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I just ignored all the praise OitNB got and didn't watch it because Weeds made me never want to watch anything created by Jenji Kohan again.
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Jan 6, 2014 23:17
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raditts posted:When did people start hating Anne Hathaway? 2011, the year Hathaway would not stop singing.
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Jan 6, 2014 23:49
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Apparently the only two movies I've ever seen Anne Hathaway in are Rachel Getting Married and The Dark Knight Rises, but I enjoyed her in both of those.
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Jan 6, 2014 23:52
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Ella Enchanted is a really good movie with a really positive message for young women. I really need to finish that movie one day.
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Jan 6, 2014 23:55
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raditts posted:When did people start hating Anne Hathaway? I wasn't aware that was ever a thing, guess it slipped by me. She gets hate from people who regard her as a Spazzy Theater/Drama Kid, and consider folks who fall that category real annoying, that I've seen. It's fairly dumb.
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Jan 7, 2014 00:46
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I can see how she would grate, but Hathaway is awesome. 
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Jan 7, 2014 01:25
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Rageaholic Monkey posted:I just ignored all the praise OitNB got and didn't watch it because Weeds made me never want to watch anything created by Jenji Kohan again. It's very Jenji in that it's a spunky middle class white girl who tangles with what her friends would say is the seedier element of society, but she don't back down and earns the respect of those elements, and her friends, who are impressed with her being tough and good.
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Jan 7, 2014 01:31
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zoux posted:It's very Jenji in that it's a spunky middle class white girl who tangles with what her friends would say is the seedier element of society, but she don't back down and earns the respect of those elements, and her friends, who are impressed with her being tough and good. This is exactly why I have no interest in watching it.
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Jan 7, 2014 01:33
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Joramun posted:http://gawker.com/5987299/joan-rivers-explains-the-hatred-of-anne-hathaway-better-than-anyone As an aside, why does anyone pay attention to that freakish, unpleasant crone? She reeks of desperation on multiple levels, and she's certainly not as funny as she seems to think she is. I'm assuming it's a media echo chamber relic of her once being funny. Like the UK media claiming that Joanna Lumley is beautiful, twenty years after her face turned into a scone.
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Jan 7, 2014 01:55
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:As an aside, why does anyone pay attention to that freakish, unpleasant crone? She reeks of desperation on multiple levels, and she's certainly not as funny as she seems to think she is. She's the very comforting type of female comedian. She makes jokes about having a vagina and about changing that status quo but does nothing to prove she cares about either of those facts outside of comedy.
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Jan 7, 2014 02:01
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zoux posted:It's very Jenji in that it's a spunky middle class white girl who tangles with what her friends would say is the seedier element of society, but she don't back down and earns the respect of those elements, and her friends, who are impressed with her being tough and good. I'm into that because I relish vicarious entertainment. I also watch Survivor.
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Jan 7, 2014 02:21
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Irish Joe posted:Ella Enchanted is a really good movie with a really positive message for young women. Watch Ella Enchanted...then watch Hannibal. Hugh  Dancy?
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Jan 7, 2014 02:36
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:As an aside, why does anyone pay attention to that freakish, unpleasant crone? She reeks of desperation on multiple levels, and she's certainly not as funny as she seems to think she is. So she's Don Rickles.
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Jan 7, 2014 02:36
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Slamhound posted:She's Don Rickles if Don Rickles wasn't funny. You shut your god drat mouth, Don Rickles is a national treasure.
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Jan 7, 2014 03:08
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PriorMarcus posted:This is exactly why I have no interest in watching it. At last, a negative stance I can get behind. I did watch Orange is the New Black but found it, at best, "unremarkable", and at worst "incredibly off-putting/offensive". I don't get the hype for it 'round these parts.
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Jan 7, 2014 03:26
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:As an aside, why does anyone pay attention to that freakish, unpleasant crone? She reeks of desperation on multiple levels, and she's certainly not as funny as she seems to think she is. I don't know that episode of Louie was pretty pro Rivers. I'm pretty sure that at the very least we were all suppose to have found a new appreciation of her.
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Jan 7, 2014 03:49
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precision posted:At last, a negative stance I can get behind. I did watch Orange is the New Black but found it, at best, "unremarkable", and at worst "incredibly off-putting/offensive". It's a well written and compelling show if you can get past your racial prejudices.
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Jan 7, 2014 03:57
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Rageaholic Monkey posted:I just ignored all the praise OitNB got and didn't watch it because Weeds made me never want to watch anything created by Jenji Kohan again. I felt the same way, but my friend was over and we randomly put on an episode... and then two more. I am one of Weeds biggest detractors (as someone who watched the whole series), but Orange is but all definitions- a really good show. It feels like Breaking Bad in the sense that if it weren't for the bits of humour it would be an incredibly bleak and depressing show. The main problem my friend brought up with the show is that (minorish spoilers) None of the main characters inside the prison are inherently bad people. I'd give the first episode a shot. The pilot does a really good job of introducing the show to viewers.
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Jan 7, 2014 04:40
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CaptainHollywood posted:I'd give the first episode a shot. The pilot does a really good job of introducing the show to viewers. See, the pilot bored the poo poo out of us, and then the final twist made us go "NOPE, WEEDS FLASHBACKS"
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Jan 7, 2014 05:49
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Where's the Shameless thread? edit: nm, of course I just found it ...
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Jan 7, 2014 07:21
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CaptainHollywood posted:I felt the same way, but my friend was over and we randomly put on an episode... and then two more. I am one of Weeds biggest detractors (as someone who watched the whole series), but Orange is but all definitions- a really good show. It feels like Breaking Bad in the sense that if it weren't for the bits of humour it would be an incredibly bleak and depressing show. The main problem my friend brought up with the show is that (minorish spoilers) None of the main characters inside the prison are inherently bad people. Regarding the bit under the spoiler, in a minimum security facility that is about what I would expect and I suspect part of the whole point the show is attempting to make if it is trying to make any larger point. There is a really weird disconnect between the parts of the show that put human faces on institutional racism and the parts that seem to argue that WASP ladies have it rough, too, darnit. It was an enjoyable show in its own way. I ripped through it pretty quickly but now can't really remember why. I enjoyed Janeway speaking with Chekov's accent? The Reno 911 vibe from Pornstache Guard? Insomnia? Gaslighting Pennsyltucky? It certainly wasn't Piper, who is about as sympathetic as Martha Stewart. I think it definitely benefited from being a Netflix Original series since it was compelling enough to keep hitting the next episode, but airing week to week I doubt I would have remembered to keep up with it.
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Jan 7, 2014 07:46
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What I liked about OitNB was that the "twist" was not a plot twist, as such, but a character twist. When we're first introduced to Alex, we're seeing her from Piper's perspective, and we assume that Alex was the bad influence on Piper, that she led Piper down this path that forced her to leave the situation and eventually culminated in her ending up in jail. As the episodes draw on, this assumption is gradually turned on its head and it emerges that Alex, although she was the one that was doing the drug smuggling (which is only "wrong" because the War on Drugs exists, but that is a whole other debate, go watch the Wire for that), she genuinely fell in love with Piper, and Piper was the narcissist that used Alex and hosed off when things got real, causing Alex to get caught (I think - it's been a while now), not the other way around. Alex never ratted her out because she loved Piper. Also, the bit where Piper says to her mother in one of her visits something like "These people are no different to us" and her mother looks at her as if to say what the gently caress are you talking about. There's some genuine growth there, but I can see why some might find some of the ways it's presented "problematic" (I hate that word).
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Jan 7, 2014 12:15
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Orange is the New Black was one of the most complex shows to air last year and the sheer amount of well-written characters with great arcs was outstanding. But the main character was a previously-well-to-do white girl so of course people are gonna whine and moan.
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Jan 7, 2014 12:27
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Cactus posted:What I liked about OitNB was that the "twist" was not a plot twist, as such, but a character twist. When we're first introduced to Alex, we're seeing her from Piper's perspective, and we assume that Alex was the bad influence on Piper, that she led Piper down this path that forced her to leave the situation and eventually culminated in her ending up in jail. That interpretation seems pretty widespread, but I never really understood it. Alex completely did rat Piper out, she admits as much toward the end of the season. She also essentially admits having a pattern of seducing women like Piper for the express purpose of turning them into drug mules. She may have truly loved Piper by the end, but she never stopped using her right up until Piper decided she was done with the whole thing. She also lies straight to Piper's face when asked if she implicated her, accepts Piper's tearful apologies and uses them as a way to rekindle the relationship, then gets busted again and tries to justify it with the whole "you left me after my mom died" thing (and while that's kind of rough timing, Piper was leaving before that for pretty valid reasons and probably felt like she was being manipulated in the moment) and paint Piper as the villain. And Alex got caught well after Piper left her, I think the time gap was something like ten years. In short, while Piper is certainly a narcissist, Alex is that and much worse. I'll never understand how some people have latched on to her as the "real hero" of the show.
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Jan 7, 2014 12:40
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ShakeZula posted:That interpretation seems pretty widespread, but I never really understood it. Alex completely did rat Piper out, she admits as much toward the end of the season. She also essentially admits having a pattern of seducing women like Piper for the express purpose of turning them into drug mules. She may have truly loved Piper by the end, but she never stopped using her right up until Piper decided she was done with the whole thing. She also lies straight to Piper's face when asked if she implicated her, accepts Piper's tearful apologies and uses them as a way to rekindle the relationship, then gets busted again and tries to justify it with the whole "you left me after my mom died" thing (and while that's kind of rough timing, Piper was leaving before that for pretty valid reasons and probably felt like she was being manipulated in the moment) and paint Piper as the villain. And Alex got caught well after Piper left her, I think the time gap was something like ten years. Yeah, I'm a little fuzzy on the details because it was a while back now so you're probably right about Alex ratting her out, but the main point I took from it all was that Piper has gone through her life thinking she's perfect and blaming others for the bad things that happen to her, and her being in jail was forcing her to come to terms with who she really was - and this was cleverly reflected in a gradual shift in the audiences POV from Piper-centric to a generally unbiased 3rd-person view as the season progressed. Alex was not totally faultless, I acknowledge that, but Piper knew what she was getting into after a while and was just as bad if not worse on the emotional manipulation front. In the end I guess they deserved each other, but Piper was ultimately the one who started the betrayal/counter betrayal that caused them to both end up being in there. I'm going to have to re-watch it, I really liked it but some of the details have escaped my long-term memory.
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Jan 7, 2014 12:58
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Cactus posted:Yeah, I'm a little fuzzy on the details because it was a while back now so you're probably right about Alex ratting her out, but the main point I took from it all was that Piper has gone through her life thinking she's perfect and blaming others for the bad things that happen to her, and her being in jail was forcing her to come to terms with who she really was - and this was cleverly reflected in a gradual shift in the audiences POV from Piper-centric to a generally unbiased 3rd-person view as the season progressed. Alex was not totally faultless, I acknowledge that, but Piper knew what she was getting into after a while and was just as bad if not worse on the emotional manipulation front. In the end I guess they deserved each other, but Piper was ultimately the one who started the betrayal/counter betrayal that caused them to both end up being in there. I guess I just fail to see how anything Piper did was "just as bad if not worse" of an emotional manipulation than what Alex did. I mean, Alex's offenses: seducing Piper (and several others over time) and using that relationship to convince her to be a drug mule, lying about being the reason for her incarceration and making Piper feel guilty for accusing her at all, happily restarting the relationship despite knowing about Piper's fiancé, and using her mother's death to justify her behavior. Piper's offenses: refusing to go on a multi-day solo drug run to help Alex in a pinch, leaving Alex when the pressure continued, and not sticking around to support Alex after her mother's death. And I guess cheating on her fiance with Alex, though I'm not sure if that counts as emotional manipulation on Piper's part. To me it's pretty cut and dry that while Piper is certainly flawed, Alex is far worse of an emotional manipulator.
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Jan 7, 2014 13:19
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Well argued. But hey look on the bright side, at least neither of us can be accused of misogyny  e: I can't remember which thread it was recommended in but I started watching Outrageous Fortune, and I can genuinely pass on the recommendation. It's weirdly good, kind of like if Sopranos, Shameless and Neighbours had an unholy threesome. Three episodes in and I've had several laugh out loud moments already. Cactus fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Jan 7, 2014 |
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Jan 7, 2014 13:24
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BarbarousBertha posted:Regarding the bit under the spoiler, in a minimum security facility that is about what I would expect and I suspect part of the whole point the show is attempting to make if it is trying to make any larger point. There is a really weird disconnect between the parts of the show that put human faces on institutional racism and the parts that seem to argue that WASP ladies have it rough, too, darnit. The fact that it puts a human face on people in these institutions is what I really loved about the show, the parts where the plot were incidental and it just focuses on these human interactions (like the Christmas Pageant and the scene where the latina woman comes back to prison after giving birth, and everyone in the cafetaria stops what they're doing to watch her go by, which about broke me). Things that might come off cliche, but because the show has spent so much time with these characters, and there so much levity and other different tones, it just comes off as wonderfully realistic. Ryan Mcgee does a better job of talking about it: http://notjusttvmcgee.libsyn.com/episode-10-thoughts-on-the-first-season-of-orange-is-the-new-black, but its these humanizing moments that will stick with me for a while. Though its not perfect though, I remember being uncomfortable with the way they portrayed Alex (as a benign character) and one or two other characters, and things did veer into wacky arcs at times (all that poo poo with the chicken). But its still counts as one of the best Netflix experiences I can ever remember, tearing into this weird, wonderful show.
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Jan 7, 2014 14:33
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Started watching The Genius and the twist at the end of the first episode completely melted my brain. This is great stuff.
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Jan 7, 2014 18:06
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I'm surprised I don't see any thread up for the new show Intelligence premiering tonight, starring Josh Holloway [Lost] and Marg Hellenbruger [CSI] (I'm sure I spelled that wrong). From the previews the premise looks sort-of like "Chuck: the Techno-thriller".
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Jan 8, 2014 00:39
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Bown posted:Started watching The Genius and the twist at the end of the first episode completely melted my brain. This is great stuff. You've seen nothing yet.
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Jan 8, 2014 00:41
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Stabbey_the_Clown posted:I'm surprised I don't see any thread up for the new show Intelligence premiering tonight, starring Josh Holloway [Lost] and Marg Hellenbruger [CSI] (I'm sure I spelled that wrong). From the previews the premise looks sort-of like "Chuck: the Techno-thriller". That's because the reviews have mostly been middling. AV Club's line about how Holloway's character is only slightly faster at things than someone holding an iPhone is pretty telling about how dated the concept is.
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Jan 8, 2014 00:47
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From the title I was expecting it to be a dramedy about Mensa.
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Jan 8, 2014 01:04
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I just watched the first three episodes of Alpha House and I'm a little blown away that that's Haley Joel Osment. I haven't actually seen him in a long time.
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Jan 8, 2014 01:52
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Channel surfing. I don't know what's more odd. NCIS still being on the air or Dads.
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Jan 8, 2014 02:18
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CaptainHollywood posted:Channel surfing. I don't know what's more odd. NCIS still being on the air or Dads. Dads. As long as old people exist, NCIS will. It's like a symbiotic relationship.
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Jan 8, 2014 02:31
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Lycus posted:I just watched the first three episodes of Alpha House and I'm a little blown away that that's Haley Joel Osment. I haven't actually seen him in a long time. Just wait for The Spoils of Babylon.
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Jan 8, 2014 02:33
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Bown posted:Orange is the New Black was one of the most complex shows to air last year and the sheer amount of well-written characters with great arcs was outstanding. But the main character was a previously-well-to-do white girl so of course people are gonna whine and moan. I don't mean to call you out specifically but this attitude really gets on my nerves. Like, when anyone says they don't enjoy Girls and people resort to "Oh well you don't like it because it's about a privileged white girl", as if it's impossible to both "get" something and dislike it.
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Jan 8, 2014 02:51
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precision posted:I don't mean to call you out specifically but this attitude really gets on my nerves. Like, when anyone says they don't enjoy Girls and people resort to "Oh well you don't like it because it's about a privileged white girl", as if it's impossible to both "get" something and dislike it. The difference is where Girls largely satirizes the middle class white girl privileged, OitNB embraces it.
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Jan 8, 2014 03:06
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precision posted:I don't mean to call you out specifically but this attitude really gets on my nerves. Like, when anyone says they don't enjoy Girls and people resort to "Oh well you don't like it because it's about a privileged white girl", as if it's impossible to both "get" something and dislike it. While what you quotes was obviously meant as a burn on "limited thinkers" or whatever (due to the whine and moan part) it's also not untrue that there are a lot of people who just don't like material that deals with that subject matter and I think you might be one of those people. It's like how some people don't like horror or other people don't like family drama no matter if they're good or bad. I don't know if Orange Is the New Black is good or bad and I have my own feelings about Girls but just like you can understand something and still not like it, disliking a thing doesn't have to mean it's bad.
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