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uG
Apr 23, 2003

by Ralp
If you want something cheap, simple, and vertical there is the Anker Vertical

http://www.amazon.com/Anker%C2%AE-V...+vertical+mouse

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big mean giraffe
Dec 13, 2003

Eat Shit and Die

Lipstick Apathy

uG posted:

If you want something cheap, simple, and vertical there is the Anker Vertical

http://www.amazon.com/Anker%C2%AE-V...+vertical+mouse

I kinda wish Logitech had a g700s but vertical like that, it looks like it would be way more comfortable.

NihilCredo
Jun 6, 2011

iram omni possibili modo preme:
plus una illa te diffamabit, quam multæ virtutes commendabunt

Rockopolis posted:

Actually, that sounds like a really good idea.

I'm not going to be missing much if I don't splurge on something pricier, right?

Well, quite frankly yes, that's why this thread is 104 pages long. But the fact that you're using a "loaner netbook" suggests that you're on limited funds, in which case you would just want something that clicks and scrolls.

Spending an extra $50 for a premium mouse is a great investment in the sense that, if you're at the computer eight hours a day, it will improve your quality of life far more than $50 spent on a faster CPU or a prettier case. But if you're still saving up the $300 for a real computer, then that $60 mouse becomes a lot more of a luxury.

Rockopolis
Dec 21, 2012

I MAKE FUN OF QUEER STORYGAMES BECAUSE I HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO WITH MY LIFE THAN MAKE OTHER PEOPLE CRY

I can't understand these kinds of games, and not getting it bugs me almost as much as me being weird
Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that money is quite so huge an issue as that. I am at a weird point where between labs at college and a loaner at home I can get my assignments done. The current setup is inconvenient, but not enough to make me go out and buy a new computer right away.
I want a mouse to make the current arrangement more comfortable, and have something nice that I can take to the whatever sweet computer I end up with.

I will be ordering that vertical mouse, I really have to know what that is like. I'm glad I asked here, thanks.

Betjeman
Jul 14, 2004

Biker, Biker, Biker GROOVE!
Wouldn't you have to move your entire arm to move a vertical mouse?

Wasabi the J
Jan 23, 2008

MOM WAS RIGHT
You just figured out why they're not common and kinda dumb if you don't have carpal tunnel.

uG
Apr 23, 2003

by Ralp
i move just my wrist when i use them

Zigmidge
May 12, 2002

Exsqueeze me, why the sour face? I'm here to lemon aid you. Let's juice it.

Betjeman posted:

Wouldn't you have to move your entire arm to move a vertical mouse?

You're kind of supposed to mouse like that all the time if you want to prevent the necessity for vertical mice and surgery.

Makes you more accurate too.

uG
Apr 23, 2003

by Ralp
Vertical mice aren't vertical to prevent your wrist from getting squished, its so your arm isn't twisted.

Ynglaur
Oct 9, 2013

The Malta Conference, anyone?
I looked at that mouse and can't even imagine how one would hold that. Still, it's cool they make things for people who need medical accommodations.

Wowporn
May 31, 2012

HarumphHarumphHarumph
I am kinda looking at new mice, can't decide what I want. I have big hands and do lots of face shooting, my sensitivity is really low and my mouse will be getting thrown around a colossal sized mouse pad. Something bigger and a bit heavier would be good, and I'd like to not spend more than $50. The ones I'm looking between:

-SteelSeries sensei
-Steelseries rival
-Corsair raptor m40
-Coolermaster storm havok
-Coolermaster storm recon

The shape and size on a lot of these look pretty nice. If nitpicking helps, I'm less keen on the Raptor m40 and CM Recon because I don't like red led's, but I could probably live with it if it's a nice mouse.

The Lord Bude
May 23, 2007

ASK ME ABOUT MY SHITTY, BOUGIE INTERIOR DECORATING ADVICE

Ruin Completely posted:

I am kinda looking at new mice, can't decide what I want. I have big hands and do lots of face shooting, my sensitivity is really low and my mouse will be getting thrown around a colossal sized mouse pad. Something bigger and a bit heavier would be good, and I'd like to not spend more than $50. The ones I'm looking between:

-SteelSeries sensei
-Steelseries rival
-Corsair raptor m40
-Coolermaster storm havok
-Coolermaster storm recon

The shape and size on a lot of these look pretty nice. If nitpicking helps, I'm less keen on the Raptor m40 and CM Recon because I don't like red led's, but I could probably live with it if it's a nice mouse.

The rival is a much better mouse than the sensei, but I suggest you strongly consider a Logitech G400s. It's one of the better gaming mice out there.

emdash
Oct 19, 2003

and?

Ruin Completely posted:

I am kinda looking at new mice, can't decide what I want. I have big hands and do lots of face shooting, my sensitivity is really low and my mouse will be getting thrown around a colossal sized mouse pad. Something bigger and a bit heavier would be good, and I'd like to not spend more than $50. The ones I'm looking between:

-SteelSeries sensei
-Steelseries rival
-Corsair raptor m40
-Coolermaster storm havok
-Coolermaster storm recon

The shape and size on a lot of these look pretty nice. If nitpicking helps, I'm less keen on the Raptor m40 and CM Recon because I don't like red led's, but I could probably live with it if it's a nice mouse.

Zowie EC2/EC1 are pretty much expressly designed for your needs

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005

Ruin Completely posted:

I am kinda looking at new mice, can't decide what I want. I have big hands and do lots of face shooting, my sensitivity is really low and my mouse will be getting thrown around a colossal sized mouse pad. Something bigger and a bit heavier would be good, and I'd like to not spend more than $50. The ones I'm looking between:

-SteelSeries sensei
-Steelseries rival
-Corsair raptor m40
-Coolermaster storm havok
-Coolermaster storm recon
The M40 is one of the shorter mice, although it is also one of the wider ones (it's quite like the G9x which is why I chose it). I use a sort of lazy claw grip and have small hands and find it very comfortable. You can turn off the glowy corsair logo on the top, obviously not the tracking light though if that's your complaint.

You should really decide if you want optical (rival, m40, recon) or laser (sensei, havoc) and go from there. Laser mice tend to do worse under low sens/high movement rate conditions due to lower max perfect tracking speed.

Wowporn
May 31, 2012

HarumphHarumphHarumph

kaschei posted:

The M40 is one of the shorter mice, although it is also one of the wider ones (it's quite like the G9x which is why I chose it). I use a sort of lazy claw grip and have small hands and find it very comfortable. You can turn off the glowy corsair logo on the top, obviously not the tracking light though if that's your complaint.

You should really decide if you want optical (rival, m40, recon) or laser (sensei, havoc) and go from there. Laser mice tend to do worse under low sens/high movement rate conditions due to lower max perfect tracking speed.

If that's all the case then I guess I'd want optical, and I'll axe the m40 off the list because I want something on the much larger side, lengthwise especially; so that leaves me with the rival or the recon.

TheQat posted:

Zowie EC2/EC1 are pretty much expressly designed for your needs

Those do look pretty nice, is there an actual difference between the ec1 and ec2? And how are the mouse buttons? I know most people don't put a ton of stock in comfy mouse buttons but I use the 2 on my current mouse a lot, especially for things like quick switching in Counter Strike (gotta reload cancel dat awp); of all of them the Rival looked best for this.

The Lord Bude posted:

The rival is a much better mouse than the sensei, but I suggest you strongly consider a Logitech G400s. It's one of the better gaming mice out there.

I like logitech stuff a lot in certain ways. The g400s looks pretty nice, but the thumb buttons look really not great, a major complaint with my current logitech mouse. And I know it's hard to judge without actually feeling it, but the shape and weird grip don't speak to me.

TheRationalRedditor
Jul 17, 2000

WHO ABUSED HIM. WHO ABUSED THE BOY.

Ruin Completely posted:

Those do look pretty nice, is there an actual difference between the ec1 and ec2? And how are the mouse buttons? I know most people don't put a ton of stock in comfy mouse buttons but I use the 2 on my current mouse a lot, especially for things like quick switching in Counter Strike (gotta reload cancel dat awp); of all of them the Rival looked best for this.
The EC2 is smaller, but exactly the same shape otherwise. The microswitches and sensor (Avago 3090) are extremely high quality, and it's completely driverless. If there were a sole weakness at all, you could say it's the unremarkable (but not lovely) wheel.

EC1 is the most comfortable mouse I've ever used. The black finish has a rubbery texture grip and the white has that old-school glossy mouse plastic stickiness that allows you to grip through sweat easily.

TheRationalRedditor fucked around with this message at 05:10 on Feb 22, 2014

Wowporn
May 31, 2012

HarumphHarumphHarumph

TheRationalRedditor posted:

The EC2 is smaller, but exactly the same shape otherwise. The microswitches and sensor (Avago 3090) are extremely high quality, and it's completely driverless. If there were a sole weakness at all, you could say it's the unremarkable (but not lovely) wheel.

EC1 is the most comfortable mouse I've ever used. The black finish has a rubbery texture grip and the white has that old-school glossy mouse plastic stickiness that allows you to grip through sweat easily.

In that case the ec1 seems like a good idea. I don't especially care about the wheel, on my current mouse it rattles around a lot when I move it since it has a free spinning mode and is so loosely placed in there, and that gets annoying, so as long as that doesn't happen it sounds good to me.

The Lord Bude
May 23, 2007

ASK ME ABOUT MY SHITTY, BOUGIE INTERIOR DECORATING ADVICE

Ruin Completely posted:

If that's all the case then I guess I'd want optical, and I'll axe the m40 off the list because I want something on the much larger side, lengthwise especially; so that leaves me with the rival or the recon.


Those do look pretty nice, is there an actual difference between the ec1 and ec2? And how are the mouse buttons? I know most people don't put a ton of stock in comfy mouse buttons but I use the 2 on my current mouse a lot, especially for things like quick switching in Counter Strike (gotta reload cancel dat awp); of all of them the Rival looked best for this.


I like logitech stuff a lot in certain ways. The g400s looks pretty nice, but the thumb buttons look really not great, a major complaint with my current logitech mouse. And I know it's hard to judge without actually feeling it, but the shape and weird grip don't speak to me.

Logitech mice are often carried in mainstream electronics stores, and the box opens with a flap to let you put your hand around the mouse and test out it's grip.

mikemelbrooks
Jun 11, 2012

One tough badass

Horizontal Tree posted:

Blow into the wheel robustly. Report back.


Welp I ended up taking it apart as the sensor for the wheel is a separate unit turned by the axle of the wheel. Its working ok so far, but its hard to see how anything could of got in there. I contacted func before i stripped it and they said to contact the seller to return it!

mikemelbrooks fucked around with this message at 07:30 on Feb 23, 2014

TheRationalRedditor
Jul 17, 2000

WHO ABUSED HIM. WHO ABUSED THE BOY.

Ruin Completely posted:

In that case the ec1 seems like a good idea. I don't especially care about the wheel, on my current mouse it rattles around a lot when I move it since it has a free spinning mode and is so loosely placed in there, and that gets annoying, so as long as that doesn't happen it sounds good to me.
It's definitely not a rattler, it's simply basic. It's a nice soft beveled rubber and the scroll tension is really nice, though.

o muerte
Dec 13, 2008

mikemelbrooks posted:

my Func MS-3 Scroll wheel has decided that when I try to fast scroll it will just bounce up and down. I bought it second hand from ebay. Any suggestions to fix it or a replacement for large handed player.

Same exact thing happened to mine:

Horizontal Tree posted:

Blow into the wheel robustly. Report back.

This fixed it.

Apparently this is a known issue with this scroll wheel, and it happened on the death adders that used it as well. Same fix applies.

Coxswain Balls
Jun 4, 2001

Goo posted:

Darkfield is terrible for games. Also it breaks your G602 battery life request.

I'm kind of curious now, why is this? The Anywhere MX is my dream mouse; the free spinning wheel is awesome, and having the middle button separate from the wheel is super convenient. Due to how I hold and move my mouse, I also can't stand using off-center mouse sensors, which most other Logitech mice seem to have these days. I also have a glass desk, so not needing a mousepad is a nice bonus, albeit nonessential. I've liked them so much that I have one for home and work, and I've never had issues with games in the few years I've used them. I also have tons of rechargable batteries, and I still get a month of use from a full charge, which seems acceptable to me.

The only problem I have with them is that the mouse buttons keep wearing down. I don't know if things are different in Canada, but the legendary Logitech warranty doesn't seem to apply here; the dude wanted my receipt and it's only after I made a fuss that they decided to send me a new mouse if I shipped them my defective one first. The warranty replacement also failed after a year, so I ended up buying another one, which just bit the dust.

Rather than deal with the warranty department again, I figured that this would be a good time to learn to solder. A bag of switches is like ten bucks, and it's a good skill to learn anyways. I did a number on the feet covering the screwholes, unfortunately; is it possible to get replacements for those directly from Logitech?

404notfound
Mar 5, 2006

stop staring at me

Had a little LAN party this weekend and my Naga 2014 kept freaking out during UT2004 and Chivalry, and now I'm having problems with it suddenly shooting downward when I pick it up to reposition (I'm a low-sens player). I've always merely tolerated Razer's awful QC, but I think I'm finally done with this company. Gonna be Logitech all the way now, even if I don't like the mouse wheels as much. Gonna go down to my local Fry's and Best Buy and see if they have a G600 or maybe G602 (I guess I don't need that many thumb buttons).

Rexxed
May 1, 2010

Dis is amazing!
I gotta try dis!

404notfound posted:

Had a little LAN party this weekend and my Naga 2014 kept freaking out during UT2004 and Chivalry, and now I'm having problems with it suddenly shooting downward when I pick it up to reposition (I'm a low-sens player). I've always merely tolerated Razer's awful QC, but I think I'm finally done with this company. Gonna be Logitech all the way now, even if I don't like the mouse wheels as much. Gonna go down to my local Fry's and Best Buy and see if they have a G600 or maybe G602 (I guess I don't need that many thumb buttons).

Check that there's not a hair or some dust under the sensor. Little hairs stuck in the opening where the optics are can gently caress up tracking really badly.

Ramadu
Aug 25, 2004

2015 NFL MVP


404notfound posted:

Had a little LAN party this weekend and my Naga 2014 kept freaking out during UT2004 and Chivalry, and now I'm having problems with it suddenly shooting downward when I pick it up to reposition (I'm a low-sens player). I've always merely tolerated Razer's awful QC, but I think I'm finally done with this company. Gonna be Logitech all the way now, even if I don't like the mouse wheels as much. Gonna go down to my local Fry's and Best Buy and see if they have a G600 or maybe G602 (I guess I don't need that many thumb buttons).

The G602 is amazing and I totally recommend it after using it for a few weeks now. I don't use all the buttons on the side but they don't hinder me in any way either. The only thing I wish it had really would be the hyperfast scroll wheel.

404notfound
Mar 5, 2006

stop staring at me

Rexxed posted:

Check that there's not a hair or some dust under the sensor. Little hairs stuck in the opening where the optics are can gently caress up tracking really badly.

Oh yeah, neglected to mention that this isn't the first time I've had tracking problems with this mouse (customer support told me to try some recalibration stuff, but it didn't really help), not to mention a history of Razer mice that either go kaput or start to physically deteriorate (badly yellowing plastic elements and/or matte coating that literally starts to rub off like dried glue on skin).

I should have parted ways with Razer long before this, but this really was the last straw. I'm looking forward to a non-abusive relationship with Logitech now :unsmith:

koolkal
Oct 21, 2008

this thread maybe doesnt have room for 2 green xbox one avs
So my Logitech G3 is pretty much done after 5 years (the pads are worn and the laser is now starting to die I think) and I want something that's similar but not too expensive. What are my Logitech options? The G400S seems the closest since it's wired, has adjustable DPI settings, and a couple extra buttons without getting silly. The G100S looks similar with lower DPI and fewer buttons. Do they both have good software? Are there any others I should be looking into?

Rexxed
May 1, 2010

Dis is amazing!
I gotta try dis!

koolkal posted:

So my Logitech G3 is pretty much done after 5 years (the pads are worn and the laser is now starting to die I think) and I want something that's similar but not too expensive. What are my Logitech options? The G400S seems the closest since it's wired, has adjustable DPI settings, and a couple extra buttons without getting silly. The G100S looks similar with lower DPI and fewer buttons. Do they both have good software? Are there any others I should be looking into?

I'm pretty happy with the G400. As far as I know the G400S is essentially the same thing with crazy paint on it. I used a G500 before but felt it was lacking for twitch gaming after comparing the two. The only thing I miss from the G500 was a third thumb button and the scroll wheel tilting to go sideways (though it didn't seem to be well supported by most applications).

RangerAce
Feb 25, 2014

uG posted:

If you want something cheap, simple, and vertical there is the Anker Vertical

http://www.amazon.com/Anker%C2%AE-V...+vertical+mouse

Oh balls, that reminds me of the FPSGun! I loved that mouse (until all the grippy padding fell off of it leaving behind sticky residue).

http://www.amazon.com/omgwat/dp/B0014DRXRA/

It was really nice since the optical part was way forward of your hand, so you could actually get smoother, more precise movements. I wish someone else made something similar, as I would give all my money to have a well-built version.

Rockopolis
Dec 21, 2012

I MAKE FUN OF QUEER STORYGAMES BECAUSE I HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO WITH MY LIFE THAN MAKE OTHER PEOPLE CRY

I can't understand these kinds of games, and not getting it bugs me almost as much as me being weird

uG posted:

If you want something cheap, simple, and vertical there is the Anker Vertical

http://www.amazon.com/Anker%C2%AE-V...+vertical+mouse

I got mine over the weekend. It took a couple minutes to get used to it, but I like it so far.
It's responsive and everything works. I don't feel like I have to make arm movements to move the cursor, especially with the higher DPI setting. At first, it felt a bit too large for my tiny hands, but that went away, so I'm assuming that was because the grip was unfamiliar. It is big and different enough that my old habit of holding a stylus while using the mouse makes it hard to click.
I need to see if I can change the default setting from low to high DPI, because I don't use the low setting.
I think I'll keep it, but now I'm curious what more expensive vertical mice are like, haha.

Unfortunately, my father, who has some pretty severe hand issues, doesn't like it because he finds the forward-back buttons too awkwardly positioned; he keeps bumping them with his thumb.

Goo
Aug 30, 2002

Hello Drippy

Coxswain Balls posted:

I'm kind of curious now, why is this? The Anywhere MX is my dream mouse; the free spinning wheel is awesome, and having the middle button separate from the wheel is super convenient. Due to how I hold and move my mouse, I also can't stand using off-center mouse sensors, which most other Logitech mice seem to have these days. I also have a glass desk, so not needing a mousepad is a nice bonus, albeit nonessential. I've liked them so much that I have one for home and work, and I've never had issues with games in the few years I've used them. I also have tons of rechargable batteries, and I still get a month of use from a full charge, which seems acceptable to me.

The only problem I have with them is that the mouse buttons keep wearing down. I don't know if things are different in Canada, but the legendary Logitech warranty doesn't seem to apply here; the dude wanted my receipt and it's only after I made a fuss that they decided to send me a new mouse if I shipped them my defective one first. The warranty replacement also failed after a year, so I ended up buying another one, which just bit the dust.

Rather than deal with the warranty department again, I figured that this would be a good time to learn to solder. A bag of switches is like ten bucks, and it's a good skill to learn anyways. I did a number on the feet covering the screwholes, unfortunately; is it possible to get replacements for those directly from Logitech?
Darkfield has to work with very small imperfections within the glass or oil smudges on its surface in order to tell where you're going. It has to analyze a lot of frames in order to make a determination as to direction of travel, and it has a lower framerate than a gaming sensor as well as a fixed DPI setting. Its latency between physical and cursor movement is therefore perceptibly slower than a gaming sensor.

As with anything, however, if it works for you already then there's no reason not to keep using it. My recommendation against using Darkfield for gaming (and reluctance to put it in a gaming mouse) stems from the expectations that most other people who use gaming mice have for gaming sensors.

Durability of switches is a global issue that affects multiple manufacturers. It is a giant pain to deal with. I don't have a good answer for you, unfortunately, as it seems that some people never have a problem and others run through mice in a few months.

You can contact Support to see if you can get feet, but getting them to Canada can be a chore and I'm not immediately familiar with replacement feet availability for the MX Anywhere. If it doesn't go well, PM me.

Harminoff
Oct 24, 2005

👽
Ordered a deathadder from ebay $24 shipped is hard to pass up (though it'll take a month to get here)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Razer-DeathAdder-2013-6400dpi-4G-Optical-Mouse-Gaming-/161235289921?pt=Mice&hash=item258a5f4741

How well will this work on a varnished wooden desk? I was looking into some pads but they seem to be as much as the mouse. Anything under $20 that I could pick up?

Wowporn
May 31, 2012

HarumphHarumphHarumph

Harminoff posted:

Ordered a deathadder from ebay $24 shipped is hard to pass up (though it'll take a month to get here)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Razer-DeathAdder-2013-6400dpi-4G-Optical-Mouse-Gaming-/161235289921?pt=Mice&hash=item258a5f4741

How well will this work on a varnished wooden desk? I was looking into some pads but they seem to be as much as the mouse. Anything under $20 that I could pick up?

That seems sketchy since they have only sold 4 items ever.

For a mouse pad for :10bux: you can get what almost literally everyone who buys a large gaming mousepad has and get this
http://www.amazon.com/SteelSeries-QcK-Gaming-Mouse-Black/dp/B000UEZ36W/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1393489345&sr=8-1&keywords=gaming+mouse+pad

If that's too small, flashy, or expensive you can get this larger Perixx pad for a dollar less
http://www.amazon.com/Perixx-DX-1000XL-Gaming-Mouse-Pad/dp/B00AJN9O1Y/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1393489641&sr=8-8&keywords=gaming+mouse+pad

Megabound
Oct 20, 2012

I currently have a Mionix Naos 5000, best drat mouse I've ever used for a couple of reasons. It's big, it's comfortable and it has index and pinkie finger rests:



It's also on the fritz, would someone care to point me towards a wireless mouse with proper finger rests (That isn't a R.A.T 9) before I end up buying a Naos 8200? I saw the Razer Ouroboros today, anyone have any experience with that?

Megabound fucked around with this message at 12:11 on Feb 27, 2014

enthe0s
Oct 24, 2010

In another few hours, the sun will rise!
A lot of the more recent talk has been about gaming mice, but is there any go-to mouse that's recommended for just day to day work use? I'm a front end developer so I don't need anything crazy flashy, but I would like something a bit nicer than what I have since I'm starting to feel some wrist pains coming on.

RangerAce
Feb 25, 2014

enthe0s posted:

A lot of the more recent talk has been about gaming mice, but is there any go-to mouse that's recommended for just day to day work use? I'm a front end developer so I don't need anything crazy flashy, but I would like something a bit nicer than what I have since I'm starting to feel some wrist pains coming on.

I've been using a Logitech M310 at work. Best $20 mouse I've ever used. Wireless, and I only have to change the battery like once every several months. If you're having wrist pain, though, you might need something more ergonomic. Maybe one of those vertical mice that was posted a few days ago?

Wibbleman
Apr 19, 2006

Fluffy doesn't want to be sacrificed

Hey Goo,

Any chances of a finger based trackball coming out again (ie Marble FX, or MS trackball explorer equiv ). The thumb based ones tend to hurt after a while using them.

Goo
Aug 30, 2002

Hello Drippy
Not allowed to talk about future projects, but even if I was I don't know anything about trackball group's plans since I sit in Gaming and focus only on what I'm doing 90% of the time. I will point out that they tend to be on a long (5-ish years?) refresh cycle for product development based on the last few generations. Trackballs are very low volume relative to standard mice.

Queen_Combat
Jan 15, 2011

Wibbleman posted:

Hey Goo,

Any chances of a finger based trackball coming out again (ie Marble FX, or MS trackball explorer equiv ). The thumb based ones tend to hurt after a while using them.

I would pay drat good money for a usb marble with a scroll wheel. My latest computer doesn't have a PS/2 port and the 3.5" marble doesn't play well with adapters.

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kaleidoscopic
Feb 11, 2008

let go your earthly tether
enter the void
empty, and become wind
y4 bl0w

koolkal posted:

So my Logitech G3 is pretty much done after 5 years (the pads are worn and the laser is now starting to die I think) and I want something that's similar but not too expensive. What are my Logitech options? The G400S seems the closest since it's wired, has adjustable DPI settings, and a couple extra buttons without getting silly. The G100S looks similar with lower DPI and fewer buttons. Do they both have good software? Are there any others I should be looking into?

The g100s is almost exactly the same shape as the g3 and has a much better sensor and smaller lift-off distance to boot. The g400s is a completely different shape so I'm not sure why you would get it unless you need the extra buttons for something?

kaleidoscopic fucked around with this message at 00:06 on Mar 1, 2014

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