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cat doter posted:Yeah, rightly. Yes, yes, you all love Dark Souls. That's why I don't take part in these conversations. You're all insane and I'm never going to change your opinions and you're never going to change mine. I think it's a bad game. I have had zero fun playing it. I'm glad you have. But nothing is ever going to make me think otherwise.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:17
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Tir McDohl posted:I don't think Jeff is that anti-Dark Souls now either. In their more recent conversations he seems to be trying to understand the game better. He knows he does not want to play it, but he doesn't hate it. I think you're putting too much weight on his opinions from a couple of years ago. I think it was made pretty clear in the last two week's podcasts that he hates nearly everything about it.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:19
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TheJoker138 posted:Yes, yes, you all love Dark Souls. That's why I don't take part in these conversations. You're all insane and I'm never going to change your opinions and you're never going to change mine. I think it's a bad game. I have had zero fun playing it. I'm glad you have. But nothing is ever going to make me think otherwise. You must be a hit at parties.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:21
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Jeff "hates" Dark Souls like he hates DOTA or something. In that he doesn't actually hate it, the game just isn't for him and he's joking around.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:25
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TheJoker138 posted:Yes, yes, you all love Dark Souls. That's why I don't take part in these conversations. And yet here we are.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:25
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cat doter posted:You must be a hit at parties. I don't even know what this means. Because I don't like a game that I think isn't fun and controls badly I don't have social skills? Or because I try to ingore internet slap fights about what video games people like, like the one you're trying to start here?
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Jan 23, 2014 16:26
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TheJoker138 posted:I don't even know what this means. Because I don't like a game that I think isn't fun and controls badly I don't have social skills? Or because I try to ingore internet slap fights about what video games people like, like the one you're trying to start here? I just wanna pinch you on the cheek, you're adorable!
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Jan 23, 2014 16:28
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More like the Crown Prince of Whine, am I right guys? Heh.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:31
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cat doter posted:I just wanna pinch you on the cheek, you're adorable! Sorry I don't like your game, I'm glad you do! I'm never going to though, and I don't see why you care so much about this.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:31
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TheJoker138 posted:Sorry I don't like your game, I'm glad you do! I'm never going to though, and I don't see why you care so much about this. I think you may have misread the situation.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:33
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I do not understand how someone can possibly claim Dark Souls controls badly when it has the most intuitive control scheme for a 3rd person RPG I've seen in many a year. Unless they're one of those weirdos trying to play with M+K, which I'm given to understand is nightmarish (you know, like all Japanese PC ports inevitably are).
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Jan 23, 2014 16:33
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Rodyle posted:I do not understand how someone can possibly claim Dark Souls controls badly when it has the most intuitive control scheme for a 3rd person RPG I've seen in many a year. Unless they're one of those weirdos trying to play with M+K, which I'm given to understand is nightmarish (you know, like all Japanese PC ports inevitably are). When I played it was with a 360 controller on PC. It just felt clunky and unresponsive to me. That's not to say I think most RPGs control intuitive and smooth, though. I've tried and tried to like it cause I feel like I'm missing something, but every time I go in it just immediately loses me. Vince MechMahon fucked around with this message at 16:39 on Jan 23, 2014 |
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Jan 23, 2014 16:35
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Rodyle posted:I do not understand how someone can possibly claim Dark Souls controls badly when it has the most intuitive control scheme for a 3rd person RPG I've seen in many a year. Unless they're one of those weirdos trying to play with M+K, which I'm given to understand is nightmarish (you know, like all Japanese PC ports inevitably are). "Most intuitive control scheme for a third person RPG" is like saying "The best kind of toast you can make with a Bic lighter and a pair of tongs."
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Jan 23, 2014 16:38
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Rodyle posted:I do not understand how someone can possibly claim Dark Souls controls badly when it has the most intuitive control scheme for a 3rd person RPG I've seen in many a year. Unless they're one of those weirdos trying to play with M+K, which I'm given to understand is nightmarish (you know, like all Japanese PC ports inevitably are). I think the lock on system can be a little confusing. The game basically switches control schemes every time you lock on, your character and the camera behaves differently and locking on and off is a skill that has be learned which isn't really immediately obvious. But anyway man if someone hates Dark Souls I don't care, it doesn't change how I feel about it. There's plenty of reasons to hate it, I get it.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:39
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TheJoker138 posted:Jeff didn't actively hate Last of Us like he does Dark Souls. He saw the merits in at the very least it's story, even if he didn't enjoy the stealth sections of the gameplay. He rightly thinks that Dark Souls is hot garbage and while I could see him allowing it on the list to placate everyone else, if it took the #1 spot I'd be loving amazed. If 4 of the 6 people love Dark Souls 2 then it will be GOTY. Unfortunately, I can't positively say Dark Souls 2 will be as good as Dark Souls or Demon Souls. The assumed everyone is always invadeable which they are teasing takes away a really cool and core player choice of more risk and more reward or less risk and less reward. PvP players are championing this as they assume the larger pool of invadees will make it less likely to get invaded when it sounds like a steady flow of assholes everytime the cool down timer is up. Captain Internet fucked around with this message at 16:42 on Jan 23, 2014 |
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Jan 23, 2014 16:39
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HOTLANTA
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If a game allows it always assume the steady flow of assholes.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:43
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Captain Internet posted:If 4 of the 6 people love Dark Souls 2 then it will be GOTY. Unfortunately, I can't positively say Dark Souls 2 will be as good as Dark Souls or Demon Souls. The assumed everyone is always invadeable which they are teasing takes away a really cool and core player choice of more risk and more reward or less risk and less reward. PvP players are championing this as they assume the larger pool of invadees will make it less likely to get invaded when it sounds like a steady flow of assholes everytime the cool down timer is up. There's a covenant that summons people to defend you so it'll always be balanced in the favour of the invadee. Also the invasion is time so if you can avoid them long enough they'll get booted. Also their estus flask is a lot less effective.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:45
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Yeah Dark Souls 2 is going to be a griefing paradise thanks to that stupid mechanic. It kills a lot of my interest on it because within a month you know it'll be flooded with cheaters.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:45
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cat doter posted:There's a covenant that summons people to defend you so it'll always be balanced in the favour of the invadee. Also the invasion is time so if you can avoid them long enough they'll get booted. Also their estus flask is a lot less effective. Man, all I can think of is people joining that blue phantom covenant and just spamming "Well what is it" over and over instead of helping the invadee.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:51
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Dark Souls fans engaging in a slap fight when one guy says he doesn't like the game? Really bucking the trend, guys. He's actually explaining himself so the least you can do is not respond with goony one-liners.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:51
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I just wish they did more with the PvP. As is, if you aren't one of the first people playing, you start at a massive disadvantage. Once someone knows all the best rings/gear, they can quickly go get them, then upgrade their gear to the point nobody else in their level range can actually fight back against them. That isn't counting stuff like abusing the world geometry to make sure you can't attack them while they kill you, or outright hacking. You also have other problems like gear that can only be countered by specific things people will likely not have by that point, or won't be specced to use, because they are trying to play the single player game. I did a full human run just to test this, and of the 30 times I was invaded over the course of the game, 2 were legitimate players wanting a fight. I lost against both because I'm not GOOD at PvP, but at least they were around my level/using similar gear. Everyone else was either a hacker, abused the world geometry, or used a specific spec I would have had to be building against just to beat them. That's not fun. It's not fun getting to the next bonfire and having some guy waiting there to kill you, so you can't advance. It's not fun losing everything because a player joined that knew to stand near a specific bridge so he could kick you in as you tried to cross, and you had no other ways across. It's not fun trying to do a spear only run for the challenge, and getting attacked by a person who has the aoe physical knockdown spell from the DLC. That's not even counting the super not fun hackers, since they perma curse/perma reduce stats you. Stuff like Old Monk is awesome. If they had more PvP centric bosses, I'd be entirely down for that, and would stay human to see that. Instead we get a system where you can be invaded while hollow, and if you die to a human, you get basically a curse that stacks. So you know, if you die, then you are at 75% health, if you die again 50% all the way down to 25%. That's the best way for PvP to be implemented I suppose, making sure you stand zero chance against the people who enjoy PvP, because you missed a parry against their super soldier character at level 1, and they keep chasing you down and killing you over and over again for fun, and now you can't do poo poo since you have less health. But hey, that's Dark Souls Amirite?! There is no way Dark Souls 2 will get GOTY with that system in place. If you legitimately think the GB guys won't suddenly stop playing Dark Souls 2 days after it's release, and sheepishly admit it wasn't for them, I don't know what to tell you.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:51
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Fallom posted:Dark Souls fans engaging in a slap fight when one guy says he doesn't like the game? Really bucking the trend, guys. To be fair, that was just me. I also don't really care, I was just being a dick.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:56
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I am a bit worried about being able to be invaded while not human, it seems like a very weird move. But I do trust that FROM has done something to balance it out more. Even making the invasion covenant easy to get into would even things out a ton. Hiding the invasion orb in a somewhat obtuse path in Dark Souls meant that you had to be pretty experienced in the game to invade early. If invading in DS2 is as easy for everyone as laying down a summon sign, that can help things.
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Jan 23, 2014 16:58
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Yeah I thought invading in Dark Souls was a bit too tough honestly. It made a lot more sense in Demon's where you had to be dead to invade and completing the invasion restores your humanity. I imagine they're trying to go somewhere between the two so more people can experience it and take part.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:00
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I don't really know how this will all pan out, but based on network tests there's a lot of little tweaks and balances that make being invaded all the time more balanced. The cooldown or chance to be invaded seems to be pretty long, there's the covenant stuff, little tweaks to how healing works, parrying and backstabs aren't a foregone conclusion anymore, most items (not just weapons) have stat requirements so twinking is less viable, etc. Assuming it'll just be like Dark Souls 1 except you can be invaded all the time is a little misleading I think.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:02
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I was actually pretty surprised when Patrick said playing Dark Souls was one of his best gaming experiences since I vaguely remember that he was pretty down on the game when he first joined Giantbomb. The Dark Souls 2 invasion stuff was troubling to me since I always seemed to get laggy invaders when they invaded my game but apparently they took great steps towards making min/maxing your character harder because elemental weapons no longer remove stat scaling and give flat damage bonuses - certain elements scale on certain stats now. Plus they have a whole bunch of stats and spread things around more so picking the holy trinity of strength, endurance and vitality probably won't do much. Pyromancy is now part of Sorcery so it scales with intelligence instead of flat bonus damage from the flame. So it could be pretty alright!
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Jan 23, 2014 17:06
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As I said Im more worried about cheaters. It's no fun to get repeatedly smashed by someone with infinite hp and maxed stats beyond what the game allows. From are not good with cheat protection so the community could utterly ruin the game for everyone. A blacklist option might help to let you block them after a first invasion. Mokinokaro fucked around with this message at 17:12 on Jan 23, 2014 |
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Jan 23, 2014 17:09
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They're switching to dedicated servers so there may be some server side cheat protection or detection, but I dunno.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:13
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From my experience Japanese companies are pretty lackluster in their attempts to stop people from ruining games on-line so not being able to remove yourself from the PVP sounds like a really bad idea to me even if they fix the online latency and bugs.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:13
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Mokinokaro posted:As I said Im more worried about cheaters. It's no fun to get repeatedly smashed by someone with infinite hp and maxed stats beyond what the game allows. Yeah, this is the thing that will probably make me avoid getting the game on PC. The consoles are still hackable, of course, but it typically takes people longer to figure those out and is usually more of a hassle to do, relative to the PC where people were using infinite health and max stats from the very first week of its release if not the very first day.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:13
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Just looked around a bit, apparently in a famitsu interview some producer said they're offering a solution for players that want to opt out of PvP.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:18
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Wow this Roher guy in patrick's new sales article is a loving idiot!
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Jan 23, 2014 17:38
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I can understand why people don't like Dark Souls. I shouldn't have to leave the game to go to GameFAQs to find out how these stats differ in any meaningful way. Like, Resistance. I die in three hits from the flimsiest enemy at the beginning of the game. So yeah, I bet something like Resistance would do me a pretty big favor! But then it turns out that it's the worst stat in the game, gently caress you. You get one of the best early-game weapons by plinking arrows in a way that doesn't seem to be doing anything against a dragon for five minutes until you inexplicably get the Drake Sword in your inventory. At the beginning of the game, I died like three times because I thought I was blocking incorrectly and tried to practice on skeletons - but no, it turns out that your starting shield just lowers the damage you take. And there is no clear way ingame that this is explained to you. Dark Souls is a good game, but you can't pretend it's flawless. Though the first time I got invaded, I was idling next to a bonfire and looking away from the screen at my phone, only to look back and see a Havel-looking-armored, Big Goddamn Business invader just chilling next to me. I ran out to the little Hollow barracks- this was the Undead Burg - and basically ran around in a circle freaking out because holy poo poo what am i gonna do. He followed me out, did the Praise the Sun gesture and disappeared. Good on you, phantom. Good on you. 
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Jan 23, 2014 17:39
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Dred Cosmonaut posted:Wow this Roher guy in patrick's new sales article is a loving idiot! "Every single person who’s giving it a negative review played it for less than an hour, which means they didn’t even get through the tutorial, the part where the cool stuff is explained," ...If your game has an hour long tutorial, you are doing something wrong and it is not the players fault for quitting out of boredom. This guy sucks.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:43
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Dred Cosmonaut posted:Wow this Roher guy in patrick's new sales article is a loving idiot!
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Jan 23, 2014 17:44
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I think calling Dark Souls flawless kinda misses the point. The reason it's so beloved is that it's unique in the best way possible. It's artistically interesting, extremely deep mechanically and it's the polar opposite of modern AAA games.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:45
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The Kins posted:Didn't he risk his wife getting rabies or something by refusing to pay to get her checked up after she was bitten by something in their weird hermit hut in the forest? I vaguely remember something to that effect, but I might have the specifics wrong. Regardless, his idiocy extends well beyond videogames. He lives in poverty on purpose and that including putting his family in dangerous situations in garbage neighborhoods like with the dog attack. He's actively against making money or...something. Every review I've seen with him makes him seem more than a little unhinged.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:48
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Dred Cosmonaut posted:Wow this Roher guy in patrick's new sales article is a loving idiot! He seems to be kind of a poo poo heel and I think the article should have had an opposing viewpoint. For example, gamasutra just had an article about Steam sales saving Cook, Serve, Delicious that even pointed out that the game's revenue went up even after the sales were over. Not every developer is going to have the same experience, but I think this guy is coming to all the wrong conclusions. Especially since he's extrapolating them from people thinking his game was kind of lovely. Tiny Timbs fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Jan 23, 2014 |
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Jan 23, 2014 17:51
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Yodzilla posted:He's actively against making money or...something.  Honestly, the most shocking part to me is that photo of him. I expected him to look more like, say, Jason Scott, than the bastard spawn of a Web 2.0 startup founder and a nu-metal singer. Not what you'd expect someone who released a DS game in Anno Domini 2012 to look like, at any rate.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:52
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Pretty much every person that whines about sales ruining video games just wants people to enthusiastically buy their game at full price. Greed, man.
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Jan 23, 2014 17:56
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