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BeavisNuke posted:I shot a web ad for this school entirely on the BMCC and go pro. (7d for time lapses only) Feels nice to ditch DSLR video. Which Get Lucky remix is that?
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Feb 11, 2014 07:06
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powderific posted:It's 8 bit 4:2:0. This makes it essentially worthless as anything other than a hobbyist camera. powderific posted:The breakout box is for uncompressed 4:2:2 10 bit 4k. And at this point one should just spend the money on a real cinema camera. At the end of the day it's still just a DSLR that needs extensive support to be cinema-worthy, and that any no-budget filmmaking might as well be done on a Canon T2i and save more money for what little extra a GH4 would get them. Also I just read that the chip is only micro four-thirds, which makes me even more annoyed with the product's hype. But hey what do I know? Somehow that poo poo-box C300 has sold like gangbusters despite being terrible.
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Feb 11, 2014 08:05
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The C300 is the most ergonomic handheld camera design ever, and while it is ridiculously overpriced it is a really nicely constructed piece of kit. Fortunately, all those suckers who bought it already basically subsidized the construction of the more accurately priced C100. edit: I don't know how the actual sensor size is on the GH3 and GH4, but on the GH2 movie mode was basically like a 1.8x crop. Not a huge difference from standard 35mm, and larger than the AF100 for some reason. 1st AD fucked around with this message at 08:15 on Feb 11, 2014 |
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Feb 11, 2014 08:12
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1st AD posted:The C300 is the most ergonomic handheld camera design ever, and while it is ridiculously overpriced it is a really nicely constructed piece of kit. While I'm glad you're happy with it and don't wish to antagonize you personally, I couldn't disagree more. You can't put it on your shoulder without extensive support, it's a really bad shape for any kind of camera work, and the cable outputs for the LCD are terrible design that breaks easily and is unrepairable. Not to mention that fact that they had a serious image debayering issue that they refused to publicly acknowledge and didn't release a public firmware fix for it until a year later. All of which might be forgivable if it wasn't so overpriced. It's just an awful camera.
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Feb 11, 2014 08:31
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I don't own it. And I said handheld and not on a rig, and I will stand by my statement that it's great for handheld use with no rig. And I already said it was overpriced (but the C100 is priced more reasonably and offers what I think is almost the exact same performance).
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Feb 11, 2014 08:45
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iSheep posted:Which Get Lucky remix is that? It's the vanderway / killtron remix: https://soundcloud.com/killtron/get-lucky-killtron-edit I am trying to get my school to buy a C100 just because it'll be easy to use. I can't train grad assistants on dslr video every year. BeavisNuke fucked around with this message at 13:55 on Feb 11, 2014 |
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Feb 11, 2014 13:50
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4K Blackmagic camera also has a global shutter, so that's a pretty attractive feature regardless of the resolution. The dealbreaker is that they've been very slow to address real issues in their firmware. A camera should be able to tell me how much recording time is left on the disk.
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Feb 11, 2014 15:33
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Jalumibnkrayal posted:4K Blackmagic camera also has a global shutter, so that's a pretty attractive feature regardless of the resolution. The dealbreaker is that they've been very slow to address real issues in their firmware. A camera should be able to tell me how much recording time is left on the disk. It does tell you the total hours:minutes:seconds recorded. So if you know how much your media holds, you'll know how much you have left. They said they are coming out with big firmware updates now that the production camera is shipping. I am interested in dual system sound just because it's more professional either way.
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Feb 11, 2014 15:52
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SquareDog posted:This makes it essentially worthless as anything other than a hobbyist camera. This is kindof ridiculous. Sure, there's a level where 4:2:0 isn't going to be ideal, but there is a lot of not hobbyist work being shot on 4:2:0 cameras. What camera do you consider acceptable for non-hobbyist work? It's not like the world of camera using professionals is exclusively those shooting features.
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Feb 11, 2014 16:18
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At work I have a PMW-200 shooting 50mbps 4:2:2 and I just hate hate hate using it. It's an ugly camera that renders skin tone in a very unattractive way, my D600 looks way better with 24mbps 4:2:0.
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Feb 11, 2014 16:20
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Sometimes I like to cruise reduser to enjoy schadenfreude of horribly wrong opinions but then I can just come here for it.
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Feb 11, 2014 16:35
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Mozzie posted:Sometimes I like to cruise reduser to enjoy schadenfreude of horribly wrong opinions but then I can just come here for it.
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Feb 11, 2014 16:37
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powderific posted:This is kindof ridiculous. Sure, there's a level where 4:2:0 isn't going to be ideal, but there is a lot of not hobbyist work being shot on 4:2:0 cameras. What camera do you consider acceptable for non-hobbyist work? It's not like the world of camera using professionals is exclusively those shooting features. I'm just saying it's overpriced for nothing more than a couple extra K's and few MBps when you could go cheaper with little difference. Mozzie posted:Sometimes I like to cruise reduser to enjoy schadenfreude of horribly wrong opinions but then I can just come here for it. Reduser is the worst, I hate that I have to read it for my work. It's just one big circle jerk with Jarred Land in the middle. And God forbid you should should say anything that even vaguely insinuates that Red cameras are anything less than God's gift to man.
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Feb 11, 2014 17:59
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Do you think that everything below the $20k mark is essentially the same or something? Maybe you're so used to higher end stuff that anything below it seems like different shades of the same garbage so you may as well but the cheapest one? I've had multicamera shoots with the T2i next to a GH3, D5200/D5300, and D800, and the T2i was a noticeable step down from any of the others to my eye. Enough so that I'd happily spend extra money for one of those other cameras. We don't know the Gh4's pricing yet, but the Gh3's pricing seemed fine and even discounting 4k the Gh4 has a good number of meaningful upgrades. I'm not saying that it's a be all and end all gamechanger or anything, but there's enough difference there to, uh, make a difference to many people.
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Feb 11, 2014 18:32
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I don't think it's improvements are enough to matter for its price range but I don't begrudge you or anyone to buy it. One could do a lot worse.
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Feb 11, 2014 18:52
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I think my hacked gh2 is great and all, but for another grand(estimate of gh4 & dock vs bm & batteries/drives) you can get raw cinema dng, s-35 sensor and global shutter. And maybe it was just the shooter and post work, but the gh4 footage in mexico wasn't all that impressive to me.
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Feb 12, 2014 22:02
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Honestly, I wasn't that impressed with that video either. But there are legitimate reasons a person might buy a GH4 over a BMPC. It's way smaller and easier to use handheld, plus it has a built in EVF. You get higher framerates available for 1080p. The GH4 probably does a little better in low light. And not everyone is going to need the dock thing, which makes the price difference larger.
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Feb 12, 2014 22:45
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1st AD posted:I don't own it. One of the reasons this bothers me so much is that I can still clearly remember an age where you didn't have to spend a fortune on third party accessories just to do the most basic things (like putting a camera on your shoulder). I am also of the belief that if you've designed a camera that needs so many third party accessories, you've screwed it up and should go back to design school because form should follow function! Even worse is with owner/operator packages because you never know how much they've invested in third party stuff (usually only the absolute minimum) so you end up with a barely usable package on set and end up having to compromise like mad to get anything done. Form factor is a hugely important part of a camera, it should be balanced and properly laid out. There is lots of precedent for this, cameras have been built that way for ages, so why are all these companies trying to reinvent the wheel, but in a square shape. It won't roll! I also do not want to waste time building a camera outside of adding a lens, battery, focus, and mattebox, it should come out of the box and be good to go. Even if they just gave me the option of a bigger body, with the same internals, I'd be happy. A lot of these manufacturers claim that they designed their cameras based on operator, and AC, feedback but I'd really like to know who those people are because they are wrong. I know a lot of operators and ACs, most work on very big shows, but also documentary guys and news guys, and as far as I know (and yes, I've asked) none of them have ever been approached by the likes of RED or Canon or Blackmagic so it makes me curious. I know ARRI has been working from real world feedback for ages and their cameras are great (if a bit heavy). It's even in the little things (Alexa has menu on the right side, where the AC usually is, but on the Amira it's on the left side, for the documentary solo shooter). It's little things like that that tell me they were listening. Now compare that to a C300, where the buttons are all over the place, and most are for functions you rarely need to change, so all they do is create dangerous scenarios where settings are accidentally changed when someone picks up the camera. I've gone on a bit of a rant here, sorry about that, but it really frustrates me that all these companies make such amazing tech and then it's like they run out of time, care, or energy when it comes to designing a great body to fit it all in. It's such a waste because it would make great cameras even better. Sometimes bigger really is better.
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Feb 14, 2014 16:00
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I'm bummed that there aren't any large sensor shoulder cams sub $20k or so. The F5 looks great and we're going to rent one for an upcoming project, but as a small ad agency with in-house production we need something cheaper for our lower budget work. Building a decent, shoulder mountable around a large sensor should be doable under $10k. I mean, there are (relatively) cheap small sensor shoulder mount cameras like the JVC-GM750, and then the cheap but sad image quality large sensor Sony EA50UH. It's frustrating that there just aren't any good options in that realm.
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Feb 14, 2014 16:49
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I agree, I always have a home-use camcorder for when I want to do personal stuff and the C100 is my current toy. Before that I was using a Z5U. I would spend more for something better if I could keep the entire thing under $10,000 but there's nothing there.Steadiman posted:Now compare that to a C300, where the buttons are all over the place, and most are for functions you rarely need to change, so all they do is create dangerous scenarios where settings are accidentally changed when someone picks up the camera. I agree with every word you said, but have to point out that the C300 can lock while running to prevent this sort of thing. Which to me says, "designed specifically for run-and-gun," so it just reinforces your point. Slim Killington fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Feb 14, 2014 |
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Feb 14, 2014 17:03
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Quote is not edit.
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Feb 14, 2014 17:05
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Having a GoPro and a phone on me nearly at all times means I shot a lot of little stuff infrequently. I really like Picasa/digiKam for managing photos. Is there something like that for video files?
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Feb 16, 2014 20:33
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Steadiman posted:I'm really going to have to disagree loudly, and wordy, with this. Ergonomically it truly is an awful camera. There is no mass to speak of, no inertia, and without a big load of third party accessories it is ridiculously unstable handheld. We get it, it is nothing compared to the Alexa. This was a conversation about the square bricks we use in the sub 5k price range and compared to those, it is an ergonomic dream.
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Feb 16, 2014 23:10
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BeavisNuke posted:We get it, it is nothing compared to the Alexa. This was a conversation about the square bricks we use in the sub 5k price range and compared to those, it is an ergonomic dream.
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Feb 17, 2014 00:06
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I definitely value the opinion of people who have experience with a variety of cameras, including stuff that's out of my reach. I'm just bummed that there isn't anything designed for shoulder use in the price ranges I can stomach--especially considering there isn't much/any engineering reason why there couldn't be. For now this is how I roll most of the time: 
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Feb 17, 2014 00:32
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My sentiments exactly.
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Feb 17, 2014 03:21
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powderific posted:I definitely value the opinion of people who have experience with a variety of cameras, including stuff that's out of my reach. I'm just bummed that there isn't anything designed for shoulder use in the price ranges I can stomach--especially considering there isn't much/any engineering reason why there couldn't be. For now this is how I roll most of the time: That doesn't hurt your neck?
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Feb 17, 2014 20:22
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Steadiman posted:That's great for a very specific, and tiny, market (run and gun, stunts, consumer) but awful for the rest of us. I'm sorry you feel this way but that's basically the entire market that DSLR and DSLR-like systems encompass. I mean I suppose Canon is partly at fault for trying to market this thing as some kind of indie filmmaker's dream camera, but it's basically for a solo shooter who is probably handheld most of the time. For just pure handheld work the ergonomics of the C100/C300 are fine and the weight isn't bad if you're running with something like a 35 IS. It's lightweight and all the controls that I need are at my finger tips. I'm comparing it to how heavy and fatiguing it is to use something like a 1/2" or 2/3" camcorder handheld for more than an hour at a time.
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Feb 17, 2014 20:38
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GOT VIRUS FROM MP3 posted:That doesn't hurt your neck? It actually hurts my upper back more than anything. Having the weight of a camera out in front like that gets tiring fast, but I can do a decently full day of shooting if I don't have too many interviews back to back. This is one area where the GH3 was a dream. It's SO light I didn't really get tired holding it.
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Feb 17, 2014 20:54
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Why doesn't that soundguy have headphones? I know next to nothing about boom operating other than that you need to point the mic at the person who is speaking but I thought headphones were a must.
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Feb 18, 2014 04:55
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Cause he's a PA not a real sound guy. I just make angry eyes at him if he's loving up. And he actually did a great job despite not being able to monitor. It was a very low budget run and gun shoot where we'd roll up with the client's brand ambassador street team, shoot a bunch of b-roll on location, talk random people on the street into doing an interview, and then cut it all together overnight. For interviews where that PA wasn't available we just used a handheld mic. And yeah, being able to hear what you're recording is generally a must for sound people. I've just made it work without a sound guy so often it's hard for me to justify one when money is tight, and when we DO have money for a sound guy, they've always had their own kit. So we're not well setup for proper boom mic work. powderific fucked around with this message at 05:32 on Feb 18, 2014 |
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Feb 18, 2014 05:30
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took this the other day.
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Feb 18, 2014 17:44
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Is that wood solid?
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Feb 18, 2014 19:31
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Mostly, it's hollowed out in places to accommodate cables. It sits great on your shoulder though.
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Feb 18, 2014 20:05
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I don't really foresee cameras going back to the big shoulder style. It may be better for professional workhorse cameras, but camera companies are really switching over to small box-style prosumer cameras. They sell more of them and can unify their production lines around fewer cameras instead of putting the same electronics in a bigger body. It's like when Apple switched to Final Cut Pro X and gave up on production houses. Selling 10,000 copies of $300 software will net you a lot more profit than selling 1,000 copies of $1,000 software.
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Feb 18, 2014 20:50
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As said throughout pretty much the last page, it depends entirely on your need. ENG cameras will probably never go small form. ARRI's investment in the Amira is proof that there's a high-budget run-and-gun market, and everyone else is stanced to cover the low-budget run-and-gun market. They'll never entirely faze out large body cameras.
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Feb 18, 2014 23:58
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Which goon works at Steiner in NY, cause I'll be there from LA for a shoot next week.
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Feb 19, 2014 01:14
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EnsGDT posted:Which goon works at Steiner in NY, cause I'll be there from LA for a shoot next week. That would be me! What job are you on?
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Feb 20, 2014 00:53
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Just wanted to post about a fun afternoon I had yesterday. I work at a university, and I make films for the university for promotion or recording lectures etc. The TV Production lecturer here is a guy I know fairly well (he used to be the producer of the UK version of Scrapheap Challenge!) and he asked me to help out with a little demonstration to his first year students. We basically brought in the following cameras: 1) Little Sony consumer handycam 2) Canon 650D + kit lens 3) Panasonic 41e 4) Canon XF305 5) Panasonic 371 (which is mine, and hence why he asked for help) The idea was to show them some technology of increasing complexity, demonstrate the pros and cons of each one. Talk about when you would use them etc. They were a really nice bunch of students, if a little shy at first, but then eventually we got into a nice little chat and they demonstrated some good knowledge. A few of them had never seen a proper broadcast camera before so when I brought the 371 out they were quite amazed. I reluctantly let a few of them pop it on their shoulder and see what it was like to operate (even though it's not really student-borrowable kit unlike the other cameras) and we also plugged each camera into a decent flat-panel display to show the output and the quality difference. Then talked about codecs and stuff. Then we played a fun game of "guess the price of the camera" and they were pretty much spot on with every camera which was really freaky and I wonder if they googled them secretly. Anyway, I have no real story or question or whatever, just wanted to talk about a nice thing that I did. Especially since public speaking is terrifying for me. Go and do something nice if you have some spare time and spread your knowledge. It's fun! thehustler fucked around with this message at 16:32 on Feb 20, 2014 |
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Feb 20, 2014 10:12
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AccountSupervisor posted:That would be me! What job are you on? NBCU Upfront! We were there last year for it too, but I don't remember if you worked there yet then.
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Feb 20, 2014 15:55
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