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Huh, according to this and some other stuff Joker can refer to any hybrid type. So Jack is probably the correct term for the fourth LB in a 3-4.quote:These players with mutating roles are often known as “Jokers:”
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Nov 13, 2013 04:54
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Are there limits (except the owner's greed) on the amount of coaches an NFL team have, or their salary? Or to the amount of people involved in the franchise can be at the side line during a game?
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Nov 13, 2013 05:50
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For the purposes of identifying the "Mike" it is not necessarily the middle linebacker, so mike/sam/will/jack don't have the same meaning here. They are not just finding him on the field and pointing to him. What the QB and center are doing is identifying the middle of the defensive scheme and the person that's the center's blitz or block responsibility. When Billick is saying it sets the protection, it means the center identifies his block responsibility, which gives any running backs their block responsibility as well depending on the play call and the line blocking scheme. You don't want to be running some sort of slant and suddenly the running back has to block a defensive tackle somehow.
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Nov 13, 2013 05:56
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The term "Joker" also tends to be used for tight ends who line up as a wideout more often than not. Think Jimmy Graham, or Aaron Hernandez before he killed someone.
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Nov 13, 2013 23:19
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Not that anyone cares any more, but "Mac" and "Jack" are the two linebackers that you have to have in the Arena Football League (they're not dead yet, but yeah, I hear 2007 calling as well). Mac's allowed to rush the QB, Jack has to stay in coverage and can't drop deep unless the QB pump fakes.
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Nov 14, 2013 01:18
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Benne posted:The term "Joker" also tends to be used for tight ends who line up as a wideout more often than not. Think Jimmy Graham, or Aaron Hernandez before he killed someone. Maybe after, to be fair.
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Nov 14, 2013 02:18
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Trin Tragula posted:Not that anyone cares any more, but "Mac" and "Jack" are the two linebackers that you have to have in the Arena Football League (they're not dead yet, but yeah, I hear 2007 calling as well). Mac's allowed to rush the QB, Jack has to stay in coverage and can't drop deep unless the QB pump fakes. That sounds like something straight out of playground football. Are there any situations in arena league where a player isn't allowed to rush the QB until counting to five Mississippi?
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Nov 14, 2013 05:05
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This is probably a complex question with no real answer, but I'm still really curious about how a defense really works as a whole since I'm still pretty new to really paying serious attention to football. If a team had a generally average LB core, is there a definite answer to whether an elite corner or an elite DE would be more beneficial to said defense, assuming each is equally elite for their position? I'm guessing the DE since he can apply pressure and work in the run game, but if said corner is Revis-level, that can completely shut down a side of a field, allowing more double-teams on the opposite side and the LBs to put more pressure. Defense is really fascinating to me right now for some reason, I'm looking forward to learning 
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Nov 14, 2013 05:25
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Trin Tragula posted:Not that anyone cares any more, but "Mac" and "Jack" are the two linebackers that you have to have in the Arena Football League (they're not dead yet, but yeah, I hear 2007 calling as well). Mac's allowed to rush the QB, Jack has to stay in coverage and can't drop deep unless the QB pump fakes. I barely ever watched any AFL, but in college a friend and I found a big screen TV set up at a Best Buy to demo that AFL game EA made in '06. He picked up the controller, the computer team snapped the ball, he rushed the line as a linebacker and immediately got a penalty for leaving the little LB box. He went "What the gently caress?!", put down the controller, and we walked away.
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Nov 14, 2013 06:03
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GobiasIndustries posted:This is probably a complex question with no real answer, but I'm still really curious about how a defense really works as a whole since I'm still pretty new to really paying serious attention to football. If a team had a generally average LB core, is there a definite answer to whether an elite corner or an elite DE would be more beneficial to said defense, assuming each is equally elite for their position? I'm guessing the DE since he can apply pressure and work in the run game, but if said corner is Revis-level, that can completely shut down a side of a field, allowing more double-teams on the opposite side and the LBs to put more pressure. It's rarely as clear-cut as that in reality, but I think in a vacuum if most coaches/GMs were deciding between a CB and DE of equal talent level, most would go for the DE because by nature of the position the CB can only cover one player or area of the field at a time, whereas if the DE is creating pressure it creates a greater likelihood that the play is disrupted entirely no matter who the QB is targeting. But the fact of the matter is that different defensive schemes can demand different responsibilities from a position. Can the CB blitz and shed blocks if the DC is in the habit of doing that, can the DE cover a running back running a passing route out of the backfield or is he purely a pass rusher, etc. It's not like Madden where players have numerical values for every aspect of what they can do, the tricky part of player evaluation is scouts and GMs (and to a degree the coaches themselves) figuring out if a player fits what they want out of that position on their team schematically.
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Nov 14, 2013 06:43
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Grozz Nuy posted:It's rarely as clear-cut as that in reality, but I think in a vacuum if most coaches/GMs were deciding between a CB and DE of equal talent level, most would go for the DE because by nature of the position the CB can only cover one player or area of the field at a time, whereas if the DE is creating pressure it creates a greater likelihood that the play is disrupted entirely no matter who the QB is targeting. This totally makes sense and is about what I was expecting for an answer. It's obviously a loaded question, but after following people's suggestions to try and watch line play more often I'm picking up on a bunch of crazy poo poo (to me) that I've never noticed before. For example, I really paid attention to the line on a play where the LG pulled to the right side of the line to open up a crazy running play (I think this was in the Bucs Dolphins game) and I was taken back as I'd never seen how drat quick that kind of play could unfold.
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Nov 14, 2013 07:22
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Pulling guards executing a trap play properly is one of the most amazing sights football has to offer. Loved it since I read the description of a trap in the John Madden Football manual.quote:Like all good offensive plays, the Trap depends on deception to 
Trin Tragula fucked around with this message at 09:01 on Nov 14, 2013 |
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Nov 14, 2013 08:59
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How come nobody ever does a fake fg/punt in the NFL?
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Nov 14, 2013 15:00
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I have a question. I come from a Rugby Union background, where free flowing back pass the ball a lot. The question is: Why aren't laterals used a lot more in the NFL?
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Nov 14, 2013 15:02
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Bob Morales posted:How come nobody ever does a fake fg/punt in the NFL? The Chargers did one four days ago
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Nov 14, 2013 15:04
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StoicFnord posted:I have a question. You'll lose the ball, which is the single worst mistake you can possibly make. Edit: The ball is pointier and a little harder to handle and you're going to get blown the gently caress up if you've got the ball out and flying around a lot. Rugby requires wrapping up (I think most do, anyhow, not too familiar with their rules, which is going to slightly slow down the tackle. In the NFL a guy is going to launch his shoulder right in to the ball a fraction of a second before you get it secured. It's just way harder to pull off. Bashez fucked around with this message at 16:21 on Nov 14, 2013 |
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Nov 14, 2013 16:18
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StoicFnord posted:I have a question. Its incredibly risky compared to Rugby Union. The play where a lateral is most likely to occur is the play that most resembles the free flowing offense with people spread across the field of Rugby, the kick off return. In all other play scenarios you're hoping to lateral across multiple defenders several of whom are likely already upon you due to lining up and by throwing a rather purposefully difficult to throw object that you have likely not attempted to throw since you were 10-12 years old you open yourself up to giving the opposition the ball which is dreadfully tough to recover from in football.
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Nov 14, 2013 16:56
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Thanks for that. I am aware i don't have the exposure to gridiron i want to, so every small titbit helps.
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Nov 14, 2013 18:36
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Yeah, it's not like the worst that would usually happen is someone drops it and then you can try to take the scrum against the head or push them off the ball at the next ruck. Maybe imagine if knocking on meant a free kick to the opposition on the centre of your 22? Turnovers in American football are that kind of drastic game-changing consequence.
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Nov 14, 2013 19:41
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Bob Morales posted:How come nobody ever does a fake fg/punt in the NFL? Gary Kubiak never calls them and even we had a fake punt this year.
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Nov 14, 2013 22:38
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Bob Morales posted:How come nobody ever does a fake fg/punt in the NFL? Its relatively rare because the NFL is an overly conservative league so going for it on 4th has just started to become a thing teams will do in situations where its 99% the better option. The other reason is because its not a large part of the teams repertoire they don't necessarily have the training and experience to do it effectively resulting in disastrous outcomes if the defense doesn't bite.
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Nov 14, 2013 22:50
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Bob Morales posted:How come nobody ever does a fake fg/punt in the NFL? They're risky. The NFL, in particular, is dominated by risk-aversion in decisions. Coaches get fired frequently for trivial reasons, so high risk/high reward situations are avoided. Nobody ever loses their job for punting, but they will if they give up a winning touchdown after a fake punt gets stuffed.
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Nov 14, 2013 22:55
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You are probably better off just going for it in regular offensive formation anyway in situations where a fake punt would be a good idea.
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Nov 14, 2013 23:05
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euphronius posted:You are probably better off just going for it in regular offensive formation anyway in situations where a fake punt would be a good idea.
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Nov 14, 2013 23:15
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StoicFnord posted:Thanks for that. I am aware i don't have the exposure to gridiron i want to, so every small titbit helps. Also, the ball doesn't mark offside. Anyone trailing the play can make a hit or grab the ball and be a-ok.
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Nov 14, 2013 23:53
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Captain Foo posted:Also, the ball doesn't mark offside. Anyone trailing the play can make a hit or grab the ball and be a-ok. Rugby offside applies at a tackle or kick but not in general play, defenders who miss tackles can still chase back and get involved as there hasn't been a tackle or a kick for them to be offside from.
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Nov 15, 2013 01:29
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Trin Tragula posted:Rugby offside applies at a tackle or kick but not in general play, defenders who miss tackles can still chase back and get involved as there hasn't been a tackle or a kick for them to be offside from. In the specific situation being asked (laterals in general play) the defenders will never be offside, right?
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Nov 15, 2013 02:30
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StoicFnord posted:Thanks for that. I am aware i don't have the exposure to gridiron i want to, so every small titbit helps. Just in case you haven't seen these here are a couple of examples of good lateral plays in American football: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfebpLfAt8g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8O4fdNJtU8 (watch this to the end) Most of them look like this though (warning--Benny Hill music): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5O5V7-PcLE Honestly that's a lie, most of them get blown up right away, like the first or second pitch gets screwed up and everyone dives on the ball.
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Nov 15, 2013 02:41
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That loving kick never fails to crack me up.
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Nov 15, 2013 03:32
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GobiasIndustries posted:That loving kick never fails to crack me up. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5BFaykcxGg e: lol loving trest man
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Nov 15, 2013 04:16
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R.D. Mangles posted:e: lol loving trest man Canadian announcers saying "out." Can someone explain this clip from a rules perspective? Why are they kicking the ball out of the endzone?
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Nov 15, 2013 20:21
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Is it possible (although I can't think of any reason why) for the punt/kick returner to hoof the ball back upfield, rugby union style?
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Nov 15, 2013 21:14
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Gambrinus posted:Is it possible (although I can't think of any reason why) for the punt/kick returner to hoof the ball back upfield, rugby union style? What does this combination of words mean? Kick it back? Thoguh fucked around with this message at 21:49 on Nov 15, 2013 |
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Nov 15, 2013 21:47
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I think he's talking about the return man kicking the ball. I don't think it's against the rules, but I can't fathom any reason why anyone would actually try it.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:07
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Benne posted:I think he's talking about the return man kicking the ball. Possible in some end of game situations in Canadian football.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:10
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Thoguh posted:What does this combination of words mean? Kick it back? Yes. Sorry.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:11
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Benne posted:I think he's talking about the return man kicking the ball. I don't know about the kicking stuff, but in Canadian football, a touchback costs you 1 point (a rouge). Since the score was tied, letting the ball die in the endzone would cost them the game. Hence, I guess their rules allow kicking the ball immediately on a catch to get it out. I don't think American rules have that. There is a fair catch free kick, but the catch has to be on the field of play (not the endzone) and play stops while the kick is set up.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:13
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Gambrinus posted:Yes. Sorry. I kind of figured, but when I hear "hoof it" I read that as "to walk". I honestly wasn't sure what would happen so I asked the Internet. There is one situation that kind of works that way, a fair catch kick. Apparently one even happened this season. It isn't immediate though. Basically after a fair catch the catching team has the option to immediately line up and attempt a field goal with no snap and the opposing team required to stand at least 10 yards away.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:19
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Thoguh posted:I kind of figured, but when I hear "hoof it" I read that as "to walk". Yeah, the 49ers did this right before halftime and tried like a 70-yard field goal. They were already winning big by that point so I assume Harbaugh was just trolling.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:36
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Thoguh posted:I kind of figured, but when I hear "hoof it" I read that as "to walk". I've seen the Rackers attempt ( I was "watching" it on justintv ) and though "My word, that's unusual". Has anyone got a link to the successful NFL attempt in the 1970s? I've had a quick look on youtube and find watching videos on nfl.com a trial at best, and impossible at worst.
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Nov 15, 2013 23:23
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