Star Trek: ...And The Neckbeards Shall Post

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edogawa rando: Mar 20, 2007

I wonder if there's a running gag among enlisted personnel about avoiding away missions with the away crew, because those always suck.

# ? Nov 15, 2013 20:41

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# ? Jun 10, 2024 18:43

Great_Gerbil: Sep 1, 2006; Rhombomys opimus

Mr. Jive posted:

I don't like it. After Wolf-359 you didn't see Federation officials clamoring for militarization. They grieved, retooled their defenses, and moved on. The post-9/11 theme struck me as unnecessary cynicism.

Yeah, the Narada destroyed Vulcan, and yes, that hits close to home, but there was nothing political or even avoidable about it, and for the Federation to respond by bulking up its military and lashing out at its neighbors is churlish and incongruous with a mature, spacefaring civilization dedicated to exploration. It doesn't make sense.

But, the prime universe immediately began creating more robust and battle-worthy starships. It even began secret work on battleships as has been pointed out.

I mean, clearly you have the 9/11 mass murder allegory. After the Kelvin you have a likely earlier relations with the Romulans than the prime universe (they knew Nero et al were Romulan) and the fact that the Klingons had unfettered access to the Narada and her crew.

Lots of political issues in between the destruction of the Kelvin and the destruction of Vulcan.

In addition, this is exactly what humanity did. After 9/11, America and a weak coalition lashed at out Afghanistan and then Iraq (under questionable circumstances). Not to mention the ongoing drone war and operations overseas.

It's a different reaction than Wolf 359, but it's a realistic one.

# ? Nov 15, 2013 20:59

Sash!: Mar 16, 2001

Imagine if instead of a handful of hijacked airliners and a couple buildings, al Qaeda had destroyed Chicago. We'd have turned Afghanistan into a sea of glass before the sunset on September 11th. That is what destroying Vulcan would be like.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 01:21

Delsaber: Oct 1, 2013; This may or may not be correct.

QVC Drinking Game posted:

In this post-Aatrek era is it safe for me to ask for a short list of the best season 1-2 Enterprise episodes?

From the first season, I'd recommend Broken Bow, Fight or Flight, Strange New World, The Andorian Incident, Breaking the Ice, Cold Front, Silent Enemy, Dear Doctor, Shuttlepod One, and Fallen Hero. You may want to include Shockwave Part 1, which is a solid cliffhanger, but Part 2 is lame enough that the two-parter might not be worth it overall. If you enjoy The Andorian Incident, then you may as well add Shadows of P'Jem to the list, but likewise it's not quite on the same level.

For the second season, go with Minefield, Dead Stop, Singularity, Cease Fire, Future Tense, Judgment, Cogenitor, Regeneration, First Flight, and The Expanse. Season 2 is probably weaker than Season 1, but it does have the Minefield/Dead Stop combo, which was the best thing Enterprise did in its first two years.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 01:48

Blade_of_tyshalle: Jul 12, 2009; If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

Sleeping Dogs is another decent episode. I think it's a season two-er. I would personally swap it for Cogenitor, because I just really dislike that episode. Trip's such a loving idiot in it.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 02:25

edogawa rando: Mar 20, 2007

Great_Gerbil posted:

But, the prime universe immediately began creating more robust and battle-worthy starships. It even began secret work on battleships as has been pointed out.

I mean, clearly you have the 9/11 mass murder allegory. After the Kelvin you have a likely earlier relations with the Romulans than the prime universe (they knew Nero et al were Romulan) and the fact that the Klingons had unfettered access to the Narada and her crew.

Lots of political issues in between the destruction of the Kelvin and the destruction of Vulcan.

In addition, this is exactly what humanity did. After 9/11, America and a weak coalition lashed at out Afghanistan and then Iraq (under questionable circumstances). Not to mention the ongoing drone war and operations overseas.

It's a different reaction than Wolf 359, but it's a realistic one.

You also need to take into account the prior existence of hawkish elements within the Federation like Section 31. They clearly had a fair amount of influence in the Prime-Universe, where their existence was an unacknowledged secret that was answerable only to those that outranked even Captains. Plot elements that would make the existence of uber-warhawks like Admiral Marcus in the JJ-universe narratively plausible had already been introduced to Trek continuity quite some time ago, and seeing as how they appear in Enterprise, of course they'll start scheming and getting up to stuff when Vulcan gets blown up.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 02:45

Great_Gerbil: Sep 1, 2006; Rhombomys opimus

Blade_of_tyshalle posted:

Sleeping Dogs is another decent episode. I think it's a season two-er. I would personally swap it for Cogenitor, because I just really dislike that episode. Trip's such a loving idiot in it.

Sleeping Dogs is a pretty important reference later on.

In fact, Enterprise is extremely self-referential. Listen carefully and you'll hear some great name drops.

I won't say every episode hinges on the one before it, but lots of plot points tie into previous episodes.

I hate to sound like AATrek (what happened to him?) but it really is worth watching straight through. There's an overreaching dynamic with regards to your sympathies toward Archer and T'Pol.

EDIT: There are some episodes dangerously similar to episodes from other Treks but they're handled well and, honestly, I haven't found anything that's nearly as bad as what you'll hear from others.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 03:38

Blade_of_tyshalle: Jul 12, 2009; If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

T'pol has a great series-long arc. She's somehow one of, if not the, most consistantly well-written characters by the end. Blalock pulls off an interesting performance on the whole.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 03:43

hailthefish: Oct 24, 2010

Great_Gerbil posted:

Sleeping Dogs is a pretty important reference later on.

In fact, Enterprise is extremely self-referential. Listen carefully and you'll hear some great name drops.

I won't say every episode hinges on the one before it, but lots of plot points tie into previous episodes.

I hate to sound like AATrek (what happened to him?) but it really is worth watching straight through. There's an overreaching dynamic with regards to your sympathies toward Archer and T'Pol.

EDIT: There are some episodes dangerously similar to episodes from other Treks but they're handled well and, honestly, I haven't found anything that's nearly as bad as what you'll hear from others.

Aatrek is literally Neelix (i.e. :pedo:

)

# ? Nov 16, 2013 03:46

Owlbear Camus: Jan 3, 2013; Maybe this guy that flies is just sort of passing through, you know?

hailthefish posted:

Aatrek is literally Neelix (i.e. )

Dude got a little bit too much into The Next Generation.

Man, I'm not sure 9/11 references belong in Trek, or if they do something like that, there needs to be some kind of other response than the whole "hold 'em by the collar while we kick 'em in the balls" thing. :smith:

I guess they showed that is was bad and stuff with Wrath of White Guy Khan, and I even give them credit for such an on-the-nose critique of drone strikes, so yeah. How did it play out in Enterprise?

Like how Picard didn't give into his fear and eliminate the Borg as a race, or didn't give into petty revenge against that evil Christmas tree.

Owlbear Camus fucked around with this message at 03:56 on Nov 16, 2013

# ? Nov 16, 2013 03:51

Delsaber: Oct 1, 2013; This may or may not be correct.

Great_Gerbil posted:

Sleeping Dogs is a pretty important reference later on.

You're right, I forgot all about that. Should probably cycle this in and cut Strange New World or something, even if I'm a sucker for "crew goes crazy" stories. Singularity did that better anyway.

quote:

There are some episodes dangerously similar to episodes from other Treks but they're handled well

Doctor's Orders comes to mind, from Season 3. It shares a lot of thematic similarities with an old Voyager episode, but turned out better thanks to Phlox, some great comedic acting by Jolene Blalock... and by not being a Voyager episode.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 04:10

Blade_of_tyshalle: Jul 12, 2009; If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

I like Strange New World because it shows how completely loving clueless Starfleet is at the start. They don't bother doing a comprehensive survey, like T'pol recommends they do, and they promptly get totally boned, learning exactly why the Vulcans prefer to do a, like, week-long survey from orbit before going down to a new planet.

Plus, there's Crewman Transporter-Accident :v:

# ? Nov 16, 2013 04:15

edogawa rando: Mar 20, 2007

Otisburg posted:

Dude got a little bit too much into The Next Generation.

The only thing he found disagreeable about little Keiko demanding that O'Brien sleep with him in Little Rascals was that he wished he could trade places with O'Brien for that one moment.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 04:19

LeafyOrb: Jun 11, 2012

Blade_of_tyshalle posted:

Plus, there's Crewman Transporter-Accident

I still think Barclay is right to fear those things, poo poo fucks up all the drat time.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 04:19

MikeJF: Dec 20, 2003

Blade_of_tyshalle posted:

I like Strange New World because it shows how completely loving clueless Starfleet is at the start. They don't bother doing a comprehensive survey, like T'pol recommends they do, and they promptly get totally boned, learning exactly why the Vulcans prefer to do a, like, week-long survey from orbit before going down to a new planet.

At the start? They're still beaming right down and getting totally boned for the next two hundred years.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 04:24

apophenium: Apr 14, 2009; Cry 'Mayhem!' and let slip the dogs of Wardlow.

"Genesis" is making absolutely zero scientific sense, but I can't look away. Worf spits acid, Spot is an iguana, and Troi is a mermaid. What next? Braga has some weird ideas about evolution/de-evolution, but damned if this isn't entertaining.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 04:36

Gau: Nov 18, 2003; I don't think you understand, Gau.

Blade_of_tyshalle posted:

I like Strange New World because it shows how completely loving clueless Starfleet is at the start. They don't bother doing a comprehensive survey, like T'pol recommends they do, and they promptly get totally boned, learning exactly why the Vulcans prefer to do a, like, week-long survey from orbit before going down to a new planet.

Plus, there's Crewman Transporter-Accident

Strange New World is fantastic because they get to their first fresh new world, and decide they're going to be literal Boy Scouts in Space and go camping!

# ? Nov 16, 2013 04:58

Blade_of_tyshalle: Jul 12, 2009; If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

Don't forget the most important plot point: Where No Dog Has Gone Before.

MikeJF posted:

At the start? They're still beaming right down and getting totally boned for the next two hundred years.

Yes, but after the 1701 hits a planet with magic pollen, the brass go "well, twice is enough, let's at least sensor-sweep these fuckers" and that specific danger happens far less

# ? Nov 16, 2013 05:02

edogawa rando: Mar 20, 2007

If Kirk hadn't come along, StarFleet would have lost that instinct to leap before looking and would probably have saved countless lives. gently caress Kirk, what a dick.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 05:16

Circutron: Apr 29, 2006; We are confident that the Islamic logic, culture, and discourse can prove their superiority in all fields over all schools of thought and theories.

Vagabundo posted:

gently caress Kirk

Looks like you got it the other way around with your avatar. Mixed messages?

Circutron fucked around with this message at 05:49 on Nov 16, 2013

# ? Nov 16, 2013 05:43

Gau: Nov 18, 2003; I don't think you understand, Gau.

Badda Bing, Badda Bang is just a fantastic piece of Star Trek, but Avery Brooks hamming it up at the end to the fourth-wall penetrating "The Best is Yet to Come" is just the perfect capstone.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 08:50

Luigi Thirty: Apr 30, 2006; Emergency confection port.

MikeJF posted:

At the start? They're still beaming right down and getting totally boned for the next two hundred years.

It's precedent. Archer's the first explorer captain dude so Starfleet captains will be making the same mistakes he does for 200 years.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 09:42

DoctorWhat: Nov 18, 2011; A little privacy, please?

Gau posted:

Badda Bing, Badda Bang is just a fantastic piece of Star Trek, but Avery Brooks hamming it up at the end to the fourth-wall penetrating "The Best is Yet to Come" is just the perfect capstone.

Every time this episode comes up I have an urge to explain the Secret Joke at the Core of the Episode ^(TM)

are all part of the heist operation.

That's NINE.

Deep Space's Nine

# ? Nov 16, 2013 09:52

Gau: Nov 18, 2003; I don't think you understand, Gau.

DoctorWhat posted:

Every time this episode comes up I have an urge to explain the Secret Joke at the Core of the Episode ^(TM)

* Sisko
* Kasidy
* Kira
* Odo
* O'Brien
* Bashir
* Ezri
* Nog
* and Vic

are all part of the heist operation.

That's NINE.

Deep Space's Nine

The scene where the eight of them are walking past Quark's makes the comparison pretty evident. It's also an awesome scene.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 10:08

Blade_of_tyshalle: Jul 12, 2009; If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

Luigi Thirty posted:

It's precedent. Archer's the first explorer captain dude so Starfleet captains will be making the same mistakes he does for 200 years.

What's really lovely is Enterprise later goes on to steal "first ever transporter accident" away from the Enterprise crew. :smith:

# ? Nov 16, 2013 13:23

Great_Gerbil: Sep 1, 2006; Rhombomys opimus

Otisburg posted:

Dude got a little bit too much into The Next Generation.

Man, I'm not sure 9/11 references belong in Trek, or if they do something like that, there needs to be some kind of other response than the whole "hold 'em by the collar while we kick 'em in the balls" thing.

I guess they showed that is was bad and stuff with Wrath of White Guy Khan, and I even give them credit for such an on-the-nose critique of drone strikes, so yeah. How did it play out in Enterprise?

Like how Picard didn't give into his fear and eliminate the Borg as a race, or didn't give into petty revenge against that evil Christmas tree.

Enterprise plays it remarkably well. The entire third season is a shift in how the characters perceive the Xindi.

It's a bit wink wink with the "there are different SPECIES not FACTIONS" and the bad guys are the predictably scary looking ones. But it plays out well. And seriously has one of the best cliffhangers since The Best of Both Worlds.

At the risk of restarting book chat, did anyone else read Best Destiny by Diane Carey? It feels like it heavily inspired the younger-Kirk aspects of JJTrek.

Great_Gerbil fucked around with this message at 15:15 on Nov 16, 2013

# ? Nov 16, 2013 15:10

Apple Jax: May 19, 2008; IDIC 4 LYF

DoctorWhat posted:

That's NINE.

Deep Space's Nine

I recently rewatched "Captain's Holiday" where whiny Picard is vacationing on Risa. I don't get how he doesn't want ANY attention and wants to be left alone...yet he's wearing the shiniest tidy whities of all time:

# ? Nov 16, 2013 20:28

Luigi Thirty: Apr 30, 2006; Emergency confection port.

Picard just sitting there in his Future Speedo on the Federation's sex planet reading his book rebuffing the advances of all the Future '80s Women

# ? Nov 16, 2013 20:33

The Dark One: Aug 19, 2005; I'm your friend and I'm not going to just stand by and let you do this!

Those satin briefs give him all the satisfaction he needs.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 21:43

Farecoal: Oct 15, 2011; There he go

apophenium posted:

"Genesis" is making absolutely zero scientific sense, but I can't look away. Worf spits acid, Spot is an iguana, and Troi is a mermaid. What next? Braga has some weird ideas about evolution/de-evolution, but damned if this isn't entertaining.

That episode actually freaked me out a bit. Troi :gonk:

What are the good episodes of TOS seasons 1/2/3?

# ? Nov 16, 2013 21:54

Islam is the Lite Rock FM: Jul 27, 2007; by exmarx

Nice legs. For a human.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 21:55

Blade_of_tyshalle: Jul 12, 2009; If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

Spock's Brain. The Squire of Gothos. The Paradise Syndrome.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 21:56

Trickjaw: Jun 23, 2005; Nadie puede dar lo que no tiene

Dipped back into STO as had nothing better to do. They have incorporated the nasty clicky aliens and rape tables from TNG. Can't be long before the next actor has a big credit card bill or something and they get them to voice an episode featuring the wacky adventures or Reg and Trelane, or something.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 21:58

Tighclops: Jan 23, 2008; Unable to deal with it; Grimey Drawer

Trickjaw posted:

Dipped back into STO as had nothing better to do. They have incorporated the nasty clicky aliens and rape tables from TNG.

Wow they're really catering to their core demos with that game these days

# ? Nov 16, 2013 22:07

Apple Jax: May 19, 2008; IDIC 4 LYF

The Dark One posted:

Those satin briefs give him all the satisfaction he needs.

I wonder if they let Stewart keep them. Or, if they were sold on auction to some trekkie for a million bucks.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 22:10

Data Graham: Dec 28, 2009; 📈📊🍪😋

Thanks to my not paying attention to the shifting subjects of the last few posts, I now assume some fan made off with the rape table prop and now has a whole dungeon/master suite built up around it.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 22:18

Islam is the Lite Rock FM: Jul 27, 2007; by exmarx

Data Graham posted:

Thanks to my not paying attention to the shifting subjects of the last few posts, I now assume some fan made off with the rape table prop and now has a whole dungeon/master suite built up around it.

If not the actual one a reconstruction. The amount of weird people get off to is endless.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 22:35

Nessus: Dec 22, 2003; After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!

Tighclops posted:

Wow they're really catering to their core demos with that game these days

The main zone for the new episode has you fighting dinosaurs with head lasers so I'd say it balances out

For clarity, they have the head lasers.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 22:36

Brute Squad: Dec 20, 2006; Laughter is the sun that drives winter from the human race

Gau posted:

The scene where the eight of them are walking past Quark's makes the comparison pretty evident. It's also an awesome scene.

Also has the best music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-QBe9pPdkM

And this is literally what STO is like now.

# ? Nov 16, 2013 22:46

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# ? Jun 10, 2024 18:43

Owlbear Camus: Jan 3, 2013; Maybe this guy that flies is just sort of passing through, you know?

Wait is laserdinos a good or a bad thing because I'm seeing arguments for both sides.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=C6CogMAUS7E

# ? Nov 16, 2013 23:14

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