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TARDISman posted:But funnels and the like are actually a part of the machine, whereas a squadron of dudes running around sticking C4 on stuff just feels cheap. Typical Feddie scum, always underestimating the strength and character of the average Zeon soldier. Also my local comic shop has started selling gunpla of all grades and basically said they'll order everything I need for the kitbash of my dreams. I'm trying to save money but the siren call of Gunpla has taken my heart 
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Feb 11, 2014 01:04
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See if they can order the old SEED NG 1/144s. You could be the one to craft the Perfect Gunbarrel Star Build Strike Noir Full Package IWSP Plavsky Wing [Speed Mode]!
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Feb 11, 2014 01:09
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:Typical Feddie scum, always underestimating the strength and character of the average Zeon soldier. Typical dirty Zeke, always using underhanded tricks instead of true skill! 
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Feb 11, 2014 01:11
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BlitzBlast posted:See if they can order the old SEED NG 1/144s. You could be the one to craft the Perfect Gunbarrel Star Build Strike Noir Full Package IWSP Plavsky Wing [Speed Mode]! Nah man, just need a MG Age-Titus, MG Gouf, and maybe some bits and odds-and-ends from Either MG Zeta or the Exia. Fair off impossible dream kit I need a MG Maxter to have ever existed. All Melee, all thruster Gouf painted White with purple detailing/accents. EDIT: Found this neat little thing for all you gunpla building boys and girls ZenMasterBullshit fucked around with this message at 01:24 on Feb 11, 2014 |
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Feb 11, 2014 01:19
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Sharkopath posted:Was anybody else kinda hoping that the brothers would have ended up winning instead? Like I knew it wasn't going to happen but they just put in so much effort. Absolutely. The Kampfer Amazing sucks, and Reiji and Sei already fought Yuuki.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:02
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boom boom boom posted:Absolutely. The Kampfer Amazing sucks, and Reiji and Sei already fought Yuuki. Well now their fighting the meijin, not yuuki so it's all good. Also the kampfer amazing is cool as hell, what's the matter with you.  .
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Feb 11, 2014 02:15
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Monaghan posted:Well now their fighting the meijin, not yuuki so it's all good. It's the Kampfer, which was already, by design, a dumb suit, and they just strapped a bunch of boxes with guns in them on it. Compare that to double sword huge fist Astray, magic Qubeley, asymmetrical Wing, Strike with all the glowy effects, and the goddamn GM Sniper K9. Doesn't even have panzerfausts on the legs anymore.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:19
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boom boom boom posted:It's the Kampfer, which was already, by design, a dumb suit, and they just strapped a bunch of boxes with guns in them on it. Compare that to double sword huge fist Astray, magic Qubeley, asymmetrical Wing, Strike with all the glowy effects, and the goddamn GM Sniper K9. The GM Sniper K9 is a GM Sniper II with a backpack, which is roughly the same amount of visual difference that the Kampfer Amazing has from the Kampfer. Also the original Kampfer wasn't a dumb suit, it was actually pretty well equipped and thought out for what it was supposed to do(get in, blow something up, get out) because it's a giant pile of weapons and rocket boosters. It certainly made a lot more sense than a lot of the garbage Zeon was trying to produce.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:38
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boom boom boom posted:The Kampfer Amazing sucks I know opinions cannot technically be wrong, but I feel like this is getting real drat close. The Kampfer Amazing is literally just a better Kampfer and the Kampfer is one of the best Zeon suits period. And since Zeon has all the best suits, it's basically the best MS ever barring the one Robotic boxing football player
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Feb 11, 2014 02:49
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I was really, really scared of how this episode would go. Even in the episode I had a lot of moments in which I thought "yeah, they're going to gently caress this up royally and annoy the hell out of me". I have no idea what I was thinking, I know how (I'm sorry for this) amazing this show is, and holy poo poo did this episode not disappoint. I thought the whole secret attack thing would end up being cheating, and so the one Latin American competitor (not to mention the one team from my country in one of the very few anime ever that remembered its existance) would just get kicked out. Instead, they're shown as extremely competent tacticians with a bunch of hidden, but fair, tactics. The Zeon soldiers were amusing and creative, and then they bust out the EXAM System when I had all but called their defeat. Holy poo poo, that was extremely entertaining. On the other hand, Yuuki was absolutely boring this time around. The grease thing was clever, and going back to get his weaponry wasn't bad either, but...he just kind of paled in comparison. Then again, that might just be because I really wanted him to lose, yet had fully accepted it was not going to happen because we can't go without a Reiji/Sei vs Yuuki rematch. Still, that was an (I'm sorry again) amazing episode, and the battle was probably the most creative I've seen in all of Gundam. This is why I love this series. About the Renato brothers attitude, it's likely just being in a competitive enviroment. However, I say this mostly because I'm not too sure when the series is happening nor how old they are. They look in their 20s, so it's almost entirely impossible they've been in an actual war (unless Gundam Build Fighters is predicting that we're having another war soon...). So yeah, they're probably just competitive assholes. I still rooted for them since they were shown, dammit, and they gave one hell of a fight.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:52
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Maybe the Argentine Gunpla scene is hyper competitive? Maybe they practically did fight a Gunpla war to get to the world championship? I really do want to know what their beef was. Do they just not like the fact the Meijin is just some privlidged teenager? One who didn't even build his own gunpla for the tournament even.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:58
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Galaga Galaxian posted:Maybe the Argentine Gunpla scene is hyper competitive? Maybe they practically did fight a Gunpla war to get to the world championship? One interpretation of them I like is that they're sort of an inverse Fellini. Fellini spends some time acknowledging that the new generation of Gunpla builders and fighters are raising the bar and threatening the older generation - look what happened to Greco and Kaiser, both some of the best of the previous generation, both punked horribly by new kids. Fellini's response to this is to acknowledge it and try to learn from it by engaging with the new generation on a personal level, even mentoring them and investing himself in their success. It's easy to imagine the Renato Brothers responding to it in a "Goddamn whippersnappers don't know what real Gunpla war is!" way. Yuuki/Meijin sort of exemplifies the new generation displacing the old generation; he's a high school kid who's garnered a huge adoring fanbase and is being feted as the King of Gunpla by pretty much everyone, with even other competitors in the tournament assuming he's going to win all of his matches by default in the goddamn Round of 16 which contains the best of the best from around the world. From a crotchety older generation perspective, he's a smug little poo poo who was handed his excellent gunpla on a silver platter by PPSE and given every advantage in the world to win. Kicking the legs out from under someone like that would be incredibly satisfying from that perspective. This interpretation is shored up even more by the Renatos' choice of suits and tactics. Instead of relying on Plavsky gimmicks and super heavy customization jobs like most of the younger gunpla fighters, they rely on solid, relatively basic and down to earth gunpla tailored for the situation at hand and focus primarily on using their cleverness and experience to win.
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Feb 11, 2014 03:14
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Kanos posted:The GM Sniper K9 is a GM Sniper II with a backpack, which is roughly the same amount of visual difference that the Kampfer Amazing has from the Kampfer. A backpack that is a mobile autonomous weapons platform with it's own backpack which is a detachable Zeon troop transport. It also has a knife on it's shoulder. quote:Also the original Kampfer wasn't a dumb suit, it was actually pretty well equipped and thought out for what it was supposed to do(get in, blow something up, get out) because it's a giant pile of weapons and rocket boosters. It certainly made a lot more sense than a lot of the garbage Zeon was trying to produce. The Kampfer was designed to appear super bad rear end. That's why it's got a giant robot shotgun and big guns on it's shoulders and panzerfausts strapped to it's legs and a chain-whip made of bombs and is ever curvier and spiker than normal Zeon suits. [0080 SPOILERS]But it get's completely wrecked and the pilot dies and almost the entire squad is wiped out because they didn't have enough intel on the enemies capabilities. The Kampfer is the idea that badassness counts for absolutely nothing when the other guy has a machine gun up his sleeve you don't know about. [0080 AND BUILD FIGHTER SPOILERS]Honestly, the whole fight was kinda a weird flip around of the original Kampfer/Alex fight. The K9 is a normal grunt suit, but it's got a poo poo ton of capabilities the enemy doesn't know about, the pilot is a master tactitian and a loving genius at battlefield control, but in the end the Kampfer amazing wins. I guess because it's badass.
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Feb 11, 2014 03:19
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The Super Renato Brothers lost because they made a major mistake. That's a pretty legitimate way to lose man.
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Feb 11, 2014 03:22
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:I know opinions cannot technically be wrong, but I feel like this is getting real drat close. The Kampfer Amazing is literally just a better Kampfer and the Kampfer is one of the best Zeon suits period. The Kampfer can do no wrong. Anything involving a Kampfer is automatically Amazing.
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Feb 11, 2014 03:38
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boom boom boom posted:[0080 SPOILERS]But it get's completely wrecked and the pilot dies and almost the entire squad is wiped out because they didn't have enough intel on the enemies capabilities. The Kampfer is the idea that badassness counts for absolutely nothing when the other guy has a machine gun up his sleeve you don't know about. That doesn't seem like the Kampfer's fault (other than its limited endurance thanks to not carrying reloads) and more the fault of, as you say, poor intel. That is like calling the Graf Spee a lovely cruiser because the crew scuttled it in a neutral port because they thought a British battleship and carrier were waiting outside for them (they were 3000 miles away). Or to keep it Gundamish, calling the RX-78 lovely because Amuro didn't know what the Zeong was capable of at first.
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Feb 11, 2014 03:46
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Galaga Galaxian posted:That doesn't seem like the Kampfer's fault (other than its limited endurance thanks to not carrying reloads) and more the fault of, as you say, poor intel. Here's the thing, Mobile Suit Gundam 0080 is one of those pieces of fiction where stuff means things and represents poo poo. I mean, I'm not gonna call it a super deep deconstruction of standard Gundam tropes, because, be fair, it's not, but it is trying to do stuff.
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Feb 11, 2014 03:52
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Oh man, that episode. That was one of the most intense fights in the franchise. Also, interestingly, the Kampfer Amazing has had a lot more screen time than the actual Kampfer. The Kampfer is a suit that is designed to be really fast and pack a lot of firepower, but it's very lightly armored. It's a glass cannon... at least in the UC, not so much in this.
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Feb 11, 2014 04:10
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Fellini is a bad influence on Maoh. He done hosed up with Misaka.
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Feb 11, 2014 04:51
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I guess Mao is going to be relegated to the goofy comic relief role now.
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Feb 11, 2014 05:01
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Pureauthor posted:I guess Mao is going to be relegated to the goofy comic relief role now. I wish he'd just go away so I can stop hearing his voice. Man, did the Gundam X Maoh episode look even worse after this one.
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Feb 11, 2014 05:05
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TARDISman posted:But funnels and the like are actually a part of the machine, whereas a squadron of dudes running around sticking C4 on stuff just feels cheap. The zeon soldiers are part of the k9 unit machine too. And they are quite slow and requires a lot of precision. It is downright weak compared to Aila's 'cloaked' funnels in utility. You seriously need a lot more effort to use that system compared to other remote weapons. After all, in a direct fight against Luang the brother specifically said they need to wait like around 20 seconds for the bombers to do their work.
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Feb 11, 2014 05:27
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Kanos posted:Who said they did their trick while Luang was watching? They could have easily released the soldiers at the start and had them simply come from behind when Luang had them engaged in close combat because there was a heavily forested area to conceal them in. The brothers even have it planned out. "Hold him in place for 20 seconds" - Give the little guys time to come up behind him and do their thing. You know, I honestly hadn't thought of that. I expected the 20 seconds line to just refer to the amount of time it'd take to release and plant. I withdraw my complaint. Kanos posted:One interpretation of them I like is that they're sort of an inverse Fellini. I don't know, the line they use, presuming it's accurately subbed mentions Yuuki as a spoiled, peacetime rich boy. Seems to indicate pretty heavily they were involved in an actual serious bit of fighting at some point in their lives to me. boom boom boom posted:Here's the thing, Mobile Suit Gundam 0080 is one of those pieces of fiction where stuff means things and represents poo poo. I think you may be looking too far for meaning to be honest. Also, I posit that the GM Sniper K9 represents the idea of tacticool badassness and how all that badassness counts for nothing if your pilot(s) are gloating idiots who waste the chance they bought themselves. Food for thought.
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Feb 11, 2014 05:28
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tsob posted:I don't know, the line they use, presuming it's accurately subbed mentions Yuuki as a spoiled, peacetime rich boy. Seems to indicate pretty heavily they were involved in an actual serious bit of fighting at some point in their lives to me. When? I pointed this out in my last post, Argentina hasn't been in war for a long while at this point, and the Renato brothers are likely in their late 20s at best. Unless Gundam Build Fighters is saying we're having another war soon, they really couldn't have been involved in any sort of war. I seriously think it's just them being dicks. I mean, I can think of several scenarios in which their lives could've gone badly, but not war-level badly. Maybe they just watched a bit too much Gundam and they're projecting? (or maybe it's me who's projecting?)
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Feb 11, 2014 05:36
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Blaze Dragon posted:When? I pointed this out in my last post, Argentina hasn't been in war for a long while at this point, and the Renato brothers are likely in their late 20s at best. Unless Gundam Build Fighters is saying we're having another war soon, they really couldn't have been involved in any sort of war. Falklands 2: Electric Bugaboo.
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Feb 11, 2014 05:41
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Blaze Dragon posted:When? I pointed this out in my last post, Argentina hasn't been in war for a long while at this point, and the Renato brothers are likely in their late 20s at best. Unless Gundam Build Fighters is saying we're having another war soon, they really couldn't have been involved in any sort of war. It takes place in the near future so the show can place as fast and loose with reality as it wants to. Not to mention that they could presumably be from another country originally and be transplanted citizens, since Reiji can compete for Japan without any issues. One of the first organizations to lay down arms in 00 was the Real IRA, with the show commenting that the troubles in Northern Ireland had been going on for roughly 400 years. At the time 00 was being made there had been a pretty effective cease fire in Northern Ireland for over a decade. If something seems to contradict reality in a Gundam show my first thought wouldn't be that the show must mean something else because clearly the guys making it are thorough in research and fact checking. tsob fucked around with this message at 05:51 on Feb 11, 2014 |
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Feb 11, 2014 05:44
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Man if you seriously think it's more likely that two characters might be victims of war instead of just kinda jerks in Build Fighters of all shows, I don't really know what to say.
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Feb 11, 2014 05:47
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tsob posted:I think you may be looking too far for meaning to be honest. Really? In Gundam 0080, The series about a Zeon attack force being sent to destroy a mobile suit that will not be ready until after the war is over, a climactic battle that happens after the motivation for it has already been defused, the two enemies meet in real life and like each other but are never actually aware of it and it doesn't affect their actions, and in the end, the whole thing was pointless and everyone died for nothing, the idea that the Kampfer being a super cool suit covered in weapons that still gets destroyed without accomplishing anything might be an intentional thing is reaching?
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Feb 11, 2014 05:50
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Given that at least half the suits in the entire franchise could probably be described as a super cool suit covered in weapons that doesn't achieve much, yea, that's what I'm saying.BlitzBlast posted:Man if you seriously think it's more likely that two characters might be victims of war instead of just kinda jerks in Build Fighters of all shows, I don't really know what to say. We already know that Aila is a least a street orphan picked up and used by a company for Gunpla purposes and that Gunpla mafia exist. Actual soldiers getting involved in Gunpla seems no more a stretch than either of those to me. tsob fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Feb 11, 2014 |
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Feb 11, 2014 05:52
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boom boom boom posted:Really? In Gundam 0080, The series about a Zeon attack force being sent to destroy a mobile suit that will not be ready until after the war is over, a climactic battle that happens after the motivation for it has already been defused, the two enemies meet in real life and like each other but are never actually aware of it and it doesn't affect their actions, and in the end, the whole thing was pointless and everyone died for nothing, the idea that the Kampfer being a super cool suit covered in weapons that still gets destroyed without accomplishing anything might be an intentional thing is reaching? Beside the falling in love stuff, futile battles and crazy hairbrained operations do actually take place in real wars.
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Feb 11, 2014 06:00
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DookieSandwich posted:Beside the falling in love stuff, futile battles and crazy hairbrained operations do actually take place in real wars. Yeah, but Gundam 0080 is fiction. Human people wrote down the things that happened in it. I know we're all anime fans here, but surely you must have at least heard of the concept of fiction having like, themes or morals or meaning or poo poo.
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Feb 11, 2014 06:12
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We have, but just because some things in a given work are thematic doesn't mean everything in a given work is thematic. Not even everything that you can work out after sitting down and thinking about it for a while. Some things are just coincidence, because if you go looking for patterns you'll find some, even where they were never intended in the first place because life is like that.
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Feb 11, 2014 06:16
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tsob posted:We have, but just because some things in a given work are thematic doesn't mean everything in a given work is thematic. Not even everything that you can work out after sitting down and thinking about it for a while. Some things are just coincidence, because if you go looking for patterns you'll find some, even where they were never intended in the first place because life is like that. The entire point of Gundam 0080 is the pointlessness and futility of war, you lunatic! The Kampfer is part of it! I'm not loving, breaking out the magnifying glass to look for bits of the background that look like cocks. Do you really think that we are explicitly denied a big knock down drag out fight between these two star-crossed loves in top of the line super cool unique robots, like what would happen in all other anime, on accident?
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Feb 11, 2014 06:24
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I wouldn't call a Zaku Kai a top of the line Zeon suit at that point in time.
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Feb 11, 2014 06:26
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I think you may have actually watched it with a magnifying glass, because you seem to have gotten the Kampfer mixed up with a Zaku. Bernie didn't pilot the Kampfer, the drunken dude did. And he did get a relatively badass scene, since he got to take out a poo poo ton of grunts all on his own before he met the Alex and died to it due to an unexpected weapon. It wasn't the most badass scene ever, but it was certainly pretty drat cool. And just because something isn't part of the background doesn't mean it can't still be coincidence by the way. Major stuff can be just as coincidental as minor stuff, because all of it has to be designed by someone and if you design enough stuff eventually some of it is going to fall under one of the show's themes even if you never intended it to just by law of averages. tsob fucked around with this message at 06:31 on Feb 11, 2014 |
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Feb 11, 2014 06:27
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DookieSandwich posted:I wouldn't call a Zaku Kai a top of the line Zeon suit at that point in time. tsob posted:I think you may have actually watched it with a magnifying glass, because you seem to have gotten the Kampfer mixed up with a Zaku. Bernie didn't pilot the Kampfter, the drunken dude did. And he did get a relatively badass scene, since he got to take out a poo poo ton of grunts all on his own before he met the Alex and died to it due to an unexpected weapon. It wasn't the most badass scene ever, but it was certainly pretty drat cool. That's what I said! boom boom boom posted:Do you really think that we are explicitly denied a big knock down drag out fight between these two star-crossed loves in top of the line super cool unique robots, like what would happen in all other anime, on accident?
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Feb 11, 2014 06:30
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Both of you misunderstood him. He's saying that in any other anime, the final duel would have been Bernie in the Kampfer and Chris in the Alex. Anyways as amusing as it is to see a guy simultaneously argue that a metaphor is proof that these two characters are totally war veterans and that someone else is looking into things too hard, this has nothing to do with Build Fighters and should really go in the Gundam general if you really want to talk about it.
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Feb 11, 2014 06:30
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I'm still not sure how the writer deciding the Kampher needs to get Worf'd by the Alex means it is "by design, a dumb suit".
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Feb 11, 2014 06:31
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BlitzBlast posted:Anyways as amusing as it is to see a guy simultaneously argue that a metaphor is proof that these two characters are totally war veterans They didn't actually use a metaphor - they outright called him a peacetime rich kid. That's not, by any definition a metaphor. And when the sole argument against it is that nothing bad can happen to people in the Gundam Build Fighters universe when Aila exists it's not really a particularly strong one.
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Feb 11, 2014 06:36
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tsob posted:They didn't actually use a metaphor - they outright called him a peacetime rich kid. That's not, by any definition a metaphor. And when the sole argument against it is that nothing bad can happen to people in the Gundam Build Fighters universe when Aila exists it's not really a particularly strong one. They treated Gundam Battling like a war, and were very serious about it, so it makes sense that they would mock other Gundam Battlers for not coming to it with the same outlook
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Feb 11, 2014 06:43
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