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Don't forget the horrible non-explanation as to why Darkhawk is there with the teen brigade when he's in his goddamn 30s (and also should have been in deep deep space nowhere near Earth.) There was also a stupid bit where they realize they can't exactly make Arcade so super powerful with no consequences so you get a throwaway line about how he's extremely powerful and invincible in this arena but he's normal anywhere else.
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Nov 26, 2013 06:53
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Considering the cover art you threw up there (insert Mad Magazine joke here), I'd say they were probably more inspired by Battle Royale, a story that preceeds Hunger Games by many years and closer resembles the plot of AA. The font for the logo to the book even resembles the logo for the Battle Royale franchise.
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Nov 26, 2013 07:19
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It was announced in September of last year and presumably it would've been in the works before then so it's not at all inconceivable to think the pitch came around the same time the movie came out (which was in June) and it was zeroed in on for that reason. The first few covers were homages to "teen death match" or whatever you want to call it stuff too (the first few issues also had Lord of the Flies and, surprise, Hunger Games homage covers; maybe a few more I'm forgetting). And the death thing is just really bad in how they have no emotional punch whatsoever. Take Red Raven. Sure she's an obscure character with only a handful of appearances, definitely Z-list, but Hopeless apparently had more plans for her but had to wind up cutting them so instead she's killed unceremoniously in the second issue by flying up, hitting the ceiling, and breaking her neck after falling to the ground while nobody reacts. Or look at Juston/ He seemingly has an entire story arc about fighting on his own, injured and I think paralyzed, and the entire thing happens completely off page until he shows up with his Sentinel converted into a giant pilotable robot and he's in quick order unceremoniously tossed from the thing which kills him so Apex can rampage around it and kill (until her revival) Nico. And then by the next issue it's done with too. It's like Hopeless just kind of went from plot point A to plot point B to plot point C like he was marking things off on a checklist. There's just no emotional investment to be gained from anything. Why should I give a gently caress when the Atlantean girl dies (in a confusing death, I'm still not even sure HOW she died she just kind of did) when she's spent most of the series barely being a character? If I'm a new reader why should I care about the deaths of Mettle, Red Raven or Juston when I'm never given any indication to care about who these people are? If they made me feel anything it's annoyance that some decent characters (Mettle and Juston mainly) were taken off the table (because face it, they're all C-list or lower which means they're not on the fast track to coming back) and that it wasn't even done well; just in a shlocky, shock value manner.
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Nov 26, 2013 07:35
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They killed the sweet little kid with the giant pet sentinel? I barely knew the character but he sure as gently caress deserved better than that. gently caress this series.
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Nov 26, 2013 08:21
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Jerusalem posted:They killed the sweet little kid with the giant pet sentinel? They all did. Yes, even Hopeless' own characters (although I guess he may have tweaked it so his favourite OCs were the ones that lived while killing off a bunch of disposables to avoid accusations of bias). Oh and Arcade got away to be followed up in another godawful series with the same lovely writer and the same characters he already poo poo on.
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Nov 26, 2013 13:48
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Choco1980 posted:Considering the cover art you threw up there (insert Mad Magazine joke here), I'd say they were probably more inspired by Battle Royale, a story that preceeds Hunger Games by many years and closer resembles the plot of AA. The font for the logo to the book even resembles the logo for the Battle Royale franchise.
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Nov 26, 2013 14:49
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Avengers Arena has been the worst Marvel book since Marvel NOW! started. It was just totally pointless. Nothing positive came out of it, and getting it instead of a Braddock Acadamy book is a tragedy.
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Nov 26, 2013 15:09
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I totally forget why Darkhawk was part of that mess. Seriously, gently caress that book for killing off Mettle, one of the most interesting characters from Avengers Academy.
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Nov 26, 2013 15:10
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E the Shaggy posted:I totally forget why Darkhawk was part of that mess. They even acknowledged the stupidity of it in the book, with Darkhawk pointing out he's a grown man now. The characters should not be pointing out your own stupidity in your story.
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Nov 26, 2013 17:19
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WickedHate posted:Avengers Arena has been the worst Marvel book since Marvel NOW! started. It was just totally pointless. Nothing positive came out of it, and getting it instead of a Braddock Acadamy book is a tragedy. Hell, the fact that Avengers Academy got replaced by it is maddening. That book was basically the opposite of Arena. It created a whole bunch of brand new characters, made them interesting, even managed to make cheap hooks (X-23 joining the class) and tie-ins (Fear Itself) work. I still love the development of Finesse from creepy autistic/sociopathic chick, to basically the most heroic of the team. Didn't DC pull a similar  move with the Titans doing Hunger Games/Battle Royale as well?
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Nov 26, 2013 17:21
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Gaz-L posted:Didn't DC pull a similar That was just the monthly title.
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Nov 26, 2013 17:25
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bobkatt013 posted:That was just the monthly title. It was still awful. Tron suits, Legion Lost, Artemis being killed off in like, one or two issues, everything you'd expect of New 52 Titans and more.
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Nov 26, 2013 17:51
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Gaz-L posted:
Not neccassarily with Titans but DC did do Countdown: Arena. I didn't read it myself because it looked terrible, but I knew about it. Basically came out while Countdown was going on, so it had the stench of Countdown on it. It was basically DC saying "who would win in a fight between all our Elseworld characters?"
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Nov 26, 2013 18:27
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Jerusalem posted:They killed the sweet little kid with the giant pet sentinel? The issue of Avengers Academy about that Sentinel almost giving his life to stop crazy Phoenix Emma Frost from hurting Juston (but it turns out Quicksilver saved the Sentinel's CPU  ) almost brought me to tears. And then he died in a lovely book.
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Nov 26, 2013 18:41
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Lurdiak posted:The issue of Avengers Academy about that Sentinel almost giving his life to stop crazy Phoenix Emma Frost from hurting Juston (but it turns out Quicksilver saved the Sentinel's CPU Seriously, that probably pissed me off more than any other death to come out of that because that Academy issue was fantastic.
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Nov 26, 2013 19:45
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Gaz-L posted:Didn't DC pull a similar "Terror Titans", it was right before Final Crisis. I still want Clock King's glasses from that miniseries, those things are so goddamn dumb but I love them.
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Nov 26, 2013 20:39
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So did Avengers Arena pull a "nope, Arcade didn't actually kill anyone, they're in suspended animation or another dimension or something" at the end, or all all the dead characters actually dead?
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Nov 26, 2013 20:41
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For Teen Titans, there is The Culling, which is indeed some dumb Hunger Games/ Battle Royal knockoff that happened in the new 52.
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Nov 26, 2013 20:51
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Evil Mastermind posted:So did Avengers Arena pull a "nope, Arcade didn't actually kill anyone, they're in suspended animation or another dimension or something" at the end, or all all the dead characters actually dead? It's not clear. There's been a lot of deaths. However Arcade has been keeping all of the bodies of the people in his lab downstairs in what looks like stasis tanks. So currently everybody is dead....but they might not stay that way.
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Nov 26, 2013 21:01
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The Question IRL posted:It's not clear. There's been a lot of deaths. However Arcade has been keeping all of the bodies of the people in his lab downstairs in what looks like stasis tanks. So currently everybody is dead....but they might not stay that way. So I assume that some point during the next series the heroes will find all their friends to be brainwashed and trying to kill them.
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Nov 26, 2013 21:03
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Hey, if it means Mettle and Juston aren't actually dead, I'm all for it.
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Nov 26, 2013 21:15
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I just can't believe anyone would use the name "Hopeless" as a writer  \/\/\/ Heh Quantum of Phallus fucked around with this message at 21:45 on Nov 26, 2013 |
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Nov 26, 2013 21:38
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Quantum of Phallus posted:I just can't believe anyone would use the name "Hopeless" as a writer The only honest writer in modern comics.
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Nov 26, 2013 21:43
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Lurdiak posted:The issue of Avengers Academy about that Sentinel almost giving his life to stop crazy Phoenix Emma Frost from hurting Juston (but it turns out Quicksilver saved the Sentinel's CPU That issue is about my only exposure to the character and yeah, it was a really sweet issue that told a charming story. It's pretty hugely offensive that they'd off him in some cheap "controversy" book like that.
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Nov 26, 2013 22:58
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I think the part that annoyed me the most out of all that stupid poo poo was giving Chase the Darkhawk amulet.
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Nov 26, 2013 23:31
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Evil Mastermind posted:So did Avengers Arena pull a "nope, Arcade didn't actually kill anyone, they're in suspended animation or another dimension or something" at the end, or all all the dead characters actually dead? The final issue is out tomorrow but spoilers have been leaked. If you find them it'll answer your question.
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Nov 27, 2013 00:04
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Codependent Poster posted:The final issue is out tomorrow but spoilers have been leaked. If you find them it'll answer your question. But that would require actually caring enough about AA to find it in advance 
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Nov 27, 2013 00:27
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muscles like this? posted:I think the part that annoyed me the most out of all that stupid poo poo was giving Chase the Darkhawk amulet. I thought Darkhawk couldn't get rid of the amulet if he tried? How did they get it off of him?
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Nov 27, 2013 00:44
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prefect posted:I thought Darkhawk couldn't get rid of the amulet if he tried? How did they get it off of him? The power of bad writing.
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Nov 27, 2013 02:47
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Something just ripped it out of him because I guess that can happen. It's no like Hopeless really did any kind of proper research on the characters it seems. I mentioned it earlier but Hazmat's "I've always been a hater" line is a real good example of that. Hazmat's deal was that she was a nice, normal girl with a perfect life who got it ripped away from her when her powers developed and over time this turned her into a bitter, cynical and angry person and then over the course of AA she winds up working through her issues and, while still kind of bitchy, is definitely in a way better place than she was at the start of the series. That line basically tosses all of her character development in the garbage (while pretty much ignoring her backstory as well) to turn her into a one dimensional caricature of how she was in Academy. Haha that reminds me that I really love how the first person killed in the book is Mettle who's (half) black. The black guy literally died first.
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Nov 27, 2013 02:55
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The problem with these story arcs (and a lot of 'event' comics, really) is that the story is built around death. Sometimes killing a character off is just the natural progression of a story, and ideally, you build that for maximum emotional oomph. You set out to tell a story and then get to a point where the death is the only reasonable way to proceed. Arena and the... dear god, THREE Titans stories are based around "Who can we kill off to show it's for real dangerous/edgy?". The cart's pulling the horse.
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Nov 27, 2013 16:21
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Gaz-L posted:THREE Titans stories are based around "Who can we kill off to show it's for real dangerous/edgy?"
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Nov 27, 2013 16:54
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Gaz-L posted:The problem with these story arcs (and a lot of 'event' comics, really) is that the story is built around death. Sometimes killing a character off is just the natural progression of a story, and ideally, you build that for maximum emotional oomph. You set out to tell a story and then get to a point where the death is the only reasonable way to proceed. Arena and the... dear god, THREE Titans stories are based around "Who can we kill off to show it's for real dangerous/edgy?". The cart's pulling the horse. And what's sad is that killing characters that way is like the laziest way to create drama or tension. And if half the characters are ones you've never heard of, it seriously undercuts what little tension you have.
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Nov 27, 2013 16:54
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Evil Mastermind posted:And what's sad is that killing characters that way is like the laziest way to create drama or tension. And if half the characters are ones you've never heard of, it seriously undercuts what little tension you have. And if they're ones you like, you're going to be pissed off since they're not likely to win the resurrection jackpot, especially if they get killed if in a lovely manner. I mean look at Barry Allen's death-people mock him for his genericness, but I'm sure he had his fans back in the day. And they probably weren't pissed off (much), because the way he died was meaningful and totally awesome, to the point it became the defining point in his character (which makes his resurrection totally baffling, to be honest). And if you do it wrong, it can backfire. Hell, even Ted's death (which I thought worked pretty well) probably sabotaged the third Blue Beetle because fans were still upset over Ted dying-and that story showed a lot of respect for Ted!
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Nov 27, 2013 18:31
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Plus, it's comic books, so whoever dies will be back with a new costume or allegiance by next month anyway.
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Nov 29, 2013 00:15
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So the people who died in Avengers Arena are dead for real. Which includes Juston, Mettle, Red Raven and Reptil. Chris Powell lived and got his amulet back. Bendis immediately whisked away X-23 who Hopeless didn't even use in the last issue, probably thanks to Bendis stealing her out of that loving stupid book. And it ends with Arcade being drawn as an attractive guy with wine and unopened condoms laying around a hotel room implicating that he's totally awesome and is going to get laid so much and he won, and he did it just to get views on youtube. Fuuuuuuck that series.
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Nov 29, 2013 00:44
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Codependent Poster posted:So the people who died in Avengers Arena are dead for real. Which includes Juston, Mettle, Red Raven and Reptil. Chris Powell lived and got his amulet back. Bendis immediately whisked away X-23 who Hopeless didn't even use in the last issue, probably thanks to Bendis stealing her out of that loving stupid book. And it ends with Arcade being drawn as an attractive guy with wine and unopened condoms laying around a hotel room implicating that he's totally awesome and is going to get laid so much and he won, and he did it just to get views on youtube. It sounds to me like the series was a more coherent version of Daniel Way's Venom, only it had an effect on the mainstream.
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Nov 29, 2013 00:58
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Codependent Poster posted:So the people who died in Avengers Arena are dead for real. Which includes Juston, Mettle, Red Raven and Reptil. Chris Powell lived and got his amulet back. Bendis immediately whisked away X-23 who Hopeless didn't even use in the last issue, probably thanks to Bendis stealing her out of that loving stupid book. And it ends with Arcade being drawn as an attractive guy with wine and unopened condoms laying around a hotel room implicating that he's totally awesome and is going to get laid so much and he won, and he did it just to get views on youtube. So wait, no Runaways were killed? Okay that's a silver lining.
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Nov 29, 2013 02:28
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They had the good fortune of being Hopeless's favorites, so he couldn't bring himself to kill them off.
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Nov 29, 2013 02:34
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Unfortunately it also means he's writing them again in the "second season" where they hunt down Arcade. And no proper Runaways.
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Nov 29, 2013 02:43
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