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I don't know that they exist but here's a few ways you could set it up. 1. 3-way, 1-way switches: Box 1: 1-way switch to control light. Power comes to this box via /2-WG cable, leaves (with switched hot and constant hot) via /3-WG cable. Box 2, dual gang: outlet and 3-way switch. Break jumper tab off hot side of outlet pair. Wire one outlet hot to constant power from /3-WG cable, along with one non-common terminal of 3-way. Wire COM terminal of 3-way to other outlet hot. Wire second non-common terminal of 3-way to switched hot from /3-WG cable. This way could also be set up so that override-on power for the second outlet comes from a second breaker without causing problems (double feeding of first outlet when overridden, etc) but that's probably a bad idea. Though lights and outlets in a room are typically on separate breakers, so maybe not such a bad idea. 2. Assuming you are powering this all off one source of power, just set up your switched and non switched outlets and control switch the way you normally would (break off tab on hot side of outlet pair, wire switch between hot screws) but add a second 1-way switch in the box with the outlet and parallel it with the main light switch. If you wanted to get fancy, you could use a duplex outlet and an outlet/switch combo in this box to give you 3 outlets and an override switch in the same space, with any number of the outlets constant powered and any number switched or overridden as required. I can draw up wiring diagrams for this but I was too lazy to do so when I wrote this post. I'm too OCD for mspaint and my circuit editor is tailored for EE stuff, not electrician stuff, so it has plenty of symbols for board level components but no outlet/wall switch pictorial elements. e: remember that modern electrical code requires "noodles in switch boxes" (white wires/neutrals in each switch box) except under special circumstances you are probably aware of if they apply to you. What this amounts to is that you can't run a 14/2-WG to a switch box, color the white wire black, and attach the switch to them, you have to use a 14/3-WG and bring a neutral out to it in case someone wants to add a room occupancy sensing smart switch in the future. Depending on your municipality and how much of a cranky old man your inspector is, he may or may not require this and may or may not have a lot of mean things to say about whoever put it in the code in the first place. kastein fucked around with this message at 00:15 on Jan 8, 2014 |
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Jan 8, 2014 00:13
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Zhentar posted:Most of the electrical outlets in my house are half switched. It's nice that I can put floor lamps wherever, but it can be fairly annoying, since I have lots of things to plug in; using a bunch of outlet splitters while half the outlets are empty seems silly. Usually, those are double-gang devices. There are devices that fit in normal duplex holes that have an outlet on top and a switch on the bottom. The problem with your setup is that there are switch legs on the wall that would end up going nowhere. It's possible to do what you want, but unlikely that the wire exists in your walls to do it. The hots for switched outlets usually don't originate in the box they're controlling. Who knows, though; you may get lucky and just have to retrofit a double-gang box in there and put a decora toggle in for the second device, and that's the one that's switchable from "switched" to "always on" and there's another duplex right next to it that's always hot.
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Jan 8, 2014 00:18
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How about just retrofit dual gang boxes, have three outlets unswitched and one switched. Minimum confusion and (hopefully) no new wiring.
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Jan 8, 2014 00:21
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Zhentar posted:Most of the electrical outlets in my house are half switched. It's nice that I can put floor lamps wherever, but it can be fairly annoying, since I have lots of things to plug in; using a bunch of outlet splitters while half the outlets are empty seems silly. how old is the house? would you like to keep some of the outlets as 1/2 hots? why not just go through and change out all of the plugs that you want as constantly hot to new ones without breaking the tab between the hot screws and leave the switch-leg part capped off in the back of the box? (if there are two wires on the switched portion, wirenut them together before you put the new plug back in.) another possible option if you don't want to change out that many plugs is in the switch box(es) tie the power and the switch-leg together and just leave the switch in as a dummy or buy a blank switch to fill the spot on the plate. i'd personally go with the first option and then if you find you want any of those receptacles switched again, pull the plug back out, break the tab connecting the two hot screws, and reconnect the switch leg to it.
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Jan 8, 2014 03:58
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I found a patent for (approximately) what I want, at least: http://www.google.com/patents/US3246179 I'll probably just go the dual gang route in a couple choice spots though, since that doesn't seem commercially available.
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Jan 8, 2014 06:01
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So I have a light in my house (1900s, k&t, romex, coat hangers) that hasn't functioned since purchase. In the switch box one controls the basement light, and the other is supposed to turn on an over head light. they bottom two screws of both switches are tie together (assuming that shout be hot) but it isn't. Its neutral and hot is on the basement light side. Any tips of tracking down where the mix up is? Its a real fucker as the switch controls two different sets of switched lights in the basement(that all function). One of the junction boxes on a basement light has about 6 pairs coming into it.
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Jan 10, 2014 04:33
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I've got an issue with one of the power outlets in my home. I live in a condo with the garage underneath and the problem is with the power outlet in that garage. The problem is that the power outlet will just stop working randomly for no apparent reason. The other electrical devices and lights in the garage work it just seems to be that one outlet. The garage door opener and it's light are fine, the washer and dryer continue to work, and the main halogen lamp in the garage works. I haven't really been able to pin down a pattern, it seems kind of random. It wouldn't really be a big deal if it weren't the outlet right above my hobby desk. On the other side of the wall from the problem garage outlet is the foyer and entrance to the house where there is another outlet that I imagine is on the same circuit or whatever. It seems to be the closest outlet to the other one, anyhow I have tested this outlet while the other one is out and it works just fine. I have also checked the circuit breakers and none of them are ever tripped. I really have no idea how else to try and diagnose what's going on. Since I've only been in the condo for six months I have a homeowners warranty but when I called they wanted like $80 to have an electrician come out and look at it. Most likely the outlet will be working just fine when he comes so I really have no idea how to go about this. Anyone have any idea what it could be or what else I should check? I was about to go down there and solder some poo poo and the thing was out again. Let me know if there is a better thread to post this in.
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Jan 10, 2014 09:36
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Try replacing the outlet?
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Jan 10, 2014 13:25
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My guess, it was installed with the backstabby things which are now coming loose. If you're not up for fixing or replacing it yourself, spring for the 80 bucks. Or the contacts are just worn out, seen that one a lot too.
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Jan 10, 2014 16:07
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Ok I'll turn off all the power to the garage and try replacing the outlet. It just seems so random when it goes out and its not like the thing flickers when I pound the wall next to it.
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Jan 10, 2014 18:46
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Personally, my money's on "mouse chewed the wiring." Have fun!
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Jan 10, 2014 19:06
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slap me silly posted:My guess, it was installed with the backstabby things which are now coming loose. If you're not up for fixing or replacing it yourself, spring for the 80 bucks. seconding this. pressfit connections are terrible and that's probably why its doing this. The outlet should have the screw posts on it, so if that's the case, just take a pair of needlenose pliers and bend a spepherds crook into it so it snaps on snug, then tighten it and you're good to go. And a little trick is to point the crook in the direction you will tighten the screw in so it doesn't try to bend the crook straight when you tighten the screw.
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Jan 10, 2014 20:39
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Pressfit connections, spepherds crooks and screw posts. Things I need to learn about today.
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Jan 10, 2014 21:13
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shepherds crook is a term I just made up to describe how you should bend it. Pressfit and screw posts will be obvious when you look at the back of the outlet. The screw posts you can see, the pressfit slots are in the back and are just little holes you press the bare wire into. (ignore the outlet on teh right)  also: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dr672ttJY8U
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Jan 10, 2014 23:53
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XmasGiftFromWife posted:So I have a light in my house (1900s, k&t, romex, coat hangers) that hasn't functioned since purchase. In the switch box one controls the basement light, and the other is supposed to turn on an over head light. they bottom two screws of both switches are tie together (assuming that shout be hot) but it isn't. Its neutral and hot is on the basement light side. Any tips of tracking down where the mix up is? Its a real fucker as the switch controls two different sets of switched lights in the basement(that all function). One of the junction boxes on a basement light has about 6 pairs coming into it. I assume you've done the obvious and tried swapping in known working bulbs? It could be the fixture itself and not the wiring. What kind of fixture is the problem light: incandescent, fluorescent, halogen or LED? Also visuvius, thirding replace that outlet. The metal springs inside that clamp down on inserted prongs do wear out over time, leading to intermittent contact when plugs are inserted. This is especially true for outlets that get used a lot, like kitchen countertop and workbench outlets. You can replace it yourself, just turn the circuit off first. Black wire goes under either brass screw, white wire goes under either silver screw, ground wire under the green screw. If you want to be up to code, replace it with a GFCI since that's what garages require now. A GFCI would probably need a new faceplate too, unless you had a Decora outlet in your garage for some reason. kid sinister fucked around with this message at 20:09 on Jan 11, 2014 |
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Jan 11, 2014 19:55
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My dad got me a Nest thermostat (2nd gen) for Christmas but my house's thermostat wires (Rh and W) appear to be just barely too heavy gauge to get into the connector holes on the Nest backing plate. I would guess that they're 18 gauge wires but I don't have a wire guide to measure them to know for sure. I'm looking for solutions - can I use wire nuts to attach 20 gauge wires to the ends of the existing wires, or should I run new thermostat wires directly from the furnace? My heating system is hot water baseboard with a furnace/boiler. The furnace is in the basement, pretty much directly below where the thermostat is on the main floor of the house. Any help/suggestions would be appreciated!
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Jan 11, 2014 20:57
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What kind of thermostat is there now?
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Jan 11, 2014 21:06
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It's a Honeywell programmable thermostat.
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Jan 11, 2014 21:08
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That doesn't really narrow it down much. Is there a model number?
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Jan 11, 2014 21:18
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Sorry, the current thermostat is a Honeywell RTH2310B: http://yourhome.honeywell.com/home/Products/Thermostats/5-2-Day-Programmable/RTH2310B.htm I replaced the old non-programmable thermostat with the Honeywell unit shortly after moving into the house in September 2009.
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Jan 11, 2014 21:23
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tropical posted:My dad got me a Nest thermostat (2nd gen) for Christmas but my house's thermostat wires (Rh and W) appear to be just barely too heavy gauge to get into the connector holes on the Nest backing plate. I would guess that they're 18 gauge wires but I don't have a wire guide to measure them to know for sure. I'm looking for solutions - can I use wire nuts to attach 20 gauge wires to the ends of the existing wires, or should I run new thermostat wires directly from the furnace? My heating system is hot water baseboard with a furnace/boiler. The furnace is in the basement, pretty much directly below where the thermostat is on the main floor of the house. Any help/suggestions would be appreciated!
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Jan 11, 2014 21:32
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angryrobots posted:I would just wire nut a smaller gauge like you say. It's just control wiring, won't hurt a thing so long as you wire it up correctly. Surprising they won't fit, but I've never installed a nest, I surmise it is a lot packed into a tiny package. Yeah my existing wires just barely don't fit. According to the Nest website, the thermostat is compatible with 18 to 22 gauge. The slightly rounded end of the wire will just stick in but that's as far as it goes. Is filing the end of the wire a bit to get it to go in an option or is that a bad idea?
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Jan 11, 2014 23:30
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Sure, just don't break the terminal if it's that tight.
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Jan 12, 2014 00:58
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kid sinister posted:It could be the fixture itself and not the wiring. The tab in the bottom of light sockets often gets bent down too far and doesn't make a good connection; bending it back up might fix things (if you've got one light that seems to burn out bulbs a lot faster, this likely the culprit - you can tell because the solder blob on the bottom of the bulb will have a divot in it where sparks have melted it).
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Jan 12, 2014 05:28
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I installed a gangable box at my parents' and when I went to install an outlet in it, the conduit locking nut blocks the outlet from fitting in. The placement of the knockouts is such that they will all have the same issue, and I can't find a thinner outlet. I have accepted that I will need to replace the box, but.. why does this box exist? Purely out of curiosity, what would be the intended purpose of a box so shallow that the thinnest outlet won't fit in? Are they intended to be junction boxes only? Or is the fact that I am using conduit the issue? Would Romex fix the problem? (I am in the Chicagoland area - Romex is an urban legend here)
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Jan 12, 2014 16:13
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kid sinister posted:I assume you've done the obvious and tried swapping in known working bulbs? It could be the fixture itself and not the wiring. What kind of fixture is the problem light: incandescent, fluorescent, halogen or LED?
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Jan 13, 2014 00:25
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tropical posted:Yeah my existing wires just barely don't fit. According to the Nest website, the thermostat is compatible with 18 to 22 gauge. The slightly rounded end of the wire will just stick in but that's as far as it goes. Is filing the end of the wire a bit to get it to go in an option or is that a bad idea? The RTH2310B is a 24V thermostat - so yeah, you're fine doing this. There's no real current going through those wires, it's just enough power for a relay. The Nest is pretty drat awesome. 
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Jan 13, 2014 11:03
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Yeah I'm either going to file the wires a bit or get some butt splices and put a 20 gauge wire on the other end to plug into the Nest. Can't wait to try it out! Thanks for the help, everyone.
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Jan 13, 2014 17:55
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Don't file them, you'll make them raggy and the sharp step will make the wire break more easily at that point. I'd probably use rather small wire nuts, they come off again in case you ever want to change something else.
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Jan 13, 2014 20:13
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kastein posted:I'd probably use rather small wire nuts, they come off again in case you ever want to change something else. This sounds like a job for scotchlocks. Not sure how common they are outside of telecom though, so it may not be the kind of thing the average person can get their hands on without ordering a box of 100 or more. 
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Jan 13, 2014 20:28
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Motronic posted:This sounds like a job for scotchlocks. Not sure how common they are outside of telecom though, so it may not be the kind of thing the average person can get their hands on without ordering a box of 100 or more. They sell small packs of these at Home Depot. I still have a few left over from a pack of 10 or 20 from my old house where the phone wiring was a goddamn rats nest.
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Jan 13, 2014 20:35
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XmasGiftFromWife posted:Incandescent. I am 100% sure the fixture functions. The fixture may function, but one socket isn't working. Do what Zhentar said about bending up the tab at the bottom of the socket. If you hulk out while tightening down a bulb, it can smash that tab down so flat that it won't make contact with the next bulb you twist in. A flathead screwdriver works pretty good for bending it back up. Turn off the power first, that is the hot tab of a socket. kid sinister fucked around with this message at 04:08 on Jan 14, 2014 |
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Jan 14, 2014 04:02
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For about 15 years I've been running my table saw (12.8A/120V) off a short shop made extension cord, maybe 8 or 10 feet long. Basic, 3 prong male end, outlet box with 3 prong outlets. Don't remember the exact wire gauge but pretty big, probably 10, or 12 at the smallest. The other day I walked in, picked up the outlet end and it was slightly warm, just a little above room temp. The saw had not been running. Should I trash it? Rebuild it? What would cause it to warm up? In the mean time I am unplugging when not in use. edit; nm, I'm just going to convert to 220V and put it on it's own breaker. wormil fucked around with this message at 01:06 on Jan 19, 2014 |
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Jan 18, 2014 23:02
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wormil posted:The other day I walked in, picked up the outlet end and it was slightly warm, just a little above room temp. The saw had not been running. Should I trash it? Rebuild it? What would cause it to warm up? In the mean time I am unplugging when not in use. My first reaction to this would be to open it up and check out what's going on with the outlet. Are the connections still tight? If everything looks good, toss another $0.88 outlet in there and see how it goes. My second reaction would be to look at this and say "self, if I know how to wire an outlet and there is one close enough to plug in this extension cord why don't I just bang a box in for real and wire it in to the existing outlet."
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Jan 18, 2014 23:07
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Motronic posted:This sounds like a job for scotchlocks. Not sure how common they are outside of telecom though, so it may not be the kind of thing the average person can get their hands on without ordering a box of 100 or more. So it does. The kind with silicone packing are even quite nice in damp areas. I think home depot has them in the specialty wiring section in packs of well under 100, but can't quite remember last time I bought any. The other kind of scotchlock on the other hand is a devilish creation and should never be used on anything.  gently caress those things. gently caress them forever.
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Jan 19, 2014 00:18
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Motronic posted:My first reaction to this would be to open it up and check out what's going on with the outlet. Are the connections still tight? If everything looks good, toss another $0.88 outlet in there and see how it goes. Yeah I just haven't time to bother with it but I just opened it up and cleaned out 15 years of cobwebs and dust and tightened the connections. Digging through my electrical supplies I discovered I have everything to convert to 220V, better late than never. Funny how I can procrastinate, that extension cord was meant to be temporary until I rewired to 220V but it ran so well the last 15 years I just never got around to it. The saw is in the middle of the shop so I'll have to run a wire underneath the building.
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Jan 19, 2014 01:04
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kastein posted:The other kind of scotchlock on the other hand is a devilish creation and should never be used on anything. Those things are quite useful for making tap splices on car wiring, especially the ones filled with dielectric grease for outside the cab. That being said, it's the only thing that I would ever use them for.
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Jan 19, 2014 18:21
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kid sinister posted:Those things are quite useful for making tap splices on car wiring, especially the ones filled with dielectric grease for outside the cab. That being said, it's the only thing that I would ever use them for. They may be useful for temporary connections, but even the ones with dielectric don't seem to hold up well. The "proper" way to do a tap like this is to strip an 1/2 to 3/4" of insulation off of the wire to be tapped, separate and make a "hole" the strands 50/50 (the probe from a test light works well for this) and insert 1-2 inches of stripped wire in that hole. Close it up and start wrapping. Then tape it properly (which is something many people don't know how to do). This gives you both a good electrical and mechanical connection and it easy to revert if necessary.
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Jan 19, 2014 22:53
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Or you could just solder it.Motronic posted:Then tape it properly (which is something many people don't know how to do). For bundled wires, more like "impossible to do without taking 2 hours separating, taping and rebundling them". Slugworth posted:I installed a gangable box at my parents' and when I went to install an outlet in it, the conduit locking nut blocks the outlet from fitting in. The placement of the knockouts is such that they will all have the same issue, and I can't find a thinner outlet. I have accepted that I will need to replace the box, but.. why does this box exist? Purely out of curiosity, what would be the intended purpose of a box so shallow that the thinnest outlet won't fit in? Are they intended to be junction boxes only? Or is the fact that I am using conduit the issue? Would Romex fix the problem? (I am in the Chicagoland area - Romex is an urban legend here) Did you still need help? It sounds like you're using a switch box for a receptacle. With conduit fittings poking inside, those things will barely have enough room for a switch. I would recommend trying a deeper box, if the wall and conduits allow it. That way, the fittings would be mounted back far enough to cram an outlet in. kid sinister fucked around with this message at 23:25 on Jan 19, 2014 |
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Jan 19, 2014 23:07
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kid sinister posted:Or you could just solder it. If we're talking about vehicle wiring or anything else in a high vibration environment this is usually a bad idea due to work hardening.
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Jan 19, 2014 23:34
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