|
Milky Moor posted:I'm not even sure why people are flustered about getting the better endings at this point anyway (on repeat playthroughs, at least). It changes nothing. I push buttons and make the numbers go up and I should get all the things.
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 03:10
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 30, 2024 22:16 |
|
|
Milky Moor posted:The Reaper codex entries are some of the weirdest things you can read because it depicts a radically different idea about the Reapers than what we got. I'm not concerned with a Wookieepedia-esque 'true canon' approach, I just can't see the reason why these codex entries would be written and then not have them play into the final product in any way shape or form and, in fact, are basically contradictory to how the Reapers are presented during the main plot of Mass Effect 3. If anyone could somehow quantify the data, I'm sure that one could chart the increasing divergence from the codex as the series went on. In the first game you've got some somewhat hard sci-fi going on and by the end we have warships rushing into spitting distance with gigantic armored cuttlefish vomiting eyeballs with lasers.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 03:25
|
|
|
Milky Moor posted:I'm not even sure why people are flustered about getting the better endings at this point anyway (on repeat playthroughs, at least). It changes nothing.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 03:29
|
|
|
Der Luftwaffle posted:If anyone could somehow quantify the data, I'm sure that one could chart the increasing divergence from the codex as the series went on. In the first game you've got some somewhat hard sci-fi going on and by the end we have warships rushing into spitting distance with gigantic armored cuttlefish vomiting eyeballs with lasers. To be fair, even in ME1 the realistic codex info on space combat didn't match up with the battle cutscenes.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 03:30
|
|
Der Luftwaffle posted:If anyone could somehow quantify the data, I'm sure that one could chart the increasing divergence from the codex as the series went on. In the first game you've got some somewhat hard sci-fi going on and by the end we have warships rushing into spitting distance with gigantic armored cuttlefish vomiting eyeballs with lasers. Let's be fair though, that wouldn't make for anything that's visually interesting but, admittedly, the Battle of the Citadel was a scenario that allowed them to get around their own writing. The first game does present a very different view - especially of biotics (gravity and mass manipulation), omni-tools (holographic computers with some cool gadgetry) and kinetic barriers* - but then the second game rolls around and biotics have become literal space magic and omni-tools can light people on fire and freeze them and kinetic barriers have gone from barriers that dissipate kinetic energy into shields that can stop the vacuum of space. Sure, it helped make the gameplay more interesting, but it's still a pretty impressive divergence. As much as I dislike Mass Effect 1's gameplay, I always found the 'realistic' hard sci-fi bits of it pretty interesting and could appreciate them for that. *And kinetic barriers only stopping kinetic impacts made Sovereign's laser weapon all the more threatening because the usual defences on all those warships didn't work. 
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 03:37
|
|
|
Milky Moor posted:Let's be fair though, that wouldn't make for anything that's visually interesting I think it's more of a case of doing what's easy versus putting effort into making it interesting. You could get a taste of it during the Grissom mission where they showed the Normandy fully using 3 dimensions and no up/down to release the shuttle, and again during Aria's attack in the Omega DLC. I suppose that, like everything else lovely about the ending, it came down to time constraints as to why the final battle was laid out like a revolutionary war firing line, but it couldn't have been that much more resource intensive to show the fleets firing at maximum standoff range and luring the Reapers into their own weapon/ramming range to open a path for the invasion ships. I guess it can be rationalized that it was all at close range because the fleets were being sacrificed in the most surefire way to get Hammer teams to the ground, but it's so easy to play might-have-beens 
Der Luftwaffle fucked around with this message at 04:27 on Dec 24, 2013 |
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 04:24
|
|
|
DrNutt posted:They didn't get the math wrong, they considered Synthesis the 'best' ending. Shepard breathing was just an Easter egg. BioWare is usually p. good about knowing what their audience wants (for better or for worse), but I will never understand why they thought everyone would have wanted some horseshit Philosophy 101 version of the Singularity over "destroy the Reapers, high-five Garrus, go home".
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 04:48
|
|
Der Luftwaffle posted:I think it's more of a case of doing what's easy versus putting effort into making it interesting. You could get a taste of it during the Grissom mission where they showed the Normandy fully using 3 dimensions and no up/down to release the shuttle, and again during Aria's attack in the Omega DLC. Urgh. Can you imagine being one of the gunners at the Battle of Earth and, like, you take a shot at a Reaper... ...and you miss... ...and the fired shell goes and slams into Earth and probably kills a lot of people? One of the things everyone takes away from ME2 is that bit on the Citadel about guns and Isaac Newton... and then ME3 just sort of lets it happen.
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 04:52
|
|
|
would have been cool with them ending the reaper plot line after ME1, perhaps even ME2. I wanted to spend ME3 running space brothels on Omega  e: end after me1 = reapers wont awake without this signal, yada yada. end after me2 = collectors are sovereign's fallback, welp. Iseeyouseemeseeyou fucked around with this message at 04:55 on Dec 24, 2013 |
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 04:52
|
|
|
I contend that the Reapers would have been way better if they were a malevolent attempt to answer The Last Question. Sadly it doesn't seem that there's many Azimov fans at Bioware.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 04:58
|
|
|
Milky Moor posted:Let's be fair though, that wouldn't make for anything that's visually interesting but, admittedly, the Battle of the Citadel was a scenario that allowed them to get around their own writing. The first game does present a very different view - especially of biotics (gravity and mass manipulation), omni-tools (holographic computers with some cool gadgetry) and kinetic barriers* - but then the second game rolls around and biotics have become literal space magic and omni-tools can light people on fire and freeze them and kinetic barriers have gone from barriers that dissipate kinetic energy into shields that can stop the vacuum of space. Most of the stuff you mentioned was pretty well handwaved though, incinerate as superheated omnigel being tossed, kinetic barriers holding air molecules in. Even Sovereign's lasers actually are mentioned to be at least slightly mitigated by the shields if only because they're not light-based lasers, they're particle beams with actual mass to them. Not that 2 wasn't a significant divergence, I just think that most of the hard sci-fi stuff in ME1 was window dressing and 2 and 3 were just dropping the pretense. quote:One of the things everyone takes away from ME2 is that bit on the Citadel about guns and Isaac Newton... and then ME3 just sort of lets it happen. Honestly if you think about it though, most of the people on Earth are already dead, and anybody left - and even Earth itself - are acceptable casualties to stop the Reapers from murdering everyone else. They have free license to fire at will because its now or never. Danger close, as they say in war films, cause you either stop them here with your big guns and die in the process or never stop them at all.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:14
|
|
|
Lightning Knight posted:Honestly if you think about it though, most of the people on Earth are already dead, and anybody left - and even Earth itself - are acceptable casualties to stop the Reapers from murdering everyone else. They have free license to fire at will because its now or never. Danger close, as they say in war films, cause you either stop them here with your big guns and die in the process or never stop them at all. earth first 
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:20
|
|
|
Iseeyouseemeseeyou posted:earth first Ah, Space Republicans. You know, I played ME1 before I knew anything about politics and the Terra Firma people made no drat sense to me, I was just like wtf, why are they space racist, they're stupid, how are people this stupid? Now I get it and it's absolutely hysterical. Oh Bioware. 
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:23
|
|
|
Pattonesque posted:BioWare is usually p. good about knowing what their audience wants (for better or for worse), but I will never understand why they thought everyone would have wanted some horseshit Philosophy 101 version of the Singularity over "destroy the Reapers, high-five Garrus, go home". Personally, I'll never understand why people wanted yet another "gently caress you Dad" themed ending where the literal infants of the setting are somehow capable of submitting their own two cents to the issues at hand. I genuinely feel that the Extended Cut needed to recharacterize the Catalyst as a M'Aiq The Liar type character, openly digging at the fanbase. Just imagine it: "Really? You think that you making peace between the Geth and Quarians proves anything? Where did I hear that before? Oh yeah, twenty times there's been peace between Creators and Created that falls to pieces. Before we continue, let's all raise our hands if you've been around for millions of cycles of organic evolution as it relates to the creation of synthetic life! *raises hand* HEY LOOK MY HAND IS UP! AND YOURS IS NOT! WHAT A SURPRISE!" MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 05:35 on Dec 24, 2013 |
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:32
|
|
|
The Shadow Broker's ship was one of my favorite items in-game. cool concept, i would have held out there w/ liara and friend thane and survived the coming of the reapers Iseeyouseemeseeyou fucked around with this message at 05:38 on Dec 24, 2013 |
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:32
|
|
|
^unnnf got drat^Pattonesque posted:BioWare is usually p. good about knowing what their audience wants (for better or for worse), but I will never understand why they thought everyone would have wanted some horseshit Philosophy 101 version of the Singularity over "destroy the Reapers, high-five Garrus, go home". I'm not saying it was a good decision, I'm just saying there are a lot of things that you can point to going wrong with ME3 without inventing "lol Bioware is bad at math" reasons.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:35
|
|
|
I'm pretty much disgusted at the blatant disregard the Alliance forces showed for Newtonian Physics in the documentary of the Battle of the Citadel, Mass Effect 1.Iseeyouseemeseeyou posted:The Shadow Broker's ship was one of my favorite items in-game. It reminds me of the Icarus 2 from Sunshine. I hope the player character's ship in Mass Effect 4: The Re-reaper-ing-ing is outside of the typical heroic starship mold and looks weird as gently caress.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:41
|
|
|
Dan Didio posted:I'm pretty much disgusted at the blatant disregard the Alliance forces showed for Newtonian Physics in the documentary of the Battle of the Citadel, Mass Effect 1. To be fair, most of the people that criticize Bioware for that stuff probably wouldn't have even picked up on it if they hadn't included it in the codex.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:46
|
|
|
Dan Didio posted:I'm pretty much disgusted at the blatant disregard the Alliance forces showed for Newtonian Physics in the documentary of the Battle of the Citadel, Mass Effect 1. Mass Star Effect Citizen e: Is ME4 a thing? If so, gemme shadow broker's ship and like a dozen other ships i can dock w/ it
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:46
|
|
|
DrNutt posted:To be fair, most of the people that criticize Bioware for that stuff probably wouldn't have even picked up on it if they hadn't included it in the codex. I just think it's funny that people are now revising history and pretending this wasn't always a blatant thing. Back in Mass Effect 1 it was that ship battles weren't portrayed exactly as in the Codex with regards to range, for god's sake. Iseeyouseemeseeyou posted:Mass Star Effect Citizen Yeah, a fourth main Mass Effect game is a thing. No idea what it's going to be called, however.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:50
|
|
Dan Didio posted:Yeah, a fourth main Mass Effect game is a thing. No idea what it's going to be called, however. 'Crap'. quote:It reminds me of the Icarus 2 from Sunshine. I hope the player character's ship in Mass Effect 4: The Re-reaper-ing-ing is outside of the typical heroic starship mold and looks weird as gently caress. That dude in Sunshine should play Shepard in the upcoming movie. Is that movie still upcoming? It seemed to die in the wake of Mass Effect 3.
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:53
|
|
|
It's been dead for ages. There's the same cycle of constant rumors trumping it up, but come on, videogame movies hardly ever complete that cycle once they spin like that for a few years.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:54
|
|
But at least we got Paragon Lost! 
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:56
|
|
|
MisterBibs posted:"Really? You think that you making peace between the Geth and Quarians proves anything? Where did I hear that before? Oh yeah, twenty times there's been peace between Creators and Created that falls to pieces. I prefer its current incarnation as a deranged computer program carrying out a broken-logic version of its original instructions. We are, after all, trying to beat it, it shouldn't be right.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:57
|
|
|
i was really bummed when you couldn't reawaken a crypt army of protheans and use them to crush the reapers
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 05:58
|
|
|
2house2fly posted:Everything you say to the Catalyst is new to it because it has never interacted with a living being before It's wrong but you still do what it wants.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 06:00
|
|
|
Milky Moor posted:But at least we got Paragon Lost! I hear those Dead Space ones were alright.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 06:05
|
|
|
why does bioware force a xenotype upon us i consider myself trans-xeno and would like to play as my drell self
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 06:22
|
|
|
Just going to throw in my own End Talk opinion: I thought that Shepard "merging" with the Reapers was a pretty appropriate ending, no matter if you were playing Paragon or Renegade. Throughout the entire series, Shep's whole M.O. has been to protect the galaxy from the Reapers. At the end, she sacrifices herself so that she can beat the Reapers at their own game: control. Now they're out there, in dark space, waiting under her command should something else arise in the future. I like that. Like for me, who has put in probably six-to-eight playthroughs of the franchise, that feels appropriate. It echoes that whole vibe of the strange and unexplored that is the heart of Mass Effect. I understand why people were disappointed that there wasn't a "high five over credits" ending, though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 06:24
|
|
|
Iseeyouseemeseeyou posted:why does bioware force a xenotype upon us i consider myself trans-xeno and would like to play as my drell self
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 08:52
|
|
|
2house2fly posted:Everything you say to the Catalyst is new to it because it has never interacted with a living being before Well, it's still kinda the voice of the Reapers, so I'm sure it has data on previous cycles. "Cycle 55482 had the Bobs and the BobBots make peace. Then guess what? The Bobs broke the peace three centuries later, and died for it. Same thing in cycles 85586, 55145, and 74695. But please, Shephard, tell me how your Creator/Created groups are special. No, seriously, I'll wait. I'll be over here, waiting to tell you that the Bobs in 55482 were from what you call Rannoch." Now I've made myself sad because I legitimately want rear end in a top hat Catalyst 2house2fly posted:" I prefer its current incarnation as a deranged computer program carrying out a broken-logic version of its original instructions. We are, after all, trying to beat it, it shouldn't be right. See, I disagree, because the Reapers being right feeds more into the concept of them as presented by Sovereign: entities operating on a scale that is impossible to comprehend by anyone but them. Disagreeing is inherently ignorant, like your common 9/11 truther or anti-vaccination advocate. That said, we do beat them, by taking one of three ways to obviate the otherwise-inevitable outcome.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 10:43
|
|
|
MisterBibs posted:Well, it's still kinda the voice of the Reapers, so I'm sure it has data on previous cycles. "Cycle 55482 had the Bobs and the BobBots make peace. Then guess what? The Bobs broke the peace three centuries later, and died for it. Same thing in cycles 85586, 55145, and 74695. But please, Shephard, tell me how your Creator/Created groups are special. No, seriously, I'll wait. I'll be over here, waiting to tell you that the Bobs in 55482 were from what you call Rannoch." I disagree. Giving the Reapers a motivation and origin like we got severely reduces them as characters. Instead of transcendent, eldritch monstrosities, they become glorified cosmic roombas ruled by a defective program that decided the best way to save organic life was to murder it periodically in the most horrific ways possible. I personally think that the best motivation yet is still reproduction. Reapers keep the galaxy as little more than a farm, harvesting organic specks to add to their numbers. They're so far above organics that using them as raw materials for a new Reaper is seen as giving them a great honor. That right there works. It makes the Reapers alien and monstrous, but keeps their semi-Lovecraft vibe. Frankly, the Reapers having such a base motivation makes them all the more terrifying by showing just how little they care about us pitiful insects. The Reapers were meaningful as antagonists. They needed nothing more. Trying to justify them through some grand cause only devalues them. Geostomp fucked around with this message at 12:33 on Dec 24, 2013 |
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 12:12
|
|
|
Iseeyouseemeseeyou posted:why does bioware force a xenotype upon us i consider myself trans-xeno and would like to play as my drell self Sounds like multiplayer is just the thing for you! E: Geostomp I'm agreeing with you. I like Sovereign far better than Harbinger. Sovereign didn't give a gently caress what you thought about it or its puppets, it just did its thing. Harbinger spent so much effort trying to talk to you and scare you, it cared too much. They characterized the horrid eldritch monstrosity from beyond the rim. And that's kinda defeating the purpose of it. GenericOverusedName fucked around with this message at 14:01 on Dec 24, 2013 |
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 13:58
|
|
|
Harbinger might have worked a lot better if his dialogue would have been limited to Arrival and the ending sequence, and maybe that bit on Horizon or whatever.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 14:06
|
|
|
GenericOverusedName posted:I contend that the Reapers would have been way better if they were a malevolent attempt to answer The Last Question. Sadly it doesn't seem that there's many Azimov fans at Bioware. Thank you so much for linking this story. I have never heard of it before and it might be the best short story I've ever read.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 17:49
|
|
|
SuitcoatAvenger posted:Just going to throw in my own End Talk opinion: I thought that Shepard "merging" with the Reapers was a pretty appropriate ending, no matter if you were playing Paragon or Renegade. Throughout the entire series, Shep's whole M.O. has been to protect the galaxy from the Reapers. At the end, she sacrifices herself so that she can beat the Reapers at their own game: control. Now they're out there, in dark space, waiting under her command should something else arise in the future.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 17:58
|
|
|
I've found Synthesis to be the best ending. Every Reaper is the collective memories of an entire civilization in it, and I took Control as an enslavement/displacement of those cultures, instead of letting them be teachers. Geostomp posted:I disagree. Giving the Reapers a motivation and origin like we got severely reduces them as characters. Instead of transcendent, eldritch monstrosities, they become glorified cosmic roombas ruled by a defective program that decided the best way to save organic life was to murder it periodically in the most horrific ways possible. You're arguing against yourself. As depicted, the Reapers are entities that see the development of organic evolution on a scale so impossibly long as to be transcendent. They know how organic life is going to develop because they've been there, done that, got the t-shirts, millions of times over. And they were created because (Leviathan spoilers) the problem was consistently happening even before them. Monstrosities? Horrific? Glorified cosmic roombas ruled by a defective program? These are terms of those who don't get it, and are incapable of getting it. The players, like Shep, are inherently in the dark. There is no permutation of ways to play ME that proves the Reapers wrong. It's like when a preteen calls their parents fascist. No, they're not. No, you're not old enough to use that term correctly. No, you're definitely not smart enough to use that term correctly. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 22:31 on Dec 24, 2013 |
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 22:24
|
|
|
So I've never played any of the Mass Effects, and I'm finally going to buckle down and get the Mass Effect Trilogy package. There is a PC version for $9.99 currently, but I read some good things about the PS3 version. Another issue, is that my current PC actually has no video card, but it does have an i5 Ivy Bridge with 8GB ram, so it has the Intel HD 3000 onboard graphics chipset. It's actually not bad for older games or low requirement games. I suspect it will play Mass Effect 1 and maybe 2 ok, but it will probably have some issues with Mass Effect 3. Anyway, a lot of the Amazon reviews also complain about missing DLC in the Trilogy package, and having to buy Bioware points to purchase the missing DLC. On my PS3, I assume I can just buy the missing DLC thru my PSN account. I don't have an account already with Bioware so I'd rather not create yet another account. Anyway, any goon advice on which platform is the best? On the PC side, are there a lot of mods that I would miss out on?
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 22:26
|
|
|
AgentHaiTo posted:So I've never played any of the Mass Effects, and I'm finally going to buckle down and get the Mass Effect Trilogy package. There is a PC version for $9.99 currently, but I read some good things about the PS3 version. Another issue, is that my current PC actually has no video card, but it does have an i5 Ivy Bridge with 8GB ram, so it has the Intel HD 3000 onboard graphics chipset. It's actually not bad for older games or low requirement games. Buying any other DLC thru PSN store is retardedly easy and requires no funbux. I also don't have any trouble finding MP games on PS if you were interested in trying it out (it's really fun, you should).
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 22:30
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 30, 2024 22:16 |
|
|
SubponticatePoster posted:Yeah I was kinda meh on control at first but it really seems to be the most fitting. Wrex dies and Krogan relapse into assholes? Reaperize. Geth/Quarians go to poo poo (and my money is on the Quarians loving up)? Reaperize. Keeps everyone in line. Old lady accidentally litters? Eradicate civilisation. Control is a horrifying future in which all species live by the whims of an unstable, sexually aggressive maniac.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2013 23:28
|
|
