Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Locked thread
Perigryn
Oct 22, 2010

TaJaaaaadoruuuuu

Cipher Pol 9 posted:

As for the ending ending: Is Kikaider getting a reboot next, then? Gavan's back, Inazuman is back, the Ironmen and Akumaizer came back. I wonder who else they will try and reboot? Maybe Zubat? He appeared in Let's Go Kamen Riders with Inazu and Kikaider, so maybe?
There has been talk of a reboot for him for the past year or so. Apart from that, nothing's surfaced since.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

SpiderHyphenMan
Apr 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy
I really hope next year's Sentai also has ten rangers so we get a 20-man roll call in the team-up movie.

Blaze Dragon
Aug 28, 2013
LOWTAX'S SPINE FUND

SpiderHyphenMan posted:

I really hope next year's Sentai also has ten rangers so we get a 20-man roll call in the team-up movie.
Clearly, rather than that, we need a Dekaranger vs Kyoryuger. Bring back DekaGold and DekaBright, as completely pointless as they were.

Cernunnos
Sep 2, 2011

ppbbbbttttthhhhh~
I've seen a number of people not liking Den-O in this thread. Is that just because TVN has the only subs.
I can't wait for Onore to finish and release their subs for it 'cause I've really been meaning to rewatch it but I really don't want to sit through TVN's subs of it again for obvious reasons.


Also Fourze is a great series and Meteor has probably my favorite transformation sequence. It's just so Disco.
:swoon::swoon:
I couldn't find a decent GIF of the actual transformation OK

Liar Lyre
Jun 3, 2011

Here to deliver
~Bad Opinions~

Meteor is kinda a butt until his little story is finished. Once he solved his problem, he was so much more tolerable.

Vandar
Sep 14, 2007

Isn't That Right, Chairman?



My thoughts on this week's Kyoryuger: Oh, so the Deboss legion has opened the portal to hell, and past monsters are being revived? This should lead to a pretty nice multiple episode storyline, and it co...oh, okay. Glad that's taken care of I guess. :V

We're entering into the end-game territory of the series. What old plotlines are left for them to close up? Dogold and Endorf, Chaos' Deboss hand, and Daigo's dad. That doesn't seem like much. I guess things are going to start ramping pretty hard soon.

toomanyninjas
Feb 10, 2005

DOGOLD, I WANT YOU TO CALL AN AM-BOO-LANCE AND WHEN THEY GET HUR I WANT YOU TO TELL THEM TO
KEEP SMILING!

Dexie posted:

My thoughts on this week's Kyoryuger: Oh, so the Deboss legion has opened the portal to hell, and past monsters are being revived? This should lead to a pretty nice multiple episode storyline, and it co...oh, okay. Glad that's taken care of I guess. :V

We're entering into the end-game territory of the series. What old plotlines are left for them to close up? Dogold and Endorf, Chaos' Deboss hand, and Daigo's dad. That doesn't seem like much. I guess things are going to start ramping pretty hard soon.

But the promo for next week had them fighting some old monsters, so I guess they're going to be tracking down all the spirits that flew out away from the portal.

Dr Tran
Dec 17, 2002

HE'S GOT A PH.D. IN
KICKING YOUR ASS!
Hooked up my pc with my new TV. Sentai is weird with the full on soap opera effect.

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum

Dr Tran posted:

Hooked up my pc with my new TV. Sentai is weird with the full on soap opera effect.

You'd better turn off that artificial "smoothing" or whatever they call it right now mister, or I will come to your house and do it for you!

Cipher Pol 9
Oct 9, 2006


Any rich jerks out there have access to two iPads?

There's a free app on the store called SentaiPad (get it?) with some simple games in it. One's just tapping the Kyoryugers to hear their names, ones a block of Red headshots with a simple quiz mode (find me a kid who knows what ChangeDragon or Red Flash look like and I'll show you a liar), and the last is a super simple poke/drag picture where you can find out some mook names and pretend to fire the Super Highway Buster or Gokai Galleon Buster at them.

But there's more modes that can only be played with two iPads connecting. I think one's Hide and Seek according to my rudimentary Japanese. No idea what the others are. But damned if I'm not curious!

In other unrelated news, the newest Megaforce episode was actually pretty good! It had spots of rough acting, and a kid who wasn't even trying to hide his accent, but the good outweighed the bad IMO. Metal Alice was actually a real villain actively trying to murder some people, RoboKnight had a nice little story, and there was no monster of the week. Then they got a new robot at the end for some reason and defeated Metal Alice but not really. I quite liked it.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

toomanyninjas posted:

But the promo for next week had them fighting some old monsters, so I guess they're going to be tracking down all the spirits that flew out away from the portal.

It also does the (typically American) cliche body switching episode as well as be a Green/Gold episode.

toomanyninjas
Feb 10, 2005

DOGOLD, I WANT YOU TO CALL AN AM-BOO-LANCE AND WHEN THEY GET HUR I WANT YOU TO TELL THEM TO
KEEP SMILING!

Xelkelvos posted:

It also does the (typically American) cliche body switching episode as well as be a Green/Gold episode.

Debo FreakyFriday

Cliff Racer
Mar 24, 2007

by Lowtax

Xelkelvos posted:

It also does the (typically American) cliche body switching episode as well as be a Green/Gold episode.

Thats actually a pretty standard sentai cliche (well, part of a more generic altered mind or body cliche and isn't really surprising to see.) Episodes like that are usually some of the series' best so I'm excited for it.

Dr Tran
Dec 17, 2002

HE'S GOT A PH.D. IN
KICKING YOUR ASS!

jivjov posted:

You'd better turn off that artificial "smoothing" or whatever they call it right now mister, or I will come to your house and do it for you!

Next episode I'm watching with 3D upconversion

ZenMasterBullshit
Nov 2, 2011

Restaurant de Nouvelles "À Table" Proudly Presents:
A Climactic Encounter Ending on 1 Negate and a Dream

Cliff Racer posted:

Thats actually a pretty standard sentai cliche (well, part of a more generic altered mind or body cliche and isn't really surprising to see.) Episodes like that are usually some of the series' best so I'm excited for it.

Magiranger had a pretty cool one

AzraelNewtype
Nov 9, 2004

「ブレストバーン!!」
So did Gokaiger all of two years ago, so it's not like it's even a stock plot that's fallen into disuse.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

AzraelNewtype posted:

So did Gokaiger all of two years ago, so it's not like it's even a stock plot that's fallen into disuse.

I had completely forgotten about that and Gokaiger was my first Sentai.

SpiderHyphenMan
Apr 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy

ZenMasterBullshit posted:

Magiranger had a pretty cool one

Is that TV-N being TV-N or are they actually talking about what I think they're talking about?

Some Numbers
Sep 28, 2006

"LET'S GET DOWN TO WORK!!"

SpiderHyphenMan posted:

Is that TV-N being TV-N or are they actually talking about what I think they're talking about?

They're talking about what you think they're talking about.

ZenMasterBullshit
Nov 2, 2011

Restaurant de Nouvelles "À Table" Proudly Presents:
A Climactic Encounter Ending on 1 Negate and a Dream

SpiderHyphenMan posted:

Is that TV-N being TV-N or are they actually talking about what I think they're talking about?

What else could the be talking about? They're pantomiming that poo poo!

SpiderHyphenMan
Apr 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy
Now that I think about it, Torin's totally gonna get more airtime (as Kyoryu Silver) than Violet, Cyan, or Grey, because he has a unique toy to advertise.

HKR
Jan 13, 2006

there is no universe where duke nukem would not be a trans ally




Torin is also a male identified character, thus he gets more airtime the a female identified character.

Cliff Racer
Mar 24, 2007

by Lowtax

HKR posted:

Torin is also a male identified character, thus he gets more airtime the a female identified character.

He's also the loving mentor character and has been in, to my knowledge, every episode already regardless of having a suit or not; of course they are going to give him air time.

SpiderHyphenMan
Apr 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy

Cliff Racer posted:

He's also the loving mentor character and has been in, to my knowledge, every episode already regardless of having a suit or not; of course they are going to give him air time.
I mean he's going to get more suit time.Yaoi's been in the last few episodes, but I can't remember the last time we saw the Violet suit.

Justin_Brett
Oct 23, 2012

GAMERDOME put down LOSER
You know you could make a decent case for Torin being just as much the lead as Daigo. I like that.

jivjov
Sep 13, 2007

But how does it taste? Yummy!
Dinosaur Gum
I really hope this week's Kyoryuger gives us a full 10-man roll call. I am a huge sucker for dramatic morphs/rollcalls.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
So I finally finished Liveman yesterday while at my grandmothers house.

It's easily my second favorite Super Sentai and likely has the best story of them all. Hot drat it was good.

Dr Tran
Dec 17, 2002

HE'S GOT A PH.D. IN
KICKING YOUR ASS!

Burkion posted:

So I finally finished Liveman yesterday while at my grandmothers house.

It's easily my second favorite Super Sentai and likely has the best story of them all. Hot drat it was good.

Is it only available hardsubbed?

HKR
Jan 13, 2006

there is no universe where duke nukem would not be a trans ally




Dr Tran posted:

Is it only available hardsubbed?

V2's are coming at some point from GUIS but for now just lovely DVD5 rips and hard subs

BornAPoorBlkChild
Sep 24, 2012
http://danstokurants.rangercentral.com/?p=1581

Anthony posted:


Allow me to introduce myself. My name is Anthony. I am a tokusatsu subber. Now, while I do have some (read: basic) knowledge of Japanese, I’m not the go to guy for translation (extensive translation anyway). The role I play in the grand scheme of things is that I’m primarily a timer, sometimes editor. Over the years, my preference of subbing style has evolved. We’ve all had that “weaboo” phase where leaving in Japanese words and improper romanizations were super-duper awesome and cool and KAWAII DESU LOL~ And for those in the anime fandom, that was a normal thing up to a point. Nowadays, as my Japanese knowledge increases and as I immerse myself in subbing work (well, hobby is the better descriptor), I find I prefer the style of professional subbers. What this means is that the translation is fluid, it isn’t 1:1, and (while some of it MIGHT be localized) the release itself is free from preposterous typesetting.

All that said? We are here to discuss a rather well known group to the tokusatsu fandom. TV-Nihon. Now before we discuss why I have a gripe with them, let me say this to start: I am E-TER-NA-LY grateful for what they’ve done for the fandom. When I watched my first Super Sentai and Kamen Rider series, it was because of them. I owe them my love for the shows before watching raw was a viable option for me. That being said, nowadays we as a fandom have more options to choose from and compare to, so it’s really time to explain why TV-Nihon is a thing of the past and should only be used until viable alternatives make themselves known.

First, we’ll talk about something that’s more preference than anything that’s really wrong… Typesetting. Typesetting, for those unaware, is the process of arranging or generating type, in this case for subtitles. This is also the process in which groups like TV-Nihon add flashy effects to their subs, like vector images to flash alongside the words when a character uses an attack, or colored fonts for when a specific character is talking. These, in my own opinion, are rather superfluous and distract you from the actual reason you’re watching: the show. The shows you’re watching are flashy and dynamic enough to hold your attention. You don’t need the subs to compete with what your watching, especially when the subs are there to make viewing *easier* to understand. I will admit this though: typesetting can be cool, and it’s not something I would fault someone for liking, but honestly, the less attention grabbing your subs are, the better. But if you are a subber who likes adding these effects? The best example to follow is Aesir, where they do typesetting, but offer a clean version of the script for people who don’t want it. That’s the best of both worlds really.





Okay, with that out of the way, let’s play with something that’s more of an issue. Random Japanese being left in. These is rampant in most of their subs (good lord their Gekiranger and Shinkenger are awful about this). Now this is really an issue with me, because the point of subbing something is so you know what it is you’re watching. I’ve seen people on a few boards admit that they learn some Japanese via this method, but let me say this: you will be laughed at for using these random phrases by actual Japanese speakers. It’s happened. Subtitles aren’t meant to teach you (unless they’re used in an educational setting). They’re meant for entertaining purposes. If you MUST learn from subtitles, it’s better to have the complete translation and learn the line by listening to the audio, knowing what’s being said in Japanese, and then reading what it means in English. It’s a method that I used plenty of times prior to taking formal classes. Simply leaving a Japanese word in (there are some exceptions) is simply lazy on the translator’s part. Let’s take an infamous example from TV-N shall we? “What are you doing there O-baka-chan-tachi?” was actually a thing that existed in their sub of Magiranger. Now, let’s break this down shall we? As any anime fan will tell you (as it’s one of the very first words you’ll probably know), “baka” is the Japanese word that can mean “fool/idiot/moron/etc.” Okay, that’s fine. The reason this… lazy construct is infuriating? The fact that “-tachi” is also not translated. “-tachi” isn’t a normal honorific. It only pluralizes a noun. So in this case, it’s pluralizing “baka”. “-chan” is an honorific, but we’ll get into those in a bit. My best translation for this line? “What are you Magi morons doing here?” It does take a liberty, since “Magi” isn’t in the sentence, but the sentence was directed towards the Magirangers themselves, so I took the context into consideration. Context is king when you’re translating something.



See? I just gave a perfectly appropriate way to handle that line in about 5 minutes. But because of TV-Nihon’s almost obsessive insistence on honorifics, that line would never come from them. Now, honorifics is a tricky subject. Depending on the show or story in question, if you chose to leave them in, then it isn’t much of a problem. This is more apparent in things like high school anime, where sometimes the only clue about character relationships you have is what honorific they refer to each other as. However, even in toku shows set in high school, like recently Fourze, the character relationships were never really deeply in question, so dropping them or appropriately translating them is wonderful. Ultimately it depends on the setting. But dropping an honorific vs. dropping it entirely also depends on the honorific in question. “-kun” can USUALLY be dropped, but it depends on who uses it and why. “-san” is like “-kun”. It depends on the context. But usually, if it applies, “-san” can be handled as “Mr./Mrs./Ms.”. “-chan”, like the above example, is usually a way to refer to things in a “cute” and informal way (like Yuki calling Gentaro “Gen-chan” in Fourze). The way this is usually handled is that you would try to make the appropriate word or name cuter, if you can. Others, like “-sama” or “-dono” do have appropriate translations (“Lord/Lady, Master/Mistress/etc”) so you’re usually fine there.

Of course, speaking of translation… the way TV-Nihon translates dialogue ranges from bad to okay but stilted. TV-Nihon’s main translator, takenoko, seems to translate things on a 1:1 basis. “This word must be this word and never anything else.” In other words, a literal translation. Unfortunately, this results in the dialogue being stilted. Yes, it may be “accurate”, but the nuance is just not there. You don’t really get the feel of a character’s personality that way, if everyone is talking the same way according to the sub. This is why a more liberal translation, which focuses on the context of the line relative to the show, is superior because it lets it flow better when reading, and actually lets you know what kind of characters you’re dealing with. And boy does takenoko ignore context. I had watched their first episode of Kamen Rider Wizard, because I was morbidly curious about how they would handle it… and they translated “mahoutsukai” as “mage”. Now, normally this would be an acceptable translation, but the show is called WIZARD. So having it strictly be “mage” is rather stupid, as wizard is as viable a translation as any, and it fits the show more. (Take has done this before, with the atrocity that is their Akibaranger subs… Princess/Precious indeed).


Now, all of these problems that plauge TV-Nihon wouldn’t even bother me if they did what ever other fansubber in this community does… release softsubs. For those who have been living under a rock for the past decade, softsubbing is where you would mux (combine) a translated (and timed) script to a raw video, making your file (usually MKV). This ensures high quality video, but it also has one other perk: you can EDIT the script. If you don’t agree with a translation choice? You can simply edit your copy of the script and never worry about it again. It’s really a beautiful thing. TV-Nihon on the otherhand, only releases hardsubbed video, which is basically an encoded video with lower quality and uneditable subs, so you’re stuck with what you got unless they FEEL like making a v2 (don’t hold your breath on that one).

Now, as I had mentioned, I only criticize TV-Nihon because they have the potential to be a good group, but they stubbornly choose not to, and only listen to their yes men or people who post nothing but good things on their forum (the slightest bit of criticsm lands you a ban). But that’s all I really wanted to say. I just thought I’d get my feelings on this down in writing after a long time putting it off. Now if you’ll excuse me, I have stuff to sub.









:bang:

Scratchman Apoo
Mar 27, 2011
You don't like obnoxious graphics overlaying Bouken Black's speech?! Clearly you're the enemy.

Cipher Pol 9
Oct 9, 2006


Jesus, that second comment. Giving characters different fonts gives them personality? Sure, yeah. Hell no. And the first guy saying they get it right the first time? I guess he's never seen Onore-TVN. To each their own, sure, let people watch TVN if they want to. As long as more people enjoy Toku, I'm happy. But sniping at the original writer and getting upset at him for for "throwing people off of TVN because he doesn't like it," when his post held nothing but honest and real criticism on their subbing choices, with no personal dislike at all for the people, is just stupid.

Monathin
Sep 1, 2011

?????????
?

That "THEY GET IT RIGHT THE FIRST TIME" comment is especially hilarious since Magenta's verbal reaming of their recent Gaim eps have been causing them to release V2s of them. So you can't even say that they're doing things right currently compared to their previous disasters like Blade and Shinkenger.

AzraelNewtype
Nov 9, 2004

「ブレストバーン!!」
Guys, this blog post is over a year old. It predates OnoreTVN and Gaim. So do the comments.

Blaze Dragon
Aug 28, 2013
LOWTAX'S SPINE FUND

I watch TVN subs in a vague hope that they'll remember they're meant to translate stuff to English.

Surprisingly, that hope may be becoming true. Their Kyoryuger translation, stupid naming aside (Kyouryuuger? Seriously, guys?), has not left a single thing in Japanese (apart from the title, which I know some subbers do translate, but that's something I honestly dislike), which is pretty drat impressive from a group that wouldn't translate "kita" in Fourze because they just could not accept they got the context wrong (and goddamn this is probably what annoyed me the most of TVN all these years - likely because I was a teenager when I watched their older, even worse subs, and I loved that they left so much in Japanese, thankfully age has taught me this is bad).

They still have a problem with awkward lines though ("You'll be surprised when you hear!" is blatantly wrong, for instance, and even I, who knows no Japanese whatsoever, can easily see this), but overall, there's some improvement. In fact, most examples I see insulting TVN tend to be of old subs. I'm not defending TVN here (because, again, they've got a lot to fix), but they have been improving, and so I'll keep hope and not fall into despair because then Wizard might appear and holy poo poo was that a dull show.

AzraelNewtype
Nov 9, 2004

「ブレストバーン!!」

Blaze Dragon posted:

I watch TVN subs in a vague hope that they'll remember they're meant to translate stuff to English.

Surprisingly, that hope may be becoming true. Their Kyoryuger translation, stupid naming aside (Kyouryuuger? Seriously, guys?), has not left a single thing in Japanese (apart from the title, which I know some subbers do translate, but that's something I honestly dislike), which is pretty drat impressive from a group that wouldn't translate "kita" in Fourze because they just could not accept they got the context wrong (and goddamn this is probably what annoyed me the most of TVN all these years - likely because I was a teenager when I watched their older, even worse subs, and I loved that they left so much in Japanese, thankfully age has taught me this is bad).

Nope, absolutely no untranslated Japanese every single time this character opens his mouth.

Also Kyouryuuger is a perfectly acceptable romanization of the name. Possibly a better one, because it at least preserves the fact that both vowels are long. It's kind of ugly though, yeah. Kyōryūger would probably be better than either, except it's hard to count on people understanding what macrons mean. Also it's annoying to input and would rely on find/replace :v:.

Blaze Dragon posted:

They still have a problem with awkward lines though ("You'll be surprised when you hear!" is blatantly wrong, for instance, and even I, who knows no Japanese whatsoever, can easily see this), but overall, there's some improvement. In fact, most examples I see insulting TVN tend to be of old subs. I'm not defending TVN here (because, again, they've got a lot to fix), but they have been improving, and so I'll keep hope and not fall into despair because then Wizard might appear and holy poo poo was that a dull show.

"You'll be surprised when you hear" is actually less wrong than our translation, for reasons (kiite odoroke was treated as a shortened version of the line in the OP, because they guessed backward about which would get more play), it's just terribly worded.

As for improvement? Well... I don't know about that.

Blaze Dragon
Aug 28, 2013
LOWTAX'S SPINE FUND

AzraelNewtype posted:

Nope, absolutely no untranslated Japanese every single time this character opens his mouth.

Also Kyouryuuger is a perfectly acceptable romanization of the name. Possibly a better one, because it at least preserves the fact that both vowels are long. It's kind of ugly though, yeah. Kyōryūger would probably be better than either, except it's hard to count on people understanding what macrons mean. Also it's annoying to input and would rely on find/replace :v:.
Eh, the Utchy thing is a verbal tic, it's not that big of a deal for me (though how they're absolutely inconsistent about it is).
And I know that Kyouryuuuuger is an acceptable romanization, but it's so annoying to see. I've managed to filter it now, but it annoyed me enough to actually post on TVN's forums about it (alongside using Kyouryuujin over Kyoryuzin when it's spelled that way on screen, even if Japan tends to be rather bad at this whole romanization business).


quote:

"You'll be surprised when you hear" is actually less wrong than our translation, for reasons (kiite odoroke was treated as a shortened version of the line in the OP, because they guessed backward about which would get more play), it's just terribly worded.
It's still really awkward. For something that's meant to be showy, it just does not work.

quote:

As for improvement? Well... I don't know about that.
I don't agree on how awkward some of the lines are, but I definitely agree on others.

Mistranslations are another matter entirely though. It's amazing how different TVN's Kaito seems to be from how he's meant to be (and how bad their opening is, jeez). I know next to no Japanese, so I hadn't noticed just how many mistakes there were.

I think I'll actually restart Gaim now, because this changes the series something fierce, and I've actually been really enjoying it! After what a disappointment Wizard was, Gaim is really enjoyable. Aesir's subs look really good, so I'll stick with them, unless there's another good choice (since I know next to nothing about subbing groups because part of me really, really hoped and still hopes for TVN to get better, and I'm too lazy to search for others).

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE

Blaze Dragon posted:

Eh, the Utchy thing is a verbal tic, it's not that big of a deal for me (though how they're absolutely inconsistent about it is).

This is why translating things is so important. It's not a "tic." It's a modifier, an expression of respect levels; to the extent that it sounds exceptional in Japanese, it's so because of what it means, not because it's just some sound he's compelled to make every so often. It colors his lines and interactions in ways that clearly haven't come across to you if that's all you think it means. And even if you've gone and read about what it's supposed to mean, we can still do better than that. Arguably, in a show that has Kyoryuger's levels of energy, we're obligated to do better than that.

e: disclaimer: I am not and have never been staff on any team's release of Kyoryuger.

DiscoJ
Jun 23, 2003

AzraelNewtype posted:

"You'll be surprised when you hear" is actually less wrong than our translation, for reasons (kiite odoroke was treated as a shortened version of the line in the OP, because they guessed backward about which would get more play), it's just terribly worded.


What is the OT translation of that line?

DiscoJ fucked around with this message at 03:23 on Nov 16, 2013

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

SpiderHyphenMan
Apr 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy

DiscoJ posted:

What is the OT translation of that line?
"Hear our roar" which is way better thing to say before a roll call.

  • Locked thread