|
Ultimaker 2 is probably one of the best options right now.
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 23:48
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 17, 2024 10:22 |
|
|
Personally if my goal was print my own warham-alikes I'd go for something like the Form1. The FDM printers just don't cut it, even the good ones. The Form1 might be "low res" in its own way but the strengths (most notably easy handling of lots of little stick-outy bits or recessed details) are perfectly suited to making miniatures.
|
|
#
?
Jan 21, 2014 23:55
|
|
|
Yeah but at $3500 the form one is quite a bit more expensive than most FDM. I agree though, there's no point in even bothering trying to make miniatures without an SLA. You might be able to get some decent ones with a .25mm nozzle and .05mm layer height, but doubtful.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:05
|
|
|
FDM... err FFF, will make it hard to do things like print miniatures, as the detail level is degraded as you get to that scale. The heat from the hot end (the melty part) will just destroy your parts. To print things of that scale with any quality you'd need a machine that uses a resin which are typically prohibitively expensive. The "Peachy Printer" supposedly answers the issue of SLS, and a lot of people are very excited about it, but I'm a skeptic of the way they are doing it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:09
|
|
|
So then maybe i'll hold off on getting a 3D printer for the time being. Come back and take a look around and see whats available in 2015. Maybe the price will come down, maybe things will be a bit more accessible. Form1 is way out of my price range. After reading the Make Article, I was looking at the Up Plus 2. I don't actually PLAY Warhammer, i just enjoy painting the models and making dioramas. Perfect, exact replicas aren't what i was expecting. 70-90% of the detail to come out though? Sure. That seemed reasonable.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:09
|
|
|
UberVexer posted:
The prints I've seen from it look very low detail with air bubbles and other strangeness. I wouldn't say it really answers the call but comes close.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:16
|
|
|
That Make article is ancient - half of the printer reviews reference "good/bad quality for mid-2012," and the 'ones to watch' section in the article itself talks about the Rostock prototype, and says "SeeMeCNC plans to have a kit, called the Rostock MAX, available by the end of the year." info: Title: Make: Ultimate Guide to 3D Printing Author(s): The Editors MAKE of Publisher: Make Year: 2012 ISBN: 978-1449357375 I wouldn't use any of the information in that link as word-of-god. Queen_Combat fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Jan 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:19
|
|
|
MickRaider posted:The prints I've seen from it look very low detail with air bubbles and other strangeness. I wouldn't say it really answers the call but comes close. I think they're making a critical mistake with their electronics, starting with using a PC audio jack as the interface to the software. Audio jacks are subject to a ton of noise.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:19
|
|
|
MickRaider posted:Ultimaker 2 is probably one of the best options right now. Yeah, but you're at least paying a good grand over the Ultimaker original for a heated bed, dual extruders, and completely plastic framework and parts. I'm not even sure if they replaced the Arduino. If any of these sound worth that extra money, then I'd go for it. That said, I do hope they make a UM-to-UM2 upgrade kit or at least start selling UM2 parts separately. There's not really much of a difference mechanically beside the dual extruder printhead and heated bed, and the UM can be modded to take those, just replace the original parts. I bought mine for miniature work as well and while I haven't exactly made any in a sellable condition, I have gotten to the point where it is feasible, especially with the Cura software allowing for prints to go down to .06mm. I'll need to take some photos of some of my work. Young Freud fucked around with this message at 00:24 on Jan 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:21
|
|
|
Honestly if you don't have a review of printers from like this month it won't be very good detail and missing lots of options.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:21
|
|
|
Young Freud posted:Yeah, but you're at least paying a good grand over the Ultimaker original for a heated bed, dual extruders, and completely plastic framework and parts. I'm not even sure if they replaced the Arduino. If any of these sound worth that extra money, then I'd go for it. Well looks of the printer are important to some people. Not everyone wants an ugly wood box on their desk. That said I didn't buy the ultimaker because of the long lead time and went with a 2x which is ok I don't see anywhere for the ultimaker 2 that it does have dual extruders?
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:24
|
|
|
Geirskogul posted:That Make article is ancient - half of the printer reviews reference "good/bad quality for mid-2012," and the 'ones to watch' section in the article itself talks about the Rostock prototype, and says "SeeMeCNC plans to have a kit, called the Rostock MAX, available by the end of the year." They just updated it for 2014. However, they want money for it. info: http://www.makershed.com/Make_Ultimate_Guide_to_3D_Printing_2_0_p/9781457183027-p.htm?Click=163251
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:32
|
|
|
poo poo, I guess I don't really understand the Make business model, then. Whoops, I guess.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:40
|
|
|
You can get a Pegasus Touch from the Kickstarter right now for $2250(July delivery) if you want to print Warhammer mans. This is over $1000 less than the others and they're going up to $3500 post Kickstarter. Full Spectrum Laser has been around quite awhile making laser cutters so at least they know something about what they're doing. They're going to be standalone and calibrated out of the box though that has to be affected by being shipped. The software will be a huge part of it so it may take a bit to mature. The vats($75 for 2-4L of use) and resin($125 per liter) are consumables you have to account for too. Obsurveyor fucked around with this message at 00:47 on Jan 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:45
|
|
|
FlashBewin posted:
Warhammer miniatures would fall under super fine detail.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 00:45
|
|
|
MickRaider posted:Well looks of the printer are important to some people. Not everyone wants an ugly wood box on their desk. That said I didn't buy the ultimaker because of the long lead time and went with a 2x which is ok Huh, i swear it had dual extruders, but you're right. The bed platform is supposedly larger, but not by a significant amount. 230x225mm vs. 210x210mm doesn't sound like it would make that much of a difference. And there's an SD card reader built in. But yeah, that wait time originally put me off. They brought it down to about a month or so, because I remember ordering mine in January of last year and getting it in February.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 01:03
|
|
|
Pegasus Touch looks good, even for the $2250 price tag. I'm tempted, but i'm not sure i can justify that much of an expense for something that might be a flop; something i might get bored with after a few prints. I have the 2014 Make magazine, but their reviews are kind of...I want to say unbiased, but i'm not sure that's the appropriate word. They don't come right out and say "this printer sucks" Although the Replicator 2 does seem to have a pretty decent review, but for that cost (magazine has it listed at $2199) i might as well do the Pegasus Touch for a few hundred more. Not sure what i'll do at this point.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 01:03
|
|
|
FlashBewin posted:Pegasus Touch looks good, even for the $2250 price tag. I'm tempted, but i'm not sure i can justify that much of an expense for something that might be a flop; something i might get bored with after a few prints. The materials for SLA cost more than standard plastics for FDM. I would argue that Make has a bias towards Makerbot, Make made some money off of Bre Pettis' video series.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 01:23
|
|
|
UberVexer posted:The materials for SLA cost more than standard plastics for FDM. Yeah but you plain can't get the detail out of a Makerbot and a $1250 savings over the other SLA machines is a lot of material.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 01:48
|
|
|
Obsurveyor posted:Yeah but you plain can't get the detail out of a Makerbot and a $1250 savings over the other SLA machines is a lot of material. This is correct, however Flash already voiced concerns with the cost of the hobby, and he should be told about the material cost.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 02:06
|
|
|
UberVexer posted:This is correct, however Flash already voiced concerns with the cost of the hobby, and he should be told about the material cost. Well, I did mention them in my post above. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 02:08
|
|
|
Does the size of the object being printed have anything to do with the quality of the print/fineness of the detail? If 28mm or whatever the Warham figs are, what if they were 2x that size, 56mm ? or some range in between? Like i said, i don't play Warham, but i do enjoy painting the figures. No matter what, the Pegasus Touch is a bit out of my price range. I hadn't considered the cost of the medium. Guess i'm just in kind of shock that i cancelled my Jr. v2, now looking to fill the void it left.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 02:28
|
|
|
FlashBewin posted:Does the size of the object being printed have anything to do with the quality of the print/fineness of the detail? Yes, smaller items require more precision to get a high level of detail. For example, printing HO scale train models would be hard to do, but you could probably get away with standard Lionel O gauge train scale printing.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 02:39
|
|
|
FlashBewin posted:Does the size of the object being printed have anything to do with the quality of the print/fineness of the detail? If 28mm or whatever the Warham figs are, what if they were 2x that size, 56mm ? or some range in between? Like i said, i don't play Warham, but i do enjoy painting the figures. It's the feature size. Many are sub-millimeter or even sub-0.1 millimeter. You could get the gross shapes but the details are going to be a mess with almost any FDM. Common nozzle sizes on FDM machines are .35mm and .5mm and plastic slump is going to increase those. There are some people that have some insane Ultimaker setups that can get really close but it took many hours and tons of upgrades/tweaks to get there. quote:No matter what, the Pegasus Touch is a bit out of my price range. I hadn't considered the cost of the medium. Guess i'm just in kind of shock that i cancelled my Jr. v2, now looking to fill the void it left. If you want to learn your machine inside and out and like to tweak/upgrade, you could always go with something like what I have, the Hadron ORD Bot. Nice and rigid machine, since it's mostly aluminum extrusion, especially if you replace all the nylon/plastic stuff you can. You can still get mechanical kits from ebay for $550 partially assembled and add your own electronics, extruder and hotend. reprapdiscount, the seller on ebay, ships extremely quick and sells electronics at a good price(and will group shipping). There are some upgrades you need to do immediately to eliminate z-wobble but they're not horribly expensive and you can print the parts yourself. The buildlog forums have lots of topics with good info that cover just about everything.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 02:43
|
|
|
Ok, getting a little tired of this argument without presenting proof, so I went and took pictures of a gnome mini I pulled off Thingiverse. I believe the layer size is .1mm.   I tried to get the best photos I could, but the auto-focus couldn't catch most of the time. This was also done with "support print everywhere", which unfortunately currently has a bug that makes the supports rock hard. Since he was only 6g of plastic, he's mostly an experiment.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 03:01
|
|
|
It's a great print but the features aren't really even close to the detail of 28mm scale figures though:
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 03:16
|
|
|
Yeah, it's great if you're trying to replace a lost player piece for that old copy of Sorry! you found in the basement, or you need more houses/hotels for Monopoly, but fantasy tabletop mans it is not.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 03:44
|
|
|
MickRaider posted:Yeah but at $3500 the form one is quite a bit more expensive than most FDM. The upcoming Pegasus from Full Spectrum Laser (see my post one page back) is going for only $2500, and offers a larger build area (7"x7"x9") than the Form1. If you're looking for a quality FDM printer, the Makergear M2 offers a stainless steel frame and quality linear motion parts for around $1500.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 04:20
|
|
|
Young Freud posted:Ok, getting a little tired of this argument without presenting proof, so I went and took pictures of a gnome mini I pulled off Thingiverse. I believe the layer size is .1mm. I'm honest to god not being a smartass, but are you saying your result is evidence that it's doable, or that it isn't?
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 04:35
|
|
|
A well nut on my threaded rod has mostly fixed my banding problems. Anyone know what causes this sort of delamination issue? It's separated like that in 4 spots on both of those trays, and all 4 are in the same spot on both prints. I'm also having problems with prints peeling off the build plate, I wonder if it's related? I've got a glass plate that I spray down with some hair spray before prints. This is ABS, and I had been printing it at 190, I've been experimenting with bumping the temperature back up to 200 to see if that is the problem. I do most of my printing on the weekend, though, and didn't get anything aside from a few small test prints done at 200 last weekend. Chainclaw fucked around with this message at 08:22 on Jan 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 08:20
|
|
|
If it happens at the same height every print I'd look at your z-axis with a fine toothed comb, something binds or jumps at that point.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 08:40
|
|
|
Chainclaw posted:A well nut on my threaded rod has mostly fixed my banding problems. Anyone know what causes this sort of delamination issue? Yeah I would think that would be cause by the print being too cold. Is your hotend temp consistent throughout a print? I found if i printed too fast on my reprap I could outrun my hotend's heating capability and it would still extruded but get no adhesion. Could also be the previous layers are cooling off too much before you come around for the next layer, something a heated chamber would probably help with.
|
|
#
?
Jan 22, 2014 08:44
|
|
|
Cockmaster posted:The upcoming Pegasus from Full Spectrum Laser (see my post one page back) is going for only $2500, and offers a larger build area (7"x7"x9") than the Form1. I was honestly somewhat unimpressed by my makergear M2. Perhaps I was just expecting too much from it, but I was encountering constant problems involving Z positioning errors, which I felt was kind of inexcusable for a $1500 machine. Basically it would occasionally slip on the Z axis, so instead of going down one layer it would go down 2 or 3, or it would do a retraction and then go back IN 7 layers when it had only retracted 5. Both resulting in failed prints, but the second one also required me to clean the print head from the glob of plastic that would melt into it. It MAY have just been an issue of needing to have extra cooling on the Z axis, or up the voltage- but again, $1500 machine: should not suffer from a base design flaw (voltage set too low or inadequate cooling). The build was VERY solid though, but the feet were too stiff, which often resulted in the whole machine being able to bounce itself around (basically the force of the head stopping on the X/Y would actually cause the whole machine to bounce and jump)- this is problematic because bed leveling was accomplished by 3 screws on springs, and all of the bouncing would inevitably throw the bed out of level. More dampened feet, or a heaver base would correct the issue <I actually screwed it to its table and that corrected the problem>
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 02:19
|
|
|
Chainclaw posted:A well nut on my threaded rod has mostly fixed my banding problems. Anyone know what causes this sort of delamination issue? Are you running a fan on the print while you are printing, if so turn it down. If you are not running a fan on the print, consider enclosing the print- your delamination is taking place pretty far up the print, so its no longer getting any heat from the bed. Is it in EXACTLY the same spot, or just close? It also could be a warping issue with the tongue pulling away, consider adding a bit of support to form a 'lip' holding the base of the tray to be removed after the print.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 02:23
|
|
|
So where am I supposed to buy new nozzles for the original Replicator? Both of the extruders on ours seem clogged (with PLA), and I'm not optimistic about fixing them, but it looks like there aren't any distributors of the bona fide parts. I do see a lot of cheap clones from chinese sellers on eBay, though. Is that my only option?
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 05:58
|
|
|
You could try loosening up the plastic by soaking the nozzles in dichloromethane, then poking out the goo with guitar strings or other fine wire.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 06:19
|
|
|
You can burn it out with a blowtorch. Don't get it too hot, you can deform the nozzle. Direct the flame inside it. But it does tend to work well. I've heard of several people using it successfully. I've also seen some talk about the possibility of using caustic soda (NaOH, sodium hydroxide) which is the active ingredient in most drain cleaners. So you could try soaking it in a solution. Note that NaOH can also react with brass. That said I haven't seen anyone who said yes, this worked for me.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 06:48
|
|
|
Yeah I already took one home and put it to my gas burner. The inside has a layer of ash stuck to it, but at least I can see through the nozzle now. Hopefully I was able to remove enough ash that it won't clog again immediately.Aurium posted:I've also seen some talk about the possibility of using caustic soda (NaOH, sodium hydroxide) which is the active ingredient in most drain cleaners. So you could try soaking it in a solution. Note that NaOH can also react with brass. That said I haven't seen anyone who said yes, this worked for me.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 14:14
|
|
|
ANIME AKBAR posted:Yeah I already took one home and put it to my gas burner. The inside has a layer of ash stuck to it, but at least I can see through the nozzle now. Hopefully I was able to remove enough ash that it won't clog again immediately. Once it's ash, you can poke at it with a thin pin or drillbit to clean the rest out.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 14:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 17, 2024 10:22 |
|
|
Right I've been poking at it with needles for a while and all the bulk ash is gone, but there's still a thin film of it covering the inside which I can't do anything about. I'll just have to give printing a try and hope it works. If it doesn't, am I stuck with the chinese knockoffs then?
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2014 15:55
|
|