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Soothing Vapors posted:Every question is just an opportunity to pander. "I hope to be specialized in [boring practice area (make sure it exists at the firm you're talking to), bonus points if it's something your interviewer knows something about] and really have made a name for myself as a hard worker slash cumdumpster. Hopefully I'll be on my way to making partner and eventually dying of a heart attack at my desk!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And on a personal note, I hope that by then I'll be raising fifteen ugly children with my nagging shrew of a [wife/husband], in a stable and committed relationship that is not in any way the death of my soul or what remained of my dreams. That's why I like Maine so much, by the by -- I have heard such wonderful things about the school systems in this boring, staid backwater!!! I cannot wait to whelp my hideous mutant brats and let your public schools fill their heads with disease (because I know you do not pay enough to afford private school tuition). ALso I'll suck your dick for five dollars" This made my day. Especially when read as Gollum/Sméagol.
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Feb 25, 2014 22:58
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^^^ haha all of my posts should be read in gollum/smeagol voices imo Hot Dog Day #38 posted:Though this one is obviously dumb and so is the work-life balance one, what are some good questions? I've had some positive response to asking about things on interviewer bios ("Before you were a lawyer you developed submarine detection technology?") but a lot of bios are boring and dumb and the firm doesn't have any big litigation or whatever to ask about. One question I only get 2-3 times per recruiting cycle is some variation of "What makes a summer/junior associate successful at your firm?" I like that question because it allows me to wax philosophical and talk about myself and things that make me angry for a few minutes, and it shows that you are a thoughtful little bootlicker who will succeed in a law firm. If interviewing in a secondary market, come up with things to ask about the city -- events, festivals, community groups, etc. We're selling you the city as much as the firm. Boring questions are boring but acceptable. We have a couple things about our firm listed on the website (compensation structure and summer program structure type things), and I get the same two questions on those two things in every interview. I have dreams where I answer those questions. Still OK to ask, won't set you apart but won't torpedo you like asking nothing will. Soothing Vapors fucked around with this message at 23:08 on Feb 25, 2014 |
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Feb 25, 2014 23:05
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Sorry, maybe it wasn't clear but my post was basically a look at how dumb career services is post.
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Feb 25, 2014 23:09
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Artic Puma posted:Sorry, maybe it wasn't clear but my post was basically a look at how dumb career services is post. Gotcha. We used to have a huge blingee in the OP saying "career services is worthless" but I think it's been lost to the sands of time
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Feb 25, 2014 23:14
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I'm a pretty capricious interviewer.
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Feb 25, 2014 23:31
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Soothing Vapors posted:Gotcha. We used to have a huge blingee in the OP saying "career services is worthless" but I think it's been lost to the sands of time Well, our current OP is four years old at this point. I'm surprised there are any images still there.
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Feb 26, 2014 00:42
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Secrets that career services doesn't tell you: I googled the name of one of my interviewers and found out she was heavily involved in her church. I found a good bible verse and quoted it during the interview.
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Feb 26, 2014 01:26
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It's been so fun watching all of you grow and wilt, from scheming LSAT gamers to advice-ignoring idiot applicants; from bright-eyed gunner fucks to salty dog 2L wastrels to 3L job grubbers. As first years with lovely drawers, you bitched about your completely manageable babby workloads, complaining about your tiny little salad plates being too full. Now you have graduated to gatekeepers for the li'l maggots behind you, stuck interviewing boring snot nosed sycophants that are one step behind you so the rest of us can generate the billables that pay your salaries. I love you guys
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Feb 26, 2014 01:34
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mikeraskol posted:I'm a pretty capricious interviewer. hahahaha BigHead posted:Well, our current OP is four years old at this point. I'm surprised there are any images still there. linguica delenda est Phil Moscowitz posted:It's been so fun watching all of you grow and wilt, from scheming LSAT gamers to advice-ignoring idiot applicants; from bright-eyed gunner fucks to salty dog 2L wastrels to 3L job grubbers. As first years with lovely drawers, you bitched about your completely manageable babby workloads, complaining about your tiny little salad plates being too full. Now you have graduated to gatekeepers for the li'l maggots behind you, stuck interviewing boring snot nosed sycophants that are one step behind you so the rest of us can generate the billables that pay your salaries. I love you guys  now go of counsel and die already so we can have your job
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Feb 26, 2014 01:38
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Phil Moscowitz posted:so the rest of us can generate the billables that pay your salaries. I love you guys And we love the poo poo out of you rainmakers, you abusive assholes that give us ridiculous tasks that we curse behind your backs but couldn't live without. Keep on feeding us! Also we're constantly trying to figure out the magical way you find clients.
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Feb 26, 2014 01:39
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Step one, be good at your job. Call me when you get there for the rest.
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Feb 26, 2014 01:42
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Being at a firm big enough to do OCI sounds kinda fun in a perverse way. I would be happy if my firm would just bite the bullet and hire a fifth associate for the prosecution side instead of a revolving door of lovely contract attorneys whose work we all end up having to completely rewrite anyway because their amendments are so dumb.
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Feb 26, 2014 01:44
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Phil Moscowitz posted:Step one, be good at your job. Elotana posted:Being at a firm big enough to do OCI sounds kinda fun in a perverse way. I would be happy if my firm would just bite the bullet and hire a fifth associate for the prosecution side instead of a revolving door of lovely contract attorneys whose work we all end up having to completely rewrite anyway because their amendments are so dumb. Soothing Vapors fucked around with this message at 01:48 on Feb 26, 2014 |
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Feb 26, 2014 01:45
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Soothing Vapors posted:It is. Huge awful timesuck but it's generally been worth it. Also it's really horrifying to find out three years after the fact just how petty and random our hiring decisions are.
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Feb 26, 2014 01:52
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Soothing Vapors posted:gently caress An alternative is pretending you are good well enough to convince potential clients. Plenty of knuckleheads have made a living that way.
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Feb 26, 2014 03:26
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A couple of tools that were posted in the self-publishing goons thread that would be super valuable here. Hemmingway App Edit Minion You basically put in some text and it spits out the problems from a readability standpoint. Whereas a grammar and spelling checker misses stuff like passive voice, these tools pick that stuff out. Especially useful for avoiding overly complex sentences in contracts and passive voice in pleadings. No I didn't program these and have no relation to them, just thought it would be useful. I don't know if they are secure though. So if you have super confidential client info you might want to see if there is a downloadable version.
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Feb 26, 2014 06:47
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My child is 10 days old. I billed 80 hours in the last seven days. Go to law school.
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Feb 26, 2014 07:33
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gvibes posted:My child is 10 days old. Life's long, don't worry about it
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Feb 26, 2014 07:44
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gvibes posted:My child is 10 days old. God drat that's terrible. I mean, an average "I'm in the office on Christmas" post is just sort of expected and only mildly depressing. But your post is really, really sad. I'm sorry your brain told you to go to law school.
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Feb 26, 2014 09:13
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gvibes posted:My child is 10 days old. Mine is 9 weeks old. I took 30 days off to stay at home when he was born. Public interest lyfe. Now I'm in day two of a jury trial. I haven't seen him awake in two weeks and I had to move into our guest room.
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Feb 26, 2014 12:21
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Out of curiosity, how many of you were paralegals before going to law school? After working for almost a year as a paralegal I know enough to never go to law school, and am planning to go back to school to get out of my comparatively babby field. Seriously, I don't know how anyone can be a lawyer and retain their sanity in the current climate.
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Feb 26, 2014 14:55
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gvibes posted:My child is 10 days old. When my first daughter was born, I was back at work on day two. That sucked. I love being a dad, and I want to be around for my kids. Two years later, when my second daughter was born, I had sold my consumer law practice, launched a new practice representing tech startups using subscription fees, and I was working more on making Lawyerist profitable. I stayed home with my wife for nearly a month, working as little as possible. I am very close to both of them. You won't ruin anything if you aren't around for a while, but now really is a good time to reevaluate what is important to you, and change your situation if you can.
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Feb 26, 2014 15:56
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Nitrousoxide posted:Especially useful for avoiding overly complex sentences in contracts and passive voice in pleadings. I'm laughing at my desk at the thought of anyone reviewing a pleading for readability. Is there an app that can make sentences longer and more complex, maybe add even more passive voice?
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Feb 26, 2014 16:12
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the milk machine posted:Is there an app that can make sentences longer and more complex, maybe add even more passive voice? Yes, but it takes three years to load and costs $150,000.
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Feb 26, 2014 16:15
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My son is 34 days old. I took off three weeks but I work from home so he's still hanging out with me while mom naps.
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Feb 26, 2014 16:56
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Kainer2000 posted:Out of curiosity, how many of you were paralegals before going to law school? After working for almost a year as a paralegal I know enough to never go to law school, and am planning to go back to school to get out of my comparatively babby field. Seriously, I don't know how anyone can be a lawyer and retain their sanity in the current climate. I was/am a paralegal and worked for a big firm doing civil litigation for a year before I went to law school (currently a 2L).
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Feb 26, 2014 17:10
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joat mon posted:Yes, but it takes three years to load and costs $150,000. Hahaha
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Feb 26, 2014 17:44
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If this wasn't the internet I'd start a slow clap for that response.
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Feb 26, 2014 17:46
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gvibes posted:My child is 10 days old. Just imagine in 20 years or whatever when you will get to hear those magic words: Dad, I want to be like you, can you pay for law school?
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Feb 26, 2014 17:51
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Syncopated posted:Just imagine in 20 years or whatever when you will get to hear those magic words: Dad, I want to be like you, can you pay for law school? I'm going into union-side labor law like my daddy. And we have a good relationship. I might even work at his small firm at some point in the future. So the point is don't sell out and become a biglaw drone if you want your kids to love you.
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Feb 26, 2014 17:55
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joat mon posted:Yes, but it takes three years to load and costs $150,000. I love you guys so much
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Feb 26, 2014 17:55
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MoFauxHawk posted:I'm going into union-side labor law like my daddy. And we have a good relationship. I might even work at his small firm at some point in the future. So the point is don't sell out and become a biglaw drone if you want your kids to love you. My dad did labor law in Pittsburgh for many years at a midsize firm there. We also had/have a great relationship but I mostly only saw him on Sundays. I had no idea what he actually did at work, but I knew from a young age that it didn't look fun. Things got a lot better when he went in-house and started having free time again.
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Feb 26, 2014 18:42
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Some real Cat's in the Cradle poo poo going on up in here.
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Feb 26, 2014 19:35
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joat mon posted:Yes, but it takes three years to load and costs $150,000. I'm just going to sit and bask in this for a bit because goddamn.
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Feb 26, 2014 23:21
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Got petitioners evidence excluded on day two. Judge seemed offended that he didn't file a response to my brief. Settled case without jury. gently caress yeah, drank my lunch today and got to see my kid. Petitioners attorney got paid more on this case than I'll make in a year. Still poor, don't go, die alone.
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Feb 27, 2014 01:22
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joat mon posted:Yes, but it takes three years to load and costs $150,000. 
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Feb 27, 2014 02:47
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Kaysette posted:My dad did labor law in Pittsburgh for many years at a midsize firm there. We also had/have a great relationship but I mostly only saw him on Sundays. I had no idea what he actually did at work, but I knew from a young age that it didn't look fun. Things got a lot better when he went in-house and started having free time again. At some point my dad got a book of business and junior partners and associates. Then I started seeing him on weekends. It is a loving slog most people don't get out of. Makes me pretty sure to want to stay with government lawyerin'.
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Feb 27, 2014 04:40
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Dirty truth is that a lot of people don't want to see their spouse or kids anyway all that much, or at least not beyond the convenient hour or so a day where you can pat them on the head, say goodnight, etc. It's brutal, but reality as far as I'm concerned. Plenty of people blame work for keeping them from family, when unconsciously they're really not all that interested in family life. I think another problem with being a partner is that there seems to be such a huge drop off in whatever else you go to. A lot of jobs where you make $50k a year, if you don't like your current job, you figure out something else to do, you probably make in the same ballpark. But say you're making $400k a year as a partner at a large law firm. You say you don't want to do this anymore. You are even willing to take a substantial pay cut for a better life hopefully coming much closer to 40 hours a week, work that you don't hate, etc. But what is that job? What else are you trained for and what else can you do? Even if you're willing to take a 50% pay cut, that's still $200k a year? In this economy, with hyper competition for jobs, what other job can you reasonably go get that pays you that? If you are willing to take a 75% pay cut, what job are you going to go get that really does substantially change your lifestyle and work, that you are actually able to obtain, that will still pay $100k? You ask people this, and they will generally mumble platitudes like, "You could be a 'businessperson.'" But when you ask them what the hell they mean by that, and exactly what "businessperson" job they have in mind, they tend to just say, "I don't know, 'businessperson,' there's businesses out there, you'd just have to look." You get a lot of, "You've just got to make it happen! Spend time and look into things," types of generic advice. But when you ask, "Okay, look into what? Where do you start? What positions are available for a generalist liberal arts major who is 'smart'" (you always get told that you could find something good, because you are "smart"), the advice gets really patchy(and usually just amounts to a repeating of how you need to make it happen, put in effort to find something, etc.). When you demand, "Tell me, with specificity, what you would look for, how you would go about the search, what jobs you could find that are available with a liberal arts major 'smart person' skillset," you tend to not get answers. Much easier to say, "You've just got to look around and work at it." Which is a lovely platitude. One I've found is much easier to say (ironic, given the focus on "effort") than admitting that there's not a lot of options that come anywhere near (e.g. making at least 20% of your former pay) to what you are currently doing. I know that's at least in part why I'm stuck. It really does not feel like there are a lot of options once you are a long way down the road. SlyFrog fucked around with this message at 15:26 on Feb 27, 2014 |
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Feb 27, 2014 15:21
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Go in house, go into government, etc. If you're already a partner, you have plenty of options - if you're willing to take that 50% or 75% pay cut.
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Feb 27, 2014 15:29
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Do consulting. Like, general, I dunno, business consulting, be a consultant
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Feb 27, 2014 16:10
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