake any time you fell you may need to stop suddenly. I get the purpose of the don't cover the break rule is EMERGENCY BREAKING and all that, but on the road not once have I had to put myself or be put in a situation where I didn't have the ability to realize "Uh oh, this might be a bad spot" and prepare to clutch and brake. Basically just make sure you don't cover the brake lever for the course and then resume normal brain activity once you hit the road. My class had several people who were riding bikes without licenses as well. Digital_Jesus fucked around with this message at 02:03 on Oct 20, 2013 |
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Oct 20, 2013 02:00
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Our instructor told us to cover the controls when we may have to stop quickly such as going through a sketchy intersection. Then again, they also told us to use all four fingers on the controls. Some trail riding broke me out of that habit pretty quickly. Using two fingers is superior.
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Oct 20, 2013 03:14
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It took me a while to get the hang of using the rear brake, since I had also only ever ridden bicycles (a couple days with friends' dirt bikes as a kid doesn't really count) and so was used to stopping with hand levers. After I did get used to the motorcycle brake setup, I actually switched all my bicycles over so that the front brake is on the right thinking that it would help reinforce the muscle memory. Dunno if it actually makes any difference but it doesn't hurt. Digital_Jesus posted:EMERGENCY BREAKING So I guess this is like when fighter jets come in for an emergency landing and they have to dump fuel and weapons to stay light enough to land safely, except it's your motorcycle dumping parts all over the road to lose weight and reduce the stopping distance?
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Oct 20, 2013 04:41
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High Speed Low Drag Tactical Lay 'Er Down. (H.S.L.D.T.L.H.D)
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Oct 20, 2013 05:33
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Sagebrush posted:
This is SOP for KTMs.
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Oct 20, 2013 05:35
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Passed BRC today. Could not get the u-turn down the entire time. Before the exam, I decided to do it in first instead of second as I kept stalling out. Went perfect. Half of my class failed the practical. Was a bit surprised at that.
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Oct 20, 2013 20:50
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Thanks for the advice guys, also passed my BRC today. Only 3 points off for taking the curve at the end a little too slow. Everyone in my class passed with me, didn't really get the feeling they fail many people.
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Oct 20, 2013 21:30
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HiggsBoson81 posted:Thanks for the advice guys, also passed my BRC today. Only 3 points off for taking the curve at the end a little too slow. Everyone in my class passed with me, didn't really get the feeling they fail many people. In my experience, there's a little bit of a weed out. If you're too nervous/incompetent to learn these basic skills, the instructors are good at quietly taking you aside and convincing you to maybe take the class again later. That happened to one person when I took the class -- she was so slow and timid with everything that, at the end of the first day, I noticed the instructor having a conversation with her in private, and she didn't come back the next day. Another person (on the next range over) crashed his or her bike on the second day and, as far as I know, got back on and finished the class. Safety Dance fucked around with this message at 23:02 on Oct 20, 2013 |
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Oct 20, 2013 23:00
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Booked the MSF BRC for this weekend. The website wasn't terribly clear and I was dumb not to ask, but they require you bring your own DOT rated helmet. I panicked a bit, but then asked a friend who is a retired bike racer and he will lend me his for the weekend. Didn't want to be rushed into a helmet purchase at the local gear shop, but silly of me not to check what they meant by "wear protective gear during the course". Can't wait.
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Oct 25, 2013 01:52
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The brochure for the MSF course I'm planning on lists all the necessary gear. Then lower there's a small blurb about having gloves and helmets available, at no extra charge. I'd call and ask.
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Oct 25, 2013 03:18
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Russian Bear posted:Booked the MSF BRC for this weekend. The website wasn't terribly clear and I was dumb not to ask, but they require you bring your own DOT rated helmet. I panicked a bit, but then asked a friend who is a retired bike racer and he will lend me his for the weekend. Didn't want to be rushed into a helmet purchase at the local gear shop, but silly of me not to check what they meant by "wear protective gear during the course". Can't wait. As said call and ask. At the 3 sites I've taught at and the 2 others I've taken courses at, they all had spare helmets. Though that being said, bring a hair net or something with you to slip on. One of a number of things in life I don't like to share is a helmet.
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Oct 25, 2013 08:39
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Skreemer posted:One of a number of things in life I don't like to share is a helmet. Helmets are like condoms: 1. They may not be the most comfortable thing to wear but they very well may save your life. 2. They get kinda gross once you've had your head inside of it for a while. 3. Once they've been used for their intended purpose they're trash and should never be used again. 4. They come in all sorts of colors. 5. Never, ever, EVER, buy a used one.
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Oct 27, 2013 01:29
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You guys were right, they had loaners and bonus is I know my head shape is a good fit in Nolan helmets. I passed! I ended up being really good at slow maneuvers and got the box first try. We rode Honda nighthawks and boy do those drum brakes blow rear end. Caliper disks are way better right?
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Oct 28, 2013 00:27
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Russian Bear posted:You guys were right, they had loaners and bonus is I know my head shape is a good fit in Nolan helmets. I passed! I ended up being really good at slow maneuvers and got the box first try. We rode Honda nighthawks and boy do those drum brakes blow rear end. Caliper disks are way better right? Yaaaay! Congratulations! Everyone should have to ride with drum brakes once, so they know how good disk brakes feel. Basically, they're capable of stopping harder, and you get a much more linear feeling out of them.
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Oct 28, 2013 01:42
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Russian Bear posted:got the box first try. Russian Bear posted:those drum brakes blow rear end. Caliper disks are way better right?
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Oct 28, 2013 06:07
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Congrats on passing. Drum brakes suck to maintain properly and are usually more "fiddly" than they are worth.
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Oct 28, 2013 06:19
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KodiakRS posted:I know that if I ever had to make an emergency stop with drum brakes I'd be blowing all sorts of things out my rear end. The last time I had to emergency stop using motorcycle drums, I wound up on my rear end.
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Oct 28, 2013 06:34
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Safety Dance posted:The last time I had to emergency stop using motorcycle drums, I wound up on my rear end.
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Oct 28, 2013 20:54
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Which sucks because there are so many awesome old vintage pre-1950s bikes that I'd love to get, but they always have tiny little drum brakes. I wouldn't mind the slowness, or the suspension, or the engine vibrations, but I'd kind of like to be able to brake well.
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Oct 28, 2013 21:17
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When I took the course I did the double u-turn perfectly just riding the clutch. When they actually tested my nerves got to me and went out of bounds. I still passed because they're pretty forgiving though. What I'm trying to say is relax.
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Oct 29, 2013 02:20
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LifeSizePotato posted:Which sucks because there are so many awesome old vintage pre-1950s bikes that I'd love to get, Depending on bike, some 50s/60s BMWs and Triumphs had decent brakes. Full width dual leading link is what you want. If you're hardcore enough you can usually find some kinda performance/race conversions for most old things that'll improve it a lot.
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Oct 29, 2013 02:33
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Zasraik posted:When I took the course I did the double u-turn perfectly just riding the clutch. When they actually tested my nerves got to me and went out of bounds. I still passed because they're pretty forgiving though. I think I sucked because my little bike kept stalling out in second gear (eat some salad, fat goon, hurr).
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Oct 29, 2013 04:45
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Evil SpongeBob posted:I think I sucked because my little bike kept stalling out in second gear (eat some salad, fat goon, hurr). Nope, sorry, your fat rear end has nothing to do with it stalling. 
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Oct 29, 2013 08:14
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Hey, you don't know that. Maybe his rear end is so fat that it spilled over the seat and down the sides and swamped the airbox and choked out the engine.
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Oct 29, 2013 08:18
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Pehaps his sheer frontal area and scraggly neckbeard presented too much aero drag even at parking lot speeds for the bike to punch through?
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Oct 29, 2013 09:09
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His fedora whipped off and got caught in his chain, causing too much resistance and ultimately his bike to stall
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Oct 29, 2013 16:19
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Don't forget the Cheetos dust clogging the intakes as well as not allowing any friction between the throttle any my hand. I can't explain it. I stalled, went outside the lines and could not complete it in second gear the previous 5-6 times. Decided to do the test in first and...zero points off.
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Oct 30, 2013 02:32
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Evil SpongeBob posted:Don't forget the Cheetos dust clogging the intakes as well as not allowing any friction between the throttle any my hand. Slip the clutch more and keep the revs high (I just like to make a lot of noise when I demo that exercise).
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Oct 30, 2013 05:29
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KodiakRS posted:The big one or the one you use on the test? When I did the big one first, I had lots of room to spare and the instructor told me to next time around just do the "test box" (before we officially moved on to it) and I did it first time. During the test at the end he commented that my low speed stuff was excellent; I chalk it up to all the bicycling last two years, especially MTB. On the flip side, my one thing I had trouble with is the emergency stop with the cones and I had to practice a bunch. Something about the cones threw me off, because when we did the emergency braking upon instructor signal I did just fine.
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Oct 30, 2013 19:20
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Russian Bear posted:When I did the big one first, I had lots of room to spare and the instructor told me to next time around just do the "test box" (before we officially moved on to it) and I did it first time. During the test at the end he commented that my low speed stuff was excellent; I chalk it up to all the bicycling last two years, especially MTB. On the flip side, my one thing I had trouble with is the emergency stop with the cones and I had to practice a bunch. Something about the cones threw me off, because when we did the emergency braking upon instructor signal I did just fine. Target fixation, try not to look at the cones.
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Oct 31, 2013 13:44
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Yeah. The teacher at the MSF started it, and instructors at the track really hammered it the gently caress home, but literally moving your head and looking to where you want to end up and not solely focusing on where you're currently traveling through will prevent target fixation and prevent a lot of silly little spills as well as saving your life in traffic.
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Oct 31, 2013 18:07
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Had my first day out on the course today, first time riding a motorcycle too actually. The hardest thing for me is shifting; trying to coordinate my hands and left foot while riding for the first time was...disconcerting, especially while cornering. I guess it's just like when I learned to drive a stick shift, practice will make perfect.
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Nov 17, 2013 00:31
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Did my first day of msf today, too. I feel like an idiot because I have no experience with stick shift anything and I kept stalling out in first and braking because I didn't "get" clutch control for the first hour or two. Also, I might be wrong but as a guy over six feet i'm not sure if the only ninja 250 on the lot was the best fit. Here's hoping tomorrow things will fall into place more, since I really did enjoy the riding part!
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Nov 17, 2013 02:59
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for sale posted:Did my first day of msf today, too. I feel like an idiot because I have no experience with stick shift anything and I kept stalling out in first and braking because I didn't "get" clutch control for the first hour or two. Also, I might be wrong but as a guy over six feet i'm not sure if the only ninja 250 on the lot was the best fit. Here's hoping tomorrow things will fall into place more, since I really did enjoy the riding part! Experience on a manual car isn't really that useful, or it wasn't for me. I've driven a manual for 15 years and all that did was have me trying to never use the friction point to control the power to the rear wheel because that's not a thing you should do in a car. It's a practice thing no matter what your background I think, it'll get easier. The second day for us had a lot more time on the bikes and that helped a lot for me.
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Nov 17, 2013 03:49
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| # ? May 28, 2024 18:45 |
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HiggsBoson81 posted:Experience on a manual car isn't really that useful, or it wasn't for me. I've driven a manual for 15 years and all that did was have me trying to never use the friction point to control the power to the rear wheel because that's not a thing you should do in a car. As a person who drives a stick this was my experience too. In the last couple exercises today I stalled out 2 or 3 teams as I felt fatigue begin to set in. I'm hoping more practice on the bike tomorrow will help.
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Nov 17, 2013 05:14
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