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tagesschau posted:Three posts later... I can just imagine the shitstorm coming from 10 Million units hitting the market over the next 15 years. A lot of people are going to discover their parents were utterly retarded and are now completely impoverished, leaving the children with no inheritance and holding the bag for keeping their parents from living on the street.
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 19:18 |
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# ? May 23, 2024 15:41 |
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Yeah, speaking of which, can you get stuck with a relative's consumer debt if she dies?
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 20:15 |
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Rime posted:I can just imagine the shitstorm coming from 10 Million units hitting the market over the next 15 years. A lot of people are going to discover their parents were utterly retarded and are now completely impoverished, leaving the children with no inheritance and holding the bag for keeping their parents from living on the street. My wife is absolutely terrified that our "inheritance" is going to be inheriting 2 old people with no retirement plan other than their house. Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Feb 19, 2014 |
# ? Feb 19, 2014 20:15 |
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It was recommended I post this here instead of BFC: I have a question about downpayment (in Canada if that matters). I'm about to put an offer on a house. If I consider the scenarios between putting 20k down and 40k down on it, there isn't a very large difference in monthly cost and over 25 year amortization the lower downpayment comes with a total greater cost of $11k. However if I invest the remaining 20k (instead of having the 40k downpayment) I would be relatively secure in earning more than 11k with that amount invested somewhere, and it gives me additional flexibility/liquidity if I ever needed it. What part of this picture am I missing in that it seems better to have a smaller downpayment?
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 21:13 |
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I think the answer depends on how confident you are really going to see these hypothetical returns. If your projections are wrong, you lose money. If the housing market tanks, you lose money and you are underwater.
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 21:18 |
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Rime posted:I can just imagine the shitstorm coming from 10 Million units hitting the market over the next 15 years. A lot of people are going to discover their parents were utterly retarded and are now completely impoverished, leaving the children with no inheritance and holding the bag for keeping their parents from living on the street. A very real worry for a lot of people, but apparently not for you?
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 21:18 |
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Jadus posted:It was recommended I post this here instead of BFC: (There is a Canadian Finance] thread if you want to discuss this in detail) Quite apart from the housing bubble implications, you're possibly losing out on some good tax shelter usage if you put as much cash as possible into the downpayment. How's your TFSA? And if you have a high marginal tax rate - how's your RRSP?
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 21:27 |
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Lexicon posted:(There is a Canadian Finance] thread if you want to discuss this in detail) I'm not too worried about the bubble/market as this is a house to live in for decades, not a stepping stone or investment. My TSFA is pretty close to maxxed but my wife has yet to start one so that is where we'd be looking at placing our cash rather than a down payment. My RRSP is collecting 6% of my wage (4% from employer) but has room for lump sum payments if necessary.
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 21:38 |
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Lexicon posted:Quite apart from the housing bubble implications, you're possibly losing out on some good tax shelter usage if you put as much cash as possible into the downpayment. Capital gains from the sale of a primary residence are not taxed, who needs a TFSA?
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 21:38 |
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blah_blah posted:Capital gains from the sale of a primary residence are not taxed, who needs a TFSA? dear god I hope you are saying this in jest
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 22:03 |
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HipGnosis posted:Yeah, speaking of which, can you get stuck with a relative's consumer debt if she dies? This probably fits in the Canadian finance thread better, but unless you're somehow a co-creditor on the loans you aren't directly liable. If they have other assets in their estate then depending on the terms of the loan these could be seized and sold, potentially for well less than fair value, meaning you would be indirectly out of pocket. Disclaimer: I am not an estate lawyer and if this is a real concern for you you should probably talk to one.
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 22:40 |
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There was an E/N thread about that a while ago, some dude was flipping out over inheriting his parents underwater house and a bunch of debt. Basically if you don't want the debt you just say "no thanks" to the inheritance and the creditors get what ever assets are in debt for them to sell off like in a bankruptcy. Sometimes scummy companies and banks will try to push it on you or make you feel like you have to but you just tell them to gently caress off. I seem to remember the bank or someone telling him something like "you have to take the house and pay it off to finish what your parents started otherwise it would dishonour their memory!" Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 22:47 on Feb 19, 2014 |
# ? Feb 19, 2014 22:42 |
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JawKnee posted:A very real worry for a lot of people, but apparently not for you? This particular issue has such wide ranging social implications it is really hard to not be fatalistic about it. I have been putting off finding out how screwed my parents (and by extension myself) actually are. Partially because they are pretty private about their finances but also because there really isn't much I could realistically do for them anyways, if they were broke. I don't blame anyone for blackly joking that their plan for looking after their parents in retirement is to find the nearest iceberg. The real irony is that our parents also ensured that there will be no icebergs left to push them out to sea on.
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 22:49 |
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There will however be lots of wood for raft-making once they have to tear down all the '60s-era wood-frame condos.
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 23:39 |
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Check out @recharts's Tweet: https://twitter.com/recharts/status/436266269328019456 Check out @recharts's Tweet: https://twitter.com/recharts/status/436270802296528896 A gently caress load of condos listed today in Toronto.
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# ? Feb 19, 2014 23:56 |
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The term for people counting on their inheritance is 'waiter'. http://www.thefamilywar.com/media/orangecounty_register_021027.htm
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 00:00 |
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Lexicon posted:dear god I hope you are saying this in jest Is it possible to distinguish between trolling and realtor propaganda at this point?
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 04:41 |
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blah_blah posted:Is it possible to distinguish between trolling and realtor propaganda at this point? Gets harder with every passing day It doesn't help that the realtors basically are trolling now.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 05:04 |
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Cultural Imperial posted:The term for people counting on their inheritance is 'waiter'.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 07:15 |
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JawKnee posted:A very real worry for a lot of people, but apparently not for you? I'm pretty sure my in-laws aren't relying on their house to fund their retirement. My parents don't live in Canada. There will be major macroeconomic implications, of course, but I don't see how I will be directly screwed by anyone near me counting on a million dollars that never really existed to begin with.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 07:20 |
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tagesschau posted:I'm pretty sure my in-laws aren't relying on their house to fund their retirement. My parents don't live in Canada. There will be major macroeconomic implications, of course, but I don't see how I will be directly screwed by anyone near me counting on a million dollars that never really existed to begin with. Not everyone's house is worth 1 million. Some folks who've owned their homes for years and planned to sell shortly before or after retirement and live on whatever they got are going to be severely impacted by this, quite aside from other implications of a potential crash. Assuming that no equity in your home ever existed to begin with is foolish, though I do think that planning for the future based on what housing prices are now is also foolish, but to say that the wealth present in your home never really existed is silly.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 07:24 |
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JawKnee posted:Not everyone's house is worth 1 million. Some folks who've owned their homes for years and planned to sell shortly before or after retirement and live on whatever they got are going to be severely impacted by this, quite aside from other implications of a potential crash. Assuming that no equity in your home ever existed to begin with is foolish, though I do think that planning for the future based on what housing prices are now is also foolish, but to say that the wealth present in your home never really existed is silly. I guess it would be better to phrase it as $300,000 that never existed if the house is nominally worth $1 million, but it's not silly to say that the extra padding in the retirement fund will not be there, and the value never was there, if these people go en masse to sell their homes upon retirement. Everyone's home is worth something, but it's totally fair to say that eye-popping, bubble-induced valuations are not representative of any real value that was ever present in these homes.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 08:01 |
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quote:Here is a summary of PIMCO’s case against the Canadian housing market: https://businessincanada.com/2014/01/29/pimco-canada-housing-market-correction-no-crash-2014/
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 11:01 |
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http://m.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/mortgages/in-2024-all-homes-will-be-dream-homes/article16246770/?service=mobilequote:How Canada’s housing market will look in 2024: If you’re wealthy, it’s healthy. If you don't read any of the bear posts in this thread, then this Rob carrick article sums it all up.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 11:09 |
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http://ftalphaville.ft.com/2014/02/19/1776182/affordability-backwards/ Interesting question : our parents got rich buying houses in the 70s because inflation was high but salary growth outpaced inflation. Regardless of high mortgage payments, our parents made out like bandits. Inflation is now low and salary growth is nil. On the other hand mortgage payments are low. Will we end up paying more over the long term? Ftalphaville is the best serious financial blog or there. It's free to read, just register an account.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 11:38 |
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JawKnee posted:A very real worry for a lot of people, but apparently not for you? I was lucky enough to be born into poverty, so my only concern is that the housing market collapses soon enough that rent prices return to sanity. My mother doesn't even have a credit card.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 18:16 |
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Rime posted:I was lucky enough to be born into poverty, so my only concern is that the housing market collapses soon enough that rent prices return to sanity. My mother doesn't even have a credit card. Hey, same here, kinda! Divorced parents, both rent. They have no grand plans for retirement. Fortunately my old man has an indexed pension (but he didn't have a high salary when he retired) so he's fine, but my mom will probably have to work herself to death. She keeps her credit card in her sock drawer because she's scared of it. But at least there's no delusions about travelling the world off of equity that may or may not be able to be turned liquid when they want it to.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 18:54 |
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http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/business/building-homes-on-spec-246286141.html?device=mobile Some news from one builder in Winnipeg who is building homes based on speculation.
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# ? Feb 20, 2014 19:00 |
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Lexicon posted:Gets harder with every passing day It doesn't help that the realtors basically are trolling now. If they are anything like their US counterparts- a vast majority of them really do believe what they are saying. Rime posted:I was lucky enough to be born into poverty, so my only concern is that the housing market collapses soon enough that rent prices return to sanity. My mother doesn't even have a credit card. Unfortunately the poor are always the hardest hit (as always) by a crash- the downturn in spending destroys the jobs they work and rent doesn't really get much cheaper either. At least in the US it didn't change much at all. Prices aren't based on the actual cost of a thing- it's all supply and demand. And when a crash happens guess what happens to the demand for rent (can't buy because of terrible credit), and often the supply of rentals is low because they were converted to condos. enbot fucked around with this message at 19:49 on Feb 20, 2014 |
# ? Feb 20, 2014 19:43 |
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enbot posted:If they are anything like their US counterparts- a vast majority of them really do believe what they are saying. Ironically during the US bubble I noticed apartments offering piles of sweeteners for new leases such as free months or reduced deposit since everyone was jumping on the home ownership bandwagon. The extra perks pretty much went away after the bubble since renting became much more attractive to many people or they were forced to rent due to losing their home.
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 01:02 |
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A Realtor compares Ottawa to NYC in the Ottawa citizen. http://www.ottawacitizen.com/homes/Condo+Scene+tale+cities/9530293/story.html
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 07:11 |
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pacerhimself posted:... builder ... Winnipeg ... speculation. Oh dear god.
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 07:57 |
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Pixelboy posted:Oh dear god. I love how they managed to put a positive spin on "we're building as many houses as we used to, except now no one is buying them!" Very smoothly done, it's almost like the article is paid reporting, And comparing Ottawa to NYC
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 13:43 |
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In that Winnipeg contractors defense, Winnipeg is basically the last place in the country where you can find both affordable housing and a job that pays a living wage. So of course it's the perfect time to gently caress up the local housing market.
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 14:27 |
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On the downside, it then requires you to live in Winterpeg.
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 14:45 |
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Kalenn Istarion posted:On the downside, it then requires you to live in Winterpeg. It's really not so bad. Lots of great areas and culture. There's lots of areas that will probably gentrify in the next decade (which of course has positives and negatives). Really if you stay near downtown you can avoid suburban jerks pretty well.
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 15:28 |
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etalian posted:Ironically during the US bubble I noticed apartments offering piles of sweeteners for new leases such as free months or reduced deposit since everyone was jumping on the home ownership bandwagon. God I wish that would happen here. We are in a bubble and renting is still ridiculously expensive. I have the great pleasure of searching for a bachelor/1 bedroom in Calgary and nothing I've seen has been under $1,100.
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 18:18 |
sitchensis posted:God I wish that would happen here. We are in a bubble and renting is still ridiculously expensive. I have the great pleasure of searching for a bachelor/1 bedroom in Calgary and nothing I've seen has been under $1,100. Well the flood swept away a lot of affordable rentals, and put a lot of pressure on an already low supply market
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# ? Feb 21, 2014 18:50 |
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Geoid posted:It's really not so bad. Lots of great areas and culture. There's lots of areas that will probably gentrify in the next decade (which of course has positives and negatives). Really if you stay near downtown you can avoid suburban jerks pretty well. Please move to Winnipeg, don't make the mosquitos starve.
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# ? Feb 22, 2014 01:24 |
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# ? May 23, 2024 15:41 |
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etalian posted:Please move to Winnipeg, don't make the mosquitos starve. I think mosquito-feeding is the only industry there.
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# ? Feb 22, 2014 04:35 |