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Arakan posted:You're the one not understanding how leases work and misinterpreting the law. How do you think he's wrong? I don't even think the wording is that obscure. quote:(1)(a) When premises are rented for an indefinite time i.e. there is no pre-defined end date (most likely a month to month lease, but I'll get to that in a second) quote:with monthly or other periodic rent reserved, such tenancy shall be construed to be a tenancy from month to month, or from period to period on which rent is payable "For the most part we mean monthly, but if you have some other indefinite arrangement like every other month or every quarter this still applies". Note that this would only apply to SloMo the way he wants it to if he pays for his lease as one lump sum for the entire year (which is his "period" as noted in bold). quote:and shall be terminated by written notice of twenty days or more, preceding the end of any of the months or periods of tenancy, given by either party to the other. So, if you're in this kind of indefinite situation, either party would have to give 20 days notice before the end of your period, otherwise you enter another one. The bad news is that if he wanted it to apply that way, missing his notice would mean he'd be due for another year of rent, since that is what he calls "his period". Of course, none of this applies to him anyways, so it's a moot point. SloMo is NOT month-to-month just because his rent is due on a monthly basis. VVV I said it doesn't apply anyways, that is only referring to his own messed-up interpretation. Perhaps you could explain which part you think is wrong? clockworx fucked around with this message at 00:53 on Feb 6, 2014 |
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Feb 6, 2014 00:48
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clockworx posted:The bad news is that if he wanted it to apply that way, missing his notice would mean he'd be due for another year of rent, since that is what he calls "his period". This is what I mean about you guys being terrible at interpreting the law. clockworx posted:Perhaps you could explain which part you think is wrong? Nah. It's way more fun watching you guys try to berate him for every little thing even if you lack basic understanding of what you're posting about. Arakan fucked around with this message at 00:58 on Feb 6, 2014 |
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Feb 6, 2014 00:52
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moana posted:You know, all I knew when I left high school was "don't spend money before it hits my bank account." That's the very most basic of basics of income. Thank you for the effort post. I'm genuinely sorry for places I've talked down. When I mentioned it before I was being sarcastic because of frustration for the people not understanding the difference between earnings, income and debt. Sorry. Try to understand that I got here more on the back of an abusive marriage than drinking or partying. I have a knee-jerk hatred for the 'holier than thou based on my bank account' types because of it. Your mention of your net worth gave me the same rage. See where the debt starts at $35,000 at the beginning of the year? I had blood dripping down my face right about then. Half the trips I mention taking were in hopes of calming my wife down down. As were things like a year of tuition when she couldn't keep a job. As were the dogs, and all the vet bills thereafter. My alcohol spending was near zero because my wife would drink everything in the house, give me a black eye and blame me for it the next day. Taking her out for drinks was another recipe for disaster. $300/month for eating and drinking at bars after I left the marriage is excessive, and I'm bringing it down more each month. Some one here pointed out that in the past six months I spent $1,700 on bars and alcohol. That's not where my debt came from. Please stop pretending like it is. I finalized the divorce last month. Now it's time to be productive. All I can ask of the thread is to be supportive of that. I can earn a lot when I put the hours in.
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Feb 6, 2014 00:54
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Slow Motion posted:Thank you for the effort post. I'm genuinely sorry for places I've talked down. When I mentioned it before I was being sarcastic because of frustration for the people not understanding the difference between earnings, income and debt. Sorry. I think everyone in this thread is sympathetic in terms of how you got yourself in your situation with your wife, there's just some frustration with your attitude from then to now. People talking about their net worth aren't trying to gloat, just trying to show you that it can be done on any salary. And just don't talk down to people trying to help you. Even if they're wrong. If they're wrong about something, explain it to them. This way everyone reading can learn. gently caress, that sounded like a lot of hippy poo poo.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:01
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Haifisch posted:I'm not even making a judgement on whether he's right or wrong about the lease, because it's just so ridiculous that he'd rather find and interpret a law than see what his lease says. Yes, knowing the law is important, but most people would look in their lease to see the notice requirements. No need to find and interpret. I knew the law way before I googled it. I volunteered for 4 years as a legal assistant for a lawyer doing pro bono tenant advocacy in Seattle during high school.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:01
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Veskit posted:I lived in washington state for 8 years, and had at least 8 leases. When you're month to month you only need 20 days notice to vacate. If either parties dont give 20 days notice then you are renewed for that month. That's the law there, done with that dumb debate I hope and get back on track to making GBS threads on Slowmo for trying to bring financial/accounting tricks into his loving retarded budget. But he is not month to month.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:01
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RheaConfused posted:But he is not month to month. Guess what he is when his year long lease ends
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Feb 6, 2014 01:02
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ryde posted:Currently, that is an outlier. Lets check back in... lets say three months. Obviously, a couple pages ago I set him a goal of 150 hours being a successful February due to less working days. I am cautiously optimistic for him getting the hours in, learning how to budget not so much.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:03
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Bloody Queef posted:I think everyone in this thread is sympathetic in terms of how you got yourself in your situation with your wife, there's just some frustration with your attitude from then to now. People talking about their net worth aren't trying to gloat, just trying to show you that it can be done on any salary. I'll do my best. And I love that hippy poo poo.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:05
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Slow Motion posted:Thank you for the effort post. I'm genuinely sorry for places I've talked down. When I mentioned it before I was being sarcastic because of frustration for the people not understanding the difference between earnings, income and debt. Sorry. Until you work out how to budget you won't get out of debt. Your situation is ridiculous because if you budget properly you will actually be able to afford more stuff, not less, and won't be at as much risk from unexpected events. It's difficult to be sympathetic about your previous situation when you laud it as being an awesome lifestyle and you patronise people who are advising you and have solved similar financial problems themselves.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:07
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Ah, there it is, the periodic almost-heartfelt post to keep us hooked. Intermittent reinforcement is a powerful tool, one that is used to great effect in abusive relationships. If only I get things just right then maybe we'll have those good times like we used to. A never-ending array of hoops to jump through, some of them set on fire. SloMo, I do understand your situation because I was there. I've tried several times to relate to you on that front, but they've gone ignored. It took me several years to truly get over my marriage, and I made many of the same mistake you've made and continue to make. But it's impossible to get through to you. You're not going to listen, you're not ready to make big changes, you're not prepared to look inward and accept your own role in your life. You're getting a little better, but you're still clinging to the relief and freedom you feel from being rid of your wife, and trying to make up for lost time. In a way, you are still trying to get back at her. She is still affecting you a great deal. It sucks and I'm sorry, but the more you act like a complete loving tool, the harder it is to give a poo poo.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:07
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Arakan posted:Guess what he is when his year long lease ends Either obligated to pay for rent for another month at the higher month to moth rate or moving out because the landlord leased to someone else
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Feb 6, 2014 01:07
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Arakan posted:Guess what he is when his year long lease ends  Slow Motion posted:I'll do my best. And I love that hippy poo poo.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:10
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Fiedler posted:About $15,000 deeper in debt than he should have been. 6.75 billed 2 studied. The study is there but I'll need more from my billings.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:16
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RheaConfused posted:But he is not month to month. Stop grasping for straws. Slow Motion posted:
It's about now slow motion. That 300 a month could have paid for debt and you're effectively funding your current drinking through debt. Who cares where your debt came from, it's the fact that it's there and you aren't paying it down properly. Slow Motion posted:6.75 billed 2 studied. The study is there but I'll need more from my billings. You mean that's how much one day's worth of billings was, or is this total up to 02/04?
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Feb 6, 2014 01:19
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One of the things I like to do for personal growth and development and to keep myself interesting is conduct periodic life experiments. Sometimes I go vegan for a month or three. Once, I tried to learn a new dance. I got rid of my smartphone for nine months last year just to see what that would be like. And small stuff, like no electricity after six (you go to bed early), wake up at 5AM for awhile to see how you like it, only use water that comes out of a bucket to see how much all that weighs, you know? Would you be interested in trying something similar? I think a cool one is to try alternative budgeting methods, as an experiment. It's only a month and the cost is tiny for a dude as well-versed in all things finance as yourself. I'll do one as well, if you like. You can propose a life experiment for me and we'll compare notes.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:20
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Veskit posted:You mean that's how much one day's worth of billings was, or is this total up to 02/04? One day. I began today with 17.5 billed in February.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:23
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Veskit posted:Stop grasping for straws.   I am not grasping at straws, I have not been mean or name calling or whatever, I have actually been trying to be helpful. Your post was specifically about month to month leases, which Slomo is not on.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:40
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Slow Motion posted:One day. I began today with 17.5 billed in February. So with studying what is your schedule? Monday-Friday 8 hours billed 2 hours studied Saturday 4 hours billed 4 hours studied Sunday 4 hours studied Something like that? That was basically my schedule for 3 months before the PE. My rock climbing friends really missed me. I passed though and got a 10% raise and into a higher bonus pool. Sacrifice can be worth it!
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Feb 6, 2014 01:41
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Despite the fact that I'm almost certainly on ignore for ripping the poo poo out of slowmo I'm going to make an effort post of my own because fool me 1747284 times and I still feel like I want to help him when he shows an ounce of penance and sincerity. Slomo, here's what you need to do: It doesn't matter a poo poo if people don't understand earnings vs. income or whatnot. You're not writing a budget for yourself, you're writing it for your bank account. The end goal here is to pay down debt. The creditors there only give a poo poo about when money appears in their bank account, and that in turn can only appear there when it leaves your bank account. Similarly, no amount of bonus accrual at work can be used to buy drugs, alcohol or opera tickets. That all comes from your bank account. So you have to budget on the income to your bank account. Not what your earnings are at work, because that's illiquid. What hits your account every pay period, and not a cent more. But Taffy, I don't have a fixed income! Ok, so make an educated-but-conservative guess. Low-ball it, because currently your debt is a risk so you need to choose the lower-risk option. Budget around that figure. When, and only when your bonus accrual actually hits your bank account, can you then spend that accrual. And we can set up a forward plan for that which rewards both responsible debt repayment and irresponsible blow and women. So say you expect to earn at least $3000 but then fully anticipate working hours enough to put away another $1500. Budget your rent, basic groceries, bills, debt minimums, etc. - everything you cannot possibly adjust because they are fixed requirements to survival - out of that. I understand booze is a necessary food group because I probably drink more than you but here me out here. So you may have a bee's dick of leftover fun money from that. Welp, that's why you engage baller mode at work. Now with the $1500, break down a reasonable percentage based distribution of it for booze, weed, hookers, travel, opera and most importantly above-minimum debt repayment and a small emergency fund ($1000 max, it's to cover poo poo like 'oh gently caress I was so high I knocked over my laptop and broke the screen'). Because it's percentage based, the aim here is to build up a little stockpile of benjies for each category which you can then feel absolutely guiltless about going and blowing on that category with no criticism from this thread. But your one rule is that you have to pay into each bucket before you can spend it. E.g.: you earn $2000 above your pretend-minimum over the course of the month, and you've put 25% to each of of debt, emergency fund, booze and travel. So you've just paid $500 into debt. Good , slap that poo poo on one of the CCs and feel good. Now you have $500 for the coming month to drink away. And you have $500 towards a Dubai trip when you so feel. The magic is, you can swing these percentages around every month. Only drink $200 because like a good little baller you've been studying too much? Allocate only 20% of next month's extras to booze because that bucket of money doesn't need as much topping up. After only 2 months you can remove the emergency fund bucket all together until you actually take money from it and it needs topping up again. I'm sure you get the idea. BUT YOU NEVER, EVER CHANGE YOUR BASE INCOME BUDGET. If you know you're going to only work enough hours to make $2500 because, say, you've saved up enough in the travel category for your Dubai holiday, then you ALSO create a bucket in your extras money to cover the $500, BEFORE you go on the holiday. For ideas on the split, maybe take 6 billables x20, since 4 weeks of 6 billable hours per day (120 hours total) seems like a pretty good base expectation and much less than that will probably get you fired. Whatever. Pick some numbers, put them to the thread and we'll give not-meanie feedback if you're willing to discuss them frankly with us. You can track your bonus accrual still. You can even go 'ok so I have $5000 in accrual that I expect to get this month. I'm gonna split my next month's bonus accrual percentages such that I can buy enough material to firefly my entire apartment!'. You just can't go and spend it until it actually hits your bank account because the budget is for your bank account, not your own earnings at work. You may disagree with parts of the above. Ok, but that doesn't make it incorrect. Just try this method. If there's something you particularly hate about it, discuss it with us and offer alternatives and most importantly listen to us if we give reasons why those alternatives don't work. The keys here are: 1: covering the necessities of life every month. They're inelastic and so you must meet them every month. That's the risk-minimisation part. 2: making a responsible, realistic split between debt repayment to achieve your goals and rewarding yourself for the hard work you put in by responsibly budgeting for your irresponsible (but fun as gently caress) lifestyle. 3: NOT SPENDING THE MONEY UNTIL YOU ALREADY HAVE IT. This is part of the 'spend last month's money' that someone talked about a while ago. It's important. We can discuss what has to go in the fixed budget and how much is reasonable for each category in time. Getting you to agree to trying this would be a huge first step and a great win for everyone. Alternatively you can miss this because I'm ignored and continue on in debt. Welp.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:46
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RheaConfused posted:
My apologies. A lease is for the contract period and then immediately goes into a month to month lease. At that point the 20 day notice rules kick in. He doesn't need to give actual notice. The apartment complex does need to give him 20 days though to tell him that they aren't going to extend him into month to month. There was just a lot of BUT SLOWMO bullshit going on with leases and wanted to squelch it. My bad didn't mean to be rude!
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Feb 6, 2014 01:48
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spwrozek posted:So with studying what is your schedule? That's right but I'm aiming for at least 8 hours worked (9 counting lunch) Monday-Saturday which translates to more like 6-7 hours billed on those days. I also plan to do some heavier work days throughout to keep the billed hours up. Today will be 12ish billed along with the 2 hours study.
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Feb 6, 2014 01:48
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Slow Motion posted:Today will be 12ish billed along with the 2 hours study. Fraudulent billing admission in this post
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Feb 6, 2014 01:52
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Veskit posted:My apologies. A lease is for the contract period and then immediately goes into a month to month lease. At that point the 20 day notice rules kick in. He doesn't need to give actual notice. The apartment complex does need to give him 20 days though to tell him that they aren't going to extend him into month to month. There was just a lot of BUT SLOWMO bullshit going on with leases and wanted to squelch it. My bad didn't mean to be rude! Well, thank you. As I stated earlier, I am worried that if he lets this happen and he is obligated to pay at least one month on a month to month rate, isn't there a huge risk that he will have to pay a much higher rate for that month? My experience has been that the complex would jack the rate up to the "market rate," which can often be much much more than your agreed upon lease rate.
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Feb 6, 2014 02:01
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Slow Motion posted:That's right but I'm aiming for at least 8 hours worked (9 counting lunch) Monday-Saturday which translates to more like 6-7 hours billed on those days. I also plan to do some heavier work days throughout to keep the billed hours up. Today will be 12ish billed along with the 2 hours study. So if we take the low end and say you work 6 per day with Saturdays you will hit 144 hours this month. With less days this month I would set my goal at 150. Good plan, I think you can do it.
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Feb 6, 2014 02:02
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Arakan posted:Guess what he is when his year long lease ends When his year-long lease ends, his lease will end unless his lease agreement explicitly states that it continues in some way, in which case it will continue in what way - which is often, but not always, as a month-to-month lease. That's why it's so drat important that he read his lease. It may terminate and kick him out immediately, or it may go to month-to-month, or it may go to any other arrangement the owner can think of. Let's go back to the actual legal language someone posted a page or two back: quote:RCW 59.18.220 states that the tenancy ends at the end of the stated lease term. A lease expires at the end of the lease term unless the contract states otherwise. Typically, a one year lease may contain language that converts the tenancy to month-to-month at the end of the stated lease term. This means that for a tenant whose lease does not have language automatically extending its term, neither party needs to give written notice, and the tenant must either move out or negotiate a new term. This mean that the lease expires completely at the end of the month, unless the contract says that it doesn't end. Typically, when this happens, the contract often contains language converting the lease to a month-to-month lease, but this is not guaranteed - it is only true if the contract specifically says that it's the case, and it's not a binary "goes month-to-month or expires right now" thing either - what happens when the lease expires is "whatever the contract says happens when the lease expires, which could be pretty much anything". That's why SlowMo needs to read his specific lease agreement, because the law in this instance amounts to "at the end of the stated lease term, the lease does whatever the lease agreement says it does", which isn't particularly informative by itself.
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Feb 6, 2014 02:03
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Wrong again. It doesn't matter what his lease says, it's predicated on whether or not the landlord accepts his money.quote:If a tenant stays beyond the expiration of the lease, and the landlord accepts the next month’s rent, the tenant then is assumed to be renting under a month-to-month agreement. http://housing.asuw.org/system/attachments/clips/000/000/016/original/City_of_Seattle_Rights_Summary.pdf?1390843542 edit: I mean I guess in your hypothetical world where landlords stop accepting money from tenants it might be an issue. Arakan fucked around with this message at 02:21 on Feb 6, 2014 |
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Feb 6, 2014 02:13
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Main Paineframe posted:When his year-long lease ends, his lease will end unless his lease agreement explicitly states that it continues in some way, in which case it will continue in what way - which is often, but not always, as a month-to-month lease. That's why it's so drat important that he read his lease. It may terminate and kick him out immediately, or it may go to month-to-month, or it may go to any other arrangement the owner can think of. Let's go back to the actual legal language someone posted a page or two back: The super relevant restriction you should take into account is this: a lease for a term of more than a year must be witnessed my a notary or it's entirely void. The only thing that can happen at more than a year in a non-notarized lease is a switch to month to month at the same rent. Which is why management will crawl up you rear end at about 30 days to either give notice or agree to month to month at a higher rate. edit - and yeah, what Arakan said. You immediately go month to month if the landlord accepts rent for the next month. Washington landlord tenant law is so detailed that besides the dollar amount for rent and specific allowed fees most of a lease is unenforceable (read: toilet paper). edit 2 - Nam Taf you're not ignored and I want to give your post a real read when I can devote more attention to it. Thank you for the effort. Slow Motion fucked around with this message at 02:23 on Feb 6, 2014 |
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Feb 6, 2014 02:18
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Arakan posted:Wrong again. It doesn't matter what his lease says, it's predicated on whether or not the landlord accepts his money. But look at the entire paragraph that contains the sentence you quoted: quote:Proper Notice to Leave for Leases. If the tenant moves out at the expiration of a lease, in most cases it is not necessary to give the landlord a written notice. However, the lease should be consulted to be sure a formal notice is not required. If a tenant stays beyond the expiration of the lease, and the landlord accepts the next month’s rent, the tenant then is assumed to be renting under a month-to-month agreement. I am not saying that it couldn't possibly turn out ok, but basically what this says is that what the lease says is what matters. I mean, as a responsible property renting adult, you should be familiar with your lease for a million different reasons anyhow. Why risk it? Why cause yourself extra stress?
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Feb 6, 2014 02:22
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RheaConfused posted:But look at the entire paragraph that contains the sentence you quoted: You're not so off base; if the lease does specify turning into month-to-month at the end at the same rent then unless you give 20 days notice at the end the landlord can come after you for the next months rent. Anything else triggers the more-than-1-year agreement notary requirement. And since nobody every gets a notary to sign a lease it's unenforceable.
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Feb 6, 2014 02:26
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RheaConfused posted:I am not saying that it couldn't possibly turn out ok, but basically what this says is that what the lease says is what matters. I mean, as a responsible property renting adult, you should be familiar with your lease for a million different reasons anyhow. Why risk it? Why cause yourself extra stress? An issue is that regardless of the law, the property management company is going to act the way their lease was written. So they may hold your security deposit illegally, but it'll take you months to get it back. Much easier to read the lease and comply if it's reasonable.
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Feb 6, 2014 02:28
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SlowMo, why do you cling to the law instead of your lease? Have you ever heard of landlords loving people over illegally, or you just think that it can't happen to you? You have this whole "I'm invincible" thing going on, which was supposed to die off as you got older. Maybe the drugs are keeping it going. Bloody Queef posted:Much easier to read the lease and comply if it's reasonable. loving A. Why do you insist on making life so unpredictable for yourself? You think that it's fun and spontaneous but it's actually a giant mountain of stress. Why do you refuse to just go look at your lease? Do you not have a copy? Go email your landlord or something, 
WampaLord fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Feb 6, 2014 |
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Feb 6, 2014 02:28
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Slow Motion posted:You're not so off base; if the lease does specify turning into month-to-month at the end at the same rent then unless you give 20 days notice at the end the landlord can come after you for the next months rent. Anything else triggers the more-than-1-year agreement notary requirement. And since nobody every gets a notary to sign a lease it's unenforceable. Can you point me to the statute you are referring to (about the notarizing I mean, I couldn't find it in what has already been referred to)? I am genuinely interested. And it seems that we agree, you would be obligated to at least one more month of rent, which you don't want to pay because that's the whole point of moving right? So, I guess what I wonder is if you are genuinely against checking your lease and following it for some reason? edit: it seems like what you are saying is that they will come after you for the next month's rent, and the lease usually contemplates a higher month to month rent at the market rate, that is another part of my worry for you. Is that what your lease says? edit again: to be clear I'm just curious about the notary thing, I don't think it matters in this case because I think your lease probably clearly says you switch over to month to month and I do not believe not giving notice would obligate you to another year. The whole reason I started asking about this in the first place is because I don't want money to be wasted on a higher month to month rate. RheaConfused fucked around with this message at 02:34 on Feb 6, 2014 |
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Feb 6, 2014 02:30
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Nam Taf posted:fool me 1747284 times and I still feel like I want to help him when he shows an ounce of penance and sincerity. Awesome post, tho. Too bad he won't listen to any of it.
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Feb 6, 2014 02:35
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WampaLord posted:SlowMo, why do you cling to the law instead of your lease? Have you ever heard of landlords loving people over illegally, or you just think that it can't happen to you? I have a copy and it does not automatically go month to month. Landlords loving people over illegally is a bad idea in Washington. Penalties (paid to the tenant from the landlord) start with triple the security deposit and go up from there. RheaConfused: I'm not sure where that is exactly. This might be it: http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=59.04.010 quote:Tenancies from year to year are hereby abolished except when the same are created by express written contract. Leases may be in writing or print, or partly in writing and partly in print, and shall be legal and valid for any term or period not exceeding one year, without acknowledgment, witnesses or seals. I swear there's another statute that states the notary requirement more clearly.
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Feb 6, 2014 02:42
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Well, I don't think it matters in your case anyway. What the important question is is does your lease contemplate your rate going up to market rate when you switch to month to month? edit: so... it doesn't automatically go month to month? So does it not have a notice provision then? Do you have a landlord? I thought you were renting from one of those corporatey type complexes? RheaConfused fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Feb 6, 2014 |
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Feb 6, 2014 02:45
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Old Fart posted:Ah, there it is, the periodic almost-heartfelt post to keep us hooked. Intermittent reinforcement is a powerful tool, one that is used to great effect in abusive relationships. If only I get things just right then maybe we'll have those good times like we used to. A never-ending array of hoops to jump through, some of them set on fire. Yeah, I've noticed this every time as well, usually when he gets caught out on some bullshit he packs his ball up and goes home in a huff, then an hour later every post is "hhmm, good point, I'll come back to that" and he never comes back to it with anything meaningful.
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Feb 6, 2014 02:49
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Wait, it doesn't go month to month? Then what does it do?
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Feb 6, 2014 02:54
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Shut the gently caress up about the lease already. SloMo, ask your landlord how much notice he needs. As long as he isn't a dick about it, give him that such that you move out ASAP without incurring extra fees. Who the gently caress cares about semantics of the law unless the landlord is being a dick over it. There's bigger fish to fry than just freeing up another $1000/mo, namely developing financial discipline so that said $1000/mo isn't just pissed away on vacations, hookers and blow.
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Feb 6, 2014 03:02
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RheaConfused posted:Well, I don't think it matters in your case anyway. What the important question is is does your lease contemplate your rate going up to market rate when you switch to month to month? Management company. I'm using the term 'landlord' loosely. Horking Delight posted:Wait, it doesn't go month to month? Then what does it do? It goes month to month if management accepts a check for the next month of rent. If I were to give no notice and stay past the end of the lease I could open myself to liability for one month of that 'market rate' that RheaConfused is concerned about. If I give no notice and just move out it's just a normal move out. In reviewing my lease I noticed that my security deposit is a whole $200. That's to protect the owners from those triple security deposit penalties if the gently caress up any of the move-out procedures. Hah!
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Feb 6, 2014 03:08
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