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QuarkJets posted:So I encountered this graphic recently: Is the beam the bit hanging out from the large hole in the upper half of the picture? Because if so, you could point out that, for a dart, it tore a pretty drat big chunk out of the wall above it, a good 3-4 floors worth for something that was shot straight. Or, more realistically, it fell from a higher angle, and then the weight caused it to collapse the wall beneath it so it tilted down after the fact.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 06:04 |
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# ? May 21, 2024 17:05 |
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Not sure what the conspiracy is supposed to be, but it looks like a lot of other poo poo hit that building also.
withak fucked around with this message at 06:49 on Jan 27, 2014 |
# ? Jan 27, 2014 06:08 |
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It's just a newer, more complex version of truthers talking out of their rear end because they don't understand what happens when a building collapses.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 06:37 |
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So why again is the "government found guilty of killing MLK" thing stupid.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 06:54 |
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Amused to Death posted:So why again is the "government found guilty of killing MLK" thing stupid. It was a civil lawsuit (IIRC) which basically means dick-all.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 06:57 |
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The lawsuit was more about recouping damages from a restaurateur trying to sell a bullshit account of a conspiracy for fame and money.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 08:22 |
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c6HsiixFS8 I did it. I found the craziest person. duck monster fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Jan 27, 2014 |
# ? Jan 27, 2014 12:37 |
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Butts McGee posted:The Supertramp thing isn't new per se. Political cartoonist and diagnosed Schizophrenic David Dees did a infographic on it... a while ago. It's hard to say when, thanks to his site's abysmal layout. Nothing's dated on it, so who knows. I thought they were going to say that the orange juice was a reference to The Godfather since Coppola used oranges in several of the death scenes.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 15:10 |
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duck monster posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c6HsiixFS8&t=32s I... but... wait... There is so much concentrated crazy-stupid in that video I don't even know how to respond to it.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 16:40 |
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That lady's not crazy, just really dumb.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 16:42 |
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duck monster posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c6HsiixFS8&t=32s I've always loved this video. There's a humble sort of magic to this.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 19:16 |
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Sorry did I say rainbow sprinkler lady was the craziest person? I mean this person is! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsdeAF_Prfo But no, not the craziest. http://www.youtube.com/results?search=Search&resnum=0&oi=spell&search_query=vinegar+chemtrails&spell=1&sa=X Theres a whole loving movement of raging loving lunatics that stand around squirting vinegar bottles in the air to fight chemtrails.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 19:37 |
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duck monster posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c6HsiixFS8 I love it. This will be the mental place I escape to when my friends start talking about poo poo. Aerosol rainbows.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 19:40 |
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This is actually really interesting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVeA07d2F_I Its Ken Hovind, who is one of the architects of the Creationist movement. Now in Jail for tax fraud or something like that. But this guy's theology has had a massive effect on american religion as one of the original big name creationists, and a LOT of the arguments you hear from young earth creationists come from this guy. Anyway, he also believes other stuff too! This video has it all, chem trails, vaccines causes autism, mass depopulation conspiracies , GM is a depopulation scheme, freemasons, etc etc etc. I wonder how much of the spread of these ideas comes from these guys pushing these theories in the 80s and 90s.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 20:02 |
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Will this nix the debate with Bill Nye?
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 20:54 |
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duck monster posted:
Along wish porn, the simpsons and anime, Conspiracy Theories were among the first big things on the internet. It's not too hard to imagine that the wingnut class saw "There's this thing that exists were I can say whatever I want AND everyone in the world could possibly see it? Finally, the evidence I collected that Bill Clinton has Angel wings for lunch will be seen!!!!"
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 20:58 |
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HootTheOwl posted:Will this nix the debate with Bill Nye? Different Kens. Bill Nye is debating Ken Hamm, an equally stupid Creationist who was the most public face behind getting the Creationism museum built.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 21:04 |
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twistedmentat posted:Along wish porn, the simpsons and anime, Conspiracy Theories were among the first big things on the internet. It's not too hard to imagine that the wingnut class saw "There's this thing that exists were I can say whatever I want AND everyone in the world could possibly see it? Finally, the evidence I collected that Bill Clinton has Angel wings for lunch will be seen!!!!" Yeah, conspiracy theories are a big part of why I don't have as optimistic a view of the internets influence on society as most. This bloody websites motto somewhat aptly sums up my view of the net, actually. And I say that as a person who's devoted a major chunk of my adult life to the loving thing. The Net has fed me, clothed me, entertained me, kept me in contact with disparate social circles and let me shoot people from reddit in imaginary spaceships. But I still am not entirely convinced its going to be a net positive for humanity if certain political trends continue. I'm not sure it wont be a net positive either. I just don't know, but I find the continuing spread conspiracy theory deeply unnerving. It may well be the worlds fastest growing religion, to be a bit hyperbolic.
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# ? Jan 27, 2014 23:37 |
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http://theconversation.com/climate-and-vaccine-deniers-are-the-same-beyond-persuasion-22258quote:Climate and vaccine deniers are the same: beyond persuasion I'm not actually convinced conspiracy theorists are beyond sanity. I've personally spent a couple of years talking with a large number of friends in the activist world who had all sorts of conspiracy theories and brought them back around to more sociological/anthropological view points about human society actually works. I haven't had much luck with the anti-vax crowd admittedly, but a friend of mine works as a vaccination educator for the health department and she's a loving pro at it. It *can* be done, but it has to be done patiently and you need to provide a more plausible world-view for them to replace the underlying world-view that breeds it. But I don't know if that can be done at a mass scale, instead of the one-one one sort of interactions people can use to re-educate conspiracy theorist friends. With that said, Health promotion sciences do have a great idea called 'peer education' where advocacy groups actually target people best positioned to educate peers. So for instance in the gay community this works by targetting influential gay figures in communities with information about HIV/safe sex/etc and then they operate within the community to pass the information and behaviors on. Its quite a successful strategy. IMHO this could be adapted in combatting conspiracy theories.
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# ? Jan 28, 2014 00:07 |
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The problem is that most of the people who come to conspiracy theories use actual logic to get themselves there. But it's more like "well you can't PROVE this DOESN'T happen" kind of logic, which is impossible to refute in the way that they need you to. "I think the Jews made 9/11 happen!" "No they didn't." "Well, can you PROVE that they didn't?" "No, I can't prove it, because the reasons you think they did are--" "Well, there you are then! You can't prove I'm wrong!" My father-in-law is exactly this sort of person. He figures that if you can't immediately slap down a fully-detailed study with extensive sources showing that what he said was wrong, then he's right--and even if you did somehow have such a study, then clearly they're funded by Monsanto or Al Gore or the Israelis or whoever and so the study's fake. Like I said earlier, these people have heard of logical skepticism, and they know it's something that smart people do, and Dunning-Krueger lets them believe that they're smart, so they think in ways they believe are logically skeptical and that's how you end up with apparently-sane people believing crazy conspiracy poo poo.
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# ? Jan 28, 2014 06:14 |
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Yeah there's the old Seth Finkelstein essay on the way the axiomatic thought process with erroneous initial assumptions leads people to conclude the stupidest poo poo imaginable.
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# ? Jan 28, 2014 13:34 |
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Miss-Bomarc posted:The problem is that most of the people who come to conspiracy theories use actual logic to get themselves there. But it's more like "well you can't PROVE this DOESN'T happen" kind of logic, which is impossible to refute in the way that they need you to. Come on. This is the easiest thing to use yourself against him. I am sure he has a favourite team. Tell them that they only win because they bribe officials. He must own a couple of cheap guns. Tell him that they are only cheap because the company makes money by selling guns to African warlords. Before long he will get frustrated.
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# ? Jan 28, 2014 15:56 |
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Miss-Bomarc posted:"I think the Jews made 9/11 happen!" Fixed that for you.
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# ? Jan 28, 2014 16:16 |
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Miss-Bomarc posted:
Show him this website, and hopefully enlighten him unto the logical fallacy known as Burden of Proof. https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/
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# ? Jan 28, 2014 18:09 |
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You can't reason someone out of a position that they didn't reason themselves into.
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# ? Jan 28, 2014 19:06 |
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withak posted:You can't reason someone out of a position that they didn't reason themselves into. This is a popular cliche around here, but I don't really believe that. People can be reasoned out of beliefs they hold for irrational reasons, just not always and almost never in one conversation.
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# ? Jan 28, 2014 21:19 |
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Silver2195 posted:This is a popular cliche around here, but I don't really believe that. People can be reasoned out of beliefs they hold for irrational reasons, just not always and almost never in one conversation. When you DesperateDan fucked around with this message at 00:04 on Jan 29, 2014 |
# ? Jan 29, 2014 00:02 |
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DesperateDan posted:When you Don't troll them. If you do, chances of them seeing reason becomes null. Silver2195 is right.
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# ? Jan 29, 2014 00:48 |
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twistedmentat posted:Along wish porn, the simpsons and anime, Conspiracy Theories were among the first big things on the internet. It's not too hard to imagine that the wingnut class saw "There's this thing that exists were I can say whatever I want AND everyone in the world could possibly see it? Finally, the evidence I collected that Bill Clinton has Angel wings for lunch will be seen!!!!" I remember sites like Shoutwire (I forget what torrent site it was always part of) and Digg were just full of that poo poo. Loose Change is a masterpiece of cinema compared to the utter insanity that filled these sites.
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# ? Jan 29, 2014 01:01 |
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Evil Fluffy posted:I remember sites like Shoutwire (I forget what torrent site it was always part of) and Digg were just full of that poo poo. Loose Change is a masterpiece of cinema compared to the utter insanity that filled these sites. Youtube is where they all live now. I love looking at the LIZARDMAN PROOF videos. Or ones that prove demons are real with a slideshow of bible quotes, images taken from RPGs and fantasy stuff, pictures of people with tattoos and piercings. yep, that dude with the horns and puzzle pieces tattoo all over his body is sure proof of demons. There's also a good Illuminati proof series that looks at pictures of famous and powerful people and looks for triangles by them. The more I think about that interview with the ancient languages expert I listened to a few weeks ago, the more I realize that the whole "the ancients didn't have a way to describe aliens and spaceships" argument doesn't hold up. I'm 100% sure the words silver, disk and flying exist in the majority of languages spoken by people who wrote down stories and myths. My raw milk friend got into a fight on FB with people who i guess he's befriended through raw milking about vaccines. He posted something about how they work, and some raw milkers, who are also anti-vax took issue with him, and started calling him a plant and asking how he can support good science like raw milk, but bad science like vaccines. He then made some crack about them being truthers too and whoo boy, that exploded. It was pretty funny to watch. I don't think my friend honestly realized how deep the rabbit hole goes, he is just a health nut (to his credit, he was 45 and weighting nearly 350lbs and then went crazy healthy and lost nearly 150lbs, which at that age is amazing).
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# ? Jan 29, 2014 01:31 |
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duck monster posted:Yeah, conspiracy theories are a big part of why I don't have as optimistic a view of the internets influence on society as most. This bloody websites motto somewhat aptly sums up my view of the net, actually. Would you argue that the printing press and radio made people more ignorant and superstitious? Or are the eras in which these technologies arose, and the format of the medium itself, too different to use for comparison with the Internet? America Inc. fucked around with this message at 13:44 on Jan 29, 2014 |
# ? Jan 29, 2014 13:41 |
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Direct mail probably had more of an impact on propagating conspiracy theories. It's basically how Ron Paul made a living for decades.
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# ? Jan 29, 2014 14:53 |
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comes along bort posted:Direct mail probably had more of an impact on propagating conspiracy theories. It's basically how Ron Paul made a living for decades. More than the internet? I highly doubt that.
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# ? Jan 30, 2014 03:10 |
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Direct mail was pretty popular among the right wing nutbars in the 80s and 90s before the internet was available, but I really doubt direct mail did anything but keep the flame alive. No matter how many "Whites are superior and gold is good" pamphlets Ron Paul put his name on (but had nothing to do with) he mailed out to people in cabins it would never have the impact as one lovely geocities webpage.
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# ? Jan 30, 2014 03:32 |
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I think a key factor in the Internet is that someone with the beginnings of a belief in conspiracy theories can easily find large communities dedicated to espousing those theories. At some point a conspiracy theorist is a member of the community, and someone debunking conspiracy theories is attacking the conspiracy community itself.
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# ? Jan 30, 2014 04:01 |
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AATREK CURES KIDS posted:I think a key factor in the Internet is that someone with the beginnings of a belief in conspiracy theories can easily find large communities dedicated to espousing those theories. At some point a conspiracy theorist is a member of the community, and someone debunking conspiracy theories is attacking the conspiracy community itself. This, and it's especially dangerous for teenagers. I discovered the whole "conspiracy underground" when I was in highschool and it sucked me in for years. Was a moderator on ATS and lost a whole lot of friends because I definitely devolved to lunatic levels around the age of 18. Finally woke up and kicked the habit, and now I'm just overly concerned about the Internet and its effect on unstable individuals. I mean, not just with conspiracies, there's a reinforcing community out there for literally anything you can think of. Believe you spontaneously generate wires under your skin? There's a forum out there full of other people willing to support your belief that the government is out to kill you, and it's only a click away.
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# ? Jan 30, 2014 05:42 |
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Evil Fluffy posted:I remember sites like Shoutwire (I forget what torrent site it was always part of) and Digg were just full of that poo poo. Loose Change is a masterpiece of cinema compared to the utter insanity that filled these sites. Ironically digg was the victim of a right wing conspiracy: http://www.alternet.org/story/147765/a_vast_right-wing_digg_conspiracy_expose_shows_journolist_scandal_to_be_a_lot_of_conservative_hot_air
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# ? Jan 30, 2014 07:31 |
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twistedmentat posted:Youtube is where they all live now. I love looking at the LIZARDMAN PROOF videos. Or ones that prove demons are real with a slideshow of bible quotes, images taken from RPGs and fantasy stuff, pictures of people with tattoos and piercings. Please post some of these!
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# ? Jan 30, 2014 08:13 |
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pd187 posted:Please post some of these! Here's a couple I found quickly on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mI7ZR_4nJxs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8meA6WMsXrg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh5XolWxLn4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiTezfoev9c http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnZ7vSDQaOQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEz--2U5XK0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3IR4nw6p9U http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50ZedImnF0c http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVoRFHqMDMQ Sorry, I didn't do them in any order. But with the Lizard people videos, there is a bunch of unifying features; they all feature a tv screen being recorded, not raw footage. Its clear to anyone who has used modern digital cable that all the so called shape shifting is just the kind of static you get because most cable providers are lovely and their signals get messed up. And for the lizard eyes, there's actually something that is known by anyone who does studio lighting. Blame it on Outerspace called this kind of stuff Fat Guy Journalism because the producers are almost always fat guys. Also, if you're making loving youtube videos that are nothing more than strung together clips, GIS images and bible quotes, you're not a Director nor a Producer. I don't think any are the "lizard SS agent" because its so loving stupid.
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# ? Jan 30, 2014 10:28 |
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# ? May 21, 2024 17:05 |
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Fake snow!
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# ? Jan 30, 2014 18:59 |