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If KC can pick up Maclin, that frees up our only pick in the first ~80 picks for something besides a WR, because good lord, we need more receivers, but we also need O-Line and some more secondary. E: What happens to James Franklin? Is he going to actually get drafted? He looks pretty good. No Butt Stuff fucked around with this message at 16:40 on Dec 2, 2013 |
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Dec 2, 2013 16:25
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Dunno why KC fans think they need a receiver, y'all have Junior Hemingway.
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Dec 2, 2013 16:50
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What's the projected cap for 2014? I know there is some new TV money supposed to be coming in but it's not supposed to be a dramatic increase from what I've read.
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Dec 2, 2013 18:34
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excidium posted:What's the projected cap for 2014? I know there is some new TV money supposed to be coming in but it's not supposed to be a dramatic increase from what I've read. Small increase, probably in the area of $300-$800k. They made some adjustments back in 2011 to ensure that the cap would increase every year that basically amounted to lowering the cap increase over the following several years. i.e. expect something like $123.5M to $124M for the 2014 cap.
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Dec 2, 2013 18:58
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Chiefs fans talking about thieir 2014 draft like their season is over is infuriating. Anyways, San Diego needs a little bit of everything. Corner, OLB, and left tackle should be the priority.
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Dec 2, 2013 19:01
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Arschlochkind posted:And the Jags just won again. There's still a chance for me to be right, so I'll wait to say my mea culpas for another two weeks, but I think it's safe to say that I vastly underestimated the Texans ability to choke games away. They're clearly not as bad as their record, much like the Bucs, but they seem incapable of closing a loving game out. Thank god Atlanta, Minn, and the Jags won so the Bucs can keep pace but now I'm getting worried since there's a logjam of teams with 3-4 wins the Bucs could conceivably win just enough to boot themselves out of the top ten.
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Dec 2, 2013 19:06
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SteelAngel2000 posted:Chiefs fans talking about thieir 2014 draft like their season is over is infuriating. Ha, I don't really think of it as over at all, but these last few weeks have definitely exposed the weaknesses in the team and made it a lot easier to talk about the coming offseason needs.
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Dec 2, 2013 19:10
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SteelAngel2000 posted:Chiefs fans talking about thieir 2014 draft like their season is over is infuriating. Oh, it's not over. But we aren't going to win the SuperBowl, so we're looking at holes to fill to make that a possibility next year.
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Dec 2, 2013 19:14
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quote:NFL.com's Albert Breer spoke with one AFC college scouting director who believes Alabama senior QB A.J. McCarron is very similar to Tom Brady.  Is this really the state of nfl scouting? He has moxie?
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Dec 2, 2013 19:33
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No Butt Stuff posted:Oh, it's not over. But we aren't going to win the SuperBowl, so we're looking at holes to fill to make that a possibility next year. I wouldn't even say that. If the defense were to come back on in the playoffs and the offense continues to put up points there's no reason we can't make a run in the playoffs. They have shown they can do really well in all 3 phases, it's just putting it together and getting all 3 going at the same time when it matters. So according to the Chig if we're looking at ~$124M next year the Chiefs are already at $121M before the next rookie class. That really doesn't leave much room for anything in FA like Maclin. Dunta Robinson would be good for $3.3M in cap space. I don't honestly believe they will cut Avery after one year when we really have very few other options, but we'll see. Other than that, some of the only cap savings looks like extending Alex Smith (trigger warning for Parm) or extending Eric Berry (if that's possible - he was a pre-new CBA contract and will be going into year 4 of 5).
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Dec 2, 2013 19:41
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Quest For Glory II posted:well. alright then It's either moxie or has a good bubble, so pick your poison. McCarron is a prospect who is starting to interest me. I do get concerned about QBs who come from big schools and are surrounded by elite talent at pretty much every position, but after living through Ponder for 3-years, the single biggest attribute I want in a QB is finding someone who is able to progress through their reads and hit their 3rd or 4th option. He's one of the guys I like if the Vikings don't address QB with their 1st pick, but we'll see how he progresses through the draft process.
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Dec 2, 2013 19:43
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Quest For Glory II posted:well. alright then These are the things scouts say when they want to fluff non-projectible guys who were successful at the college level. They can't talk about tools or tape so they have to justify it somehow. e: To be clear I don't think McCarron is actually a terrible prospect, although he'll almost certainly be overdrafted based on said college success as guys usually are. He's a high-floor guy more than a high ceiling one, but a lot of teams could use one of those. For example, if Jacksonville were to take Clowney instead of a QB in the first and then take McCarron on the second day that would probably make them dramatically better in both spots. Grozz Nuy fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Dec 2, 2013 |
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Dec 2, 2013 19:45
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Quest For Glory II posted:well. alright then Ernie Accorsi described Eli as having a certain magic in his scouting report I'm not sure it's ever not been this way
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Dec 2, 2013 19:48
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excidium posted:I wouldn't even say that. If the defense were to come back on in the playoffs and the offense continues to put up points there's no reason we can't make a run in the playoffs. They have shown they can do really well in all 3 phases, it's just putting it together and getting all 3 going at the same time when it matters. Extend them both. Cut Robinson. Albert will be gone, that'll save us $12m. I'm sure we're losing some others to FA as well.
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Dec 2, 2013 19:53
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No Butt Stuff posted:Extend them both. Cut Robinson. Albert will be gone, that'll save us $12m. I'm sure we're losing some others to FA as well. http://overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Chiefs&Year=2014
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Dec 2, 2013 20:03
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How do we owe Jon Baldwin a million bucks? Ugh, we're gonna have to restructure a few contracts, aren't we? e: I like this site. Eric Decker and Jeremy Maclin are both free agents next year? Plus Edelmen, if we wanted a scrappy white guy to replace Dex on the offense. Talib specifically to jam up receivers at the line, I don't know anything about which safety to bring in though... last edit: Just realized that if the season ended right now the 49ers would have back to back picks in the second round. No Butt Stuff fucked around with this message at 21:03 on Dec 2, 2013 |
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Dec 2, 2013 20:33
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excidium posted:I wouldn't even say that. If the defense were to come back on in the playoffs and the offense continues to put up points there's no reason we can't make a run in the playoffs. They have shown they can do really well in all 3 phases, it's just putting it together and getting all 3 going at the same time when it matters. yeah you just activated my PTSD with that THANKS EXCIDIUM
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Dec 2, 2013 21:33
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Volkerball posted:Not when you're dealing with a franchise QB. Then too, since most "franchise qbs" are just overpaid faces of their teams, why take two years to develop a first overall pick and then debut them as phenoms just to get stuck on the hook for a massive extension after losing two years. That's second round and lower logic, and decades of overrating QBs then watching them flounder is an argument for drafting those qbs later, not drafting them and sitting them.
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Dec 2, 2013 21:50
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MJBuddy posted:Then too, since most "franchise qbs" are just overpaid faces of their teams, why take two years to develop a first overall pick and then debut them as phenoms just to get stuck on the hook for a massive extension after losing two years. When's the last time a team won the Super Bowl with a rookie QB? Also, if the QB is good, it's not like they aren't going to extend them long term anyways. Who cares if you "lose a year" of your QB taking shots at 22? Would you like them to actually get hit in practice too, so they don't lose valuable experience? There's definitely quarterbacks who have busted out of the league, and never reached their ceilings because they were set up for failure. Drafting somebody 1st overall is just more of a reason to make concessions to ensure he develops properly.
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Dec 2, 2013 22:38
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Volkerball posted:Not when you're dealing with a franchise QB. This is, like, the worst concept in football. The benefit of the restructured rookie wage scale is that you can get top talent and pay little for it for their contract. If they burn out during your contract you can cut them and draft again or enjoy the Russell Wilson experience of paying nothing on an Elite QB for years and surround him with proven veteran talent for the rest of his contract and try to win it all while still being able to draft for the future. If you let them sit you are wasting both training and contract time and assuming the person infront of them isn't also a rookie you're paying somebody veteran starter money to go out there and play bad enough you had to draft a new QB. Ultimately, if you're not confident the QB should start day one you pick a talent that you think can in some other position of need and pick up some other QB in the second.
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Dec 2, 2013 22:39
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Barudak posted:The benefit of the restructured rookie wage scale is that you can get top talent and pay little for it for their contract. If they burn out during your contract you can cut them and draft again or enjoy the Russell Wilson experience of paying nothing on an Elite QB for years and surround him with proven veteran talent for the rest of his contract and try to win it all while still being able to draft for the future. You still can't get stupid about it and start playing with the cap ceiling when you've got a franchise QB deal you're going to have to have space for, not to mention whoever else you've drafted that is coming out of rookie deals. Yeah, it's a benefit, but you're exaggerating it. quote:If you let them sit you are wasting both training and contract time Who cares if you waste contract time on a player who will play every snap of their career for your if they perform? And you aren't wasting their time training. You're making sure they're focused on training instead of winning on Sunday. quote:Ultimately, if you're not confident the QB should start day one you pick a talent that you think can in some other position of need and pick up some other QB in the second. This is silly. Just because someone is toolsy enough and has shown the potential to be a top QB doesn't mean it's smart to throw them to the wolves. Not every team is the Seahawks. Volkerball fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Dec 2, 2013 |
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Dec 2, 2013 22:50
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I think the answer is not to draft a QB in the first round if you have a terrible line that's going to get him killed like David Carr.
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Dec 2, 2013 23:01
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Volkerball posted:You still can't get stupid about it and start playing with the cap ceiling when you've got a franchise QB deal you're going to have to have space for, not to mention whoever else you've drafted that is coming out of rookie deals. Yeah, it's a benefit, but you're exaggerating it. We're not saying to not start guys you draft first overall. We're saying not to draft guys who aren't ready to start first overall. It's a different statement. The gap is actual value vs cap cost isn't being overstated. It's literally a description of how you create a good team and the logic of every gm decision.
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Dec 2, 2013 23:01
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MJBuddy posted:We're not saying to not start guys you draft first overall. We're saying not to draft guys who aren't ready to start first overall. It's a different statement. Which is different than the reality, the player is probably capable of starting, but it's your decision whether or not to let him. Same deal in hockey. Jonathan Drouin could play right now, but they kicked him back to the minors to develop his game, even though they lost a year of his rookie contract and he's a top 3 pick. quote:The gap is actual value vs cap cost isn't being overstated. It's literally a description of how you create a good team and the logic of every gm decision. Yes, but good GM's with consistent teams save up a ton of cap space and use it to resign their studs over time. Having a QB on the rookie wage scale doesn't give you free reign to spend a whole lot more than you would anyways. Russell Wilson might not be getting paid $15 million, but they're going to have to have that cap space ready to sign him when his deal's up. 90% of QB's aren't going to take your team to the playoffs in their first two years, and anyone you sign in the last two is going to be hurting your cap space moving forward. There's still a lot to be conscious of there.
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Dec 2, 2013 23:12
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Volkerball posted:Which is different than the reality, the player is probably capable of starting, but it's your decision whether or not to let him. Same deal in hockey. Jonathan Drouin could play right now, but they kicked him back to the minors to develop his game, even though they lost a year of his rookie contract and he's a top 3 pick.
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Dec 2, 2013 23:15
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Volkerball posted:Which is different than the reality, the player is probably capable of starting, but it's your decision whether or not to let him. Same deal in hockey. Jonathan Drouin could play right now, but they kicked him back to the minors to develop his game, even though they lost a year of his rookie contract and he's a top 3 pick. Yes, cap space they create by accelerating bonuses into base salaries in low years to keep your higher paid guys cheaper in the future. A benched player has zero value. Someone in without the complementary features to magnify their value has a very low value. If your choice is between those two, it's because you've got a glaring hole in your team already. Fixing those is valuable, and if you maintain that logic, you can pick up a reach later in the draft and put them with a strong complement. You know, like Seattle did.
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Dec 2, 2013 23:30
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No Butt Stuff posted:E: What happens to James Franklin? Is he going to actually get drafted? He looks pretty good. Didn't see anyone answer this, I did hear one SEC homer announcer say that 'he will be playing on Sundays' a few weeks ago but I just don't see it. He'd be a project but I guess someone might be interested in trying to stash him on their practice squad. I don't even know if he's a candidate for a position change, tight end would seem to be a possibility but he's both short for the traditional version of that position and probably a little slow for the H Back/combo version. I figure he'll be a UDFA camp invite somewhere and if he's lucky stick around for a few years but never really play. Also I don't see the Chiefs getting rid of Donnie Avery, we all know he sucks but he was like the only playmaker on offense other than Charles for the first half of the season when he managed to hold onto a ball here and there.
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Dec 2, 2013 23:39
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Wolfy posted:Yeah, but you also get to draft hockey players at 18 instead of 21-22.
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Dec 2, 2013 23:41
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I don't think I sit on anybody's side here. I think that the dropoff from first round QB talent to the next tier is so large that if you don't get a QB early you should wait until late. But in terms of "a first round QB should start right away", Christian Ponder and Brandon Weeden were drafted in the first round because they were perceived to be pro-ready, and all it's done is gently caress up the Vikings and Browns and ruined some of the best years of Adrian Peterson's career. And then you have projects like Josh Freeman, who was not developed properly and rushed onto the field in his rookie year when he wasn't ready, and now he'll never be ready, it's hosed. Maybe we live in an NFL where there is no "sit and learn" for any QB anymore, but. Ugh. Don't spend a 2nd day draft pick on a QB, guys. Just don't do it. Here's some names for you: Kevin Kolb, Jimmy Clausen, Ryan Mallett, Colt McCoy, Pat White, Brian Brohm, Chad Henne, Kevin O'Connell, John Beck, Drew Stanton, Trent Edwards, Geno Smith. Just... no. I mean I get it, two teams profited from an absurdly rich quarterback draft in 2012 in Seattle and Philly, but no. There's so much talent you can get in the 2nd day. Don't do this thing. The Eagles took Kolb when they could have had Eric Weddle.. ughhh (yes I know he's had a down year this year but.. we have Nate Allen and Patric Chung. WE HAVE NATE ALLEN AND PATRIC CHUNG.) The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Dec 2, 2013 |
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Dec 2, 2013 23:51
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Quest For Glory II posted:I don't think I sit on anybody's side here. I think that the dropoff from first round QB talent to the next tier is so large that if you don't get a QB early you should wait until late. But in terms of "a first round QB should start right away", Christian Ponder and Brandon Weeden were drafted in the first round because they were perceived to be pro-ready, and all it's done is gently caress up the Vikings and Browns and ruined some of the best years of Adrian Peterson's career. And then you have projects like Josh Freeman, who was not developed properly and rushed onto the field in his rookie year when he wasn't ready, and now he'll never be ready, it's hosed. I think you should draft for value and feel comfortable with the systems you can produce from your personnel and have no fear picking late round guys who can fit that system. That's how you end up with big value in later rounds.
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Dec 2, 2013 23:54
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Well, the Eagles are good at system fits, but then on occasion you still get the "what the gently caress" pick. Like, Matt Barkley doesn't fit this team in any way whatsoever. Of all 32 teams he could have gone to, he went to the least compatible one. I mean.. I guess it wasn't as bad as Oakland taking Tyler Wilson since he was cut in the preseason, but still. gently caress. The draft pick that goons laugh at the most in April always tend to bust too. TFF just has a knack for it. It's amazing. e: this post has no relation to my earlier point, it's just an off tangent The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Dec 3, 2013 |
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Dec 2, 2013 23:59
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Quest For Glory II posted:Well, the Eagles are good at system fits, but then on occasion you still get the "what the gently caress" pick. Like, Matt Barkley doesn't fit this team in any way whatsoever. Of all 32 teams he could have gone to, he went to the least compatible one. I mean.. I guess it wasn't as bad as Oakland taking Tyler Wilson since he was cut in the preseason, but still. gently caress. I feel like Chip drafted Barkley solely to embarrass the kid for playing against the Ducks. Now he can ruin him forever. Chip is heartless
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Dec 3, 2013 00:31
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Febreeze posted:I feel like Chip drafted Barkley solely to embarrass the kid for playing against the Ducks. Now he can ruin him forever. Chip is heartless I believe this.
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Dec 3, 2013 01:39
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Volkerball posted:Yes, but good GM's with consistent teams save up a ton of cap space and use it to resign their studs over time. Having a QB on the rookie wage scale doesn't give you free reign to spend a whole lot more than you would anyways. Russell Wilson might not be getting paid $15 million, but they're going to have to have that cap space ready to sign him when his deal's up. 90% of QB's aren't going to take your team to the playoffs in their first two years, and anyone you sign in the last two is going to be hurting your cap space moving forward. There's still a lot to be conscious of there. You can front load the gently caress out of a deal though. When the Panthers re-signed Charles Johnson he made something like 20 million dollars his first year back. The team had a massive amount of space because of the clear out the year earlier and it means that he's still locked up and isn't anywhere near as expensive as he would've been. When Cam needs an extension at the end of 2014 they'll be able to do the same thing while the first rounders are paid less. Problem used to be you'd want to pay your guys that you've developed by had to pay some rear end in a top hat you just drafted more money than the majority of his position just because he was there and if you hosed it up you were crippled for a good 2-3 years.
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Dec 3, 2013 05:37
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This site is incredible. I've been pouring over it for hours. Next year, the Raiders are going to be insane. They have $45 million in cap space on the books according to that calculator. If they designate Peppers a June 1st cut, they can free up another $14 million. That and cutting Bush and Bennett can give them almost $65 million in cap space. That is plenty of money to focus on targeting key players to extend and begin to shore up that defense. If they are smart with their money, they cover most of their key needs and focus on best player available in the draft. Also, just have to say that it is scary how much Oakland has to spend. I wouldn't be surprised if they are competing for a wild card spot next season.
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Dec 3, 2013 06:31
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Sataere posted:This site is incredible. I've been pouring over it for hours. Next year, the Raiders are going to be insane. They have $45 million in cap space on the books according to that calculator. Raiders are going to buy the entire market. Also every team should attempt to trade their inflated contracts to the Raiders because they will give you draft picks for bad deals.
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Dec 3, 2013 06:34
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MJBuddy posted:Raiders are going to buy the entire market. Also every team should attempt to trade their inflated contracts to the Raiders because they will give you draft picks for bad deals. I honestly don't think they are going to. They look like they are taking a focus towards building through the draft. I wouldn't be surprised if they focus on a bunch of value mid-tier contracts, with only a couple of key play makers. If they play it right, they will end up with a stacked defense and solid offensive line depth before they go into the draft.
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Dec 3, 2013 07:02
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So, Percy Harvin to the Raiders?
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Dec 3, 2013 07:38
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Sataere posted:This site is incredible. I've been pouring over it for hours. Next year, the Raiders are going to be insane. They have $45 million in cap space on the books according to that calculator. Wolfy fucked around with this message at 07:56 on Dec 3, 2013 |
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Dec 3, 2013 07:54
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Sataere posted:I honestly don't think they are going to. They look like they are taking a focus towards building through the draft. I wouldn't be surprised if they focus on a bunch of value mid-tier contracts, with only a couple of key play makers. If they play it right, they will end up with a stacked defense and solid offensive line depth before they go into the draft. They have to meet a salary floor. They could restructure to eat big cap numbers now and spend at CB and probably walk away with a huge off season that sets them up to gently caress everyone in two years. I like spending at CB because its a difficult position to hit for big value in the draft.
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Dec 3, 2013 08:03
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