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verybad posted:It's not like INT is terribly important for mages unless you're playing on Core+/No-Reload, either. The EEs actually have spell scribing limits based on Int implemented.
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Dec 7, 2013 17:59
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Moving on through my IWD run, I just finished the whole Severed Hand tower, and it was amazing. Is it normal that I like that game a lot more than BG? I like the mini story arcs a lot.
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Dec 7, 2013 19:24
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IWD is a beautiful game, both of them are.
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Dec 7, 2013 19:38
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Furism posted:Moving on through my IWD run, I just finished the whole Severed Hand tower, and it was amazing. Is it normal that I like that game a lot more than BG? I like the mini story arcs a lot. This might be heresy, but Icewind Dale's music, atmosphere and environments are all superior to BG's. It's not surprising that some people prefer it.
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Dec 7, 2013 20:22
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Well I get tired of looking at snow all the time, but overall it's pretty good.
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Dec 7, 2013 20:25
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I think if there's one thing I didn't like about IWD, it's the fact they spring enemies completely immune to non-enchanted weapons on you in like the second dungeon. It's like, okay, your normal swords and arrows mean nothing, you're hosed. Especially if you were used to Baldur's Gate and had went in with an Archer loaded with standard arrows. Whoops.
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Dec 7, 2013 20:27
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Pimpmust posted:A Monk might not be that great, but I never get tired of importing a Kenshiro portrait and making dudes explode with punches Just wait til your monk gets some levels. By the end of BG2 Rasaad was loving everything sideways. Absolute monster
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Dec 7, 2013 20:32
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jneer posted:This might be heresy, but Icewind Dale's music, atmosphere and environments are all superior to BG's. It's not surprising that some people prefer it. The Kuldahar theme alone is worth a playthrough. http://youtu.be/-kMsj9Pb6Ms
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Dec 7, 2013 20:51
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To whoever complained about not playing evil characters in BG1, you're dead on. I'd never played an Evil character before in PnP or computer D&D, but I decided an evil Fighter/Thief was for me. Holy poo poo is it worthless. If you say evil things you don't get rewards from so many quests, but 10% of the time you might get an extra 10-50 gold. Not worth it. You can't really murder anyone or do anything because the penalties are so severe. The story itself is even good focused. You can't decide early on to stop helping people in the mines or solving their crises and instead hunt Sarevok down like a dog. You get no benefit from killing Imoen to steal her power. You can't meet a priest of Cyric (there's at least 2) and decide to join him. And the worst is Viconia talks poo poo every time your reputation goes up, but I had to use EEKeeper to bump my reputation to positive levels when I met her just to be able to recruit her rear end. They made it so a loving evil cleric drow won't join you if your reputation is too low.
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Dec 7, 2013 20:54
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MrTheDevious posted:Just wait til your monk gets some levels. By the end of BG2 Rasaad was loving everything sideways. Absolute monster Don't they end up with +5 weapons for hands and immune to anything less than a +3, in addition to their punch that can kill things instantly and insane AC bonus?
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Dec 7, 2013 20:55
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Arcaeris posted:To whoever complained about not playing evil characters in BG1, you're dead on. Well to be fair, if you have a low reputation she probably has heard that you like to lure people into the woods and murder them. I wouldn't join you too, no matter how evil I was.
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Dec 7, 2013 20:56
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Either that or you thought it would be a fun idea to steal an idol from a digging expedition and cause the death of everyone there.
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Dec 7, 2013 21:02
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The fact remains that even evil people don't want to spend time near people who might murder them.
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Dec 7, 2013 21:06
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Ugly In The Morning posted:Don't they end up with +5 weapons for hands and immune to anything less than a +3, in addition to their punch that can kill things instantly and insane AC bonus? IIRC Their fists end up +4, they're immune to normal weapons, they have an ability that makes anything they hit for 1 round save vs death or die and their AC gets better as they level up but as they can't wear armor or shields it never gets insane. They do also end up with a natural 83% magic resistance, immunity to slow, poison, disease, charm, move amazingly quickly and have +2 to saves vs spells Iggles fucked around with this message at 21:13 on Dec 7, 2013 |
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Dec 7, 2013 21:11
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caleramaen posted:The fact remains that even evil people don't want to spend time near people who might murder them. So you're saying that an evil party as a concept shouldn't exist? Maybe for all CEs even, but the idea of several LEs grouping up for a common goal is not a weird idea at all. Or the idea of one leader (the PC) and a bunch of evil henchmen who are along for the loot. You could just be a self-serving opportunist dick and still be D&D evil, and it will still get you a reputation of -infinity and no chance to recruit followers.
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Dec 7, 2013 21:17
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Just loaded an old ToB save to check -- My Rasaad's level 32 -13 AC base which is by far the best in my party, -11 THACO Fists are +4 1d20, 4 attacks/round, immune to basically everything and 88% raw magic resist. He plows.
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Dec 7, 2013 21:21
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Arcaeris posted:So you're saying that an evil party as a concept shouldn't exist? Maybe for all CEs even, but the idea of several LEs grouping up for a common goal is not a weird idea at all. Or the idea of one leader (the PC) and a bunch of evil henchmen who are along for the loot. I'm saying that the game is written in a way that all evil characters come off as psychopaths. The good dialogue is fine, but the evil stuff is way out there. And reputation isn't a repetition of the deeds you've done. It's how rumors interpret your actions. You kill one guy for no reason, and now the rumor is that you are a serial killer. I agree, you should be able to play the game the way you want, but that isn't how it's written.
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Dec 7, 2013 21:24
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I always liked how aside from raising a demon at the mining operation, one of the easiest ways to tank your reputation is to get in a fight with that guy who poisons you at Baldur's Gate. One of his first moves is almost always Confusion, which since you're fighting upstairs in a packed inn, is most likely going to cause your group to run off and slaughter everyone there. It wasn't my fault!
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Dec 7, 2013 21:27
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MrTheDevious posted:Just loaded an old ToB save to check -- My Rasaad's level 32
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Dec 7, 2013 21:40
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jneer posted:This might be heresy, but Icewind Dale's music, atmosphere and environments are all superior to BG's. It's not surprising that some people prefer it. Not heresy at all. As far as replay value goes, IWD1 (never finished 2) is the crowning achievement of the Infinity engine games. The Baldur's Gates may be the one that everyone's heard of, and PS:T may have the deepest story, but IWD delivers fun gameplay in an excellent package in such a way, that it never gets stale. PS:T was a real eye opener for me, in regards to roleplaying games, but it's IWD that I've completed more than a dozen times over. In that company, Baldur's Gate is a bit of an afterthought, really.
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Dec 7, 2013 22:00
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Arcaeris posted:And the worst is Viconia talks poo poo every time your reputation goes up, but I had to use EEKeeper to bump my reputation to positive levels when I met her just to be able to recruit her rear end. They made it so a loving evil cleric drow won't join you if your reputation is too low. It's not because of the reputation alone. You get a reaction roll which is then modified by reputation and charisma. Some NPCs won't join if that roll is too low. Having a bit higher charisma would have probably allowed you to recruit her even with low reputation.
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Dec 7, 2013 22:05
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Dorn appears to be flirting with me. Talk about unexpected 
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Dec 7, 2013 22:34
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MrTheDevious posted:Dorn appears to be flirting with me. Talk about unexpected How does Dorn get along with good party members in BG2? I'm going to be starting my first BG2EE run soon and I'd like to use him since I skipped him in BG1 due to that game's insane hatred of evil conduct, but I don't want to lock myself out of cool dudes like Mazzy and Keldorn.
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Dec 7, 2013 22:45
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Kanos posted:How does Dorn get along with good party members in BG2? I'm going to be starting my first BG2EE run soon and I'd like to use him since I skipped him in BG1 due to that game's insane hatred of evil conduct, but I don't want to lock myself out of cool dudes like Mazzy and Keldorn. It seems like they didn't introduce any alignment fights with new characters to maximize uptake but I could be wrong.
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Dec 7, 2013 22:48
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oswald ownenstein posted:It seems like they didn't introduce any alignment fights with new characters to maximize uptake but I could be wrong. Several characters fight with Hexxat or just leave if she's in the party, as I understand it, and I believe Anomen leaves if you recruit Dorn.
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Dec 7, 2013 22:50
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The way Reputation is set up it's less a Good/Evil scale and more... well, what everyone else thinks you are about. It's silly that your evil party members gets upset about having a "Heroic" reputation if you think about it, I usually switch that mechanic off with a mod when I play. As for the story being "good aligned", on my last replay I reflected over the fact that I had murdered some 20 bears before even hitting Nashkel, and not to mention a village or two of Smurfs. And that was with a good party  Oh yeah, and the whole collecting scalps for money. Only human scalps, mind you.
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Dec 7, 2013 22:52
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Anomen definitely drops the party if you pick up Hexxat (though he doesn't disappear, he goes back to the Copper Coronet). I'm not aware of any duels, though. I imagine Dorn would actually fight. I wonder if the community will eventually mod out those conflicts for the tweakpack
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Dec 7, 2013 22:55
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Basic Chunnel posted:I wonder if the community will eventually mod out those conflicts for the tweakpack Probably. Lots of folks like using Keldorn and to a lesser degree Aerie even in otherwise all-evil parties due to how powerful they are, and don't like that those two characters get into fights with evil NPCs.
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Dec 7, 2013 22:57
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Cythereal posted:Several characters fight with Hexxat or just leave if she's in the party, as I understand it, and I believe Anomen leaves if you recruit Dorn. Everyone hates Hexxat. She pretty much had my entire party bitching. The only reason nobody left was because Keldorn murdered her so quickly. I at least knew he was getting ready to slaughter Viconia...Hexxat he has like one "I don't like this bitch" line then immediately tears her head off. Dorn I've not had any issues with at all, but I didn't use him in BG2 on my good playthrough. He's drat happy in my evil party. Almost too happy... His quest owns though vvv That's probably true since Keldorn happily murders basically every NPC that isn't ponies and rainbows level of good MrTheDevious fucked around with this message at 23:00 on Dec 7, 2013 |
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Dec 7, 2013 22:58
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I tried recruiting Keldorn with Dorn in my party and I got a dialogue that (I think) always leads to one or the other leaving the party and attacking.
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Dec 7, 2013 22:58
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MrTheDevious posted:Everyone hates Hexxat. She pretty much had my entire party bitching. The only reason nobody left was because Keldorn murdered her so quickly. I at least knew he was getting ready to slaughter Viconia...Hexxat he has like one "I don't like this bitch" line then immediately tears her head off. Interesting. What's funny is that Hexxat's writing is hardly evil at all. She has one little bit of evil when you first complete her quest and she's basically been chaotic neutral at worse.
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Dec 7, 2013 23:01
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MrTheDevious posted:Dorn I've not had any issues with at all, but I didn't use him in BG2 on my good playthrough. He's drat happy in my evil party. Almost too happy... His quest owns though Personally? I think Dorn and Hexxat were added specifically for evil players due to the dearth of evil-aligned characters in the base game. You've got Korgan, Viconia, and Edwin. True, they're the only single-classed examples of their classes in the game and they're very strong as a result, but that's still only three. Dorn adds an evil Keldorn-equivalent, and Hexxat is the best thief in the game, I believe. With BG2EE, you can now have a complete party of evil characters. quote:vvv That's probably true since Keldorn happily murders basically every NPC that isn't ponies and rainbows level of good He attacks Edwin (a possibly rogue representative of the Red Wizards), Viconia (an unrepentant drow and priestess of one of the FR's primary evil deities), Hexxat (an undead monster), and Dorn (a blackguard). He doesn't attack Korgan or Haer'Dalis, much less any other neutral or good characters. CN Anomen will pick a fight with him, but Keldorn doesn't start that one. Cythereal fucked around with this message at 23:04 on Dec 7, 2013 |
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Dec 7, 2013 23:02
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oswald ownenstein posted:Interesting. Yeah, but there's a pretty obvious extenuating circumstance with her that makes everyone want to butcher her immediately regardless of her actions. Everybody's super chill with her until you finish that portion of her quest ^^ yeah my party's all-evil now except for Jan, who has zero issues with the rest of us murdering babies and such. The party banter almost makes up for how awful the quests are for evil people You should spoiler that Hexxat reason 
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Dec 7, 2013 23:02
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MrTheDevious posted:Yeah, but there's a pretty obvious extenuating circumstance with her that makes everyone want to butcher her immediately regardless of her actions. Everybody's super chill with her until you finish that portion of her quest What are you talking about? Using the drone to restore her own life? After that's done she is basically true neutral or chaotic neutral.
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Dec 7, 2013 23:27
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oswald ownenstein posted:What are you talking about? No, just the fact that she's a vampire. regardless of how she actually behaves. I agree on the neutral behavior, some NPCs just give no fucks about it.
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Dec 7, 2013 23:32
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dvl posted:It's not because of the reputation alone. You get a reaction roll which is then modified by reputation and charisma. Some NPCs won't join if that roll is too low. Having a bit higher charisma would have probably allowed you to recruit her even with low reputation. I understand this, but with 15 CHA there's only so much higher it can go. Another +2 at 18 wouldn't have mattered much when I had to raise reputation by like 11.
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Dec 7, 2013 23:47
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As much as I love IWD I never made it through IWD2 and I am thinking of starting up again. All the character creation guides are huge treatises on 3e rules. Is it possible for anyone just to describe what to or not to do for the various member archetypes in general terms so I don't feel like the character guide is playing my game for me? vvvvvvvvvvv e. I've got the general idea down, just wondering about major non negotiables like hardiness is a trap and spell casters should take X meta magic and spell pens but not even think about y. I guess that's slightly different for everyone but in the internet guides its all hidden in detailed character builds instead of summary broad strokes. zedprime fucked around with this message at 00:33 on Dec 8, 2013 |
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Dec 8, 2013 00:07
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zedprime posted:As much as I love IWD I never made it through IWD2 and I am thinking of starting up again. All the character creation guides are huge treatises on 3e rules. Is it possible for anyone just to describe what to or not to do for the various member archetypes in general terms so I don't feel like the character guide is playing my game for me? The reason they're all mega complex is because 3e has a ton of booby trap feats (toughness) and the ability to totally gently caress up your character without realizing it. You can permanently lock characters out of all kinds of later poo poo by not distributing stats/feats correctly and there's no way to know you're doing it except having advance 3e knowledge. 3e did a lot of things right, but it's far worse than 2e as far as being able to gently caress yourself at character creation without knowing it. I'm not sure what kind of description to give since it'd turn into a novel length post, but I've played a ton of 3e so I can answer whatever specific questions you have or check your party once you've made it and point out ways you accidentally hosed yourself.
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Dec 8, 2013 00:24
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zedprime posted:As much as I love IWD I never made it through IWD2 and I am thinking of starting up again. All the character creation guides are huge treatises on 3e rules. Is it possible for anyone just to describe what to or not to do for the various member archetypes in general terms so I don't feel like the character guide is playing my game for me? It's really hard to do this without just writing out a full feat guide.
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Dec 8, 2013 00:56
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Does anyone know for sure how spells that have a level-based duration work with dual classed characters? I was thinking about a Cleric of Lathandar dualled to Fighter at level 6, which lets you get to level 8 in BG and wondered how long Boon of Lathandar would last for as it's meant to be 6 seconds/round according to the kit description, though I know that's not always accurate.
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Dec 8, 2013 01:05
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