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Inspector Zenigata has a new favorite as of 23:17 on Apr 2, 2014 |
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Jan 23, 2014 21:15
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I'm loving this Predator stuff. I love that movie and have seen it multiple times, but I never thought too deeply about it.
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Jan 24, 2014 01:01
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Nastyman posted:I'm assuming the bright orange is something similar to today's greenscreens and motion capture suits, where a costume or some sort of CGI would be in the final footage, I'm actually a little curious to see what that version was supposed to look like. IIRC they used an updated version of that costume in the Predators movie a few years back, for that creature they fight before running into Laurence Fishburne's character.
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Jan 24, 2014 06:35
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I don't have anything to add about Predator, unfortunately, but I've still got a movie moment: In Strangers on a Train, early into the film, Bruno follows Miriam through a carnival. Eventually, her and two young men get into a tunnel of love boat, and Bruno gets in the one behind them. For this sequence, it is as if we are watching Bruno watch a movie. As he gets on his boat, there is a medium shot of his face while he looks on ahead at them and eats popcorn. Then we see the entrance to the tunnel, including its giant paddlewheel that may as well be a film reel (although that mixes the metaphor a bit). The shot inside the tunnel just shows everyone's silhouettes, which is like the darkness of a movie theater, or we could stretch it and say that the shadows against the walls of the tunnel are akin to a projector screen. Self-reflexive stuff like this happens all the time in film, especially in Hitchcock's works, and I usually find it rather boring. Most often, that type of self-reference just has no point save for the director getting to seem oh-so-clever. I love this sequence though, because it has actual significance in showing Bruno's worldview: he sees everything from the detached perspective of a moviegoer. Whenever he takes action, it ends up being detached from him in some similar way, such as when we see his murder of Miriam in the reflection of her discarded glasses, acting as another type of "screen". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S04ArwiZwjE The sequence in question, for anyone interested.
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Jan 24, 2014 06:36
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minato posted:I don't think it's surprising that Predator is so good. Predator shares a lot of plot similarities with Aliens. Bunch of bad-asses go on a mission, gets their rear end handed to them by an alien, get betrayed about the mission's purpose by their corporate ride-along (Dillon / Burke), add a sole female survivor to the team, the team and the arena is destroyed by the end, and only the protagonist and the sole survivor make it out. Also, miniguns. Not only that, but they're both Vietnam allegories. Aliens had marines directly modeled after Viet Nam era soldiers, down to the graffiti on their body armor. They rely exclusively on their superior firepower, aircraft and righteousness and get absolutely massacred by a low-tech enemy that utilizes numbers and the terrain in ways they can't counter with their fancy weapons. Predator pretty much takes the same stance, only amps it up with a cast of the biggest, meanest-looking 80's action heroes. It's a giant middle finger to the Reagan-era revisionist Vietnam movies like Rambo II - the jungle takes out the equivelant of six heavily-armed Rambo types with barely a scratch. Until Dutch goes all Colonel Kurtz they never even get a good look at it, let alone get into a position to defeat it*. *Except I guess Billie, but he just tried to do what Dutch did and failed miserably.
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Jan 24, 2014 15:51
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Inspector Zenigata posted:Is that really a theory and not what happened? What other possible interpretation for those things is there? The other interpretation is that the Predator comes to see Arnold as an equal, so simply gunning him down from the trees as if he is prey would be dishonorable. Instead he strips off his armor and weapons and gives Arnold a fair fight because they are both warriors. That doesn't really fit all that well with the Predator setting off the self-destruct though, you'd think he'd be accepting of being beaten by the better man.
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Jan 24, 2014 17:26
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minato posted:I don't think it's surprising that Predator is so good. Predator shares a lot of plot similarities with Aliens. Bunch of bad-asses go on a mission, gets their rear end handed to them by an alien, get betrayed about the mission's purpose by their corporate ride-along (Dillon / Burke), add a sole female survivor to the team, the team and the arena is destroyed by the end, and only the protagonist and the sole survivor make it out. Also, miniguns. Perhaps this is already obvious, and I don't think the parallels are as strong as with Aliens, but I've also heard Predator compared to the legend of Beowulf, at least in the basics of its plot and structure. Both concern an elite group of soldiers in an environment foreign to them, facing off against an inhuman(ly powerful) foe that picks them off one by one. Finally, only the leader (Dutch) is left, and his success only comes when he throws away his accoutrements and fights the beast mano-a-mano: not just in a straight fight, of course, but using his wits, adapting his approach to the threat before him. There are also similarities between the Predator's abilities and how Grendel tends to be depicted. I'd be very surprised if John McTiernan or the screenwriters explicitly had Beowulf in mind as they made the film, but it's interesting to see the echoes of a very old tale in a modern action movie.
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Jan 24, 2014 17:34
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Basebf555 posted:The other interpretation is that the Predator comes to see Arnold as an equal, so simply gunning him down from the trees as if he is prey would be dishonorable. Instead he strips off his armor and weapons and gives Arnold a fair fight because they are both warriors. That doesn't really fit all that well with the Predator setting off the self-destruct though, you'd think he'd be accepting of being beaten by the better man. It's just high-tech seppuku. Also it means that no Predator technology can fall into another species' hands.
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Jan 24, 2014 17:42
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Buzkashi posted:It's just high-tech seppuku. Also it means that no Predator technology can fall into another species' hands. If what I remember from the comics, Predator tech is all stolen from an even older and much smarter civilization. Predators are really not that clever.
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Jan 24, 2014 18:29
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Inzombiac posted:If what I remember from the comics, Predator tech is all stolen from an even older and much smarter civilization. Predators are really not that clever. Do you know where that came from? I've read an embarrassing number of Aliens/Predator comics and not seen that.
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Jan 24, 2014 18:39
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Wild T posted:Not only that, but they're both Vietnam allegories. Aliens had marines directly modeled after Viet Nam era soldiers, down to the graffiti on their body armor. They rely exclusively on their superior firepower, aircraft and righteousness and get absolutely massacred by a low-tech enemy that utilizes numbers and the terrain in ways they can't counter with their fancy weapons.  James Cameron wrote Rambo: First Blood, Part 2 and Aliens (which he also directed). The similarities between Rambo shooting up the control center and Ripley destroying the egg chamber are hard to ignore.
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Jan 24, 2014 19:04
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Wild T posted:*Except I guess Billie, but he just tried to do what Dutch did and failed miserably. In all fairness, facing it on a very narrow bridge over a long drop was a decent idea, since it eliminated the Predator's ability to move around and meant that Billy could always just grapple and pull it down with him as a last ditch effort. Of course, the Predator probably just shot Billy without even breaking it's stride because he doesn't get jokes.
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Jan 25, 2014 00:43
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Was it only in Predator 2 that the whole 'don't kill pregnant prey' was seen? I always wondered if a parent protecting a child, or several children, would rank as a threat worthy of being killed, or swatted aside and ignored because it was being protective rather than offensive? And it's a little old, but in the first Shrek, when Farquaad is looking over the princesses in the Magic Mirror, Fiona's theme is the Pina Colada song, which is not a romantic song by any means; it's about a couple who's fallen out of love with each other but surprise, they meet each other when they're setting up the affair. So it's more of a song about settling and not knowing your partner for poo poo. Which is pretty much the entirety of the relationship between Fiona and Farquaad. Thankfully they don't settle like the idiots in the song.
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Jan 25, 2014 00:59
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Professor Shark posted:In all fairness, facing it on a very narrow bridge over a long drop was a decent idea, since it eliminated the Predator's ability to move around and meant that Billy could always just grapple and pull it down with him as a last ditch effort. Probably didn't help he decided to cut his own chest open first.
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Jan 25, 2014 01:42
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If anything it just made a convenient "X" to target.
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Jan 25, 2014 01:58
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Sorry to derail Predator chat, but I recently re-watched Pulp Fiction and wanted to share something. I'm not going to spoiler it because that movie is 20 years old, and you're all goons so you've seen it. Towards the end of the movie, Jules and Vince are attempting to deal with Marvin's body (in the trunk, minus the head, in the garage) at Jimmy's place. Jules is loving steamed at Vince, and this comes out on the phone when he's talking to his boss. Jules says "I don't wanna hear about no motherfuckin' ifs. All I wanna hear from your rear end is, You ain't got no problem, Jules. I'm on the motherfucker. Go back in there, chill them niggers out and wait for the cavalry which should be coming directly." Marcellus Wallace then pauses for just a second. You can almost hear his thoughts at this point in time. "Motherfucker doesn't talk to me like that, ever, I'm the boss here. poo poo must be loving serious if he's going to take that tone with me. Also, there's no way I can lose that briefcase, or worse, let the police get their hands on it. Better send the best guy I've got." Then he send The Wolf and Jules' tone changes instantly. He knows he's going to be taken care of and that everything's going to turn out ok. And then it does, unless of course your name is Marvin and a dude named Vince forgets the second rule of gun handling.
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Jan 25, 2014 02:42
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Cowslips Warren posted:Was it only in Predator 2 that the whole 'don't kill pregnant prey' was seen? I always wondered if a parent protecting a child, or several children, would rank as a threat worthy of being killed, or swatted aside and ignored because it was being protective rather than offensive? Well, there weren't any pregnant women in the first one. All we get from the first two is that a Predator won't kill anyone they consider "innocent"/non-combatants. So the girl in the first one, and then the innocent fetus in the second. I imagine a person protecting a group of children would get killed, but the children ignored.
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Jan 25, 2014 02:46
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Memento posted:The Wolf It's not a very good show, but Sons of Anarchy had an episode where Stephen King basically reprises that role. His take is a lot creepier but funny as heck.
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Jan 25, 2014 03:13
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Buzkashi posted:It's just high-tech seppuku. Also it means that no Predator technology can fall into another species' hands. Except its laughing like a huge dickbag when it sets off the bomb, so I don't think it was a point of honorable defeat. Content: The Wolf of Wall Street is explicitly a story told by its main character, Jordan Belfort, who narrates several scenes and directly addresses the audience at several points. At several points in the movie, Jordan hastily glosses over events in his life that portray him and his lifestyle as less than amazing, such as a co-worker killing themselves; directly contradicts reality at some points, such as by saying he drove home in one piece while high out of his mind on 'ludes (when its shown shortly thereafter that he utterly destroyed his Ferrari in the process;) and at scenes where Jordan is exposed for what he is in a way he can't deny, the narration cuts out entirely, and at at one point the movie directly cuts from his wife forcibly turning him down for sex to Jordan loving her while she's laying motionless and with a blank expression, as if Jordan edited out the part of the film showing that he forced himself on her.
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Jan 25, 2014 03:26
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Chard posted:It's not a very good show, but Sons of Anarchy had an episode where Stephen King basically reprises that role. His take is a lot creepier but funny as heck. Bachman remains the best character in that show.
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Jan 25, 2014 03:39
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mr. stefan posted:Except its laughing like a huge dickbag when it sets off the bomb, so I don't think it was a point of honorable defeat. It's pretty much the same in Predator 2 ("poo poo happens") so this may not count for much, but I assume that while the Predators may presumably obey some kind of "warrior code", it doesn't necessarily define them individually. Anyone could be bound by the rules of their society and still be a douche about it V  Ve: Maybe that was why the Elder gave Harrigan the flintlock. "Yo for real man, thanks for shutting that guy up. Dude was such a smug loving rear end in a top hat." DrBouvenstein posted:Well, there weren't any pregnant women in the first one. All we get from the first two is that a Predator won't kill anyone they consider "innocent"/non-combatants. In AvP, one of the Predators throws Weyland aside because it senses that he's dying, but kills him when he decides to attack it anyway. I think basically they see it as unsporting to kill anyone who is sick or unable to defend themselves (unborn life included, and unarmed/defenseless prey who isn't considered a threat i.e. they'll still kill anyone acting as a guard or scout) but you still only get the one chance. Nastyman has a new favorite as of 16:39 on Jan 25, 2014 |
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Jan 25, 2014 03:43
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When I was in kindergarten me and some of my buddies met Kevin Peter Hall at the local mall while I guess he was on vacation. The guy was HUGE. We got a polaroid with him flexing with a couple of us dangling from his arms. It made me real sad when I looked at his wikipedia page to see that this probably happened a short time before he died.
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Jan 25, 2014 05:32
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Predator is an extremely underrated action movie.
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Jan 25, 2014 07:31
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Smiling Jack posted:Predator is an extremely underrated action movie. I really wish there was a documentary about the filming of Predator. Everything I've read about it makes it sound both hilarious and hellish. Android Bicyclist posted:If you want to get even more Cameron also inspired the look of the Predator's face. Stan Winston was on a flight with him and told him about the creature he was trying to design when Cameron told him he'd always wanted to have a monster with crablike mandibles.
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Jan 25, 2014 08:25
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Bear Enthusiast posted:Bachman remains the best character in that show. I think you're forgetting a certain lady. A certain miss Venus Van Dam :bigtran: Walton Goggins with the most amazing pair of bolt-on tits ever
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Jan 25, 2014 12:12
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Mu Zeta posted:We should all thank Ridley Scott for changing the Hannibal ending too. Starling and Lecter became lovers and ran off together. I can understand the reasons for changing it, but I think the book's ending is more interesting. Even in the the Silence Of The Lambs movie Clarice is always pretty lovestruck around Lecter, and the series is supposed to be about general human psychological hosed-upness. It's not just the serial killers who are nuts, it's the good guys as well. The TV series is a shitpile, though.
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Jan 25, 2014 12:25
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Roger Tangerines posted:The TV series is a shitpile, though. Thank you- I watched like 3 episodes and couldn't stand the show, but people keep telling me how good it is.
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Jan 25, 2014 12:44
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Roger Tangerines posted:I can understand the reasons for changing it, but I think the book's ending is more interesting. Even in the the Silence Of The Lambs movie Clarice is always pretty lovestruck around Lecter, and the series is supposed to be about general human psychological hosed-upness. It's not just the serial killers who are nuts, it's the good guys as well.
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Jan 25, 2014 12:46
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Roger Tangerines posted:I can understand the reasons for changing it, but I think the book's ending is more interesting. Even in the the Silence Of The Lambs movie Clarice is always pretty lovestruck around Lecter, and the series is supposed to be about general human psychological hosed-upness. It's not just the serial killers who are nuts, it's the good guys as well. Professor Shark posted:Thank you- I watched like 3 episodes and couldn't stand the show, but people keep telling me how good it is. I will fight both of you. At the same time if need be. 95% of television today I simply cannot stand. What I can stand is usually insipid fluff like Doctor Who that doesn't ask you to think to hard, but has a legacy behind it. Hannibal is the only show I can think of where every single person from the creator to the actors to the set dressers to hell, the guys in charge of lighting, every single person comes in and gives this 110%, and tries to make this show special and worth it. I can't think of another show where even half of any of the people working on the show give that much effort and quality.
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Jan 25, 2014 13:36
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Inspector Zenigata has a new favorite as of 23:17 on Apr 2, 2014 |
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Jan 25, 2014 13:43
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Choco1980 posted:I will fight both of you. At the same time if need be. 95% of television today I simply cannot stand. What I can stand is usually insipid fluff like Doctor Who that doesn't ask you to think to hard, but has a legacy behind it. Hannibal is the only show I can think of where every single person from the creator to the actors to the set dressers to hell, the guys in charge of lighting, every single person comes in and gives this 110%, and tries to make this show special and worth it. I can't think of another show where even half of any of the people working on the show give that much effort and quality. Everyone except the writers. Admittedly, I never had any issues with the actors, they were all doing what they could. Mads Mikkelsen is great.
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Jan 25, 2014 13:50
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Professor Shark posted:Everyone except the writers. Bare Knuckles it is. The writing is fantastic on this show, with so many little details and turns of phrase, and foreshadowing not detectable until a second viewing. For example, there's a throwaway line in the very first episode related to the over-arching plot of the shrike killer that doesn't pay off until the very end of the second-to-last episode. Before they find the dead girl in her room, the dad weakly opines "She likes trains, maybe she was taken on a train..." And when we see Abigail Hobbs' flashback to being used as bait by her father to find victims, they find her on a train, so in a way, he was right.
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Jan 25, 2014 14:19
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widunder posted:The show is the greatest thing done with the IP since the Silence of the lambs (and arguably since Manhunter) and is ripe with subtle moments if you like that sort of thing (which you should). Wow, such high praise in saying it's better than Red Dragon (which was poo poo) and Hannibal (a turd even Sir Ridley couldn't polish). E: also you're saying Manhunter is better than Silence of the Lambs?
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Jan 25, 2014 15:59
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Nastyman posted:It's pretty much the same in Predator 2 ("poo poo happens") so this may not count for much, but I assume that while the Predators may presumably obey some kind of "warrior code", it doesn't necessarily define them individually. Anyone could be bound by the rules of their society and still be a douche about it V I agree with this interpretation. Considering that the Predator in Predator 2 got clowned on by Danny Glover, he probably wasn't the best and brightest.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:38
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widunder posted:The show is the greatest thing done with the IP since the Silence of the lambs (and arguably since Manhunter) and is ripe with subtle moments if you like that sort of thing (which you should). It's never *that* subtle. It's full of wink-nudge lines and callbacks, but that's just referencing, it's not particularly clever. It's a really well-produced show with great art direction and casting, but the writing isn't clever enough for the source material.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:40
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I know a lot of people can't stand The Village, but there are a few little things that you see in the beginning that hint at everything being off, like posters in the classroom, lined paper, and the style of glasses frames that wouldn't have existed yet in the time period it's supposed to be set in.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:53
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Jedit posted:E: also you're saying Manhunter is better than Silence of the Lambs? Although speaking of Silence of the lambs: 
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Jan 25, 2014 18:03
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Manhunter and the Hannibal show are the only things related to that series even worth a drat. And they're both fantastic. People talking poorly about the writing probably have some dumb mental block where they see the surrealism and implausibility of a lot of the plots and freak out because "not real" and overlook the actual nuance of how each plot connects together within an episode thematically and the dozens of subtle character interactions. EvilTobaccoExec has a new favorite as of 19:17 on Jan 25, 2014 |
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Jan 25, 2014 19:12
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Coconut Indian posted:I know a lot of people can't stand The Village, but there are a few little things that you see in the beginning that hint at everything being off, like posters in the classroom, lined paper, and the style of glasses frames that wouldn't have existed yet in the time period it's supposed to be set in. The Village's big "twist" was pretty obvious and a lot of people hated it for that without examining the rest of the film. Personally I think it's one of Shyamalan's best works, although with each passing year that seems to mean less and less. Seriously that whole movie had a bunch of subtle moments revolving around how and why the Village must have come into being and why their society has all those strange rules.
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Jan 25, 2014 20:05
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Bear Enthusiast posted:Bachman remains the best character in that show. They named his character after his pen name? That's amazing.
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Jan 25, 2014 23:00
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