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290X is kind of a ripoff, single 290 might be a tad underwhelming and not that cost effective if you want max everything at 1440p and constant high fps (or can simply afford two 280Xes)... if you don't mind crossfire hassles then I'd definitely go with a pair of 280Xes.
Straker fucked around with this message at 00:52 on Dec 9, 2013 |
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Dec 9, 2013 00:46
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Yeah... Going from 1080p to 1440p is about a 1.8x pixel increase (okay I did the math it's 1.7repeating god), and while the 290 does have a huge geometry advantage going for it, the difference in shader and texture power isn't unbelievably high when you compare the two cards. Just solidly next-gen. All the really out-there poo poo went into putting more primitives on display at a rate that the shaders and textures can keep up, even into the 4K+ region - which is nicely forward looking (or three-monitor dude now-looking) but not going to pay off immediately for single card users. By way of comparison, two 7970GHz/280x in Crossfire would handle 1440p/1600p nicely, shouldn't run into any VRAM issues with 3GB to work with. Consider that the 7970GHz/280x is actually quite competitive with a stock GTX 780 in many cases, and then consider that the 290 is basically 780 performance in most situations, better performance in extremely high resolution situations, but for a lot less dough. A 280x crossfire setup would have more memory bandwidth, nearly double the core and shader performance (after overhead is accounted for), but the same number of ROPs as a 290. Good setup for pushing a shitload of frames on a single monitor, yes. Good setup for pushing similarly high FPS at 4K or above? No. Still, the 290 does perform pretty well at 1440p. You don't HAVE to go with the "make all the frames, turn up all the settings" option. But... at the risk of crossing over into sunk-cost territory disguised as opportunity cost... If you already have the 280x, adding another will put you significantly ahead of the 290 or any other single-GPU card currently made in performance at that resolution.
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Dec 9, 2013 09:26
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Man, not a single goon interested in my 760s 
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Dec 9, 2013 22:12
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Sorry, Deimos. -- I'm getting really frustrated. Need and cashflow combined just right that I'm looking at putting a CLC on my 680 in my Bitfenix Prodigy, and Goddamn nothing will fit and it's running more expensive than I thought it would be or should be. Arctic Accelero Hybrid misses by 14 mm. The NZXT Kraken G10 looks like it should fit, except proper mounting makes it float way above the PCB so I'd probably need to cut parts off and replace the fan. All the custom air coolers are 3-slot affairs. And on top of all this, I have to account for replacing my optical drive with a shorter (i.e. slim) model - more cost, unless I want a hole in the case. I look into doing The Mod, because that would be cheaper, and Dwood has stopped selling mounting brackets. Also, part of the reason I wanted to do this CLC thing is because the stock fan was starting to fail, but The Mod requires leaving the stock fan for VRM cooling. So if I did The Mod, I'd have to RMA this thing for a rattle-fan and get a fresh chip lottery; I might as well RMA it, sell the returned card, and buy a new 770 with a semicustom cooler. Argh.  Any advice? All I want is this thing to be quiet. and the GPU is the loudest thing in it by far.
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Dec 9, 2013 23:47
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I'm kind of in the same boat. The Gelid cools well, but it's such a constant source of headache the I'd frankly would rather just have ran stock until a proper 290 cooler came along. On top of the horrendous installation process that involves a fair bit of jury-rigging, the fans mounts are loose, which causes an annoying rattling that I just can't seem to correct for long (even with zip ties). I have the system in the corner of my bedroom closet and I can pick out the sound of the Gelid fan from my living room. One of the positive leads came off from the fan header, which lead to me having to strip the adjacent lead and patching it onto that with some electrical tape. If you're looking for a cooler, go with the Arctic. Or, if you can, hold off until a proper 290 custom comes along. When that time comes I may wind up ditching my Gelid and just writing it off as a learning experience.
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Dec 9, 2013 23:57
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Buy an Asus 780 DCII. Two slots!
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Dec 9, 2013 23:57
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Can't you flash the BIOS so you can allow the fan to go <40% and then use Afterburner to set a fan curve so it ramps up when you're gaming or whatever, when the sound is less bothersome?
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Dec 9, 2013 23:59
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I can't afford one. The only reason I'm considering a hardware purchase at all is that the noise just drives me insane. It's piercing compared to any other noise around me. O to be back in my last, noisey-rear end apartment where the noise floor was 20 dB higher...Ghostpilot posted:If you're looking for a cooler, go with the Arctic. Or, if you can, hold off until a proper 290 custom comes along. When that time comes I may wind up ditching my Gelid and just writing it off as a learning experience. We're talking about a Green 680 in a micro-ATX case, not a Red 290 in something that can hold an Arctic/Gelid/etc. custom air jobber. uhhhhahhhhohahhh posted:Can't you flash the BIOS so you can allow the fan to go <40% and then use Afterburner to set a fan curve so it ramps up when you're gaming or whatever, when the sound is less bothersome? It already does that. Games like EVE are not loud, yet they spin up the thing like mad, even frame-limited. And the rest of the system is REALLY quiet, like silent PSU + Noctua 140mm fan plus Bitfenix 230mm fan quiet. The GPU idles at twice the noise of the rest of the system at load. Factory Factory fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Dec 10, 2013 |
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Dec 10, 2013 00:00
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Factory Factory posted:We're talking about a Green 680 in a micro-ATX case, not a Red 290 in something that can hold an Arctic/Gelid/etc. custom air jobber. Oh I didn't mean you specifically, I meant anyone who had a 290 and was looking for a custom cooler. I should've phrased that differently.
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Dec 10, 2013 00:08
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What are folks' experience with fan rattle? I've gone without for about a week now. It was only giving funny noises some of the time for a short while. Should I assume the worst or what?
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Dec 10, 2013 00:25
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Factory Factory posted:Sorry, Deimos. Hm, I'm not sure if they still offer it, but a Thermalright Spitfire might be an option. It's loving huge and given the orientation of that case might necessitate a low profile CPU cooler, but if you've got a CLC on the CPU it could work. Notably, it requires zero space in the adjoining slots, instead moving the cooler over the top area of the card, to where your CPU heatsink likely is:  (Pictured is my old GTX480, which the Spitfire took from a noisy as gently caress 95 degrees down to a silent ~60 degrees at load). This thing actually comes with a support system because it's so large and heavy- There is a bracket that mounts over where the ram is on most motherboards, with an extension rod to hold up the other end of the cooler since it's so lopsided. Gwaihir fucked around with this message at 00:53 on Dec 10, 2013 |
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Dec 10, 2013 00:50
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Agreed posted:No. Here, let me try again, with a little more brevity. Sorry to bring this back up, but I've been super busy lately with a new job (and I don't do much directly with GPUs anymore), but I will try to be around more often, and Agreed/FF you can definitely take over the OP whenever you want, it's woefully out-of-date.
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Dec 10, 2013 01:09
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Gwaihir posted:Hm, I'm not sure if they still offer it, but a Thermalright Spitfire might be an option. It's loving huge and given the orientation of that case might necessitate a low profile CPU cooler, but if you've got a CLC on the CPU it could work. Notably, it requires zero space in the adjoining slots, instead moving the cooler over the top area of the card, to where your CPU heatsink likely is: Not offered any more :C
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Dec 10, 2013 01:11
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Factory Factory posted:Sorry, Deimos. I am confused here. You are saying you desire to do The Mod but you stated that the G10 would float way above the card? That's exactly what dwood's brackets do. The benefit of the G10 is the fact they include a fan, a better mounting mechanism for the bracket and all for relatively cheap. Dwood brackets still require a 92mm fan for VRM cooling (it's very rare for the original cooling setup to fit the dwood bracket). I've offered it in this thread before, but I have a dwood bracket (that unfortunately says "670 FTW" on the side), spare 92mm fans and a couple Antec 620 kits. You don't use any of your existing parts. The parts are just sitting around; I would love for someone to be able to use them. 
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Dec 10, 2013 01:19
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Factory Factory posted:What are folks' experience with fan rattle? I've gone without for about a week now. It was only giving funny noises some of the time for a short while. Should I assume the worst or what? Once a month>Once a week>Once a day>Replaced it
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Dec 10, 2013 01:27
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jink posted:I am confused here. You are saying you desire to do The Mod but you stated that the G10 would float way above the card? That's exactly what dwood's brackets do. The benefit of the G10 is the fact they include a fan, a better mounting mechanism for the bracket and all for relatively cheap. Dwood brackets still require a 92mm fan for VRM cooling (it's very rare for the original cooling setup to fit the dwood bracket). Hm. Hmmmm. PM me with what you'd want for a set? As for your question, the problem isn't so much the float height, it's an extra lip, as so:  Red is clearance, roughly (should be an extra mm available). Blue is the Kraken's height, which is specified at 32.5 mm. Tan is where a 25mm fan would be on the thing. Everything fits but the Kraken's side wall. Without the float, the "32.5mm tall" Kraken sounded like it would fit.
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Dec 10, 2013 01:42
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This is what happened to my old 5970, it was just under 2 years old, and playing a game on it became unbearable, it was even scratchy when idling. luckily I live in Australia though, so I just returned it to the store I bought it from, got my $700 back, and then bought a 680 for $500, so you could say that premature graphics card failures are a perk to me.
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Dec 10, 2013 04:15
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Could you get some oil on the bearing, or is it sealed?
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Dec 10, 2013 04:19
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Factory Factory posted:Sorry, Deimos.
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Dec 10, 2013 06:58
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Dogen posted:Could you get some oil on the bearing, or is it sealed? Honestly it just sounds like fan noise to me. It's a reference GeForce 680 blower. I dunno if it can be oiled or whether that would be effective if it could. sinep posted:This is very similar to a problem I'm facing too. I want to use the Kraken G10 in a Prodigy as well. I currently have an H80 in a push/pull exhausting out of the case and 200mm fan in the front providing air to the rest of the case. If I wanted to mount another rad for GPU, I'd have to put it in front where the large fan is. Is it generally a bad idea to have a radiator exhausting another radiator's air, or will this case have enough airflow that it wouldn't matter overall? Does the G10 even fit in the Prodigy? The G10 might fit if you take a dremel to it. It has this one unnecessary lip on one side that seems to be the impediment. It appears to be a cosmetic piece, having an NZXT logo and mostly for hiding the CLC tubes from view. And the way the video card is aligned, you could lop off the entire thing and not really miss it - it'd be across the top. Hm... CLC deals on Newegg... Zalman LQ-310 is $43 after $20 MIR, and ThermalTake Water 3.0 Performer is $50 after $20 rebate but has a second fan I could try to sell, and Corsair H55 is $55 after $10 MIR but has the best stock fan. They're all the same radiator, but the Corsair is the best combo deal of out-of-pocket and stock performance, but the Zalman I could fit with a Noctua fan and come out the best for the least Noctua-equipped cost, assuming the rebate worked. Plus if I had to have a brand name showing in this dumb window, I'd prefer Corsair... CHOICES. Anyway, re: rads, I was setting it up for a 140mm rad in rear, 120mm rad in top-rear, and 230mm intake. Catch is that you can't do push-pull on either radiator, and especially not the rear one, doing this. That seems best to me, as using a radiator on intake does indeed warm the air unless you have a LOT of fan moving a LOT of air to dilute the effect. You could do something wacky like front rad in, rear rad in, top fans exhaust maybe.
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Dec 10, 2013 07:29
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Factory Factory posted:What are folks' experience with fan rattle? I've gone without for about a week now. It was only giving funny noises some of the time for a short while. Should I assume the worst or what?
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Dec 10, 2013 08:08
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Are there any closed loop systems for VGA similar to the corsair H100i like things for CPUs?
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Dec 10, 2013 08:36
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Byolante posted:Are there any closed loop systems for VGA similar to the corsair H100i like things for CPUs? Not exactly. What there are are premade and DIY systems to hook those same systems onto the GPU and cool the rest of the card (VRMs, RAM) another way. From most premade to least:
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Dec 10, 2013 08:40
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Factory Factory posted:Not exactly. What there are are premade and DIY systems to hook those same systems onto the GPU and cool the rest of the card (VRMs, RAM) another way. From most premade to least: If you were to watercool both your GPU and CPU, would you still need intake and/or exhaust fans that are separate from the radiator fans? I'm considering (as a pipe dream) to watercool my GPU on a single loop, as I already have a h100i for my CPU.
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Dec 10, 2013 10:48
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Guni posted:If you were to watercool both your GPU and CPU, would you still need intake and/or exhaust fans that are separate from the radiator fans? I believe veedubfreak's m-m-m-megacase purchase was specifically to avoid literally boiling the water inside the one loop he was trying to use to cool both his CPU and his GPUs. That said, it might be possible to cool a CPU and one relatively low power draw, low heat card like the GTX 680 - he was running his CPU and two R9 290x with the loop, which, uh, woah.
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Dec 10, 2013 12:10
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Agreed posted:I believe veedubfreak's m-m-m-megacase purchase was specifically to avoid literally boiling the water inside the one loop he was trying to use to cool both his CPU and his GPUs. That said, it might be possible to cool a CPU and one relatively low power draw, low heat card like the GTX 680 - he was running his CPU and two R9 290x with the loop, which, uh, woah. As with everything computers, there are tradeoffs. LC performance is a combination of: - Pump speed (water flow) - Radiator surface area and fin density - Fan speed (upto a point for some radiators) There are a few gotchas in this in terms of silence, which is what veedub is going for: 1. The denser FPI (fins per inch) radiators usually need fans to spin a little bit faster for the same performance of low FPI radiators, but can often get a LOT more performance with more/faster fans. So as an example a low FPI radiator could take a max of 500w of heat out of the loop even with a Delta uberfan at NaN dB, but it could do the same job with a noctua. A high FPI radiator really benefits from having a gentle typhoon on it spinning fairly fast, but it's obviously going to be louder. The main problem is the low-RPM scenario, the low-RPM for a dense rad is louder (because fans need to spin faster to compensate for the airflow restrictions) than for a low-FPI rad. 2. The pump can get really loud to get to a good amount of flow through a restrictive loop, there are two details for this: you can maximize flow by using the least restrictive parts you can find and more flow doesn't mean more heat out of the system, so there's really a cap you can go for. What I've seen goes best for silence in this case is going for dual serial pumps in the same loop, crazy enough this works extremely well (not linear but still pretty good). Also: parallel loops almost unequivocally suck, you're better off going for serial pumps in a serial loop.
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Dec 10, 2013 14:35
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deimos posted:2. The pump can get really loud No kidding. The H100 pump is by far the loudest thing in my computer, the second loudest being the fans on Noctua D14. Luckily since I'm using the H100 on a videocard I can run the radiator passively, but the included fans were ridiculously loud.
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Dec 10, 2013 15:18
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What is the latest incarnation of the GTX 780? I looked up my local online retailer and they have 21 variations of the GTX 780 from €460- €700 (for the 780Ti). What's the best bang for the buck right now? My last three card have been 6850 > 6870 > 7950 but it seems the racing sims I run love Nvidia cards.
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Dec 10, 2013 16:14
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CactusWeasle posted:What is the latest incarnation of the GTX 780? I looked up my local online retailer and they have 21 variations of the GTX 780 from €460- €700 (for the 780Ti). What's the best bang for the buck right now? Best bang for the buck right now is 2x4GB 760s that I am selling on SA-Mart  Other than that R9-290 or GTX 780 depending on your resolution.
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Dec 10, 2013 16:23
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Time for a watercooling story kids. Gather around. My current loop has 2 DDC pumps which are are these. http://www.frozencpu.com/products/2128/ex-pmp-27/Swiftech_MCP655-B_12v_Water_Pump_w_38_Conversion_Kit_317_GPH.html?tl=g30c107s153 If I run them at a setting of 1-2 they are silent. At 3 and above you can hear them, they are not loud enough to really bother you. These are pretty much the quietest pumps on the market. I run 2 of them in series, mostly because I had separate loops up until recently. To cool off all the water, I run through 2 of these here. http://www.frozencpu.com/products/5795/ex-rad-121/Swiftech_MCR320_Quiet_Power_Triple_120mm_Radiator_-_Black_MCR320-QP-K.html?tl=g30c95s161 These radiators are thin and low fins per inch so running the fans at super high speeds doesn't really make a huge difference in performance. But, here's where it gets sticky. Running my processor and a single 290x the loop stays cool enough with the fans barely on. Once that 2nd card starts throwing another 300+ watts of heat into the system, I either have to turn the fans up or the loop gets a bit warm. So how do you solve this solution? Why, double the radiator count of course!
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Dec 10, 2013 16:31
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veedubfreak posted:If I run them at a setting of 1-2 they are silent. At 3 and above you can hear them, they are not loud enough to really bother you. These are pretty much the quietest pumps on the market. I run 2 of them in series, mostly because I had separate loops up until recently. Keep in mind the 655 resonates at around that speed, so it's actually quieter when running slightly faster. Also the QP radiators are poo poo according to Martin's findings/reviews, pretty much any other 360 rad is better at low RPM. deimos fucked around with this message at 16:49 on Dec 10, 2013 |
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Dec 10, 2013 16:41
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veedubfreak posted:Time for a watercooling story kids. Gather around. We need high resolution and well lit images of the final machine; links to products alone does not do it justice. This sounds like an incredibly over the top build. I love it.
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Dec 10, 2013 16:41
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deimos posted:Best bang for the buck right now is 2x4GB 760s that I am selling on SA-Mart It's specifically a GTX 780 im looking for, but there's so many I cant figure out what variation has the price/performance sweet spot. Ti, superclocked, vanilla..
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Dec 10, 2013 16:52
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Well... Agreed, what's your overclock in MHz and real-world FPS delta or percentage? Then we can convert that to frames per MHz and then through MHz per dollars to frames per dollar. Then we just find the local maximum for your card choices and their likely overclocking chops. Probably gonna be Superclocked or SC+, though, assuming you get the ACX cooler and overclock it. The Ti is a different card than the 780 regular, as the GPU has a different configuration. It performs better, but the performance per dollar is a good amount lower because the performance increase is far less than the price increase.
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Dec 10, 2013 17:05
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Factory Factory posted:Well... Agreed, what's your overclock in MHz and real-world FPS delta or percentage? Then we can convert that to frames per MHz and then through MHz per dollars to frames per dollar. Then we just find the local maximum for your card choices and their likely overclocking chops. I don't have sufficient data for a proper analysis here, but here's what I can show, based on 3DMark scores. Just taking the Graphics portion of the Firestrike test, all other factors equal, here's what my overclocked-as-far-as-it-would-go EVGA GTX 780 SC ACX did: Graphics Test 1 53.6 fps Graphics Test 2 44.1 fps By way of comparison, my EVGA GTX 780Ti SC ACX, also overclocked as far as it will go - which, incidentally, is about 100MHz higher than the 780 would, both for the core and for the already-faster VRAM, but that seems to be fairly standard for a high quality sample of fully enabled GK110; good ones clock above 1200MHz, amazing ones clock into the 1300MHz range. I got a good one. Graphics Test 1 63.6 fps Graphics Test 2 51.9 fps It's important to note that these tests are particularly flattering to the differences in the 780Ti. Some stock configuration numbers: The 780Ti has 20% more TAUs (texture address units) and 20% more SMXes (unified shader units). It has a very small pure primitive advantage that's reliant mainly on clock speed and memory bandwidth ensuring that it utilizes its ROP resources efficiently for pushing pixels. Texturing benefits from the higher core clock, as does geometry output; but, geometry is much more constrained, and both cards have the same number of ROPs, 48 each. At the same clock rate, one wouldn't expect much more in the way of GPixels/sec at all, though the high memory bandwidth and (frankly overkill) texture unit advantage does help to ensure that there is never an effective bottleneck on the 780Ti's geometric performance. But the results of these tests rest almost entirely on the card's superior shader and tessellation performance. So - in this single synthetic benchmark that favors texel and shader performance while simultaneously benefiting from the additional 100MHz clock rate, the 780Ti pulls ahead by 15.7% in the first graphics test, and right about 15% in the second graphics test. I have found that to correspond pretty well to real-world performance gains, though in some cases I have seen gains as high as 20% over the 780. Both of these units are good samples of their respective cards, for what it's worth - to get similarly high results, you'd need to have cards capable of overclocking well. The 780Ti costs 28% more than the 780 alone, for base models, and you only get about half of that in games, or a bit more if you're lucky. The EVGA SC ACX unit is my favorite off the shelf unit because it has arguably the best cooler (I think Asus did a revision to their DCUII that may make it competitive for that spot) and an extremely aggressive stock BIOS, with timely and powerful Boost 2.0 behavior before you even start overclocking it at all. It guarantees a performance floor higher than some cards are able to reach when overclocked, all while keeping the card quite comfortable, temperature-wise, and thus running well (a cool card is a happy card, when it comes to Kepler and overclocking).
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Dec 10, 2013 18:31
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deimos posted:Keep in mind the 655 resonates at around that speed, so it's actually quieter when running slightly faster. I use those really thick 2 sided tape to mount the pumps, so any vibration is negated. The only actual sound is the whirl of the pump itself. As far as the QP rads go, I already had 2 from when I built this like 5 years ago, so I figured I'd just stay with them for consistency sake. I've been looking for an excuse to buy an Ascension for a while now, as the UFO was pretty cramped with all the tubing as it was. I'll have a full build thread at some point, I'm going to build it up over the next couple weeks, and then over the long weekend before Christmas I'll tear down my rig and finish it.
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Dec 10, 2013 20:16
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This is very helpful, thanks
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Dec 10, 2013 20:26
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Agreed posted:The EVGA SC ACX unit is my favorite off the shelf unit because it has arguably the best cooler (I think Asus did a revision to their DCUII that may make it competitive for that spot) and an extremely aggressive stock BIOS, with timely and powerful Boost 2.0 behavior before you even start overclocking it at all. It guarantees a performance floor higher than some cards are able to reach when overclocked, all while keeping the card quite comfortable, temperature-wise, and thus running well (a cool card is a happy card, when it comes to Kepler and overclocking). They did, they put a bigger heatpipe in there and are using some kind of weird axial/blower hybrid for one of the fans, it tests the best out of the current aftermarket air coolers on nvidia which is why I grabbed one instead of another MSI this gen. Do the vanilla 780s not come with a bundle now? The only game I don't have on there is assassin's creed IV, but it woulda been nice.
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Dec 10, 2013 22:11
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veedubfreak posted:Time for a watercooling story kids. Gather around. I like that setup. I have a water cooled 3x680 setup as well as one of those hexa-core 3770k's in an asus rampage motherboard.. I ended up buying one of these and running it in a different room: http://koolance.com/erm-3k3uc-liquid-cooling-system-copper Nowhere near quiet, but the pump is good for 30 feet of loop, so I just ran my cooling loop from the computer into the furnace room where there's a big noisy fan there already. Works pretty well for me, and the hottest I've ever seen the loop was 35 degrees under load, but I'm definitely not saying it's worth 1100 dollars for the heat dump/pump setup at all. I'm not home but I can definitely get pictures if anyone is interested. (the 680's are mated to ekwb full cover blocks)
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Dec 11, 2013 00:35
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originalnickname posted:I like that setup. I have a water cooled 3x680 setup as well as one of those hexa-core 3770k's in an asus rampage motherboard.. I ended up buying one of these and running it in a different room: As if you needed to ask. Commence with the pictures.
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Dec 11, 2013 00:52
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