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Bad Munki posted:How annoyed off would a contractor be if an owner he was building a house for showed up at the build site from time to time to have a look around? I'm not an inspector but I'd sure feel a lot better if I could actually watch the house go up in person. Maybe with a case of beer for the crew? I was an assistant pm for a GC years ago, and owners were always very involved and present on our jobs. As long as they followed job site safety (hardhats, etc) nobody cared. It can actually be very helpful at times. Little issues would pop up like placement of bath accessories not called out on the drawings, etc. Nice to be able to get owner input.
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Jan 29, 2014 16:38
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Okay, that's good to know. I don't even know if house-building will be a thing that soon, it all depends on where we go next and what's available, but it's a good possibility and an exciting prospect.
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Jan 29, 2014 16:39
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Bad Munki posted:How annoyed off would a contractor be if an owner he was building a house for showed up at the build site from time to time to have a look around? I'm not an inspector but I'd sure feel a lot better if I could actually watch the house go up in person. Maybe with a case of beer for the crew? My grandfather was a general contractor all his life, and he was known to drop in on his builders as well as contractors hired by family members on their properties. He was not well liked by the contractors, but shortcuts were not taken. I hope to have a home built one day, and I fully intend to be there a fair bit through the framing, insulation, plumbing and wiring. You're paying them, it's your right to supervise.
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Jan 29, 2014 16:40
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Bad Munki posted:How annoyed off would a contractor be if an owner he was building a house for showed up at the build site from time to time to have a look around? Maybe with a case of beer for the crew? I don't know what kind of crazy contractor you'd have to be to not expect the owner to be checking up and asking questions. Also, instead of a case of beer make it a large meatlover's pizza and some sodas around lunch time. Next week make it some subs, and if they are there for a third get some burgers. If you do that once a week they will love you! Also don't be afraid to ask questions, I'm sure they will have a few for you as long as you're not a sperglord or super annoying. If they like you, their work will show and they will ask you for input when it comes to aesthetic options or just preferences (you want this closet a little bigger, or further away from the door?). Many contractors (at least good ones) will be able to pick out issues with floor plans when they are building things, and if they like you they're more willing to stop and ask or phone you to get your opinion ("hey, this wall could be moved another foot to the side in case you wanted to put a king-size in there, you'll never notice it missing from the living room") etc. Blistex fucked around with this message at 16:49 on Jan 29, 2014 |
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Jan 29, 2014 16:45
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I think it's more just that I don't really know where the line is between "checking in on things" and "god drat this guy is loving here all day every day."
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Jan 29, 2014 16:47
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Bad Munki posted:How annoyed off would a contractor be if an owner he was building a house for showed up at the build site from time to time to have a look around? I'm not an inspector but I'd sure feel a lot better if I could actually watch the house go up in person. Maybe with a case of beer for the crew? My dad (a ME, but not in the construction industry) did this frequently on the only new construction home they bought, which would have been around 1994. They reportedly hated him for it, but the worst issues I remember in that house were nail pops. So yeah, an owner who can read blueprints 
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Jan 29, 2014 16:50
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Bad Munki posted:I think it's more just that I don't really know where the line is between "checking in on things" and "god drat this guy is loving here all day every day." Once a week is no big deal, 2-3 times a week max and if you are there that much make sure they know you are coming so that it feels like a visit and not surprise inspection. Also don't loiter. Get in have the GC walk you around, then take 10-15 minutes of time where you just poke around and then leave. At the end of the day they are all your employees, but don't abuse the role of being their "boss".
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Jan 29, 2014 16:52
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Bad Munki posted:I think it's more just that I don't really know where the line is between "checking in on things" and "god drat this guy is loving here all day every day." Just think of you doing something in your line of work for a client that is worth tens of thousands of dollars. What would you consider to be acceptable, and do the same with the crew. If you are satisfied that they are doing a good job then you can leave them alone for the most part. Also, like I said, if they like you they'll stop things and check with you if a problem arises or a decision needs to be made.
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Jan 29, 2014 16:56
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Bad Munki posted:I think it's more just that I don't really know where the line is between "checking in on things" and "god drat this guy is loving here all day every day." Stopping in every day isn't a big deal, but don't make it a pain in the rear end; show up either in the morning before they get started, later in the day before everyone takes off for home, or around lunchtime. Personally, I prefer a homeowner that's involved, and like to see them in the morning. Ask questions, try not to stick your nose in too far unless you think things are gettting hosed up/will leave you unhappy with the house. Also, like Blistex said, buying the guys lunch once a week can't hurt. The bottom line: It's your house. You've got to live in it. It doesn't matter if the contractors loving despise you, if that's what it takes to ensure you're happy with the end result.
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Jan 29, 2014 17:00
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Blistex posted:If you really want to keep a contractor honest, have the building inspector show up (if he is willing) on the day before your home is getting sheeted, so he can see all the studs and such. Hell, offer to pay another contractor a few hundred to do an inspection once of twice. If your contractor knows that you are keeping tabs on him/her, they will keep in line. Is that not standard most places? Our house (in a big development) had to have framing approval prior to insulation (minus attic), and then insulation inspection prior to drywall...not to mention the electrical/plumbing/etc. Even though we built with a developer either my wife or I went to the site 3 or 4 times a week, sometimes when there were no workers. Had no issue pulling out the plans, making sure everything was where it belonged and asked questions of the site supervisor if there were issues or questions. I also really felt good about our local inspectors because all of the contractors hate building in our area because of them  .
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Jan 29, 2014 17:35
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ntd posted:Is that not standard most places? Our house (in a big development) had to have framing approval prior to insulation (minus attic), and then insulation inspection prior to drywall...not to mention the electrical/plumbing/etc. Depending on county/municipality you could have a building inspector telling the contractor to pull every nail out, or one who shows up a week before the first block is laid and "OK's" the entire build.
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Jan 29, 2014 19:23
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Bad Munki posted:How annoyed off would a contractor be if an owner he was building a house for showed up at the build site from time to time to have a look around? I'm not an inspector but I'd sure feel a lot better if I could actually watch the house go up in person. Maybe with a case of beer for the crew? As someone who's worked as a builder's labourer on house builds, I can say that it would be considered strange (at least in the UK) if the owner wasn't there to have a look around once a week at least. It's expected; you're the one who's paying for the work. Just be genuinely interested, ask intelligent questions (and listen to the answers!) and generally be curious without making a nuisance of yourself. Don't be afraid to ask technical questions; people love to share their expertise and it'll also give you a good feel for how trustworthy the crew is. Do not bring them booze. Save that for the last day. You're already paying them, after all. Bring them pizza etc for milestones if you want, but it's not expected (think: foundation in, walls going up, roof being topped out).
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Jan 29, 2014 19:30
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Indolent Bastard posted:Once a week is no big deal, 2-3 times a week max and if you are there that much make sure they know you are coming so that it feels like a visit and not surprise inspection. Also don't loiter. Get in have the GC walk you around, then take 10-15 minutes of time where you just poke around and then leave. At the end of the day they are all your employees, but don't abuse the role of being their "boss". gently caress this. If I'm spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on construction, you better loving believe I'm going to be there every day, and for more than 15 minutes. And I'm going to be asking a lot of questions and when I find problems I am going to want them fixed properly. 45 minutes PER WEEK on a project like that? Are you crazy?
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Jan 30, 2014 01:15
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If I ever hired a contractor I'd probably be there at quitting time with beer and food once or twice a week to bullshit, look around, and ask questions. But if I ever build a house, the only thing I'll be hiring out is the cement work and a septic field if needed. I have no intention of ever paying anyone to do the rest, seeing as I can do it myself, alone if necessary.
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Jan 30, 2014 01:23
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There's also value in it getting done within a decade.
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Jan 30, 2014 04:08
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DNova posted:gently caress this. That's actually what the general contractor is there for. If you distrust their ability to manage the job so much that you need to be there every day, you've not done a good enough job vetting and hiring your GC. He's your on-site professional house-building manager, and if you're constantly there micromanaging, you're undermining his ability to do his job. Visiting regularly and asking questions is reasonable. Hanging out at the job site every day is going to get everyone who works there hating you pretty quickly, and when your employees hate you, they will always do the absolute minimum that they can, and may even secretly sabotage you when they know they can get away with it.
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Jan 30, 2014 04:19
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^^^ Right on. Micromanaged people have a nasty habit of skipping whatever they can get away with.Bad Munki posted:I think it's more just that I don't really know where the line is between "checking in on things" and "god drat this guy is loving here all day every day." Good advice in this thread. Coming in and changing multiple items at the last minute tends to piss the people off, but if you are on good terms with the builders you can plan ahead, or better still, get everything right at the design stage. Network any of your friends who happen to work in the industry, they'll know who's who. I've noticed that sometimes people do a better job on referrals because it gives them more of a personal stake in their work. A construction cock-up for y'all: Back when I started I went out with one of our techs to survey a bunch of stormwater and sewer lines in the car park of a big box store. When we arrived all the materials were still lying in piles and we were told to come back in a week or two because the work wasn't done. The drainlayers had started marking where all the pipes would go, and found that the drain grates were located at the all highest points of the parking area. The civil engineer had let a student design the drainage system and signed it off without checking it. A quick redesign and all was well, excepting a few completely wasted man-days.
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Jan 30, 2014 11:07
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Bad Munki posted:How annoyed off would a contractor be if an owner he was building a house for showed up at the build site from time to time to have a look around? I'm not an inspector but I'd sure feel a lot better if I could actually watch the house go up in person. Maybe with a case of beer for the crew? Owners on jobsite are pretty common. One way owners can help keep down the costs of work is to do the cleanup work themselves. Still, that's at the end of the workday, right as they are leaving. kid sinister fucked around with this message at 20:44 on Jan 30, 2014 |
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Jan 30, 2014 20:41
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kid sinister posted:Owners on jobsite are pretty common. One way owners can help keep down the costs of work is to do the cleanup work themselves. Still, that's at the end of the workday, right as they are leaving. This right here is a big deal for contractors! I remember the owner screening sand one morning before my uncle and I arrived to lay blocks. Wasn't a huge job or super time consuming, but we really appreciated not having to do it.
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Jan 30, 2014 21:35
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My parents built their house in 1997. They decided they were going to deal with all the permitting and spent weeks calling the building inspectors to find out who were good contractors and talking to people they new in construction. I spent every single day on the construction site after school for 6 months. We did a ton of work ourselves. Busting out forms, pulling nails out of any lumber laying on the job site, picking up nails, picking up brick, chipping mortar off whole bricks and cut bricks, sweeping floors, hanging windows and doors, painting, trim work, building cabinets, laying flooring, etc. It was a lot of work, but they built their house for $36/square foot and it was done correctly. Dad went so far as to check out NEC code books, plumbing books and other things from the library so he could talk to the contractors on site. They all complimented him on how we stayed out of the way and kept the site clean while asking good questions. If I ever build a house, I will probably follow his example. Also, bring food and sodas. We did that a couple times for each crew and they seemed to appreciate it.
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Jan 31, 2014 14:54
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Went downstairs today to make lunch only to hear what sounded like a sink running from the basement. Which would be weird since I haven't used the utility sink down there in at least a month. Found at least a foot of standing water in my luckily unfinished basement. So after getting zapped a few times wading around in the water due to the now underwater powerstrip, I get the water shutoff and rip out a bunch of insulation to find this.  Bad day at the job plumber guy? Couldn't dig up an elbow or what?
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Jan 31, 2014 22:09
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Pop quiz! What is this? A) An ingenious improvised heating duct part found in my house B) A potato chip can from the 50s C) A piece of metal absolutely covered in asbestos If you answered A, B, or C, you win! Your prize is that you aren't me.
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Feb 1, 2014 00:20
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Suited up in some coveralls, a mask, and took a flashlight into the 2' tall crawlspace under the addition in my house. The floor joists for the 8x16' addition run lengthwise, which isn't too much of a problem, except that that they are not 12" apart, or even 16" apart, but a whopping 24" apart. Seems that I'm going to have to put in two 5x5" crossers and some additional supports, and jack up the center one, and shim it as well. I'm wondering if that addition started out as a deck and they just built two stories above it. gently caress!!! Funny how a simple draft in the back room progressed into this mess. Locate Draft, Strip Wall, insulate wall, replace other poorly installed insulation, replace/install headers and new studs, jack up floor, install new supports, replace the floor, tear out ceiling, discover what mess is there, probably do more structural work, replace ceiling, install drywall, mud, paint, install new flooring, install trim...
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Feb 1, 2014 03:43
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Blistex posted:Suited up in some coveralls, a mask, and took a flashlight into the 2' tall crawlspace under the addition in my house. The floor joists for the 8x16' addition run lengthwise, which isn't too much of a problem, except that that they are not 12" apart, or even 16" apart, but a whopping 24" apart. Seems that I'm going to have to put in two 5x5" crossers and some additional supports, and jack up the center one, and shim it as well. I'm wondering if that addition started out as a deck and they just built two stories above it. gently caress!!! How long have you had the house? Is it recent enough that you can go screaming after whatever bumblefuck signed off on the inspection?
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Feb 1, 2014 18:30
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Liquid Communism posted:How long have you had the house? Is it recent enough that you can go screaming after whatever bumblefuck signed off on the inspection? Yeah, that... never works.
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Feb 1, 2014 18:37
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Splizwarf posted:Yeah, that... never works. Hey, it won't do -him- any good, but if noone ever bitches, they just keep pencil whipping inspections and leaving lovely poo poo like that to be found later.
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Feb 1, 2014 18:49
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House was built in 1928 and has a poured foundation and is rock solid and very well made. What isn't well made is the addition that I am working on which was built sometime in the 60's-70's so there is probably no way to know who did it since it has gone through several owners since then. I'm guessing it was a DIY job given the materials used, mistakes made, and the way that the wall was studded (saved no material, just took longer). If it was a lovely contractor he would have skimped on materials instead of making stupid mistakes. I just picked up some 2x4's and 2x8's from the farm (we cut them actual size not .5" smaller) so it should mesh well with what's already in the walls. Got two bottle jacks, and some 5x5" cedar as well for the floor under the crawl space. Going to have an hour nap then get started.
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Feb 1, 2014 22:09
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Rotten Red Rod posted:C) A piece of metal absolutely covered in asbestos Ehhh isn't there no safe minimum limit for asbestos? Should you really be flouting that around like that?
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Feb 1, 2014 22:44
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Rocko Bonaparte posted:Ehhh isn't there no safe minimum limit for asbestos? Should you really be flouting that around like that? As long as he isn't kicking up asbestos dust, or at least he's wearing a mask, he ought to be okay. The big danger from asbestos is getting it in your lungs.
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Feb 1, 2014 23:25
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:As long as he isn't kicking up asbestos dust, or at least he's wearing a mask, he ought to be okay. The big danger from asbestos is getting it in your lungs. Which is why a lot of things that utilized the stuff won't be replaced. As long as you don't try to remove it or kick it up it's fine. Won't stop people from thinking it's radioactive though.
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Feb 2, 2014 01:39
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ColHannibal posted:Which is why a lot of things that utilized the stuff won't be replaced. As long as you don't try to remove it or kick it up it's fine. And even if you kick up a bunch of it, it doesn't increase your lifetime risk of cancer or lung problems much.
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Feb 2, 2014 02:44
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dyne posted:And even if you kick up a bunch of it, it doesn't increase your lifetime risk of cancer or lung problems much. No, actually, it's unpredictable. When they look at the people who get mesothelioma (a particularly nasty and aggressive cancer that is the bellwether because you only get it if you've been exposed to asbestos), it has turned out to be the result of continuous low-level exposure situations (working in an old building with vibrating A/C ducts covered in the stuff, for instance) and also as the result of single high-level exposures (renovating your old house without a respirator). Continuous high-level exposure, like asbestos mining, obviously will cause you to develop mesothelioma...except when it doesn't. There's no good idea of how much exactly is needed to cause illness and in what situations, and it will generally take upwards of ten years for anything to show, so all you can ever do is protect yourself well and hope for the best. The one thing we do know is its association with smoking. If you do think you've been exposed to asbestos, you absolutely mus stop using tobacco, because the combination of the two increases your risk of developing mesothelioma to nearly 100% over ten years.
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Feb 2, 2014 03:36
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The thing is, mesothelioma is an uncommon malignancy so even if you double the risk of it, your chance of contracting it is still very, very low. You're more at risk of developing asbestosis, though that is also uncommon.
dyne fucked around with this message at 04:22 on Feb 2, 2014 |
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Feb 2, 2014 04:20
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ColHannibal posted:Which is why a lot of things that utilized the stuff won't be replaced. As long as you don't try to remove it or kick it up it's fine. Exactly. It is perfectly acceptable to cover asbestos or otherwise protect it so it won't be disturbed/create dust, yet most people think you need to remove every last spec and bring it to a special disposal site with a police escort.
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Feb 2, 2014 04:20
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Motronic posted:Exactly. It is perfectly acceptable to cover asbestos or otherwise protect it so it won't be disturbed/create dust, yet most people think you need to remove every last spec and bring it to a special disposal site with a police escort. If you plan on living there forever. Here in aus it was common practice to bury asbestos in the concrete slab of any new construction going on. Now people are digging up that poo poo because it was forgotten about. Just spend the money and get rid of the poo poo. Burying it and covering it up end up with guys like blistex accidently uncovering a shitload of friable material instead of 24 inch spaced joints. Fuckface the Hedgehog fucked around with this message at 04:43 on Feb 2, 2014 |
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Feb 2, 2014 04:39
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I just bought a condo, and the water heater pipe in the attic is wrapped in the stuff and there is no degradation on the layer at all. I've got no desire to even think about touching it, and it will probably be there forever or until California decides what can be in my attic. This is my kitchen:  With the exception of the ones over the stove (which you can't open when your hands are wet as you can't get enough leverage as the base is flush with the microwave), every cabinet opens the opposite way you think it should.  This is my fridge cubby, the standard width of a fridge is 36in, this opening is 36.01in. And the cabinet maker neglected to run a waterline that I had to run to the sink (Where the 20 year old fridge hookup was connected to the hot water pipe) on the other side of the kitchen.  This is my fireplace, it's horrible and I'm warping my head around fixing it but it just seems like such a huge mess.  This living room seems a little snug.  Ah, that's better.
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Feb 2, 2014 08:04
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ColHannibal posted:
I think you should feel a little lucky that it wasn't 35.99inc as these things often turn out to be.
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Feb 2, 2014 14:06
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spog posted:I think you should feel a little lucky that it wasn't 35.99inc as these things often turn out to be. Like the time I had to help move a new fridge into my sister's house. The (hand made by a previous owner) cabinets were shy by 1 inch. We had to take the top ones down, and shave an inch off the bottom to get it to fit.
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Feb 2, 2014 15:57
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We used some IKEA stuff for a kitchen remodeling (the original kitchen that was supposed to go in had major transportation issues and the owners wanted a faster approach) and the fridge is just a millimeter wider than the place it's supposed to go in inside one of the cabinets so it rubs against the hinges.
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Feb 2, 2014 16:45
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I don't know why some builders are so fascinated with making the fridge space as tight as humanly possible against their fridge. Leave 6" on a side. Fridges will fit easily so you can clean behind them without calling in a wrecking crew, you'll never miss that tiny amount of counter space, and having a slot to store a broom and sponge mop right there in the kitchen is super handy. 
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Feb 2, 2014 16:48
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