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TheBuilder posted:I asked him if he'd be willing to pay the 15 grand for the wedding I wanted to do in the USA as is our culture for the bride's parents to pay - this of course didn't go over so hot. Hahaha, nice. At that point he's either got to furiously backtrack, make up some bullshit about how Westerners have more money, or play the "Chinese culture is supreme and other cultures don't matter" card. Was it you that had (or had a friend who had) serious problems with the in-laws after a baby was born? I vaguely remember some real  stories.
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Feb 9, 2014 21:52
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My inlaws visited in early fall last year, and I did have some trouble out of them. Our daughter was about 8 months old at the time, but my wife stood up to most of their complaints about our childcare. Their ideas about baby diet and care were nearly impossible to make compatible with my wife's. In the end, the inlaws got the opportunity to visit us for 3 months on an all expenses paid trip, and one of their other daughters used us for a travel visa which she ultimately overstayed and is now working illegally in a Japanese restaurant making good pay (and sending most of it home), so in the end, it worked out ok for ol' pops.
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Feb 9, 2014 21:57
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Woodsy Owl posted:Dudes with Chinese wives; did you end up paying a dowry or bride-price or whatever to your wife's parents? How did you reconcile your ethical position to accomodate this tradition? My girlfriend and I have been discussing marriage and the only defense she could raise for giving a dowry to her parents was that they'll lose face if I don't. It's a hosed tradition. Have not paid any dowry, though also haven't done the whole big party in her hometown (we got married in the US and will finally be going back in May to do that thing). In our case though we already support her parents pretty much 100% so I don't know how that would work if we (or I?) were supposed to pay more?
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Feb 9, 2014 22:47
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If they wanna play the Traditional China card, then you guys can just play it right back. Shave your heads into a Manchurian queue, pay the bride price, strike her name from their ancestral hall, then take her back to your village where she will never again have contact with her family. Also foot binding.
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Feb 9, 2014 23:00
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The girl I dated before my current girlfriend said she needed 50k RMB if we were going to get married. I told her absolutely not and that I was a foreigner and that was just insane. She said she had to pay this money to her family, even though she hates them. I said no, we can just leave. She said "no, I have to." I really loved her a lot and felt terrible for her but I'm sorry, there's no way I'm going to pay 50k for a bride, because that is just crazy. Good on her, though, as she is working now in New Zealand to make that money herself so she can "buy freedom" as she put it. Some Chinese traditions are hosed as all hell.
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Feb 10, 2014 00:16
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goldboilermark posted:The girl I dated before my current girlfriend said she needed 50k RMB if we were going to get married. I told her absolutely not and that I was a foreigner and that was just insane. She said she had to pay this money to her family, even though she hates them. I said no, we can just leave. She said "no, I have to." I really loved her a lot and felt terrible for her but I'm sorry, there's no way I'm going to pay 50k for a bride, because that is just crazy. On the one hand, $8,000 or so isn't a lot of money. On the other hand, it's $8,000 more than a human being should have to pay for the freedom of choice.
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Feb 10, 2014 00:19
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caberham posted:Nope no good local beer here in the south Oh well, I'm sure I'll find something to enjoy. I was pleasantly surprised to find a Paulaner restaurant in Shanghai so you never know what you can stumble upon. I get enough traditional Chinese food during the work-related dinners because apparently I'm the guest of honor or some happy horseshit like that. And I'm unfortunately limited to a connection in Hong Kong both ways so I don't have time to visit the city properly. Work is a butthole that way. MeramJert posted:Like caberham said, there's nothing like that place in Shanghai down here. There's some guy in either Guangzhou or Shenzhen that makes small batches of whiskey that are pretty good if you can find it, but I don't really know where to find it anymore. For a more real local thing, there's places down here that do hornet and snake venom infused shots of baijiu or something that are supposed to affect you more than alcohol alone does. I don't know if they do that other places in China or not. I was not the biggest fan of baijiu to begin with but if they start mixing snakes and poo poo with it, that can gently caress right off.
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Feb 10, 2014 00:53
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blinkyzero posted:On the one hand, $8,000 or so isn't a lot of money. Its sad because the parents have the opinion of "I raised you and brought to you into the world, so now you owe me X amount of RMB for the time I took care of you". What the gently caress, children aren't born and raised with the expectation of a goddamned payback.
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Feb 10, 2014 00:57
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This all sounds horrible, Anyone remember why the western equivalent of the dowry has kind of gone away? Gone are the days when parents would sell their daughters to a man who would take them off their hands. [Insert :GB: flag thing here, I'm on my phone so I can't check smilies code] Facepalm Ranger fucked around with this message at 01:54 on Feb 10, 2014 |
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Feb 10, 2014 01:50
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South Africa still has them. So if I wanted a Chinese wife, her dad would have to accept X heads of cattle from me. He's not getting 50,000RMB, though... gently caress that. Truth is, this does sometimes happen now: quote:Many traditional marriages utilise a cash-based Lobolo; this can be then followed by a European-style wedding ceremony, where the Lobolo funds are used to pay for expenses. In this way, any outlaid costs are returned to the payer in another form, preserving tradition, honour and finances.
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Feb 10, 2014 02:08
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systran posted:My wife's family is mostly from a very small town in Shandong. Some of them live in Jinan though. Her parents are pretty well off, but she has some super poor relatives too that live in those communal farm buildings way off in the middle of nowhere. Me and my girlfriend are in/going to be in the same situation soon (even the same region) and she said her parents probably won't want a bride price, thankfully, I just would have to get their permission for marriage. She said we'd probably just give them the hongbaos though because we'll have enough money in the US.
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Feb 10, 2014 02:35
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I can't justify paying someone's parents for the privilege for their daughter to exercise one of her inherent human rights. It's absolutely hosed. Is it coincidence that the only traditions that seem to have stuck around since the Cultural Revolution are financially beneficial? Anyway, this whole situation will be an exercise in compromise (ha!). Woodsy Owl fucked around with this message at 03:31 on Feb 10, 2014 |
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Feb 10, 2014 03:24
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You guys should share your stories in this thread. You're also making me glad that the one Chinese girl I dated seriously was from a family of BeiDa professors who both had extensive experience living abroad. In other news it is cold in China. I would not come to China now.
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Feb 10, 2014 04:59
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Man wish more Chinese would post here. Or non Chinese female foreigners dating/marrying Chinese. Oh well, I suppose my previous antics scared them all away  Marriage and bride price surfaces up from time to time, man everyone here in the forums is getting old. Woodsy Owl posted:Dudes with Chinese wives; did you end up paying a dowry or bride-price or whatever to your wife's parents? How did you reconcile your ethical position to accomodate this tradition? My girlfriend and I have been discussing marriage and the only defense she could raise for giving a dowry to her parents was that they'll lose face if I don't. It's a hosed tradition. Sorry to hear about your situation. This topic is tv soap material. First of all, your girlfriend needs a bigger back bone. TheBuilder posted:Didn't pay bride price. All of my wife's sisters and her mom were of the opinion that I was not of their culture, so I was exempt. Her dad on the other hand thew a shitfit of the idea that I wouldn't pony up fiften grand for a gift. This is one of the more unfortunate cases. Wife moved overseas because dad was an rear end in a top hat. The wedding is just single sided and the kids will grow up isolated from mom's relatives and Chinese culture. And your father inlaw is dumb. If he was actually a nice sensible person he would have been able to get your support a lot easier in the long term instead of being a money grubbing rear end in a top hat. TheBuilder posted:My inlaws visited in early fall last year, and I did have some trouble out of them. Our daughter was about 8 months old at the time, but my wife stood up to most of their complaints about our childcare. Their ideas about baby diet and care were nearly impossible to make compatible with my wife's. It's not that happy of a deal when you have this lingering house guest. You guys are so remote that you call your sister-in law "one of their daughters". Geeze Going to America to do some dead end service job is pretty much failure when she's on the cusp of finishing her studies and having a life of her own. A bachelor's certainly doesn't mean job security but at least she should have tried working on her own in China and having some autonomy instead of being some illegal.MeramJert posted:My girlfriend's dad told her last year that when she gets married and he gets the bride price, he'll just deposit 100% of the money into her personal bank account. Are you sure you wouldn't get anything back? Your girlfriend's dad is cool. But so is your choice in women. And you are cool too! This should be the loving gold standard. systran posted:Her cousin, whose parents are way more rich and live in a big city, got about $100,000 USD from her wedding reception. So basically this reception is a huge potential moneymaker, and you probably don't expect to be turning your marriage into a loving business opportunity, so just tell them they can keep all of the money, and that is the dowry? That's a nice attitude. But I recently have encountered a very very miserable wedding experience. Normally I would be posting whatever and whenever but this one just drives me mad and upset. goldboilermark posted:The girl I dated before my current girlfriend said she needed 50k RMB if we were going to get married. I told her absolutely not and that I was a foreigner and that was just insane. She said she had to pay this money to her family, even though she hates them. I said no, we can just leave. She said "no, I have to." I really loved her a lot and felt terrible for her but I'm sorry, there's no way I'm going to pay 50k for a bride, because that is just crazy. Foreigner or no foreigner, asking someone else for X amount of RMB out of thin air is just retarded. Facepalm Ranger posted:This all sounds horrible, Anyone remember why the western equivalent of the dowry has kind of gone away? Well aren't you being supported by your girlfriend and her family right now? So I guess the tradition in is still alive in some way  I look forward to your Cheetos/Mountain Dew/PS3 wedding.
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Feb 10, 2014 05:32
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goldboilermark, a few months ago you posted in the job openings thread that your company is always recruiting. Is this still the case? I'm interested so please email me if you can gunstav @ gmail.com
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Feb 10, 2014 05:48
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I was going to type a spergy long paragraph  post but I give up.Cultural heritage and customs should be celebrated and embraced. BUT ONLY WHEN THEY ARE PRACTICAL. Setting off fireworks for hours and hours past midnight is dumb. Having a gigantic fireworks display by the harbour for one evening is much better. If someone else is shielding behind culture for their own personal gain then gently caress em. And young people nowadays, so bad at filial duty and tradition Chinese girlfriends/boyfriends should be the ones bridging the Chinese cultural gap. The "But I don't know how to confront my parents" excuse is bullshit because it's unfair for your significant other to deal with your family issues. Weak.And Chinese wedding customs differ by region. Things in Guangzhou like the hair combing ceremony don't exist in the North East. ***** And if you actually got nickel and dimed then you, your wife, your immediate family and everyone else will think the future inlaws are poo poo bag. I don't think my girlfriend would be too thrilled if everyone else looks down on her family (even if they are legitimate). Having young people pay a heft amount of money when they are just starting out a new phase in adult life is just loving cruel. I hate greedy money grubbing parents, wimpy kids, and people who taint my wonderful Chinese culture 
caberham fucked around with this message at 08:17 on Feb 10, 2014 |
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Feb 10, 2014 07:55
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Don't pay money for your wife, wtf. Don't marry into that kind of lunacy.
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Feb 10, 2014 08:11
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Facepalm Ranger posted:
My mom's parents (though from everything I've heard about them, I'm guessing it was just the mother...my grandmother was an awful person) tried to do that to her when she was 17. In North Dakota. In 1971. The man was like 45.
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Feb 10, 2014 08:28
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Baddog posted:Don't pay money for your wife, wtf. Don't marry into that kind of lunacy. Oh but paying cows is OK?  
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Feb 10, 2014 08:33
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Is anyone else a bit worried about paying for the health care of the inlaws? As far as I can tell, their health insurance is fairly lovely/non-existent. Routine care is obviously dirt cheap, but major issues that require decent non-witch-doctor specialists seem to be on the way to getting really expensive. Sister in law had some problems with a pregnancy requiring her to be hospitalized for a bit, and the bill was no joke. We sent a check to help (which they didn't cash, I think I won the chinese-in-law lottery), but it got me thinking about whats gonna happen if her folks get really sick in their old age. Seems like the worst case is actually much worse than the US, where at least old people will still get some minimum of care while only being personally bankrupted. In China it seems like if they run out of cash, they don't get poo poo?
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Feb 10, 2014 08:34
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I'm really happy that my girlfriend says she has no idea what all this bride-price stuff is about and that she's never seen it before. The only thing she seemed to think is related to weddings in China is basically having huge receptions that are sources of hongbaos. So yeah, ymmv.
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Feb 10, 2014 08:40
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Baddog posted:Is anyone else a bit worried about paying for the health care of the inlaws? As far as I can tell, their health insurance is fairly lovely/non-existent. ChineseDatingProblems.txt - "How are your parents" is actually one of the questions you can ask in that stupid dating show. But yeah, sometimes people will not date you if they know that you already have an ailing mother/father/whatever. That's why people are so crazy about housing/income/etc. There's not much of a social safety net for non government/non party people. You dad is already on the wheel chair and turned alcoholic? gently caress that probably means a bigger financial burden and less money in the household. Not being able to afford help for your loved ones just plain suck.
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Feb 10, 2014 09:06
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Bloodnose posted:If they wanna play the Traditional China card, then you guys can just play it right back. Bring recent medical reports documenting the status of the prospective chattel's hymen to any negotiations involving Bride Price. Pro-PRC Laowai posted:I used to think that bride price was a thing but then I went on taobao and found a bride for, like, half the price I had seen everywhere else.
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Feb 10, 2014 09:16
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I did not pay bride price because my family does not believe in exchanging humans for money, even if it is just symbolic. I explained it was part of my culture, and that people in my country had fought a war over this issue, and we feel very strongly about it. That was acceptable. But we paid for everything else, which turned out to be quite expensive (though much cheaper than a us wedding) and had to buy a bunch of gold and poo poo, and did give the mother some symbolic amount of money at the ceremony (it wasn't much, though) and they gave me a lesser amount. But if you want to go traditional, the parents are supposed to give you money the first time you meet your girlfriend's family (which is tacitly a pre-engagement event). Edit: also not paying bride price is on my wife's mental list of grievances to rattle off every time we get in an argument, so maybe it would have been worth the money.
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Feb 10, 2014 09:33
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Really goons, be careful when your relationships get serious. bad day posted:I did not pay bride price because my family does not believe in exchanging humans for money, even if it is just symbolic. I explained it was part of my culture, and that people in my country had fought a war over this issue, and we feel very strongly about it. If you simply stated that you were not comfortable with the bride price, then fine. But the "in my country..."? Oh please  That's almost just as bad as the other side insisting on bride price BECAUSE CHINESE CULTURE Hey guess what? The Confederate flag still exists in Mississippi. The Homestead Act was basically WHITES ONLY. Red lining is still a thing. Desegregated school buses lead to race riots. Gentrification means gently caress poors and gently caress black people. Black people are not property, they are just as free as any other man! Those hard fought unalienable rights. Yet Black people still live in institutionalized racism and end up in prison way higher than everyone else. Yeah, in my country...  Don't even get me started on US foreign policy. God now I sound like Pro PRC Lao Wai or some social justice warrior. Where's my fedora  quote:That was acceptable. But we paid for everything else, which turned out to be quite expensive (though much cheaper than a us wedding) and had to buy a bunch of gold and poo poo, and did give the mother some symbolic amount of money at the ceremony (it wasn't much, though) and they gave me a lesser amount. I'm sorry if you got strong armed into things Nice wedding pictures though  quote:But if you want to go traditional, the parents are supposed to give you money the first time you meet your girlfriend's family (which is tacitly a pre-engagement event). This is true. Or a subtle hint as approval from your folks. Parents will probably give you poo poo if you keep on bringing different girls and collecting all the time, so be careful quote:Edit: also not paying bride price is on my wife's mental list of grievances to rattle off every time we get in an argument, so maybe it would have been worth the money. What a lovely thing to do. Perpetually holding on to past grudges and bringing it up whenever convenient for argument's sake is not healthy. First it's QUIT YOUR JOB. Now it's QUIT YOUR WIFE. What's next 5 years down the road? QUIT YOUR LIFE
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Feb 10, 2014 10:31
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caberham posted:What a lovely thing to do. Perpetually holding on to past grudges and bringing it up whenever convenient for argument's sake is not healthy. First it's QUIT YOUR JOB. Now it's QUIT YOUR WIFE. What's next 5 years down the road? QUIT YOUR LIFE No it's gonna be QUIT SOCIETY and we will be encouraged to become monks who live in caves and subsist on yak's milk and calming sutras.
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Feb 10, 2014 11:39
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Ceciltron posted:No it's gonna be QUIT SOCIETY and we will be encouraged to become monks who live in Except now ERIC is shite.
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Feb 10, 2014 11:50
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Ceciltron posted:No it's gonna be QUIT SOCIETY and we will be encouraged to become monks who live in caves and subsist on yak's milk and calming sutras. I've told my girlfriend if we get married I want to live in a small town in the Pacific Northwest, even Alaska (because they will pay you to live there fulltime and I already did it before), away from people and she was like "me too". And I said "You know I really hate everyone" and she said "me too". MY GIRL 
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Feb 10, 2014 12:59
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Baddog posted:Don't pay money for your wife, wtf. Don't marry into that kind of lunacy. Also this was the big thing for me. You are marrying INTO a family that accepts this poo poo. And I don't care what they say or what the girl says, it won't stop after a dowry. Once they have blood in the water, it will be money forever, because she is THEIR DAUGHTER and don't you LOVE US? blah blah blah nonsense
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Feb 10, 2014 13:02
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goldboilermark posted:MY GIRL GuestBob posted:Then again, maybe she isn't real - which doesn't mean she isn't "meaningful", I am pretty sure there are a bunch of
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Feb 10, 2014 13:31
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goldboilermark posted:Alaska (because they will pay you to live there fulltime and I already did it before For how long? 23 years here, and it was about 17 years too long. The PFD isn't worth it, and Alaska sure the gently caress ain't going to help your misanthropy.
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Feb 10, 2014 13:33
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Why does he need help? Is misanthropy a problem?
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Feb 10, 2014 13:42
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MeramJert posted:Why does he need help? Is misanthropy a problem? Hands up if you would join a secular monastery. [edit for fearcotton] Penis optional, beard mandatory. GuestBob fucked around with this message at 13:48 on Feb 10, 2014 |
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Feb 10, 2014 13:45
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At any other time in human history I would have joined a monastery. Think of all the old books to read and wine to drink!
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Feb 10, 2014 14:06
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VideoTapir posted:For how long? 2013 paid 900 usd for one year. Is that even enough for heat and gas in Alaska? Hey goldboilermark, if you like free money from the government why not try collecting welfare  Anyways I'm super fascinated by Alaska, some guy used to post a Alaskan living thread and few stripper goons posted their stories there. It seems to be a frozen wasteland like hei long Jiang. At least Chinese north eastern folk make great dumplings. How about Alaska?
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Feb 10, 2014 14:10
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Ceciltron posted:At any other time in human history I would have joined a monastery. Think of all the old books to read and wine to drink and mysteries to solve! You forget the best bit: BBC dramatisation of Ellis Peters' Cadfael series. Watch it.
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Feb 10, 2014 14:14
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GuestBob posted:You forget the best bit:
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Feb 10, 2014 14:38
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Alaska is better than Heilongjiang. Alaskan Amber/Alaskan IPA/Alaskan Summer Ale/Alaskan Brewing Company is my choice of beer from anywhere in the world, it's cold, it's dark, it rains all summer, outdoors stuff galore, wildlife, people leave you alone, northern lights/amazing scenery. Trust me if I can get a University job in Alaska a large amount of people in my life would never hear from me for years. No one cares what you do in Alaska. It's like China, except it's clean, people don't stare at you, scream at you, piss on manholes near you or spit on the floor next to you. Only problem is everything there is a bit more expensive because it is ridiculous to get all the stuff up there but it's a small price to pay, we made trips to the Wal-mart in Wasilla to load up and I even went to a few movies in Anchorage on my day trips. After living in the third largest metropolitan city in China, going back to small town Maine is good. I'm talking like 4,000 people small town Maine. Alaska sounds even better.
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Feb 10, 2014 14:55
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caberham posted:If you simply stated that you were not comfortable with the bride price, then fine. But the "in my country..."? Oh please Well I get what you're trying to say, but surely the things we are/aren't comfortable with are in large part due to our upbringing and the culture we grew up in.
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Feb 10, 2014 16:15
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caberham posted:What a lovely thing to do. Perpetually holding on to past grudges and bringing it up whenever convenient for argument's sake is not healthy. First it's QUIT YOUR JOB. Now it's QUIT YOUR WIFE. What's next 5 years down the road? QUIT YOUR LIFE I don't ever think I've had a serious relationship where there wasn't a list of grievances hauled out at some point or another.. Clearly you haven't dated anyone long enough to reach that stage.
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Feb 10, 2014 17:12
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