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My Lovely Horse posted:At least Malack managed to instill the right values into Durkon. Interesting to see what Durkon's dad issue will be. His letter to the high priest suggests that his dad is missing or dead.
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Jan 15, 2014 17:39
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Proof that V is male: he's a terrible parent.
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Jan 15, 2014 20:05
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Mniot posted:Proof that V is male: he's a terrible parent. In a Burlew piece, that's probably true.
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Jan 15, 2014 20:18
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The Leper Colon V posted:I'm just glad that there exists almost no possibility of Xykon's dad showing up. We got a partial hint that his folks were good people (mild SoD spoiler) because they saw his talents and contacted a professor to try to recruit him for an X-Men knockoff group that saves the world that loathes its differences. And his dad's probably a zombie now with a trapped soul that will never be able to haunt him with messages to do the right thing.
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Jan 15, 2014 21:33
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Eschers Basement posted:Okay, Rich, we get it. Fathers are irrational about how they think the world works, are obsessed with their children playing important roles in making sure that the world works that way, and go crazy and destructive when those children take a different path. That's why Gene forced Roy to continue the quest to kill Xykon and won't stop bitching about how terrible a job his son is doing at it; why Tarquin tried to destroy the Order so that Elan would finally take the right role in what Tarquin's narrative is; and why Ian initially rejected Haley and Elan because they didn't share his paranoid fantasies. This is exactly why I hope that the conversation between Haley and Ian is going to go like this; Haley: Dad, come with us. Ian: For the last goddamn time, no! Roy: Alright, time to go. So that all the people who keep saying "well Ian is gonna be there and of course that means Tarquin will show up despite not knowing or recognizing who Ian is nor learning about him later" can shut the hell up already.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:18
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Or Ian will just flat out refuse to come with her so long as Elan is there, believing him to be manipulating her into unknowingly setting up a trap.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:24
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Honestly, maybe it's about time that Elan gave Haley her own advice, about finding family in Good people, than good in your family.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:25
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Who What Now posted:This is exactly why I hope that the conversation between Haley and Ian is going to go like this; Not quite. Haley: Dad, come with us. Ian: For the last goddamn time, no! Roy: Aaaand 10 minutes. Alright, time to go.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:26
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Shugojin posted:Not quite. The the last strip was very self-referential. No, they're not going to deal with Tarquin and his empire in this story. Yes, the ending to this arc has dragged on a fair bit.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:29
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Also no, characters don't do the optimal guaranteed win thing if it doesn't make for a good story.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:33
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The Leper Colon V posted:Honestly, maybe it's about time that Elan gave Haley her own advice, about finding family in Good people, than good in your family. Ian isn't remotely as bad a parent as Tarquin though. Also, Ian isn't the person that needs dealing with. His traitorous brother-in-law is.
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Jan 15, 2014 23:35
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NihilCredo posted:Ian isn't remotely as bad a parent as Tarquin though. I don't know, his whole TRUST NO ONE thing almost ruined his daughter's life by, you know, making her unable to trust anybody. I mean I guess he appears to have come by it via trauma so it's not as much his fault as Tarquin's murdering his son, but he still did a really bad job as a dad.
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Jan 16, 2014 01:30
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Shugojin posted:I don't know, his whole TRUST NO ONE thing almost ruined his daughter's life by, you know, making her unable to trust anybody. He also successfully raised her to adulthood in a city run by thieving murderers.
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Jan 16, 2014 02:45
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By turning her into a thieving murderer. SoD spoiler: Remember that one of her major concerns re: getting her dad back was the revenue that she could make by doing so.
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Jan 16, 2014 04:38
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If we're going to count "being a thieving murderer" as a parenting failure in a comic about D&D adventurers, successes are going to be few and far between. Celia has a mom, I guess? I kind of doubt the resolution to the Ian thing will just be Haley going "huh, I guess he really is dead-set on not accepting any help, okay on to the next plot point." Hopefully it won't drag on for fifty strips either, but it'll still probably be something more significant. If Rich just wants to tie off a loose end, they could just have a brief confrontation where Ian accepts her help and admits she's right about Elan, sewing up the whole trust issues thing.
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Jan 16, 2014 05:09
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Combed Thunderclap posted:...not that V necessarily specifically told anyone that they divorced their partner and sold their soul to fiends. Which may or may not be relevant to the ability to pass through Elven airspace, depending on where Rich wants to take the story. I think V mentioned the whole "leased hir soul to fiends" to Roy (there was a bit of argument about what is and isn't the place for that sort of thing), specifically re: "where I was for the entire loving fight", but I don't know if the information was disseminated to the rest of the party or how they feel about it if it was.
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Jan 16, 2014 08:49
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I suspect being a murderhobo and having a satisfying and happy childhood are not the most common pairing.
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Jan 16, 2014 08:55
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Dr. Buttass posted:I think V mentioned the whole "leased hir soul to fiends" to Roy (there was a bit of argument about what is and isn't the place for that sort of thing), specifically re: "where I was for the entire loving fight", but I don't know if the information was disseminated to the rest of the party or how they feel about it if it was. At least on-panel, V never explained why zhe was absent or where zhe was. Just that it involved "shockingly poor moral character" on V's part. V says "I'm telling you now so that it is done," but that doesn't mean that V is actually done; redemption requires an ongoing effort to be a better person, and can never actually be "done". I think that's meant to be another teaching moment as V realizes that. The strip in question: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0920.html
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Jan 16, 2014 09:20
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Ponsonby Britt posted:At least on-panel, V never explained why zhe was absent or where zhe was. Just that it involved "shockingly poor moral character" on V's part. V says "I'm telling you now so that it is done," but that doesn't mean that V is actually done; redemption requires an ongoing effort to be a better person, and can never actually be "done". I think that's meant to be another teaching moment as V realizes that. I think by "it" V just meant "telling him", not the incident as a whole. Based on the conversations with Blackwing at least, V is aware that there isn't a quick solution to the situation. However, it's highly unlikely that more was explained off panel given what was happening at the time, so presumably it might be worth revealing a bit more about what happened, especially given the whole "I might disappear for 23 minutes at an incredibly vital time" aspect.
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Jan 16, 2014 09:48
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MikeJF posted:People keep forgetting, the grand legacy with the great story was a recent thing since he re-met Elan. Tarquin, for most part, was concerned with living the good life until his death. Huh, was the background always white in some of those panels?
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Jan 17, 2014 03:45
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Anatharon posted:Huh, was the background always white in some of those panels? Scroll down.
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Jan 17, 2014 03:55
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Taciturn Tactician posted:I think by "it" V just meant "telling him", not the incident as a whole. Based on the conversations with Blackwing at least, V is aware that there isn't a quick solution to the situation. However, it's highly unlikely that more was explained off panel given what was happening at the time, so presumably it might be worth revealing a bit more about what happened, especially given the whole "I might disappear for 23 minutes at an incredibly vital time" aspect. I phrased that poorly, I meant to say what you're saying. Roy just knows "V made a poor moral decision", not "V made a deal with fiends, and will disappear at two important moments in the future".
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Jan 17, 2014 09:39
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http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0939.html Donation Drive
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Jan 17, 2014 10:47
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Guess Rich really doesn't want another Tough Ethical Debate at this point in the story, and I can't blame him in the least tbh.
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Jan 17, 2014 10:51
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That's never going to develop into any problem at all.
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Jan 17, 2014 10:51
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It's great to Belkar occupying moral high ground. Durkon's way of speaking feels a little different from before he was vamped. More forced. Am I just imagining that? It has been a while since Durkon had a lot of dialog.
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Jan 17, 2014 10:57
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Roy's a PC. Any group of PCs worth their salt when given access to a Vampire Cleric will move heaven and earth to keep said Cleric. There's so much power and utility there. Naturally, Rich will make them pay dearly for abusing that opportunity. Almost certainly in the form of Redcloak and Command Undead, if not before then. I'm curious about who exactly Durkon's getting his spells from. Thor shouldn't be fulfilling his requests...he's the wrong alignment now, and undead besides. I'm guessing we'll get a Durkon prayer time reveal of him having switched to Hel at some point, and that he's mentioning Thor to keep people thinking he's just the same old Durkon. Which, as Zz'ditri could tell you if he hadn't been murdered, he most certainly is not.
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Jan 17, 2014 11:08
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I wonder what Real Durkon would/will think of this.
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Jan 17, 2014 11:08
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Now that would be an awesome way to end the book. A look at Durkon's soul in the clouds weeping in horror, before being led away by Durkon's Archon to Thor's Meadhall.
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Jan 17, 2014 11:14
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jng2058 posted:Now that would be an awesome way to end the book. A look at Durkon's soul in the clouds weeping in horror, before being led away by Durkon's Archon to Thor's Meadhall. I believe Durkon's soul is currently in stasis until his body dies according to how things work in D&D.
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Jan 17, 2014 11:18
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I really don't think it works like that. If it did it would imply the soul of Xykon is around somewhere, either watching his animated body do terrible things (albeit approvingly) or in stasis, and that doesn't quite go together with his big speech about "be a lich, be a brain in a jar, anything as long as you avoid the big fire below." If the Xykon we know had been created only upon becoming a lich he wouldn't care.
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Jan 17, 2014 11:28
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DnD Liches and Vampires both have explicit mechanics. The vamprire's host-body's original soul is meant to be in stasis or something, yeah, but liches retain the same soul and personality (which I think they store in the phylactery?).
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Jan 17, 2014 12:04
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My Lovely Horse posted:That's never going to develop into any problem at all. Taking all bets! I've got 4:1 odds on "I cannae do it, lad, I don't feel right doing this," 7:1 on Elan running out of OJ, 50:1 on "Roy, I dinna know how to tell ya this, but you've got no blood fer me to drink," 100:1 on "Haley, lass, I'm pregnant, and yer tha father!"
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Jan 17, 2014 12:09
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Allstone posted:DnD Liches and Vampires both have explicit mechanics. e: Durkon will totally feel alright doing this. That's the thing.
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Jan 17, 2014 12:11
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I thought the former soul of an undead was what animated the undead (with magic taking that place for a lich).
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Jan 17, 2014 12:13
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Font changed back. It is easier on the eyes.
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Jan 17, 2014 12:18
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Two things that occur: - Rich has spent a lot of time showing us that even though people are evil, that doesn't mean they can't work together and have friends. I suspect we may see the flipside soon: evil people can have friends but that doesn't mean they're not still evil. - Roy, Elan and Haley are entering into a situation where there will be a vampire travelling the lands with three living people in tow he drinks from each night, no questions asked or protests raised and in fact they offer themselves willingly.
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Jan 17, 2014 12:29
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MikeJF posted:I believe Durkon's soul is currently in stasis until his body dies according to how things work in D&D. This is what is known as "the fluff" and depends on the setting as the actual details are copyright according to each particular setting. "The soul is trapped by a blank demon with your memories and a mockery of your personality" is Greyhawk/one of the pre-Faerun settings and isn't and explicit mechanic of the Open Gaming License. No mention is made at the d20 SRD. So we won't know until Rich makes it explicit, but the most we know is the soul is not able to pass on and likely still within the vampire at the least because it cannot be resurrected/true resurrected until the vampire is destroyed.
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Jan 17, 2014 13:16
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Durkon's totally conning them with his helpful act to play some long game. I'm basing this theory on the fact that it's this comic.
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Jan 17, 2014 13:20
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jng2058 posted:Roy's a PC. Any group of PCs worth their salt when given access to a Vampire Cleric will move heaven and earth to keep said Cleric. There's so much power and utility there. Durkon is now a Theistic cleric and gets his spells just generally from a concept, like he's suddenly entered the setting of Fate/Stay Night; there's a fairly in depth process iirc to switching to a different god.
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Jan 17, 2014 13:30
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