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Enkor posted:This is somehow always the case, I've found. hubris.txt
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Mar 18, 2014 04:51
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Tao Jones posted:Bremen, the graveyard of empires. You know, I mostly just try to cultivate a reputation as a good and trustworthy neighbor, but I don't mind this one either. To be fair I've played in 3 goon games, and in one of them I got conquered and sliced up like a pie. It's just the other two where I ended up in super defensible positions that repeatedly ground attacking forces to dust. And I'll note I'm still not sure how I held off Austria in this last game. It was by the skin of my teeth, with my city ending several turns on single digit hp. Some screenshots, btw. Early Assyria in all its glory. Pre-Artillery it was really only attackable by sea (not that this stopped America from trying), and the bizarre map layout meant that I was one of only three nations with cities on the main ocean. And the other two were across the planet. Also visible is the citadel Jaymax used to steal my cotton, the first of many ways he decided to poke the lion. Like conquering my befriended CS neighbor of Bogota. fuckyoujaymax.jpg Shortly followed by the most justified war of conquest the world has ever known. After that I kind of forgot to take screenshots, but Austria and Brazil (the other two coastal powers) hit me by sea while America tried to invade from the east. I feel bad I bitched so much about that but I was under the impression they were doing it in response to Jaymax's complaints about my "warmongering". I managed to hold them off but, deceptive score to the contrary, was never in a great position and rapidly fell behind on tech.
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Mar 18, 2014 06:38
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I on the other hand had nothing really going for me. I also went stupid and decided to deep a little bit into Liberty to rush a GE so I could throw up a wonder (I think i finally used it on Forbidden Palace so I could have some sort of leverage on international decisions). The area all around me is full of flat plains, with minimal resources and I think around 10 hills spread out total. Unfortunately my only screenshot, but you get the idea of whats lying around me  Not really used to playing Poland either so I really wasn't sure what to do in my situation besides settle near some hills and pump out some hammers. I guess I could've gone culture? Poland seems so balanced that I didn't know what to do besides have some production for military use. I did eventually build a city in the nearest jungle and a coastal city up in the northwest (which could've traded with Jaymax but lol boston) and upon discovering that the pangaea map is absolutely riddled with peninsulas spreading all the way to the icecaps made the city location kind of useless. My initial plan was to raze Valletta (I didn't know you couldn't raze city-states  ) and steal the remaining hills so I could pump out more production.And then Fart Laffer came with his merchant and bought it out... This immediately ticked me off and I was preparing to attack but on hindsight I should have waited a couple more turns and not have surrounded his territory with crossbowmen because he DOW'd me allowing him to attack first, knocking the majority of my crossbowmen army out. After that I turned into a slowly-degressing civ with not a lot going for but production for some army-men in the late game..and we know how that turned out
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Mar 18, 2014 07:07
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bef posted:I did eventually build a city in the nearest jungle and a coastal city up in the northwest (which could've traded with Jaymax but lol boston) Nope. Boston was one tile from the coast.  e: Unless that’s your point. I figured you didn’t want to trade with Boston anyway because it was a poo poo city with few resources and little base income.
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Mar 18, 2014 08:21
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It looks like there's a Call To Power mod for Civ 5, but I haven't found out much about it. Anyone tried it? I really fancy a crazy game of orbital cities, plasmaticas, bioterrorists etc. and it would be great to do so in the Civ 5 engine. Am I getting my hopes up too high?
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Mar 18, 2014 10:53
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Flopstick posted:It looks like there's a Call To Power mod for Civ 5, but I haven't found out much about it. Anyone tried it? I really fancy a crazy game of orbital cities, plasmaticas, bioterrorists etc. and it would be great to do so in the Civ 5 engine. Am I getting my hopes up too high? Yes. All ambitious Civ 5 mods suck. Civ 5 is just easy enough to mod that you can make the game worse, but not difficult enough to mod that bored smart people waste their time on it. There will never be a Fall From Heaven for Civ 5.
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Mar 18, 2014 11:20
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What options were choosen for the map, especially for resources? There seem to be a lot of strategic resources in particular, or is it just standard with a relatively lucky start?
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Mar 18, 2014 14:47
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My Ramses game is getting fun and I finally started using my spies as diplomats. Schmoozed with Hiawatha and Siam to vote against Dido being the world congress leader then schmoozed them into voting yea for Beef Sausage world religion. Got that passed and Dido/Napoleon/Shaka are pissed. Shaka finally attacked me but he doesn't have dynamite yet so I've been sitting behind the great wall with artillery killing his knights and stuff. I'm just at a loss now though. Korea and Ghandi are close to me with cultural victory and I'm narrowly ahead of Hiawatha for science. If I give up on either I think one of them will surge ahead. I'm considering turning this into a domination victory.
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Mar 18, 2014 14:50
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Hollow Talk posted:What options were choosen for the map, especially for resources? There seem to be a lot of strategic resources in particular, or is it just standard with a relatively lucky start? It was a bog standard pangaea except for low sea levels and I can't remember if we opted to set the temperature 1 notch colder than normal to try to shrink the jungle band.
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Mar 18, 2014 15:17
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Doltos posted:My Ramses game is getting fun and I finally started using my spies as diplomats. Schmoozed with Hiawatha and Siam to vote against Dido being the world congress leader then schmoozed them into voting yea for Beef Sausage world religion. Got that passed and Dido/Napoleon/Shaka are pissed. His Great Wall or yours? In a decision that's illogical to the point of being exactly backwards, but makes a certain amount of sense from a strategic tradeoff gameplay standpoint (want artillery? give up your defenses), Great Wall is obsoleted when its owner discovers Dynamite, not when its attacker does.
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Mar 18, 2014 17:01
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Vil posted:His Great Wall or yours? In a decision that's illogical to the point of being exactly backwards, but makes a certain amount of sense from a strategic tradeoff gameplay standpoint (want artillery? give up your defenses), Great Wall is obsoleted when its owner discovers Dynamite, not when its attacker does. Oh, it's mine, and I didn't know that. I thought if the attacker has dynamite then it becomes obsolete.
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Mar 18, 2014 17:06
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Platystemon posted:Nope. Boston was one tile from the coast. I set up the city before boston existed hoping I could have a naval military or trade with Bremen or anyone else to the west, little did I know a fractal of its landmass protrudes itself out to the icecaps.
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Mar 18, 2014 17:48
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Vil posted:His Great Wall or yours? In a decision that's illogical to the point of being exactly backwards, but makes a certain amount of sense from a strategic tradeoff gameplay standpoint (want artillery? give up your defenses), Great Wall is obsoleted when its owner discovers Dynamite, not when its attacker does. Great Wall(And other such wonders with cutoff) have ALWAYS worked so, and SAID so, from Civ 1 through 4. I cannot understand anyone who is familiar with the previous games being surprised by this.
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Mar 18, 2014 18:27
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Squid (Klean Energy) didn't have a coastal city either. It was literally Bremen and me all alone on the ocean of six city states.
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Mar 18, 2014 18:31
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Bloodly posted:Great Wall(And other such wonders with cutoff) have ALWAYS worked so, and SAID so, from Civ 1 through 4. I cannot understand anyone who is familiar with the previous games being surprised by this. Plenty of people aren't familiar with the previous games, and regardless of tradition it's very unintuitive that your Great Wall no longer works to stop your opponent's knights just because you have artillery. But as noted it makes sense from a game balance perspective.
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Mar 18, 2014 18:32
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Yeah I played Civ 4 but I still didn't know that. I find out something new every time I play. Like, for instance, I NEVER did diplomacy with my spies until last night. I always stuck them in city-states or as counter-intelligence. My form of diplomacy was to kill the CPU with trebuchets.
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Mar 18, 2014 18:38
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Doltos posted:Yeah I played Civ 4 but I still didn't know that. I find out something new every time I play. Like, for instance, I NEVER did diplomacy with my spies until last night. I always stuck them in city-states or as counter-intelligence. My form of diplomacy was to kill the CPU with trebuchets. The tech that gives you extra votes for spies as diplomats is a fantastic way to get a diplomatic victory into the end zone in the late game. Edit: I'd love to play a game of Civ on a map that represents Venus if it had as much water as Earth. That, or a watery Mars. Peas and Rice fucked around with this message at 19:58 on Mar 18, 2014 |
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Mar 18, 2014 18:39
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Peas and Rice posted:The tech that gives you extra votes for spies as diplomats is a fantastic way to get a diplomatic victory into the end zone in the late game. Yet another reason why every victory is a science victory.
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Mar 18, 2014 20:28
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Gort posted:Yet another reason why every victory is a science victory. Most diplo victories are economic victories, really. I mean, sure, science helps your economy get up to the 100-200 GPT you need to be able to bribe all the city-states to your side, but you don't need to have unlocked the entire tech tree to win diplo the way you need to to win a "real" science victory. I mean, you could as easily say "every victory is a military victory" because you have to keep a sizable standing military to keep the other players from stomping you. Kinda hard to say "every victory is a cultural victory" though  .
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Mar 18, 2014 20:43
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Bloodly posted:Great Wall(And other such wonders with cutoff) have ALWAYS worked so, and SAID so, from Civ 1 through 4. I cannot understand anyone who is familiar with the previous games being surprised by this.
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Mar 18, 2014 22:14
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Anyone have any idea how to get a custom civ playable on a custom TSL map? This is a .civ5map file, not a mod folder, so I can't do the XML voodoo I've seen mentioned on a couple of forums, and I'm not coming up with anything through some googling and messing around with the worldbuilder. Specifically, I'm trying to get this version of the UK to replace the default Britain spawn on this Europe TSL map. Do I need to somehow convert the map file into a mod folder so I can make the XML changes?
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Mar 19, 2014 01:17
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What days/times does multiplayer happen? I wouldn't mind getting in on the next game if I've got that timeslot available.
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Mar 19, 2014 05:19
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Tao Jones posted:What days/times does multiplayer happen? I wouldn't mind getting in on the next game if I've got that timeslot available. It has been happening at 19:00 U.S. East Coast time Sundays and Thursdays. There was talk of making it one day per week next time.
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Mar 19, 2014 05:52
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Platystemon posted:It has been happening at 19:00 U.S. East Coast time Sundays and Thursdays. I was thinking about holding separate games on Thursdays and Sundays. That way people only need to commit to 1 night a week. I don't love the idea but last time we didn't get a full 8 players. I personally don't find 2 nights a week too prohibitive but I guess we couldn't find 7 other people who agree with that :welp: In any case I'm going to hold a game on Quick/Small on Thursday for people who want to do something while the next big game gets fully organized. I'll probably gently caress with the map settings a bit too.
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Mar 19, 2014 06:18
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If you could move the game to Fridays or Saturdays (for East coast), then I'd be okay to play.
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Mar 19, 2014 06:23
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That would be easier for us eurogoons as well. 
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Mar 19, 2014 07:27
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Yeah! I would be up for that if it were Friday or Saturday. At least then I could catch up on sleep the morning after... Btw, last call for the current GMR game being set up. Now's your chance because the next one likely won't get enough players for a very long time. Thread is here: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/goonciv/discussions/0/540732888809763839/ Invites are here: http://multiplayerrobot.com/Game/Join/9664?token=1f70ba73-c0b2-4d5a-9d58-80e523c8882a http://multiplayerrobot.com/Game/Join/9664?token=b1871bb1-b705-4d2f-8775-fe801dcb281e http://multiplayerrobot.com/Game/Join/9664?token=11db848b-fa06-4e91-891c-9b1f5e9438a3
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Mar 19, 2014 09:06
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KKKlean Energy posted:Yeah! I would be up for that if it were Friday or Saturday. At least then I could catch up on sleep the morning after... I joined up through the first link! Looking forward to it. I've never really done civ multiplayer on this scale, though I tend to hold up against the immortal AI just fine, we'll see how it goes. I'm new to this client stuff though, sorry if I goof it up, I'm getting it all set up now.
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Mar 19, 2014 09:25
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So I've played some more and read some guides, and I feel I have a better grasp on the game. Right now I'm trying to think of a good strategy in multiplayer when I play with friends. My thinking is defensive with no reliance on externalities as I call them. Things such as City State alliances and trading with other Civs. While I'd still utilize them, my policy would be isolationism until I'm ready to win. With that in mind, I'm thinking of a Cultural Victory. Right now we're using GaK as one player doesn't want to get BNW before it's on sale at some point. My thinking is to use Egypt to get as many as Wonders as possible. Is this the best strategy, or is there a better one? I do use BNW sometimes, what about with that? Wonders seem critical to Cultural Victories, and the early game can be extremely tight on production timing. The issue being that beyond that Egypt doesn't do anything for Culture or Tourism at the late game, like France's Chateaus for example. But if I play as France or another Civ, I might end up missing Wonders in the early game, especially if I screw up my research and build order, or get a lovely start. Is early Wonder rushing really critical like I think it is, or not so much? Anyway, I might also be interested in a game with goons as well if you guys can't get players. I'm not sure on the etiquette here though, I've never done anything with goons beyond trying and failing to run some DnD games. Is it all right if I joined the Steam group, or what?
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Mar 19, 2014 10:20
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Lord Justice posted:So I've played some more and read some guides, and I feel I have a better grasp on the game. Right now I'm trying to think of a good strategy in multiplayer when I play with friends. If you're playing without Brave New World then tourism isn't a factor and you just need to max your cultural output.
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Mar 19, 2014 10:45
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Cultural Victory absolutely calls for interacting with other civs, getting those open borders and diplomats and world religion/ideology votes out are crucial. Science on the other hand is isolationist.
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Mar 19, 2014 11:14
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Phobophilia posted:Cultural Victory absolutely calls for interacting with other civs, getting those open borders and diplomats and world religion/ideology votes out are crucial. Yeah, thinking on it, you're right, at least with BNW. From what I understand, Cultural Victory is somewhat defensive in GaK, while BNW requires you to go on the offensive with Tourism and interact with externalities. All right, so, Science. I don't have access to Babylon or Korea, so that's out. Is Wonder rushing still a good strategy with Egypt for a science victory, or is there a better tactic with a different Civ? That's kind of my big hangup here, not getting the Wonders I need, or think I need anyway. Lord Justice fucked around with this message at 11:35 on Mar 19, 2014 |
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Mar 19, 2014 11:27
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Culture victory wasn't really defensive either, it was just hard and worse. I remember the one saving grace was that puppet cities didn't raise your social policy costs while providing culture, so you could puppet a massive empire while staying at 4 cities to win culture relatively quickly. You still needed to tech fast to unlock the culture buildings to win in a reasonable frame of time, and winning it without key wonders like stonehenge and oracle was a huge pain in the rear end. Not to mention you still had to build the Utopia Project. Mayans are probably the second/third best civ for science victory. You get science from pyramids and rushing theology for a quick great scientist is great. Not quite as fast as the Babylonians but that civ is stupid broken good anyway. There really are no key world wonders for science victory outside of Great Library, but rushing that is a gamble and more a factor on the terrain of your capital than civ bonuses. +20% isn't going to do poo poo if they have a bunch of 2f1h tiles and you're competing with 2f1c. Or if they get a goodie hut with +1 pop and you don't, or find writing in a hut, or find a city state with an early worker, etc. But gimmicks aside, empire management is going to be the key factor in how fast you can get to any victory. WarpedLichen fucked around with this message at 11:46 on Mar 19, 2014 |
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Mar 19, 2014 11:44
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Mayans are definitely the best science civilization if Babylon and Korea are out of the picture. Just make sure to grab Tradition and Rationalism ASAP to maximise your science output and you should be fine. National College goes in your capital, too, and try and get your cities next to mountains for observatories.
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Mar 19, 2014 12:56
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I’m going to say that the Aztecs are better than the Maya for science. Floating gardens are unbeatable. This guy makes a case for the Netherlands as the best science civ with the right start.
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Mar 19, 2014 13:06
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Gort posted:Mayans are definitely the best science civilization if Babylon and Korea are out of the picture. Shouldn't Mayans be going Liberty and thus wide to abuse the Pyramud UB or am I missing something here?
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Mar 19, 2014 13:13
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No because then the limiting factor becomes Happiness, which Mayan Pyramids don't provide. Liberty sucks, its only purpose is to get a super fast settler and ram it into someone's face. Really, any Civ that can grow their cities vertical incredibly quickly will do well in science. Getting free great scientists or bonus science from academies are only the cherry on top. Edit: T-Hawk doesn't even make that case, he just had a good start with a ton of free land (which scales better in G&K), and exploited the AIs with luxury sales for free settlers. Phobophilia fucked around with this message at 14:04 on Mar 19, 2014 |
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Mar 19, 2014 13:55
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Platystemon posted:I’m going to say that the Aztecs are better than the Maya for science. Floating gardens are unbeatable. If that's the case then the Inca should be above Netherlands. With the right start they're a crazy unstoppable monster of growth.
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Mar 19, 2014 13:56
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Platystemon posted:I’m going to say that the Aztecs are better than the Maya for science. Floating gardens are unbeatable. That was in GaK, in which a) Trading for lump sums was available without declarations of friendship and b) The science penalty for multiple cities didn't exist. Those two factors let him quick-expand, sell his luxuries for cash, and keep some happiness while still getting a lot of science. With BNW that strategy is nerfed pretty hard.
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Mar 19, 2014 15:09
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How much would you guys be willing to play a Civ if domination was the only way to win? Science would affect the quality of guys you have while production would focus entirely on keeping your troops trained and fed. Culture would be a modifier to your happiness to prevent revolutions/military coups.
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Mar 19, 2014 15:16
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