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Pope Guilty posted:So is Ecclesia supposed to be really hard? I was doing fine up until the prison island, and the giant skeleton at the start of that just repeatedly wrecks me. Elevator-crab at the lighthouse (which I think is right after the prison island) and that horse-machine-crossbow thing late in the game absolutely wrecked my poo poo in Ecclesia. It has some pretty rough boss battles at times. But if you could get the patterns down, that really eased things up.
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Mar 18, 2014 06:49
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Pope Guilty posted:So is Ecclesia supposed to be really hard? I was doing fine up until the prison island, and the giant skeleton at the start of that just repeatedly wrecks me. Yeah. It's hard. The bosses have specific patterns, though. So if you watch for those you can theoretically dodge everything. Think of Shanoa as more of a dodge/agile character than the usual rough-and-tumble Belmont.
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Mar 18, 2014 06:55
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Mister Roboto posted:Yeah. It's hard. This is basically the thing. Don't just run in mashing the attack button. Dodge, look for an opening, attack, dodge, repeat. There are even some mook enemies who will require this approach upon first encountering them.
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Mar 18, 2014 07:38
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Pope Guilty posted:So is Ecclesia supposed to be really hard? I was doing fine up until the prison island, and the giant skeleton at the start of that just repeatedly wrecks me. Remember that you pretty much can't tank anything in OoE, unlike the other metroidvanias. Luckily almost every attack has a tell you can find if you hang back for a bit.
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Mar 18, 2014 07:45
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Mister Roboto posted:Yeah. It's hard. Yeah, this is something really important to remember. Even with high defence and buffs and such, Shanoa both hits like a truck and bleeds buckets. However you don't have a backdash that's any good. What's a vampire slayer to do? First things first, keep in mind that doing damage is ALWAYS less important then avoiding it. You may do a ton of damage but in a straight race you're barely a match for most basic enemies, let alone a boss. Attack when you can, but learn the pattern of the boss and avoid them. Second, Magnes nodes in boss arenas are usually quite useful but not something you can hang around on. For the Giant Skeleton, keep in mind it has a charge if you try to get behind it. Also, the vast majority of bosses are much bigger then Shanoa and take big steps to match it. The Giant Skeleton can step over you if you're standing in just the right spot, but it also has a nice big blind spot to step over you when you crouch. Next is that there's three things that affect damage. One is your Strength or Int. Two is your damage type vs the enemy's weakness, and lastly is your weapon rank. The last one is annoying but using the same weapon helps power it up. I wouldn't worry about it terribly much, though. The type of weapon is usually much more important then your rank. At this point, you'll have Macir, the hammer glyph. It's effective vs the skeleton, so make sure to use that instead of Confodore, Ascia or the like. Another thing is Shanoa has a bit of a backswing on ground attacks. If you can help it, hopping a bit before attacking helps you keep up mobility. Good luck! The next boss is the only one I've never gotten a perfection medal for. Dresh posted:This is basically the thing. Don't just run in mashing the attack button. Dodge, look for an opening, attack, dodge, repeat. There are even some mook enemies who will require this approach upon first encountering them. I can think of about 3-5 in the very same Prison Island that that's the case for.
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Mar 18, 2014 07:47
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Equip the same weapon glyph to both arms and you can alternate between them almost as rapidly as you can press the buttons, which is essential for having adequate damage output against bosses.
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Mar 18, 2014 07:51
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Speaking of tanks, I liked how they had 8-bit Simon appear as a playable cameo on the DS and he played like on the NES. Slow sprite plod, awkward nes jumping, but hit like a tank. It fit the image of Simon as a burly barbarian in the official art. Made the Belmonts actually seem like different people.
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Mar 18, 2014 07:56
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One thing that's just killer is that if you change direction in midjump, Shanoa changes facing when she hits the ground. I'm used to being able to jump in, then start to fall back, attacking as I do, then hit L to backdash away when I hit the ground. This must be unlearned for Ecclesia, since Shanoa changes facing, meaning that backdashing upon hitting the ground sends her right into the boss!
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Mar 18, 2014 08:00
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Mister Roboto posted:It was fun to see the NES characters rendered in 3d. You mean seeing Death Note characters dressed up as Castlevania ones. Even on the NES it was pretty clear that Grant was a pirate and not a mummy.
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Mar 18, 2014 11:27
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Dresh posted:This is basically the thing. Don't just run in mashing the attack button. Dodge, look for an opening, attack, dodge, repeat. There are even some mook enemies who will require this approach upon first encountering them. At least until you get Ignis/Vol Ignis, then it just becomes a game of Gradius 
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Mar 18, 2014 20:32
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Pope Guilty posted:One thing that's just killer is that if you change direction in midjump, Shanoa changes facing when she hits the ground. I'm used to being able to jump in, then start to fall back, attacking as I do, then hit L to backdash away when I hit the ground. This must be unlearned for Ecclesia, since Shanoa changes facing, meaning that backdashing upon hitting the ground sends her right into the boss! If you attack before trying to switch directions she will continue facing the way that you're attacking as long as you're still in the attack animation when you're holding back. Another tip is that if you land facing one way and want to backdash the other, hold down before trying to change directions to stay in the same place. Order of Ecclesia's bosses are all about positioning, and you never want to be forced to move too close to the bosses that damage you when touched. With regards to this, you have a main glyph (Y button) and sub glyph (X button). The main glyph has a slightly longer range than the sub glyph, and you can use that to stay further away from enemies if needed. The skeleton boss has a very simple trick. His kick attack leaves him extremely vulnerable to the hammer. He seriously just sticks his leg out for several seconds and you can get several hits in. The kick will never hit you if you're ducking on the left corner of the boss arena, so when he gets too close you know that he is going to try and use his jump attack on you. Before he's able to do that, use magnes to jump over him and once he backs up a bit jump back over and hit him whenever he kicks again. Repeat until dead. Anatharon posted:However you don't have a backdash that's any good. What's a vampire slayer to do? Shanoa's backdash is actually incredible and you can cancel everything on the ground with it except for sliding. Here's an example of the kind of things you can do with it from the LP of level 1 hard mode that I did.
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Mar 18, 2014 21:27
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Evil Eagle posted:If you attack before trying to switch directions she will continue facing the way that you're attacking as long as you're still in the attack animation when you're holding back. Another tip is that if you land facing one way and want to backdash the other, hold down before trying to change directions to stay in the same place. Order of Ecclesia's bosses are all about positioning, and you never want to be forced to move too close to the bosses that damage you when touched. With regards to this, you have a main glyph (Y button) and sub glyph (X button). The main glyph has a slightly longer range than the sub glyph, and you can use that to stay further away from enemies if needed. That's really helpful, thanks! quote:The skeleton boss has a very simple trick. His kick attack leaves him extremely vulnerable to the hammer. He seriously just sticks his leg out for several seconds and you can get several hits in. The kick will never hit you if you're ducking on the left corner of the boss arena, so when he gets too close you know that he is going to try and use his jump attack on you. Before he's able to do that, use magnes to jump over him and once he backs up a bit jump back over and hit him whenever he kicks again. Repeat until dead. Okay, so once the skeleton is flipped over, clawing at Shanoa, I should be focusing on getting back to his left to tempt the kick?
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Mar 18, 2014 22:13
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Evil Eagle posted:Shanoa's backdash is actually incredible and you can cancel everything on the ground with it except for sliding. Here's an example of the kind of things you can do with it from the LP of level 1 hard mode that I did. I was making the unfair comparison to Albus' backdash which is probably the best one in the entire series. :v It's also kinda slow. Cuntellectual fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Mar 18, 2014 |
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Mar 18, 2014 22:27
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Pope Guilty posted:Okay, so once the skeleton is flipped over, clawing at Shanoa, I should be focusing on getting back to his left to tempt the kick? Yep, that's the best way to go about it. Anatharon posted:I was making the unfair comparison to Albus' backdash which is probably the best one in the entire series. :v Well it's hard to beat backdashing through enemies and projectiles. I will say that canceling Shanoa's backdash is the fastest way to move through the game before grabbing Rapidus Fio or Redire+Magnes. Evil Eagle fucked around with this message at 22:50 on Mar 18, 2014 |
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Mar 18, 2014 22:37
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Evil Eagle posted:Yep, that's the best way to go about it. Hm, maybe I have been undestimating it then. I tend to not spend much time on the ground so I never really used it.
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Mar 20, 2014 08:43
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I was posting this stuff in the Lords of Shadow thread but it's probably better posted here: IGA interviews! I've added some excerpts, but go ahead and read 'em all if you're bored. http://kotaku.com/the-challenge-of-leaving-castlevania-and-konami-behin-1544855373 quote:I asked Iga why he wasn't in charge of Lords of Shadow. "We made two 3D Castlevania games," he said. "And to be honest, they didn't turn out so well. Mercury Steam is very skilled at creating beautiful 3D images, so they were brought in to develop the game." http://www.polygon.com/2014/3/19/5523676/koji-igarashi-interview-castlevania-konami-and-going-independent quote:"The more hardcore the game... the less suitable it is for the casual market," Igarashi told Polygon in an interview at this week's Game Developers Conference. "Unfortunately, I'm good at making core experiences, so it was two years of making a game that leaned too 'hardcore' for the social market. So it was canceled. Then I'd try again and be canceled. And again and be canceled. quote:"A lot of people said, 'That's a shame. We're going to miss you,'" Iga recalled. "Others said 'It's a shame and we'll miss you, but this really is probably the right time,' because they know what Konami is about. One of the things, that made me happy is [that] a lot of people said, 'Hey, I want you to hire me, take me with you.' So that felt good." quote:When asked to expand on his future game plans, Igarashi said, "If you just look at my strengths, most likely it will be an action game. Of course, fans would like a 2D exploration sort of game, a Metroidvania-type game. That's definitely something i'm interested in to make them happy. http://www.usgamer.net/articles/the-resurrection-of-koji-igarashi quote:USG: Why do so many creators have to go independent to make the games they want to create? Why do publishers seem so willing to ignore the evidently large number of fans who are begging for these classic style games and franchises? quote:USG: There's a trend these days of classic game developers going independent and getting the band back together, so to speak. Do you plan to work with people like Ayami Kojima and Michiru Yamane, who are so closely linked with your Castlevania games?
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Mar 20, 2014 12:09
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IGA sounds like a cool dude, I hope he gets to make games again. 
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Mar 20, 2014 14:05
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Sakurazuka posted:IGA sounds like a cool dude, I hope he gets to make games again. I can't wait for his Mighty No. 9-esque Castlevania equivalent. It will be so great 
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Mar 20, 2014 15:17
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IGA posted:"And since the quality for our 3D Castlevania games wasn't that high, it wasn't really our place to tell them how to do one. They had that expertise." Uhh, Curse of Darkness is legit one of the best Castlevania games. What the hell Iga 
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Mar 20, 2014 15:47
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Silhouette posted:Uhh, Curse of Darkness is legit one of the best Castlevania games. What the hell Iga I feel like you played completely different 3D castlevanias from me because those games were real bad.
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Mar 20, 2014 15:49
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Barudak posted:I feel like you played completely different 3D castlevanias from me because those games were real bad. Lament of Innocence was pretty bad but Curse of Darkness was a big step up.
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Mar 20, 2014 15:55
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I'd still rather play LoI and CoD than Lords of Shadow, for whatever that's worth.
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Mar 20, 2014 15:56
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IGA designed game with MercurySteam visuals would have been the perfect mix. Don't let them near the music though, LoS was some boring generic poo poo.
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Mar 20, 2014 15:58
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While I didn't like the music in the original LoS, I enjoyed the music in Mirror of Fate and LoS2. LoS I felt was the most enjoyable 3d Castlevania, but I put LoI behind CV64 and LoD
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Mar 20, 2014 16:09
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MarsDragon posted:I'd still rather play LoI and CoD than Lords of Shadow, for whatever that's worth. I wouldn't. I think Lords of Shadow is a good game, but I couldn't stand either of the PS2 Castlevanias. Great soundtracks, though.
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Mar 20, 2014 16:11
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Barudak posted:I feel like you played completely different 3D castlevanias from me because those games were real bad. Curse is almost literally SoTN in 3D. Plus it has Trevor Belmont, with a much better redesign than Simon got for Chronicles.
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Mar 20, 2014 22:29
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Curse of Darkness had cool designs and the ability to gently caress up Dracula with a sword bigger than you are in 3D. Also a pet system that was surprisingly unobtrusive for what it was.
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Mar 20, 2014 23:00
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To be honest it was sort of nice to have a human+pet game where the pets were actually stronger than you.
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Mar 20, 2014 23:03
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Silhouette posted:Curse is almost literally SoTN in 3D. Plus it has Trevor Belmont, with a much better redesign than Simon got for Chronicles. You're making me want to track this down and fire up the PS2 again man.
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Mar 20, 2014 23:07
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It's not really that good. I mean, stealing was awesome, it's true. Some pets and weapons were cool. It just felt like there was less cool stuff.
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Mar 20, 2014 23:13
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Curse of Darkness was somehow lacking in content and also bloated to poo poo. Large, barren areas that you had to go through to get to other parts of the castle because teleporters were sparse, grinding with weapon types to get specific IDs, getting specific IDs to get to certain (albeit optional) areas, just a bunch of boring padding. It didn't help that half the weapon types were slow enough so as to be useless or at least not as good as just using the fast ones. Music was fantastic though. What the gently caress was with the chairs, though? At least Juste was building up a sweet bachelor's pad.
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Mar 20, 2014 23:19
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Juste's bachelor pad was awesome. The first time I played that game I was like "Uh what's up with this weird object, is it part of a puzzle or something?" and it was a statue or something. Really though for the most part the games built at least a little on the previous entries. Especially OoE.
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Mar 20, 2014 23:30
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Phantasium posted:Curse of Darkness was somehow lacking in content and also bloated to poo poo. Yeah, Curse of Darkness was ambitious, but it had a ton of poo poo that just wasn't interesting to bother with. I think the pet system was far deeper than what I used it for, but it was just easier to go down the regular evolve path.
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Mar 21, 2014 00:07
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Monkey Fracas posted:You're making me want to track this down and fire up the PS2 again man. Get the Xbox version instead, it runs at 60fps and has almost no load times.
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Mar 22, 2014 03:47
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Monkey Fracas posted:You're making me want to track this down and fire up the PS2 again man. I coulda sworn that game was on PS3 as a PS2 classic.
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Mar 22, 2014 12:37
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ChaosArgate posted:I coulda sworn that game was on PS3 as a PS2 classic. Nah, only LoI.
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Mar 22, 2014 17:50
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IGA posted:"The more hardcore the game... the less suitable it is for the casual market," Igarashi told Polygon in an interview at this week's Game Developers Conference. "Unfortunately, I'm good at making core experiences, so it was two years of making a game that leaned too 'hardcore' for the social market. So it was canceled. Then I'd try again and be canceled. And again and be canceled. Man that is sad. There were actual 2D Castlevania games being developed and canceled because they were too "hardcore". Order of Ecclesia's my favorite game of all time so I hate to hear that.
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Mar 22, 2014 21:01
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That reminds me of how God Hand (of all things) got a 3/10 from IGN for being too hard.
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Mar 22, 2014 21:12
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It also called out how janky it was graphically, which was true. But not 3/10 true.
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Mar 22, 2014 22:02
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Evil Eagle posted:Man that is sad. There were actual 2D Castlevania games being developed and canceled because they were too "hardcore". Order of Ecclesia's my favorite game of all time so I hate to hear that. Based on his wording, it sounds like he was making games for the social market, not Castlevania games.
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Mar 22, 2014 22:04
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