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This stuff doesn't even feel spergy to me; it just feels like the sort of things you need to pay attention to if you want a good, usable design that doesn't feel slapped together. To me, the spergy stuff is caring about whether or not the little cocktail flags used as display labels are hung in accordance with U.S. flag handling guidelines and standards.
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Mar 13, 2014 22:41
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KOS just don't burn out before you finish it okay  also I'm trying to rebuild a merged patch with FNVEdit and I think I'm doing it wrong. I thought there were some good step by step instructions posted earlier in this thread but I can't find them. Anyone have those around somewhere? Here or elsewhere, I don't care, I just want to do a proper merged patch now that I've changed up my mod order. Again.
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Mar 14, 2014 01:17
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The King of Swag posted:This stuff doesn't even feel spergy to me; it just feels like the sort of things you need to pay attention to if you want a good, usable design that doesn't feel slapped together. To me, the spergy stuff is caring about whether or not the little cocktail flags used as display labels are hung in accordance with U.S. flag handling guidelines and standards. Well, how much would a militia care about the flag code of a nation that participated in killing the world two hundred years ago? "Whoops, dyed some of these backwards. Better put 'em up the way that's readable." Shows the previous occupants were human.
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Mar 14, 2014 02:01
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Psion posted:also I'm trying to rebuild a merged patch with FNVEdit and I think I'm doing it wrong. I thought there were some good step by step instructions posted earlier in this thread but I can't find them. Anyone have those around somewhere? Here or elsewhere, I don't care, I just want to do a proper merged patch now that I've changed up my mod order. Again. As far as I know, making a merged patch is really just right clicking one of the esp files in FNVEdit, going to options at the bottom and then hitting 'Create Merged patch' and that's all the magic done, because it handles detecting all the conflicts for you. You can then BOSS your load order to put your new merged patch in the optimal place in the queue. Anything more advanced than that and you need to use Wrye Flash or some poo poo. Maybe doing this poo poo properly might be good content for op? Nobody Interesting fucked around with this message at 02:15 on Mar 14, 2014 |
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Mar 14, 2014 02:09
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I gotta ask, because maybe I'm missing out, but what's a merged patch for? I've got ~25 mods in my load order and haven't seen any weird behavior, so maybe I don't need it? I just use BOSS.
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Mar 14, 2014 02:24
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Where do I want to save the mod manager? Anywhere, or does that also need to go into 'data'? First time modding anything.
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Mar 14, 2014 02:27
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Crimson Harvest posted:I gotta ask, because maybe I'm missing out, but what's a merged patch for? I've got ~25 mods in my load order and haven't seen any weird behavior, so maybe I don't need it? I just use BOSS. Two main reasons: to reduce plugin count, and make otherwise incompatible mods, compatible. All Bethesda Gamebryo based games have a hard plugin count of 255, but most people run into serious errors and crashes between ~100 and ~125. That sounds like a ton of mods at first, but then if you take into account that a lot of mods (especially housing and larger mods) have upward of ten plugins to add support for other mods, you can see that you can quickly and easily hit that plugin limit. The other reason is that a lot of mods affect the same forms within the game, and while many instances can be resolved with a proper load order, sometimes they can interfere or even outright break each other regardless of the load order. A lot of these conflicts can be resolved by merging multiple plugins together, and selectively editing the final values and forms so that all the mods merged together will work without conflict.
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Mar 14, 2014 02:33
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Another Person posted:Where do I want to save the mod manager? Anywhere, or does that also need to go into 'data'? First time modding anything. FOMM will ask where your game directory is the first time you run it, so you can launch it from wherever you want.
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Mar 14, 2014 03:54
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I had my 3rd crash ever in my latest run of Fallout NV + TTW yesterday. That's 3 crashes in over 100 hours. It's amazing how stable F:NV is after NVAC, NVSR, etc.
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Mar 14, 2014 04:02
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Right, so using FOMM I was able to get the mods to list, but when I ran it the game wouldn't work, even with all the mods disabled and even when not using FOMM. Fresh install of the whole game is taking place now. I assume my fuckup was in running FOMM, not the mods, I probs moved a file to the wrong place. I also hosed up running the 4GB mod. Any tips for what I hosed up? Also, I couldn't get any of the texture upgrade mods to work, as in, appear in FOMM. I am just supposed to put them into Data, right? I also dislike how disorganised Data looks with a swath of mods in there, is there a tidier way of doing this? Another Person fucked around with this message at 05:18 on Mar 14, 2014 |
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Mar 14, 2014 05:13
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I hate to say this, but I'm not entirely fond of the little flags. I think they look cool, but they feel just out of place enough to bug me whenever I look at them. Trust me when I say that I hate having to go back and redo them way more than you guys hate the extra time it'll take. Here's my issue though: I don't know what to replace them with. I talked with CapnBeeb and he suggested actually stenciling the shelves themselves and using invisible activators, which I thought was a great idea, but it's a bust because the shelves don't have enough leading edge space to actually put stencils on. The only alternative I've come up with is replacing the little flags with black note-cards, and possibly reducing the total size by about a third. This may be enough to not look out of place, but I feel like there's still better suggestions out there. More heads are better than one, so if you guys have a suggestion for what you think might be a better alternative, please let me know. This one has me stumped, and I'm going to step away from it until tomorrow, with the hope that I'll have some fresh ideas then that wouldn't have formed if I just kept looking at it all night. The only thing that has to stay constant between all suggestions is that the icon needs to glow like it does now, because it's not easily visible otherwise.
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Mar 14, 2014 05:25
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I'll be honest, I didn't like the flags either. In fact, I wouldn't be a fan of any visual label. If you have to have a label chart, I'd rather it be in the form of a poster with the icons stylized into where they'd sit on the shelf on the side of the shelf or something. That's a bit more subtle while still being informative.
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Mar 14, 2014 06:09
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The King of Swag posted:Two main reasons: to reduce plugin count, and make otherwise incompatible mods, compatible. Thanks for this, now I know! Different question, I've got a problem recently where rocks and cliffs flicker. I've read that this can be because of LOD textures/meshes but I don't really know what that means or how to fix it. Makes it hard to play the game. Any advice?
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Mar 14, 2014 06:15
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Unfortunately something like that wouldn't work, because the flags are also used to control the options for the individual items on the shelf, and there is simply no other way to go about that, other than make a singular massive menu, which simply isn't expandable or user friendly. Just as a thought, another alternative I've thought about; instead of the little flags, make them little square patches of leather that are riveted to the shelf. At least then the explanation is as simple as taking an old and worn-out pair of leather clothing and cutting it up to re-purpose it. All that said, if you really hate any form of individual label, I suppose I could create another option in the sorting system computer that just turns off all the labels. You'll remove your ability for fine-grained control over the displays, but it'll hide the labels.
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Mar 14, 2014 06:19
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Hmmm. The flags can't act as an invisible activator? Like if you mouseover, the functionality and such is still there but they're just not visible?
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Mar 14, 2014 06:25
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Naky posted:Hmmm. The flags can't act as an invisible activator? Like if you mouseover, the functionality and such is still there but they're just not visible? You know, I can give it a shot, but my worry is the same as with what CapnBeeb suggested: invisible activators are just that, invisible, making them a nightmare to deal with should the poster/shelf ever need to be moved. It wouldn't be so bad if the GECK had the ability to group items like most 3d modeling software, but it doesn't. The lack of such an ability makes moving collections of regular items hard enough--invisible items just take that to another level. That said, if it ends up being the best looking option, then that's likely what I'll go with. Lord knows that making a few posters and a single invisible mesh (with square collision so it can still be activated) is much easier than the many textures and meshes I've had to create so far. Edit: By the way, if anyone sees something in my updates that they don't like or just aren't that keen on the idea of, please speak up about it. It's much easier to make changes or tackle issues early on than it is to handle it after a lot of the work has already been done. Crimson Harvest posted:Thanks for this, now I know! LOD is a method where at increasing distances, textures are replaced with lower resolution versions and meshes and replaced with meshes consisting of less geometry. This can greatly increase performance while maintaining far draw distances with little to no drop in visual quality, because the items are so far away that the additional detail can't be seen anyway. Problems occur however when similar but different meshes have their LOD swap distances at different distances from each other, or when the engine simply messes up and doesn't swap a mesh when it should be. The result is a mesh and/or textures that no longer match those around it. The flickering you see is likely due to mismatched meshes now partially overlapping each other, and because of their distance to the camera, start z-fighting. The z-buffer is used by the graphics card to determine which polygon (specifically, the texels that make it up) gets drawn over the other (one item going behind another). This z-buffer has limited accuracy though, especially on older cards, and that means that the further an object gets from the camera, the less accurate the z-buffer becomes. At great enough distances, there might not be enough accuracy to determine which polygon is actually in-front of another, so they "fight" for dominance, which causes a flicker as one is drawn over the other, and vice versa. If you have an old graphics card, the easy (but expensive) fix is to get a new graphics card with higher bit z-buffer support. The proper fix is to find out why you have LOD issues and fix them, but that's an entire can of worms that even I haven't really figured out. The King of Swag fucked around with this message at 08:14 on Mar 14, 2014 |
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Mar 14, 2014 06:32
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Right, I have figured out how not to be an idiot for the most part. I am currently adding radio stations, dropping in Existence and Colenrad, but I am having trouble getting the Secret Stash to work. At all. Or even the Extender. It basically makes it so that Mr. New Vegas does a news clip, then it goes into silence. Any idea what I am doing wrong?
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Mar 14, 2014 07:09
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Another Person posted:Right, so using FOMM I was able to get the mods to list, but when I ran it the game wouldn't work, even with all the mods disabled and even when not using FOMM. Fresh install of the whole game is taking place now. I assume my fuckup was in running FOMM, not the mods, I probs moved a file to the wrong place. I also hosed up running the 4GB mod. 1) Post your load order. You may have a mod missing a master or something, and if you show us what you have we might be able to help you spot it. 2) Texture mods don't necessarily need an .esm or .esp file, meaning they won't show up in FOMM; simply having the new texture files in the data folder will override vanilla textures, so as long as you installed them properly they will work. 3) If you happen to be a stickler for organizing your data folder, Mod Organizer may be a better choice for your day to day use than FOMM. Some mods (UI mods for example) are best set up with FOMM, but once installed you can use MO to pick and choose which mods you use at a time. MO has the added benefit of showing a complete list of installed mods (like texture mods) in addition to a FOMM style list of .esm and .esp files.
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Mar 14, 2014 07:14
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Hobo on Fire posted:1) Post your load order. You may have a mod missing a master or something, and if you show us what you have we might be able to help you spot it. I basically cleared my entire game over, redownloaded and got rid of my data files since then. I stopped messing with texture mods, and now it all works fine except Radio Extender, which just makes RNV into dead air.
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Mar 14, 2014 07:20
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Another Person posted:I basically cleared my entire game over, redownloaded and got rid of my data files since then. I stopped messing with texture mods, and now it all works fine except Radio Extender, which just makes RNV into dead air. You may have configured the ESP wrong. Additionally, there's an .exe with the mod that you use to set it up. If you don't place things properly it may cause the issues you're having. You may also have files in the wrong format and/or location. There's a bunch of stuff you have to do for it outside of FOMM for the Radio Extender. Otherwise they won't function properly.
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Mar 14, 2014 07:53
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Aahhh, I'll just leave it for another time then. Shame I can't use the RNV extender, which seems to rely on the main extender, unlike the other station add ons, but I don't mind too much. Means I get to listen to Heartache By The Number more often, so I can't complain.
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Mar 14, 2014 08:31
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Nobody Interesting posted:As far as I know, making a merged patch is really just right clicking one of the esp files in FNVEdit, going to options at the bottom and then hitting 'Create Merged patch' and that's all the magic done, because it handles detecting all the conflicts for you. You can then BOSS your load order to put your new merged patch in the optimal place in the queue. The 'Create Merged Patch' function creates an 'automatic merged patch', which won't resolve all conflicts you may have; just those concerning lists of various kinds (formlists, containers, levelled lists, etc). Anything more complicated than that generally needs a human brain to say "for this weapon I want to use the altered mesh from this mod, but the rebalanced stats from this other mod", or what-have-you. You don't need Wrye Flash for that, but yeah; it does need some manual work. Also I've never used BOSS, but I wouldn't have thought it would know what to do with an automatic merged patch you've generated yourself. In any case, those just go at the bottom of your load order (in all cases I'm aware of).
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Mar 14, 2014 13:28
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Another Person posted:Right, so using FOMM I was able to get the mods to list, but when I ran it the game wouldn't work, even with all the mods disabled and even when not using FOMM. Fresh install of the whole game is taking place now. I assume my fuckup was in running FOMM, not the mods, I probs moved a file to the wrong place. I also hosed up running the 4GB mod. Try using Mod Organizer next time. It doesn't actually "touch" the Data folder, so you can keep it really clean and tidy.
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Mar 14, 2014 16:08
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Gyshall posted:Try using Mod Organizer next time. It doesn't actually "touch" the Data folder, so you can keep it really clean and tidy. If you use anything with fomod scripts however, you're going to need FOMM. It can't handle stuff like Project Nevada, oHud/uHud, and many, many other UI mods. The main trick to 'organizing' your data folder is to be very careful about what you install and how you install it. FOMM is perfectly good for this, it just requires you to be exacting in your own maintenance and not utterly rely on FOMM to do it for you. Also, merged patches created automatically basically combine any formList or leveled list or whatever sort of list to prevent conflicts and changes from not applying, because most modders are really dumb and lazy. Good modders use scripts to add these things to lists on gamestart, which is why PN - Equipment and all of Millenias guns don't need merged patches for various different things; If Millenia adds a gun to the cowboy perk formlist, he doesn't stick it in there, altering the list, he has a script that adds it to the list at game start so the list is 'vanilla' and unaltered, and it will always work much better. E2: Also you can, in FNVEdit, edit your merged patch to include proper changes and specifics down the line in addition to the automatic functions. SpookyLizard fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Mar 14, 2014 |
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Mar 14, 2014 17:48
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Another Person posted:I basically cleared my entire game over, redownloaded and got rid of my data files since then. I stopped messing with texture mods, and now it all works fine except Radio Extender, which just makes RNV into dead air.
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Mar 14, 2014 17:54
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The King of Swag posted:Just as a thought, another alternative I've thought about; instead of the little flags, make them little square patches of leather that are riveted to the shelf. At least then the explanation is as simple as taking an old and worn-out pair of leather clothing and cutting it up to re-purpose it. I was sort of wanting to suggest something like that instead of the flags but I didn't want to sound like a jerk. I was thinking of the items just sitting on a color-coded or text labeled mat on the shelf, it sounds cleaner in my mind? And you could interact with the part of shelf mat still visible in front of the items, assuming there is any. This is of course not being said from a modder's perspective so I'm sure there are issues with this concept as well.
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Mar 14, 2014 20:55
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SpookyLizard posted:If Millenia adds a gun to the cowboy perk formlist, he doesn't stick it in there, altering the list, he has a script that adds it to the list at game start so the list is 'vanilla' and unaltered, and it will always work much better. Millenia don't add poo poo to poo poo, I do  Also, adding stuff via script does have one really, really bad drawback versus adding stuff manually - have fun with your save game if you decide to remove a mod that added stuff via script. You can't clean that poo poo like you can with the manual, 'dirty' way. There are drawbacks to both but making a merged patch is arguably the lesser of the two evils in the long run. Fortunately for me, I don't give a rats rear end about any of your save games and just wanted to cut down on the amount of bitching in the comments about incompatibilities 
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Mar 14, 2014 22:53
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Light Gun Man posted:I was sort of wanting to suggest something like that instead of the flags but I didn't want to sound like a jerk. I was thinking of the items just sitting on a color-coded or text labeled mat on the shelf, it sounds cleaner in my mind? And you could interact with the part of shelf mat still visible in front of the items, assuming there is any. This is of course not being said from a modder's perspective so I'm sure there are issues with this concept as well. I've already tried out the posters and they unfortunately don't really work, because there's not enough space to place them around some of the shelves. They also wouldn't be expandable to the ammo shelves when they're done, because the item placement on the shelves is dynamic and not predetermined. Your idea may work to solve both problems; by making the activators look like shelf liners that drape a little over the edge (with the item icon bleached into this draping part), they shouldn't look nearly as out of place, while still retaining the needed dynamism. They would probably only be in a handful of colors though; I have excellent color vision, but I know from working on other projects, that a lot of people are color-blind (especially red-green) and would have serious issues with any sort of label that relied entirely on colors to distinguish between them. Beyond that, there's really no good way to attribute a color to items any more granular than categories (i.e. black for poisons, red for healing items, yellow for stimulants). I'm also hesitant to replace the icons with text, because aside from a lot of the item names being really long, they also aren't easily translatable. Edit: I also want to reiterate that if you disagree or don't entirely like something I post, please speak up about it--you won't sound like a jerk. If I'm the only one looking critically at something, then I may not spot the issues with it until I've already done a lot of work on it (such as in this case). The King of Swag fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Mar 14, 2014 |
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Mar 14, 2014 23:39
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Naky posted:Millenia don't add poo poo to poo poo, I do I intend for my mod to be good enough for users to never delete it
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Mar 14, 2014 23:51
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E:Fixed its self apparently, whoop.
dbzfandiego fucked around with this message at 00:40 on Mar 15, 2014 |
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Mar 15, 2014 00:29
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SpookyLizard posted:I intend for my mod to be good enough for users to never delete it When it comes to modding and the Nexus, I always must assume that the user is borderline retarded. Therefore the scripts are the best way to go for wide release 
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Mar 15, 2014 02:15
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Naky posted:Millenia don't add poo poo to poo poo, I do This is basically why I usually do it the manual way (though I try to do it in as compatible a way as is reasonably possible); I like to give users more control. The downside is that the user needs to be literate and ideally not an 'Ask-Firster'. It's probably also partially habit for me, going back to my FO3-modding days - and there I was influenced by ElminsterEU (original creator - from memory - of TES4Edit/FO3Edit/FNVEdit/etc), when he told me to "do it this way, it's better". To be fair this was in the context of WMK, where it was more necessary due to the way the weapon modification script worked (formlist contents needed to be in a precise order). The 'OrderedList' thing in FO3Edit/etc was largely added with this part of WMK in mind, iirc.
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Mar 15, 2014 05:48
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Alright, I'm trying out the shelf liner idea to replace the flags, and I think it looks better, but I want some feedback on what others think. The red of course is just an example color I decided to start out with. If this does end up being what people prefer, I'll probably do as I suggested earlier, and color code shelves with black, yellow, etc. as a general hint of the type of stuff on that particular shelf. In this screenshot, I've yet to remove the flags and add the item icons to the hanging parts of the liner, so you may have to use a little bit of imagination. I didn't get enough time today to put together a full and complete example. 
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Mar 15, 2014 07:08
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It looks... rather fancy, for what's meant to be a last-resort military hideout.
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Mar 15, 2014 13:16
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Antistar01 posted:This is basically why I usually do it the manual way (though I try to do it in as compatible a way as is reasonably possible); I like to give users more control. The downside is that the user needs to be literate and ideally not an 'Ask-Firster'. When I made Mill's weapon pack, I actually intended to do it the manual way simply because I had just a tiny bit of guilt that I'd be wrecking everyone's save games the moment they disabled all of his guns and used the pack instead but then I realized I didn't much care and instead still wanted to cut down on complaints and how-to requests in the comments. Plus I hate making the scripts. The next update to the pack will probably force me to start a second loving script thanks to the text limit. Who knew adding 38 weapons to the various leveled and form lists would have enough lines of code to run into a text limit?
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Mar 15, 2014 15:58
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This is an odd one. I have Four Eyes so wearing glasses is optimal, I've been wearing a pair of shades added by a mod (I think Spice of Life) and I've just found a pair of Lucky Shades (oddly enough in a metal box in OWB, I'm finding really weird items all over the place - Dean's Tuxedo was in The Sink) and putting them on makes everything darker. With the shades my Per becomes 10 and at 2pm outside it's as dark as 5pm until I take them off. This didn't happen with the Spice of Life shades.    Also Lobotomites have nipples on their legs: 
Nobody Interesting fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Mar 15, 2014 |
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Mar 15, 2014 17:06
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Don't know about the nipple-legs but the shades look like it's the Project Nevada visor overlay effect that's darkening your screen. If you are indeed running PN it can be turned off in the MCM menu. Shades from Spice of Life might not have full PN support.
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Mar 15, 2014 17:16
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The sunglasses sound like part of the enchanted vision thing from project Nevada. Do you have that installed? Because it's probably that. It's a feature. You can disable it in MCM if you don't like it. There's a formlist in PN-core I think you can edit to include any modded in sunglasses to give the. This feature.
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Mar 15, 2014 17:18
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Nope, don't have Project Nevada. E: Seems it was Active Wasteland, thankfully that's modular so I can turn off tinting. Nobody Interesting fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Mar 15, 2014 |
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Mar 15, 2014 17:22
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Nobody Interesting posted:I've just found a pair of Lucky Shades (oddly enough in a metal box in OWB, I'm finding really weird items all over the place - Dean's Tuxedo was in The Sink)] Do you use More Perks? There's a Perk that gives you a chance to find unique items in containers. (I found the La Lounge Carbine in Nelson once.) I forget it's name, but the icon is Vault Boy finding a grandfather clock in a duffel bag.
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Mar 15, 2014 17:39
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