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Skaw posted:The only pre-hardmode summoning item I'm aware of is the Slime Staff. And it's 8 damage. Also super rare. Not if you set some slime statues on lava.
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Nov 3, 2013 10:03
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benzine posted:Not if you set some slime statues on lava. No, it's still super rare even then. It just makes it faster to get.
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Nov 3, 2013 10:05
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KataraniSword posted:Yeah, melee is sincerely the worst idea in the Hardmode Dungeon no matter what. You don't want to get anywhere NEAR the enemies, and most of them have means of taking you out at a distance anyway. Golden Shower and/or a Megashark with good enough bullets (Ichor, Chlorophyte, or Crystal usually) will typically keep things at bay long enough for you to get SOME ectoplasm or one of the dungeon magics (Inferno Fork, Shadowbeam Staff, or Magnet Sphere), and from there you should be fine for the most part. Just try to keep mobile; staying too long in one spot is asking to get ganked by a Skeleton Sniper or Diabolist. The problem with the melee builds is that the best melee weapons for the situation are usually found in the hardmode dungeon. The only ones I can think of that you can get elsewhere are the Terra Blade and the Posessed Hatchet, which go out of style once you get the Vampire Knives, Scourge of the Corruptor or Paladin's Hammer. Even then, by the time you get those, you'll probably have the better, if not best, ranged and magic options.
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Nov 3, 2013 10:40
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J.A.B.C. posted:The problem with the melee builds is that the best melee weapons for the situation are usually found in the hardmode dungeon. The only ones I can think of that you can get elsewhere are the Terra Blade and the Posessed Hatchet, which go out of style once you get the Vampire Knives, Scourge of the Corruptor or Paladin's Hammer. Even then, by the time you get those, you'll probably have the better, if not best, ranged and magic options. Another problem is that all of those, despite doing melee damage, are all used as ranged weaponry, save for the Terra Blade, which DOES have a ranged option, it's just that it rather sucks. If you're using ranged damage and calling it melee, it only matters in terms of what armor you should be putting on.
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Nov 3, 2013 11:27
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At this point I have pretty much kicked the poo poo out of normal mode but I am scared to activate hardmode. I have the night blade, ivy whip, hellstone tools, jungle, necro, and hellstone armors, space gun and armor, and magic scythe move. It seems like both ranged options are rather weak. I have been using the space gun mostly but am worried it is not going to cut it in hard more. Is there a better ranged options I should acquire first?
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Nov 3, 2013 16:23
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DrPlump posted:At this point I have pretty much kicked the poo poo out of normal mode but I am scared to activate hardmode. I have the night blade, ivy whip, hellstone tools, jungle, necro, and hellstone armors, space gun and armor, and magic scythe move. Just take the plunge into hardmode. Hardmode is a lot of fun and opens up a lot of new toys to play with.
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Nov 3, 2013 16:25
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If you're worried, you can always create a separate world for hardmode and keep your current one as it is. With your equipment you are fine for making the shift. You'll still want to find or craft new stuff as you go, of course, but you won't get gimped by the new enemies straight away. Your mindset will get you killed far more than your equipment - you'll be in a similar position to when you were just starting out, where every enemy is a threat to be careful of, so you can't act as you're probably used to and slaughter your way heedlessly to wherever you want to go. Get back into that trepid mindset of the early game and you'll be fine until you've got strong enough to go back to being invincible.
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Nov 3, 2013 16:34
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I would recommend you to search where are located some of the demonic altars in your world before activating hardmode. The more you have located and destroy once you activate hardmode the more new minerals will spawn in your world making it easier to find them.
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Nov 3, 2013 16:41
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loving finally I have some decent weapons. Plinking away at the skeletron with a platinum bow was extremely tedious. Armor is a pain to find though. I'd like to say i cleaned out most of the dungeon, and raided a good chunk of underworld houses, but I'm still sporting platinum armor.
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Nov 3, 2013 17:39
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What's the deal with large dirt circles appearing all over my map? I don't remember triggering anything but I just noticed that they're all over the place now, including large circles in the temple walls.
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Nov 3, 2013 17:49
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Fargin Icehole posted:I'm still sporting platinum armor. The next tiers of armour are Demonite/Crimtane (requires Shadow Scales/Tissue Samples from the Eater of Worlds/Brain of Cthulu) Meteorite (from meteorites) Necro (made from cobwebs and bones, good for ranged characters) Jungle (made from jungle spores, stingers and vines, good for magic characters) Hellstone (made from hellstone ore and obsidian) At your level you should be able to make any of these.
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Nov 3, 2013 17:52
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Fargin Icehole posted:loving finally I have some decent weapons. Plinking away at the skeletron with a platinum bow was extremely tedious. Armor is a pain to find though. I'd like to say i cleaned out most of the dungeon, and raided a good chunk of underworld houses, but I'm still sporting platinum armor. Have you beaten the Brain/Eater of Worlds? Get yourself a Nightmare pickaxe and start mining Hellstone. Or go for Jungle or Necro armor depending on what offense you're working on.
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Nov 3, 2013 18:00
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Also consider making a staff. Platinum + diamonds for a great multi-hit ranged weapon.
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Nov 3, 2013 21:29
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Jimbone Tallshanks posted:Have you beaten the Brain/Eater of Worlds? Get yourself a Nightmare pickaxe and start mining Hellstone. Or go for Jungle or Necro armor depending on what offense you're working on. I took down the Brain recently, and crafted that pickaxe, along with some crimson armor, and i'm gonna start mining some Hellstone. I use sunfury mostly, I'd like to do melee, but all signs point to ranged.
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Nov 3, 2013 22:59
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Melee is perfectly valid up until you hit Wall of Flesh and Hardmode. Then it becomes pretty much useless outside of the Mushroom Spear to poke things through walls. Would also highly suggest mining up some Meteorite to make a Space Gun and Meteor Armour, it's pretty hilariously powerful pre-HM. v: Why would you use a Fire Gauntlet over a Destroyer Emblem? The knockback from the gauntlets are meh, and the loss of crit in exchange for 1 damage fire isn't the best trade off. Rynoto fucked around with this message at 23:11 on Nov 3, 2013 |
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Nov 3, 2013 23:05
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Rynoto posted:Melee is perfectly valid up until you hit Wall of Flesh and Hardmode. Then it becomes pretty much useless outside of the Mushroom Spear to poke things through walls.
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Nov 3, 2013 23:07
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Rynoto posted:Melee is perfectly valid up until you hit Wall of Flesh and Hardmode. Then it becomes pretty much useless outside of the Mushroom Spear to poke things through walls. Melee is perfectly valid for low resource usage when you're just doing day to day exploration, outside of the hardmode jungle/dungeon of course. It only really falls flat during Invasions/blood moons/vs Bosses. Get a Phasesaber (or Cobalt sword? Not sure on that one) and you're fine for regular exploration. Of course Range is for blowing things up with huge numbers and Magic has all the fun effects, but Melee is a decent fallback.
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Nov 3, 2013 23:16
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So with the +Crit modifier going up to 8% now, is it better than +4% damage?
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Nov 3, 2013 23:19
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So is it just me, or is Crimtane armor the absolute best pre-hardmode? Even though Molten gives better defense, that regen bonus is just silly.
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Nov 3, 2013 23:50
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Deific Presence posted:So is it just me, or is Crimtane armor the absolute best pre-hardmode? Even though Molten gives better defense, that regen bonus is just silly.
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Nov 4, 2013 01:09
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So my super twinked out hardcore character loaded into a fresh world and was instagibbed for no reason. Some glitch 
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Nov 4, 2013 01:28
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That sounds like a really weird feature, like, "No, you dont get to make a new world, its a hardcore character! Play until you die!"
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Nov 4, 2013 02:32
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Did you try to escape a Wall of Flesh fight by quitting and moving to another world? That'll happen if you did.
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Nov 4, 2013 02:44
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MR. J posted:Did you try to escape a Wall of Flesh fight by quitting and moving to another world? That'll happen if you did.
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Nov 4, 2013 02:45
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MR. J posted:Did you try to escape a Wall of Flesh fight by quitting and moving to another world? That'll happen if you did. I've used the mirror to get home and was instagibbed before. It happened when I hadn't set up a bed in that world. The Wall wasn't involved in my case.
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Nov 4, 2013 07:35
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So I finally took my hardcore character into hardmode after constructing a proper floating base. Killed WoF 3 times or so, got laser rifle and stuff. And then... Welp. I'm sure I can handle that!  It took a lot of time and running around inside/outside the house to not risk it, but I guess it paid off:  After that I finally went to smash altars, mined, killed WoF few more times (still no clockwork rifle) and now have full Orichalcum armor. God, that looks awful. At least my strategy for avoiding spontaneous boss spawns works: you just need to spend nights underground.
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Nov 4, 2013 14:08
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Do the different dungeon types /have/ to spawn? I can't find a tiled dungeon on my friends server.
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Nov 4, 2013 14:34
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Dungeon sub-biomes can sometimes be limited to one room or even not appear at all. I think the dungeon brick area has to exist though. This is probably less likely on large worlds, but I don't know.
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Nov 4, 2013 14:40
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GobiasIndustries posted:What's the deal with large dirt circles appearing all over my map? I don't remember triggering anything but I just noticed that they're all over the place now, including large circles in the temple walls. Sounds like tedit's 'spawn ores' option.
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Nov 4, 2013 16:06
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So they made it so that if you use a teleporter while fighting Plantera it despawns, so there went my plan. I've got full Shroomite Gear and a Megashark with like 3000 crystal bullets. I should be able to kill it pretty easy, right?
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Nov 4, 2013 20:08
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Chug an Iron Skin and a Regen potion if you don't feel confident, but yeah, you shouldn't have any problem with that setup.
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Nov 4, 2013 20:12
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First time I killed Plantera I did so with plenty of running room, crystal bullets and a ruthless mega shark. I had a patch of jungle (that I planted) near my four screen wide crystal farm, so I was able to run across that and then double back while shooting. Had chlorophyte armor, ironskin and regen pots on. In short, if you have plenty of room to run or maneuver I think you'll do fine. Oh, and get the pumpkin pie well fed buff for good measure. 
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Nov 4, 2013 20:29
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The first time I fought it the bulb spawned really low in the jungle, near my underworld bridge i built to fight the wall of flesh. don't lure it down there because if you do it will just go apeshit and kill you immediately. I assume it's the same behavior that it does when you lure it to the surface.
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Nov 4, 2013 20:40
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andrew smash posted:The first time I fought it the bulb spawned really low in the jungle, near my underworld bridge i built to fight the wall of flesh. don't lure it down there because if you do it will just go apeshit and kill you immediately. I assume it's the same behavior that it does when you lure it to the surface. Correct. If it thinks it's in any biome that's not Underground Jungle, it goes into an unkillable murder frenzy. This includes the Temple, Corruption/Crimson/Hallow, anything that's not strictly Underground Jungle. It's also super picky, too. But apparently Red got Absolute Virtue syndrome. 
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Nov 4, 2013 20:42
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Kyrosiris posted:Correct. If it thinks it's in any biome that's not Underground Jungle, it goes into an unkillable murder frenzy. This includes the Temple, Corruption/Crimson/Hallow, anything that's not strictly Underground Jungle. It's also super picky, too. Well there's a reference I didn't expect to see. Back when I played FFXI, I played on the server that had the linkshell that kept finding ways to beat Absolute Virtue in ways that the developers didn't intend, eventually ending in several hotfixes and GMs threatening to ban them all if they kept it up. They then introduced a boss that absolutely required poopsocking to brute-force until another linkshell on some other server had people get health issues from the 11+ hour fight and they got a shitload of bad press. Instead of making the boss mechanics less arcane, they just put a two hour time limit on it. FFXI was a game design dinosaur in so many ways.
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Nov 4, 2013 21:02
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Daeren posted:Well there's a reference I didn't expect to see. For those that understand the reference, it's a very succinct way to say "X developer got whiny about 'unintended' strategies making their boss easier and 'fixed' it in a super-hamfisted manner". Also I'm so glad you still have that avatar. Loved that LP.
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Nov 4, 2013 21:05
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Daeren posted:Well there's a reference I didn't expect to see. Back when I played FFXI, I played on the server that had the linkshell that kept finding ways to beat Absolute Virtue in ways that the developers didn't intend, eventually ending in several hotfixes and GMs threatening to ban them all if they kept it up. They then introduced a boss that absolutely required poopsocking to brute-force until another linkshell on some other server had people get health issues from the 11+ hour fight and they got a shitload of bad press. Instead of making the boss mechanics less arcane, they just put a two hour time limit on it. Well, bosses having enrage timers isn't exactly unique to FFXI. Most raid bosses in WoW have a berserk timer that gives them +500% attack speed and +150% damage if you take too long to kill them, mostly so that you don't just bring a raid full of healers and attrition them to death. But in that case, they're usually designed such that unless you go out of your way you're not going to run into them or the fight is designed around the timer, such that you have to stay alive while dealing sufficient damage to the boss before it goes nuts and murders you, as opposed to being a band-aid solution to it being a poorly-designed piece of poo poo.
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Nov 4, 2013 21:10
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President Ark posted:Well, bosses having enrage timers isn't exactly unique to FFXI. Most raid bosses in WoW have a berserk timer that gives them +500% attack speed and +150% damage if you take too long to kill them, mostly so that you don't just bring a raid full of healers and attrition them to death. But in that case, they're usually designed such that unless you go out of your way you're not going to run into them or the fight is designed around the timer, such that you have to stay alive while dealing sufficient damage to the boss before it goes nuts and murders you, as opposed to being a band-aid solution to it being a poorly-designed piece of poo poo. To elaborate on the timer, Pandaemonium Warden wasn't set to enrage after two hours, he just vanished. Nothing else about that fight changed. Absolute Virtue, meanwhile, had spells players wouldn't get for YEARS, every single job's two-hour cooldown power, and could spam them, including the one that completely healed him. This made fighting him legitimately effectively impossible, so The Wall of Justice (a zone divider that was JUST short enough to let people on the far side target Absolute Virtue without being targeted back) and other exploits were used to kill him like clockwork to get his drops once they were figured out. Of course, Squeenix threw a shitfit and patched out all the ways of dealing with him except their intended version, which they eventually had to spell out for the playerbase because nobody ever figured it out. It was something like "when Absolute Virtue uses one of its two-hour job abilities, someone in the alliance fighting it must IMMEDIATELY use the same ability and then Absolute Virtue will no longer be able to use it." It was a really obtuse, unexplained, no-hints way of trying to get an alliance with most of the jobs in the game together to fight him, except all you had to do was lock down his Mage abilities and a few other troublesome ones from common jobs and go for a tank-and-spank.  I played too much loving FFXI. I remember when Goblin Smithies were the incarnation of Pubbie Tears, dragged to zone boundaries by veterans to sit there forever, one-shotting any poor idiot who wanted to come level.
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Nov 4, 2013 21:16
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Daeren posted:
Let's not forget the death penalty, combined with the games infancy with regards to experience gain strategies and locations, resulted in the loss of at least 30 minutes worth of exp grinding work at points. Significantly longer if you're a class that was undesirable in a party.
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Nov 4, 2013 21:53
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Daeren posted:To elaborate on the timer, Pandaemonium Warden wasn't set to enrage after two hours, he just vanished. Nothing else about that fight changed. The third boss had a large knockback that reset agro, forcing dps to halt attacking or be instagibbed, an ability that hit the tank very hard and most of the challenge came from the constantly respawning enemies in his room and the respawn timer on a bigger nearby enemy that placed a debuff on the tank that would almost certainly kill him if he got hit to it during the bossfight. Literally all of this can be trivialized by having the tank cower behind that chair in the previous room. The 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th boss all have the same problem. Blizzard hotfixed it fairly quickly, but not quick enough to start a "kite it to Vael's room" meme and since then all bosses either lock you into their room when the fight starts or disengage and reset when moved too far. Then there was Lord Kazzak, who was a boss walking around in the open world, who, if he wasn't dead in 6 minutes, would enter "Supreme Mode", which meant that he would start casting all his abilities every second and become practically invincible. The most dangerous of these abilities were a debuff called Twisted Reflections that healed him every time the victim would take damage and a volley of projectiles that would damage everything within drawing distance. These abilities made him a fairly challenging fight with the gear available back then when cast every 30 seconds but in Supreme Mode, he would take 50% of everybody's health and heal back to full again every second because they'd overlap. The result was that if somebody managed to lure him to a capital city, the constantly respawning npc's and local players getting killed repeatedly would trap him in an endless loop where he turned the city into a no-man's land and killed everybody who tried to get near, typically resulting in a GM being required to reset him. The early 2000's were a good time for unintended MMO design "features" 
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Nov 4, 2013 21:53
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