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Heran Bago posted:Spelunk HD is GOTY and surprise surprise the Wii U doesn't have it. It really is. I just got struck in the face by an arrow trap and landed right on to a pit of spikes, and that's not stopping me from trying again. Also, Tearaway is loving charming, and actually has a unique art style that defines the game's mechanics. It's like Okami in that way, rather than the lazy Skyward Sword style where they just throw a photoshop filter over everything and give all the characters weird facial expressions and call it a day. Once I started experimenting with other consoles/the PC after I got a bit sick of the Wii, I realised that Nintendo aren't the only people who can make really high quality games. They're actually pretty backwards in a lot of ways, still making you put up with lives systems and limited save points. Mario, Kirby, and Donkey Kong all feature at least 2-player co-op, but none of them have thought of a better lives system for this, like LittleBigPlanet did.
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Nov 23, 2013 19:40
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Supercar Gautier posted:Has this thread become a competition to see who can describe games as inaccurately as possible?
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Nov 23, 2013 19:45
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That loving Sned posted:
Speaking of Little Big Planet, it would have probably been the most ideal to make New Super Mario bros. exactly like how LBP did it's custom level creator. I mean you have Nintendo higher ups bragging that they can have about having a paint by numbers Mario program that spits out full games for NSMB, you might as well release a full game like that to the public. It would have probably been better than NSMB2,NSMBWU, and the Luigi DLC. Hell even allowing to dress up Mario and Luigi differently or maybe switching out their models with other things would have been welcome.
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Nov 23, 2013 19:51
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I still think there are a million more likely reasons why the Wii U is failing than this discussion and the primary one is still a complete lack of marketing and visibility to the mainstream. I may be a broken record about it, but even Reggie admitted it this week. They've been invisible since the Wii U launched, while Xbox is the official partner of the NFL, Playstation is the official partner of FIFA/EUFA, their ads are EVERYWHERE and Nintendo's aren't. I think it's as simple as that. They're never going to climb out of this hole until they're willing to spend money to make money. I think that experimenting with your IPs is something you can do when you've already got the install base, not as a way to sell systems. The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 19:57
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That loving Sned posted:Final Fantasy is long-running and successful all over the world, and it changes its gameplay with each entry. IX, X, XI, XII, XIII, XIV, and XV all have completely different battle systems, with IX using the old ATB style, X being completely turn-based, XI, XII, and XIV using MMO-style battle systems, XIII being real-time with a menu interface, and XV being fully real-time, like an action game. The thing to understand about Final Fantasy is that for FF1-6, it was pretty consistent about gameplay. It had different worlds but they were still closer to one another than they were apart. Chocobos, Cids, and various characters and weapons were introduced and became franchise mainstays all the way to 7 and beyond, and the gameplay was remarkably similar with minor upgrades. They had good production values and increasingly involved storylines but otherwise were remarkably similar games. Final Fantasy VII was an absolute behemoth of a game due to marketing and basically being *the* game to show off your PS1. Afterwards, Square was still consistent, but what they were consistent in was offering high-budget story driven narrative adventures. The fact that the stories were stupid and goofy didn't really matter because nobody else was offering what Square (later Square-Enix) was for console gamers. When you got a Final Fantasy game you got a big budget popcorn adventure with a battle system that was often simplified enough that the variation didn't matter because you could just mash X to get through. (To the point the last two non-MMO games have literally automated Mash X to get through in their own FFXV is certainly a big leap for the franchise but it isn't one born of wanting to switch things up. It's born of the fact that they had a half-finished spinoff (Final Fantasy XIII Versus) and desperately needed a new Final Fantasy game on the market as soon as possible. It might even pay off for them, but I don't think anyone is going to argue Square-Enix is making an intelligent reasoned choice born of good production practices here. They're making a "poo poo, we're hemorrhaging money, get that poo poo on the market" choice. Square-Enix's business practices are a mess and they're doing whatever they can to recoup.
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Nov 23, 2013 19:57
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Quest For Glory II posted:I still think there are a million more likely reasons why the Wii U is failing than this discussion and the primary one is still a complete lack of marketing and visibility to the mainstream. I may be a broken record about it, but even Reggie admitted it this week. They've been invisible since the Wii U launched, while Xbox is the official partner of the NFL, Playstation is the official partner of FIFA/EUFA, their ads are EVERYWHERE and Nintendo's aren't. I think it's as simple as that. They can advertise and yell from the top of the highest perch but it isn't going to mean a drat thing unless there are games to play on it. No 3rd party support = dunzo. It doesn't matter if you're Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft or any other console. You have to have the software. They don't have the software because they also don't have the hardware. Round and round we go...
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Nov 23, 2013 19:59
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The Taint Reaper posted:Speaking of Little Big Planet, it would have probably been the most ideal to make New Super Mario bros. exactly like how LBP did it's custom level creator. I mean you have Nintendo higher ups bragging that they can have about having a paint by numbers Mario program that spits out full games for NSMB, you might as well release a full game like that to the public. It would have probably been better than NSMB2,NSMBWU, and the Luigi DLC. A level editors for New Super Mario Bros. Wii has been made, but you'd need a softmodded Wii or an emulator to play them. They should really have put a level editor in at least the Wii U one, especially since making your own stages was fun even back in Excitebike on the NES. Speaking of character customisation, Tearaway lets you completely change your characters' face. No matter where or how many eyes or mouths you have, Atio or Iota will still express themselves in cutscenes. Animal Crossing gives you a lot of character customisation options, but it wouldn't hurt to put it in other games. ImpAtom posted:The thing to understand about Final Fantasy is that for FF1-6, it was pretty consistent about gameplay. It had different worlds but they were still closer to one another than they were apart. Chocobos, Cids, and various characters and weapons were introduced and became franchise mainstays all the way to 7 and beyond, and the gameplay was remarkably similar with minor upgrades. They had good production values and increasingly involved storylines but otherwise were remarkably similar games. You're right that XV wasn't originally going to be the next big entry in the franchise, but I'd argue that I-VI are very diverse gameplay-wise. First of all, there's a split between the NES games that are turn-based, and the SNES ones that are partially real-time. FFI lets you choose what jobs each of the four characters have, which they keep throughout the whole game, II uses a WRPG-style system where each action a character does will improve their stats in a different way, and III lets you switch jobs on the fly. IV introduces a rotating cast of characters with defined roles and abilities, V features an improved system from III that also lets you mix and match abilities, and VI combines IV's character rotation with the ability to influence their growth and teach them any spell. Sure, Chocobos and cutscenes are now staples of Final Fantasy, but they put far more effort into mixing things up with each entry, and that still applies today. It might just be a requirement of the genre, because some people prefer having cinematic game with a large cast of characters to switch between and tactical turn-based combat, so they'd enjoy FFX. Others might prefer a lighthearted game with real-time combat and a job system, so they would like V or X-2. I think that each game is worth playing, because they're different enough that you might prefer one style more than another. All the New Super Mario Bros. games just feel like level packs, and don't attempt to really experiment with the genre like Rayman does. That Fucking Sned fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 19:59
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GOOCHY posted:They can advertise and yell from the top of the highest perch but it isn't going to mean a drat thing unless there are games to play on it. No 3rd party support = dunzo. It doesn't matter if you're Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft or any other console. You have to have the software. And I don't care if they do or don't have the games, if they were planning on waiting to advertise the system for when they had games, then they should have launched Wii U in 2014. Since they didn't do that, they should advertise what they have, and advertise the gently caress out of it.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:03
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That loving Sned posted:Speaking of character customisation, Tearaway lets you completely change your characters' face. No matter where or how many eyes or mouths you have, Atio or Iota will still express themselves in cutscenes. Animal Crossing gives you a lot of character customisation options, but it wouldn't hurt to put it in other games.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:04
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Zelda would probably be the most ideal game for character customization, mostly due to Link having no personality or defining traits outside his hat. Make it a boy, make it a girl, it doesn't matter a Link is a Link they're all interchangable.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:05
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Quest For Glory II posted:Who is buying a Playstation 4 to play Knack? They're buying into the brand. It's not like they can't just get Black Flag, or Ghosts, or Madden on their PS3/360. They certainly aren't buying it to play those games. Launch lineups are awful. I just don't think it's about having the games at this early stage. I think it's about the hype, and Nintendo isn't producing hype.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:09
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Fulchrum posted:....did you just attempt to say The Last Of Us is bad because it actively removed a thing people despise? Naughty Dog could have come up with a game mechanic, copied from a game that did escorts successfully like Resident Evil 4, or just written the game such that Ellie is not present for those particular sections. There are multiple ways to deal with the escort mission problem than just ignoring it.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:10
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PrBacterio posted:The Wii U has been out for a year though so it isn't really about "launch lineups" anymore. Anyway I think you're both wrong, while some of what you're saying is true for other console developers, Nintendo have always been in the unusual position that people buy their consoles mainly because of the very high quality of the exclusive first-party titles, and the Wii U has so far been hampered by a severe drought in that regard. Their first party games for consoles really haven't been cutting it anymore.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:10
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TheEggsBenedict posted:Yeah, I have no idea why there aren't very much Nintendo games with character customization. There's Animal Crossing, Pokemon X and Y, and that's all I can remember. Nintendo's characters are defined by their specific looks and designs. Again, Mickey Mouse style, where anyone drawing Mickey Mouse has to follow very specific rules. The Mii is supposed to be their midpoint between customizable characters and pre-defined ones but they don't seem to use it for much these days. The Taint Reaper posted:Their first party games for consoles haven't been cutting it anymore. Pretty much every first party game they've made recently, aside from the disaster that was Other M and I think Wii Music, has been a success both critically and commercially. The Wii U games are the exception and it's a lot easier to blame those on the system, not the games. (NSMBU aside which is only a commercial failure when compared to other NSMB games.) ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 20:11
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ImpAtom posted:Nintendo's characters are defined by their specific looks and designs. Again, Mickey Mouse style, where anyone drawing Mickey Mouse has to follow very specific rules. The Mii is supposed to be their midpoint between customizable characters and pre-defined ones but they don't seem to use it for much these days. Also all the Miis look ugly as hell instead of charming. Like the Sims look worlds better than how they did the Miis. Sackboys/girls at least gave you a shitload of outfits and hair to wear and the Xbox Avatars look somewhat passible.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:12
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The Taint Reaper posted:Speaking of Little Big Planet, it would have probably been the most ideal to make New Super Mario bros. exactly like how LBP did it's custom level creator. I mean you have Nintendo higher ups bragging that they can have about having a paint by numbers Mario program that spits out full games for NSMB, you might as well release a full game like that to the public. It would have probably been better than NSMB2,NSMBWU, and the Luigi DLC. The wii u tablet controller thing would actually work very well for constructing levels and similar things. Unfortunately Nintendo hasn't seen fit to capitalize on that.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:13
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Install Windows posted:The wii u tablet controller thing would actually work very well for constructing levels and similar things. Unfortunately Nintendo hasn't seen fit to capitalize on that. Also the tablet would have been ideal for Smash bros. to have a 5th player be the one to distribute items and activate level specific traps and obstructions.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:14
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ImpAtom posted:Nintendo's characters are defined by their specific looks and designs. Again, Mickey Mouse style, where anyone drawing Mickey Mouse has to follow very specific rules. The Mii is supposed to be their midpoint between customizable characters and pre-defined ones but they don't seem to use it for much these days. Disney have been experimenting with Mickey Mouse. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDD1f-w9__4
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Nov 23, 2013 20:14
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That loving Sned posted:Disney have been experimenting with Mickey Mouse. Disney gave it to a Canadian company and said go nuts. It's not their in house team.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:15
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That loving Sned posted:Disney have been experimenting with Mickey Mouse. Yep, but the thing about those Mickey Mouse designs is that while they're in another art style, they still follow all of Disney's rules for how to draw Mickey Mouse. It was given to another studio who was given a lot of freedom (and made some loving great cartoons) but they're still following specific rules for what is allowed. I'm not saying Nintendo couldn't alter the designs somewhat or go for a different art style. Just that full customization of all characters is less likely because they want to have control over how the characters are presented.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:16
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Pankratos posted:Naughty Dog could have come up with a game mechanic, copied from a game that did escorts successfully like Resident Evil 4, or just written the game such that Ellie is not present for those particular sections. There are multiple ways to deal with the escort mission problem than just ignoring it. This is like getting mad that Tails always comes back to life no matter how many times he dies. I wouldn't really compare it to RE4 since The Last of Us is primarily a game that emphasizes stealth and you can't really write her out of sections since she plays a key part to the gameplay.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:16
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ImpAtom posted:Yep, but the thing about those Mickey Mouse designs is that while they're in another art style, they still follow all of Disney's rules for how to draw Mickey Mouse. It was given to another studio who was given a lot of freedom (and made some loving great cartoons) but they're still following specific rules for what is allowed. I dunno Mickey acts like a real jerk in those cartoons, he's never really acted like a jerk before.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:19
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The Taint Reaper posted:I dunno Mickey acts like a real jerk in those cartoons, he's never really acted like a jerk before. You never saw early Mickey Mouse cartoons, huh? The super squeaky clean Mickey Mouse stuff was something the character trended towards as he got more mascoty. He (and really most of the Disney cast) were pretty big assholes in the early days. Hell, look at Fantasia and the infamous Sorcerer's Apprentice. Or hell, this:  ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 20:19
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ImpAtom posted:You never saw early Mickey Mouse cartoons, huh? The super squeaky clean Mickey Mouse stuff was something the character trended towards as he got more mascoty. He (and really most of the Disney cast) were pretty big assholes in the early days. Hell, look at Fantasia and the infamous Sorcerer's Apprentice. No I've seen the early ones but he never seemed that much of a jerk(really I love the how Mickey does his sarcasm in the newer ones), but I've honestly never read the comics. Only ye olden Disney comics I have are the Scrooge ones.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:22
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The Taint Reaper posted:No I've seen the early ones but he never seemed that much of a jerk(really I love the how Mickey does his sarcasm in the newer ones), but I've honestly never read the comics. When Epic Mickey came out, they were originally intending to have a morality meter between rear end in a top hat Early Mickey and Squeaky Clean Modern Mickey. I think he was going to be called "Scrapper" Mickey or something akin to that, and you'd veer closer to one or the other depended on if you acted mischievous or squeaky clean. but the focus testers got super upset at Mickey being presented as a jerk, despite the fact that it was explicitly based on the older version of the character. (And indeed the story itself is focused on the idea of modern Mickey dealing with the consequences of something he did mischievously in his youth.) People had the idea of squeaky clean Mickey so ingrained in their head that they reacted extremely negatively to the idea of a 'mean' Mickey. I'm honestly glad Disney is willing to be less controlling about it these days and more willing to embrace the older style of the character.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:27
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You can visit basically any online store selling indie art prints if you really need your "What if Mario was dark and TWIZTED" fix.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:27
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Mickey Mouse also fights anime men with a sword shaped like a key.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:27
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Supercar Gautier posted:You can visit basically any online store selling indie art prints if you really need your "What if Mario was dark and TWIZTED" fix. Dark and twisted isn't the same as funny sarcastic bastard. Also It's not art unless you can play it with a controller. 
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Nov 23, 2013 20:29
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When it comes down to it, Nintendo's problem with the Wii U is a variety of things. The system is not just underpowered like the PS2 or whatever, but drastically underpowered. They didn't advertise when they needed to, and the advertising has also been very poor. Their stable of IPs still sell well, but they're not getting people to buy the hardware like a Mario 64 or Smash Bros. They also aren't pushing any new, creative IPs like Pikmin on the Gamecube, which makes sense from a business perspective but, given how Nintendo fucks around with hardware so much, I am surprise they don't bother giving their team room to do new stuff. The current market totally allows for all sorts of experimentation: you don't have to blow millions on a full-priced title. Just grab a small team and tell them to make a cheap game for the eShop. GameFreak did this with HarmoKnight on the 3DS, and while that game was...not so great, it was at least the team trying SOMETHING besides pokemonpokemonpokemon. I dunno how Nintendo gets back third party. Even in the past, third parties complained that they couldn't compete with Nintendo's first party offerings. That strikes me as weak excuses for poor sales, because they apparently had no problem competing with the Halos and Uncharteds out there. But the problem is multifaceted, and Nintendo do a lot of things differently with whatever succeeds the Wii U.
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Nov 23, 2013 20:52
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The eShop thing is a great point. Wii U's eShop is really criminally underused, and while I don't blame third parties for not wanting to sell a digital only game on Wii U, the fact that Nintendo has contributed nothing to it other than a Pokemon Rumble game, when Nintendo has made so many awesome little games for 3DS eShop like Dillon's Rolling Western, Pushmo, Crashmo, Sakura Samurai, is pathetic. All their new IPs have been on 3DS in bite sized form. Spread the love! You've got a lot of studios under you! Just devote a small team at least. e: I think it's important mostly for evangelical purposes, since a lot of Nintendo fans still don't own U, either because they're waiting for The Game to get it, or they're disillusioned or whatever. But they might be more inclined if there were a TON of 1st/2nd-party titles, instead of just... I'm trying to think of how many have been released at this point. It's still less than ten isn't it? It's not a ton. The 3DS towers over Wii U in 1st/2nd-party support. The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 21:35 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 21:31
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It's a lot more profitable to create a game that you can sell on multiple platforms, then one that you need to tailor make for the previous gen wii. Right now, the Wii U will get titles because there are still titles being made for the PS3/360. But the poor attach rates make it seem less than worthwhile. If I make a game that targets the PS3, I might want to port to the 360 as that is an audience of 80m+, even if I get a lack luster attach rate, I might still earn back my money. If I make a game for the Wii U its a much much smaller audience. It may not be worth my time. Launch game attach rates are usually high, but the Wii U has been on the market for a year and outside of nintendo titles not much is selling. Unless they pull a gamecube and make it like 200 dollars and get actually competent marketing, I just don't see it working. I would love to play SMW3d. But right now it doesn't like it is worth 350 dollars to me. I bought a wii for galaxy,galaxy 2 and super paper mario, and I mostly regret that decision as after playing those titles it mostly collected dust. Even my PS3 which I don't really game on at least is a competent blu-ray player.
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Nov 23, 2013 21:35
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ImpAtom posted:Pretty much every first party game they've made recently, aside from the disaster that was Other M and I think Wii Music, has been a success both critically and commercially. The Wii U games are the exception and it's a lot easier to blame those on the system, not the games. (NSMBU aside which is only a commercial failure when compared to other NSMB games.) One of the continuing themes regarding WiiU software is that everything is bombing relative to the install base and there hasn't been any "evergreen" trend outside of NSMBU (which presumably will cease selling now that it's bundled). Existing owners are simply not buying any software for it. quote:It's a lot more profitable to create a game that you can sell on multiple platforms, then one that you need to tailor make for the previous gen wii. Right now, the Wii U will get titles because there are still titles being made for the PS3/360. But the poor attach rates make it seem less than worthwhile. Zachack fucked around with this message at 22:06 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 22:01
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Zachack posted:Game & Wario is a commercial and critical bomb. Pikmin did well critically but I don't know if I'd consider it a commercial success, even by WiiU standards. W101 is not a critical success (more of a midrange) and outright bombed by WiiU standards. Wii Party U was a critical semi-bomb and has kinda sales-bombed by WiiU standards, although this gets into regional discussions (it completely bombed in the US). So you completely ignored the part where I said "the Wii U games are the exception", right? There's a number of factors there but trying to boil it down to 'nobody likes Nintendo games anymore" is pretty demonstrably false. Pikmin's attach rate is actually pretty high and its sales are about what is expected from a Pikmin title. It isn't insanely high like New Super Mario Bros U. but it's higher than Pikmin has had before. A significant percentage of Wii U owners bough it, it's just that there are not enough Wii U owners out there. Nintendo has turfed consumer confidence in the Wii U and that's a really bad thing even for good/popular games. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 22:04
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ImpAtom posted:So you completely ignored the part where I said "the Wii U games are the exception", right? No, I ignored the part where you said "it's easier to blame them on the system" because that's not been proven. I also reject that the hardware made Game & Wario, W101, or Wii Party U not be critical successes.
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Nov 23, 2013 22:09
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Wii-U games are also 60 dollars which is way too much when you have comparable games also coming out for 60 bucks. I've got well over 100 games for the gamecube and well over 100 games for the Wii, none of them ran 50 bucks when I got them, let alone 60. Even going back to my N64 and SNES collections none of them ran 50 or 60. NES I don't remember, but if you were to get the first party titles now they wouldn't be worth all that much either. If the Wii-U became the cheap system with cheap games that would help turn poo poo around probably. Outside of Monster Hunter I've yet to play a game on the system that felt like it justified the 60 dollar price tag.
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Nov 23, 2013 22:10
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I don't think W101 had any chance of being a success but I was pretty consistent on that from the day it was announced. I also never understood the point of Game & Wario because it felt like Nintendoland B-Sides that they slapped Wario's image on, making it not even a recommended purchase for Wario fans. N64 and SNES games absolutely went above 60 dollars though, I'm not sure what you're talking about there. That's why I rented as a kid. There were games that ran for as much as $79.99. I do think Wii U games should be $50 rather than 60 though, I agree with you there.
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Nov 23, 2013 22:13
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The Taint Reaper posted:Wii-U games are also 60 dollars which is way too much when you have comparable games also coming out for 60 bucks. Super Mario RPG was like $90, and pretty every N64 game was $60 or more.
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Nov 23, 2013 22:14
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Zachack posted:No, I ignored the part where you said "it's easier to blame them on the system" because that's not been proven. I also reject that the hardware made Game & Wario, W101, or Wii Party U not be critical successes. No, but cherrypicking a Platinum game and a low-budget minigame collection and going "see, nobody buys Nintendo games anymore" is a pretty flawed premise. Nintendo has a handheld system where their games are still selling immensely well. Even the most rehash of the rehash New Super Mario Bros. games (2) did 6 million copies on the 3DS. The Taint Reaper posted:I've got well over 100 games for the gamecube and well over 100 games for the Wii, none of them ran 50 bucks when I got them, let alone 60. Even going back to my N64 and SNES collections none of them ran 50 or 60. You're comparing late-life prices to new prices. You can't go "I'd buy every game for $10, why don't they make games $10?" There is a bare minimum they need to sell for in order to make a profit, with lower prices coming into play either when they've made enough that they can afford to go after the holdout customers or when a game has bombed so hard they have to try to recoup their losses however they can. It's entirely possible Nintendo games could be cheaper, but going "I never paid $(x) for a Wii game" doesn't mean much when it comes to a company's success. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 22:22 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 22:17
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Quest For Glory II posted:
I always picked them up at sales. I got Golden Eye the week of release at Toys R Us for 40 bucks, same went for Star Fox, both Banjo kazooies, and the other Rare games. This was back when you used to need the service tags to redeem the games behind the bullet proof enclosed service counter because R Zone didn't exist yet. Last game I remember spending 60-70 bucks on was Growlancer Generations and before that it was Earth Worm Jim 2. ImpAtom posted:
Yeah a few were late in life prices. But even recently, Xenoblade was 40 bucks brand new at Gamestop when it came out, Last Story was around the same and Pandora's Tower was 30 bucks. I'm not sure how exactly the development costs are distributed, but none of those were considered small games. They were also within the last year if the Wii's life cycle so they're still rather a solid comparison between the Wii-U's pricing and the previous one. The Taint Reaper fucked around with this message at 22:25 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 22:18
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The Taint Reaper posted:Yeah a few were late in life prices. But Xenoblade was 40 bucks brand new at Gamestop when it came out, Last Story was around the same and Pandora's Tower was 30 bucks. Xenoblade Chronicles was $49.99 at launch. I don't recall the other two since I bought them later off Amazon. The Taint Reaper posted:none of those were considered small games. Every single one of those was a small game. The only reason they got a launch at all was because of a dedicated fan push and even then I don't believe any of them broke 100,000 units worldwide. They were also full price games in Japan (and I believe Europe but I can't remember for sure.) ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 22:30 on Nov 23, 2013 |
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Nov 23, 2013 22:24
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