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Bonapartisan posted:I thought I would try to play a Muslim ruler after hearing about decadence and wanting to try out the mechanics and all that. I usually play as a female to start off my dynasty, I guess because I'm a woman myself? I don't know. Anyway. Turns out this works poorly with Muslims as you can't matrilineally marry. Not just the matrilinearlly bit, but females can't be rulers at all upon succession. This forces you to use daughters for alliance building rather than building up your dynasty. You even get fewer mercenary groups and only one holy order available, again to force military alliances. It really does feel like playing as a Muslim ruler means you must Always Be Conquering (especially since it helps with the decadence mechanic) and changes the game. At least the casus bellis are better - you get "invasion of England" instead of "invasion of county and then wait a while unless you want to kill your prestige." As an aside, "invasion of Rome" really does kick the Pope out. In my game he was somewhere in Germany (I was surprised it wasn't Avignon or something.) Every once in a while he tried sending an invading force down, but with the Scots being Fraticelli, Aquitaine being Lollard, etc. the invasion force was pretty pathetic. Moral authority may be a bit overpowered, but I guess losing Rome would probably have caused a lot of problems with the faithful.
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Feb 2, 2014 21:57
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44 hours and I still don't get this game. I tried to play as the Prince of Kiev and when I died all my titles went away and I don't know what I could have done to stop it. I tried giving out titles to lower my demense, but in the end I lost all my poo poo except like 3 provinces.
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Feb 2, 2014 22:07
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Finally just said 'gently caress it' and gave up in my Croatian game  Things just kinda stalled for me and in the end no amount of stabbing would destabilise the Byzantines enough. Just got too much unrest and went terribly in debt due to the last war. Them declaring on me right when I was about to join a crusade, then beating me in a way and having their king die so they could declare again destroyed me.
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Feb 2, 2014 22:16
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Jakse posted:44 hours and I still don't get this game. I tried to play as the Prince of Kiev and when I died all my titles went away and I don't know what I could have done to stop it. I tried giving out titles to lower my demense, but in the end I lost all my poo poo except like 3 provinces. Don't use Gavelkind succession.
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Feb 2, 2014 22:18
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:Don't use Gavelkind succession. Gavelkind is literally the worst, and there's a reason why everyone in history either got rid of it or was conquered by someone. Elective is probably the best in the game since it makes the senior vassals happy, and lets you choose the genius son/daughter; the worst you'll see upon succession is a few people wanting independence who can be bribed or crushed, and the 'lower crown authority' types which isn't the end of the world anyway even if it happens.
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Feb 2, 2014 22:26
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Ofaloaf posted:I just don't go for the SWMH option in HIP. You can simply tell the installer to ignore that bit. I hate HIP because of the stupid drat trait requirements on every single decision and it spams you (maybe this is from VIET?) with events that give you 1 prestige or 1 piety. The included map is truly awful (albeit pretty) but yeah, that part is optional.
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Feb 2, 2014 22:30
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It's 80 for everyone. Nope, it's different for every faction type. Crown Authority is only 50 to get them to leave for example, Independence is 80, etc. But yes AFAIK the value is always the same for members as it is for leaders.
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Feb 2, 2014 22:46
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Gavelkind owns, it means you actually have to give a poo poo about keeping your vassals happy. It's actually pretty trivial to game - only have one of the highest level title, and wee that's it you win.
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Feb 2, 2014 23:02
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Tulip posted:Gavelkind owns, it means you actually have to give a poo poo about keeping your vassals happy. It's actually pretty trivial to game - only have one of the highest level title, and wee that's it you win. It's trivial to "game" by doing exactly the thing it would do if you let it - handing out most of your kingdom titles at the Empire levels, or duchies at the kingdom level. This isn't gaming the system, that's being a subservient bitch to it. Gavelkind cannot be "gamed" in the sense that elective can, by loading the votes with your dynasty.
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Feb 2, 2014 23:13
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Tulip posted:Gavelkind owns, it means you actually have to give a poo poo about keeping your vassals happy. It's actually pretty trivial to game - only have one of the highest level title, and wee that's it you win. That's not always the best solution. I had a game recently where, as a pagan emperor, my heir inherited the empire, one kingdom, and one county outside that kingdom, and my second son inherited 3 kingdoms, 2 duchies, and 8 counties.
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Feb 2, 2014 23:14
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Pakled posted:That's not always the best solution. I had a game recently where, as a pagan emperor, my heir inherited the empire, one kingdom, and one county outside that kingdom, and my second son inherited 3 kingdoms, 2 duchies, and 8 counties. I usually gift out every single county i get whoever it's de jure for so i basically run 1 county almost the entire time.
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Feb 2, 2014 23:16
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The other thing Elective lets you do is hand the crown to your grandkid (or great-grandkid, this has happened once to me) - this lets you minimize the number of times you have to deal with the new ruler penalty. I guess Ultimogeniture lets you do something similar. Minimizing that - and getting that sweet long reign bonus - is a huge deal.
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Feb 2, 2014 23:29
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Last Emperor posted:Finally just said 'gently caress it' and gave up in my Croatian game Croatia being dejure Byzantine really pretty much sets it up to being destroyed every time by the Byzantines, which I think, really isn't fun. Also, I kinda think the BE should have something to make it more unstable, maybe strong enough Douxs get a claim to the throne so that there are fairly common civil wars.
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Feb 2, 2014 23:59
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Pakled posted:That's not always the best solution. I had a game recently where, as a pagan emperor, my heir inherited the empire, one kingdom, and one county outside that kingdom, and my second son inherited 3 kingdoms, 2 duchies, and 8 counties. It's still better than not having the empire title and instead having two of your four kingdoms pass out of your realm completely.
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Feb 3, 2014 00:19
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Gorelab posted:Also, I kinda think the BE should have something to make it more unstable, maybe strong enough Douxs get a claim to the throne so that there are fairly common civil wars. I don't think I've ever had a game where Byzantium wasn't awesomely unstable. 
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Feb 3, 2014 00:33
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Yeah every game I've ever played the Byzantium fractures every 30 or so years as every duke rebels, then gets crushed, then waits until the ruler dies, then rebels, then gets crushed, endlessly forever. Makes for really good targets as muslim/mongol/zoroastirans, since every few decades you can grab an extra two or three duchies if you're quick.
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Feb 3, 2014 04:36
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1066 Byzantines have two families who will be inheriting claims on the throne to start, as well as an already-started foreign war that should nuke half of the neutral dukes. 867 Byzantines have an Iconoclast in line for the throne. I don't know how you could possibly make them less stable.
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Feb 3, 2014 04:54
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Torrannor posted:Except Mongols and Aztecs. Oh god, don't stab the Mongol or Aztec leaders. Except when the heir is content and cynical. In which case, as long as you're not actually at war with them, stab away.
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Feb 3, 2014 05:06
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If you really want to stab hordes, you stab the generals, not the leaders.
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Feb 3, 2014 05:07
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In my game there only usually seems to be a short period of instabilty the emperor almost always crushes everyone very quickly and then expands into Sejulk lands and into Croatia/Apulia which have no chance at all to stand against them.
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Feb 3, 2014 05:07
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jpmeyer posted:If you really want to stab hordes, you stab the generals, not the leaders. How do you find out who the generals are?
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Feb 3, 2014 05:33
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^^^^ They show up on the battle screen. As soon as your army runs into their army, pause the game, select the battle so you can see both sides' army details and leaders, pick the most troublesome general (or the one with the lowest feudal rank, if you're short on cash) and start spamming assassination attempts till it works. It depends a lot on random chance. Rather than just revoking titles, the AI emperor prefers to castrate rebellious dukes (which obviously pisses them off) and then release them back to their duchies without confiscating their territory, which results in a very disgruntled set of vassals ready to revolt immediately after a war against the Muslims goes badly and decimates the emperor's levies. That's pretty much how my Byzantine vassal game went - the Byz was an unstoppable juggernaut until it took Jersualem and triggered Jihads, and the combined Muslim forces finally managed to grind down the emperor's troops, and after the war ended I started my rebellion and basically every single vassal joined it. Main Paineframe fucked around with this message at 05:40 on Feb 3, 2014 |
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Feb 3, 2014 05:37
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My Byzantine Empire is actually really goddamn stable right now, but it's the 1300s and Europe's mostly stabilized. I'm currently in the process of kicking it all over and conquering everybody, but apart from that, it's really been quite stable the last fifty years or so.
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Feb 3, 2014 06:03
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Gorelab posted:Croatia being dejure Byzantine really pretty much sets it up to being destroyed every time by the Byzantines, which I think, really isn't fun. Also, I kinda think the BE should have something to make it more unstable, maybe strong enough Douxs get a claim to the throne so that there are fairly common civil wars. We need a 4th crusade mechanic.
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Feb 3, 2014 07:07
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Baron Porkface posted:We need a 4th crusade mechanic. We need a Children's Crusade mechanic.
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Feb 3, 2014 09:53
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So I bought sons of Abraham and started a Jewish khazar game. Is it just me or is the implementation of the Jewish faith just really shoddy and lazy? They're worse than the Catholics in vanilla, just one event to be getting on with which gives piety and prestige without any interesting flavour, in addition to having a really restricted gene pool for eugenic shenanigans. I really feel like they could have added more stuff.
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Feb 3, 2014 11:22
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lenoon posted:So I bought sons of Abraham and started a Jewish khazar game. Is it just me or is the implementation of the Jewish faith just really shoddy and lazy? They're worse than the Catholics in vanilla, just one event to be getting on with which gives piety and prestige without any interesting flavour, in addition to having a really restricted gene pool for eugenic shenanigans. I really feel like they could have added more stuff. Considering that the Khazars were the last time Jews ruled anything before the creation of modern Israel I don't really know what you expect. Of course the gene pool is shallow but that is an accurate depiction of medieval life. And I guess they were especially hesitant to invent some fantasy events because of the controversy naturally surrounding Judaism, and the fact that it is a religion that is still practiced today, in contrast to the ancient Norse or Romuva faiths.
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Feb 3, 2014 11:43
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lenoon posted:So I bought sons of Abraham and started a Jewish khazar game. Is it just me or is the implementation of the Jewish faith just really shoddy and lazy? They're worse than the Catholics in vanilla, just one event to be getting on with which gives piety and prestige without any interesting flavour, in addition to having a really restricted gene pool for eugenic shenanigans. I really feel like they could have added more stuff. You get a few more decisions when you conquer Jerusalem, but nothing mindblowing. I can't really find a benefit to being Jewish rather than Christian or Orthodox, but I started converting the entire world (now property of the re-established Roman Empire) to Judaism regardless (needed something to do for the last 200 years of the game).
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Feb 3, 2014 12:07
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Yeah. And the Celebrate Passover event isn't even changed when you own Jerusalem (and converted it to Judaism). But I'm having a lot of fun in my Spanish Jew game. Zealot Israel 
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Feb 3, 2014 12:27
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Civilized Fishbot posted:We need a Children's Crusade mechanic. Your 14 year old genius heir with all 20+ stats just joined the Children's Crusade!  
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Feb 3, 2014 13:52
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Fintilgin posted:Your 14 year old genius heir with all 20+ stats just joined the Children's Crusade! Yes, the XCOM smilie is quite appropriate. For many situations. What, your genius heir died of a common cold? You cruel, arbitrary slothful second son is your new heir? Your new king died in a battle with his 20,000 troops against 1000 peasant rabble? After losing half your troops in the desert of Arabia the Caliph is calling a jihad for your lands? We need a CK2 smilie.
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Feb 3, 2014 14:27
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Torrannor posted:Yes, the XCOM smilie is quite appropriate. For many situations. What, your genius heir died of a common cold? You cruel, arbitrary slothful second son is your new heir? There already is 
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Feb 3, 2014 15:03
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Torrannor posted:Considering that the Khazars were the last time Jews ruled anything before the creation of modern Israel I don't really know what you expect. Of course the gene pool is shallow but that is an accurate depiction of medieval life. And I guess they were especially hesitant to invent some fantasy events because of the controversy naturally surrounding Judaism, and the fact that it is a religion that is still practiced today, in contrast to the ancient Norse or Romuva faiths. The Kingdom of Semien was a Jewish kingdom in northwestern ethiopia that lasted centuries after the fall of the Khazars. They are in some mods, but they really ought to be on the vanilla map.
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Feb 3, 2014 15:06
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jpmeyer posted:If you really want to stab hordes, you stab the generals, not the leaders. This is great advice, in my current game as the Scottish King I had a claimant return event where some distant cousin turns up with 15'000 troops to pay the iron price for his throne. Already being involved in a closely fought war with someone else I simply did not have the resources to take on that many troops (I think the most I could muster was maybe 8k?). So with a 25% chance for a successful assassination I gambled on Lady Luck and holy poo poo it worked, Pretender dead and his army vanished. I was discovered and my king ended up with the 'kinslayer' trait but it was a small price to pay for keeping my kingdom.
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Feb 3, 2014 15:29
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Does anyone have any tips for being Jewish Khazaria starting at the earliest date? You get a pretty big starting kingdom which is nice, but the HRE is to your west, the Caliphate to your south and the Tengri to the north. I'm attempting an Ironman game with the objective of restoring Israel but it's hard to declare war when it means multiple kingdoms and their deathstacks joining in against me.
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Feb 3, 2014 16:00
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I wish factions were accounted for in the threats tab. What is the relationship number i need before vassals will stop leading factions?
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Feb 3, 2014 16:03
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If I'm reading the thing on the wiki right, it's 50 for crown authority factions, 75 for succession and 80 for independence.
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Feb 3, 2014 16:37
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Feb 3, 2014 16:48
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Torrannor posted:Considering that the Khazars were the last time Jews ruled anything before the creation of modern Israel I don't really know what you expect. Of course the gene pool is shallow but that is an accurate depiction of medieval life. And I guess they were especially hesitant to invent some fantasy events because of the controversy naturally surrounding Judaism, and the fact that it is a religion that is still practiced today, in contrast to the ancient Norse or Romuva faiths. As a Viking I can 'reform the faith' and raid Egypt with no problems. As a catholic I can become a lollard king and unseat the papacy. If I wanted to have historical realism in my 'I am the welsh orthodox ruler of Byzantium and restorer of the Roman Empire' game I'd have it. But I would like a fun and interesting game. More events! More ridiculousness! Feasts and blots give humorous and useful events and hunts give you traits, Passover gives you the same 100 prestige and 100 piety every year. Useful, yes. Fun, no.
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Feb 3, 2014 16:54
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How is Zoroastrianism for events and fun times? I was thinking of having a go at reuniting Persia.
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Feb 3, 2014 17:01
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