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Omnikin posted:!!! i agree. i really think they should hold tighter to the consecutive yusho standard. it's going to be annoying having to hear the months/years of people complaining after this that maybe kakuryuu isn't yokozuna material after all - i'd love to be proven wrong about that but i feel like he'll probably settle in around the 10 wins mark. if he'd actually won 2 yusho it'd be a different story that being said, fantastic basho. and what a tachiai from harumafuji in that last match, god drat. strongest i've ever seen from him
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Mar 23, 2014 16:12
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Omnikin posted:Sure, but does it make sense? His records indicate a lot of inconsistency including barely making kachikoshi the two bashos before his recent stellar performances. I don't know why they're rushing him to a likely promotion Considering how they were so eager to push Kisenosato previously, this is actually rather consistent behavior for them. Personally, I'd wonder if they didn't promote Kakuryu after promising Kisenosato would be promoted if he had performed similarly. E: That being said, I personally think they should stick to the two yusho standard. anakha fucked around with this message at 16:38 on Mar 23, 2014 |
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Mar 23, 2014 16:35
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All I know for sure is this is one of the best basho I've seen in some time. There were quality matches every day and not just at the top, either. The story lines being played out were very compelling and dramatic. As for the other thing, I'm also down for the two yusho standard. I like consistency and that's been their threshold and they should stick to it. That being said, I do wonder if the SA has just decided that they are temporarily going to set that standard aside to account for Hakuho being around right now. He's clearly an all-time great (possibly greatest) and they may be thinking that in order to keep the hopes of the lower ranks alive we'll show that promotion is still possible under the reign of Hakuho instead of stick to the old ways and potentially let a lot of elite wrestlers potentially get left at Ozeki simply because Hakuho is just that drat good. This also prevents wrestlers from becoming complacent which leads to bad sumo. However, I think that the 2 yusho standard should still apply because in my eyes you can only ever really be judged by the competition you have to face in your own era in terms of being deserving of title and rank. If you can't yusho twice against a field including Hakuho, then you aren't a loving yokozuna in my mind and that's that. Bad luck to you that you happened to compete in the same time as he. If you just happen to keep competing longer than he does and then you gain promotion, then I think you would be fairly judged as someone that benefited from his retirement. I don't know of any time in the past where this same thing has occurred, but I don't pretend to be a sumo history expert.
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Mar 23, 2014 17:01
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For promoting out of lower divisions and even in makuuchi for some things a playoff loss is considered a yusho equivalent by the NSK, so even if you guys want to stick to that metric he has satisfied it anyway.
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Mar 23, 2014 17:16
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I blame Kisenosato
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Mar 23, 2014 17:41
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Nice to see Osunaarashi hit KK Isn't Kakuryu Mongolian as well? It makes it seem less they're doing it just to get a Japanese yokozuna and more because of the whole Hakuho is too drat good thing.
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Mar 23, 2014 17:47
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Awesome basho! I'm particularly glad Osunaarashi scraped kk after his injury spell and Goeido - who's becoming a personal favourite of mine - had a great run, and is well set-up for an Ozeki push in May. Kakuryu knocking on the Yokozuna door and an excellent couple of inter-Yokozuna bouts going Harumafuji's way is the icing on the cake.
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Mar 23, 2014 18:02
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Goeido's a straight choker, but with the Ozekis thinning out the way they have I wouldn't be surprised to see him becoming Ozeki in July. The only thing I really like about him is how often he'll start staredowns with just about anyone and get wrecked right after. Big examples are against Hakuho and Shohzan. It's still fun though because the crowd always gets way into it
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Mar 23, 2014 18:33
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Kikkoman posted:Goeido's a straight choker, but with the Ozekis thinning out the way they have I wouldn't be surprised to see him becoming Ozeki in July. The only thing I really like about him is how often he'll start staredowns with just about anyone and get wrecked right after. Big examples are against Hakuho and Shohzan. It's still fun though because the crowd always gets way into it I've got a soft spot for chokers, to be fair. Kisenosato can get hosed, though
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Mar 23, 2014 18:37
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I'm fine with Kakuryu's promotion. As far as Im concerned, 14-1 with a playoff loss to Hakuho is as good as a Yusho. And he did beat Hakuho last tournament, he just couldn't do it twice in a row.
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Mar 23, 2014 19:52
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All right guys, I think we can stop with the spoiler tags on everything re: day 15 - I'm pretty sure nothing is getting spoiled at this point. I can't say any thing that hasn't already been said. What a basho. Lots of guns blazing early on and lots of breath-holding down the stretch, and some great stories. Especially for those of you in Japan, please keep us posted with stories or videos of the aftermath. I'm curious if Kakuryu ever showed any emotion, because he's a friggin robot afaik. And, please don't forget to donate to Kintamayama if you watched his videos and feel appreciative of his efforts.
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Mar 23, 2014 22:13
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I also don't think Kakuryu should be promoted. If he had a string of yokozuna level preformances then sure, but before the last 2 bashos he's consistently been in the 9-10 win range. That's fine for an ozeki, but if he goes back to that form as a yokozuna then he'll be forced to retire very quickly. I say wait until May, if he puts in a solid 12 win performance or better then promote him, but there's no reason to break the 2 yusho rule right away.
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Mar 23, 2014 23:11
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Konstantin posted:there's no reason to break the 2 yusho rule right away. Only if he was Japanese, then NSK would be all over a yokozuna promotion. I really don't think he should be promoted, especially since having three Mongolians representing the highest rank will only force NSK to hype their hopefuls even more (Endo, Goeido, Kisen).
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Mar 23, 2014 23:35
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Fryhtaning posted:All right guys, I think we can stop with the spoiler tags on everything re: day 15 - I'm pretty sure nothing is getting spoiled at this point. I watched a long-form interview with him on NHK, and he was still a super robot. During the parade though he looked pretty happy. Konstantin posted:I also don't think Kakuryu should be promoted. If he had a string of yokozuna level preformances then sure, but before the last 2 bashos he's consistently been in the 9-10 win range. That's fine for an ozeki, but if he goes back to that form as a yokozuna then he'll be forced to retire very quickly. I say wait until May, if he puts in a solid 12 win performance or better then promote him, but there's no reason to break the 2 yusho rule right away.  A playoff loss is a de facto yusho for considering promotion
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Mar 24, 2014 01:05
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I think another performance like this and Kakuryu would be ok, but I really think the two yusho rule is best. So many great matches this month. I am glad Osunaarashi managed kk. Holy hell that last tachiai from Harumafuji was ruthless, he really went for it and it paid off. I hope he keeps up this level of tenacity next basho.
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Mar 24, 2014 03:01
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Last 10 Bashos 135-15 Hakuho 120-30 Harumafuji 104-46 Kisenosato 102-48 Kakuryu Also, shamelessly reading from Wiki quote:The de facto standard is to win two consecutive championships as ōzeki or an equivalent performance. In the case where the "equivalent performance" criterion is used the wrestler's record over the previous three tournaments is taken into account with an expectation of at least one tournament victory and two runner-up performances, with none of the three records falling below twelve wins. So I guess if they really consider the playoff a Yusho, that's that. I just hope that his performance picks up
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Mar 24, 2014 04:28
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Omnikin posted:I just hope that his performance picks up That's really my main concern as well. If he's just on a short burst of good form and soon returns to his old ways of 9 or 10 wins, that's not going to fly as a yokozuna and he'll be forced into retirement. I'd rather he not get promoted and then get another yusho or 13-win performance to show that it isn't a flash in the pan.
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Mar 24, 2014 05:02
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Today the sumo association council recommended kakuryu for promotion. The requirement is 2/3rd yes votes and the decision was unanimous.Pvt. Public posted:That's really my main concern as well. If he's just on a short burst of good form and soon returns to his old ways of 9 or 10 wins, that's not going to fly as a yokozuna and he'll be forced into retirement. I'd rather he not get promoted and then get another yusho or 13-win performance to show that it isn't a flash in the pan. There was one guy who was promoted on his 5th yusho and ended up doing nothing and retiring after like a year and a half. So who knows! 3 yokozuna is kind of unserviceable anyway unless they beat everyone below them all the time.
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Mar 24, 2014 17:57
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That's not Homasho on the left of this photo, is it? Wonder why it wasn't one of the other Mongols. I mean, Hakuho himself rode with Kyokutenho. Somehow I've always gotten the impression that Hakuho and Harumafuji weren't too fond of Kakuryu, and the fact they've been nowhere to be found in the aftermath doesn't help dispel that notion any more. Fryhtaning fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Mar 24, 2014 |
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Mar 24, 2014 19:12
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Fryhtaning posted:That's not Homasho on the left of this photo, is it? yeah that's pretty weird. not from the same stable even.
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Mar 25, 2014 00:15
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Homasho just won the Juryo championship, so I'm gonna assume that's why he gets to ride along.
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Mar 25, 2014 00:47
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a false posted:yeah that's pretty weird. not from the same stable even. Yeah, that was my first reaction - I figured they'd be the same stable. Nope. Homasho is one weird looking dude when he smiles. Still my boy, though. Can't wait to see him back in makuuchi in May! Hopefully goony goon Tochinoshin is back in Juryo, too. He was pretty low in Makushita, but they tend to give established rikishi the express train when recovering from injuries. Edit: Good point about him winning Juryo, in any case. Still, I thought they get to pick who goes along with them. Maybe Kakuryu really DOES have no friends. 
Fryhtaning fucked around with this message at 01:05 on Mar 25, 2014 |
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Mar 25, 2014 01:00
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Tochinoshin looks like he won't get promoted, I was told by people more knowledgeable than me. I was hoping for promotion too because I was watching his bouts and he almost killed a mans. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21mXMQIY0NA Actually looking at the records he handed 3 guys their only losses, he was paired up with good dudes for the division. On the bright side goon favorite Takonoyama should be back in Juryo next time.
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Mar 25, 2014 01:51
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Uncle Jam posted:Tochinoshin looks like he won't get promoted, I was told by people more knowledgeable than me. I was hoping for promotion too because I was watching his bouts and he almost killed a mans. Tochinoshin was placed at Ms55, I guess that's too many places to jump in one go, even with a 7-0. He was demoted that far for being out injured for 3.5 basho so I guess expecting him to get back to Makuuchi in fewer than 3 tournaments is optimistic. He'll be top-end Makushita next time, which should still be a cakewalk - with another 7-0 he could reasonably expect a high entry into Juryo and only spend one basho there before getting back where he belongs (assuming he can stay fit this time)
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Mar 25, 2014 02:03
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Uncle Jam posted:Tochinoshin looks like he won't get promoted, I was told by people more knowledgeable than me. I was hoping for promotion too because I was watching his bouts and he almost killed a mans. Jesus, talk about overmatched. David vs Goliath: The More-Likely Story. With the lower body that Tochinoshin has, it's a shame he wasn't ever able to survive the komusubi meat grinder. He is built to put Kisenosato to shame when it comes to balance.
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Mar 25, 2014 04:19
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When you have a new yokozuna you gotta make a new rope
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Mar 25, 2014 22:56
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kakuryu's promotion is front page news on wikipedia 
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Mar 27, 2014 16:08
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oh and i didn't see anyone mention it before but the special prizes for this basho were: Fighting Spirit - Yoshikaze Outstanding Performance - Goeido Technique - None
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Mar 27, 2014 16:29
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a false posted:kakuryu's promotion is front page news on wikipedia Came to post this. I honestly don't see him hanging around much longer.
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Mar 27, 2014 16:42
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Funkysauce posted:Came to post this. yeah, i have my doubts about how he'll do as yokozuna but i hope i'm proven wrong. gonna be a lot of kinboshi opportunities
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Mar 27, 2014 16:44
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a false posted:gonna be a lot of kinboshi opportunities Remember that only maegashira can get a kinboshi. So, M1 and below would have to defeat him to earn one, which I don't see happening more than once during a typical basho. I think it's more the sanyaku who could potentially start thrashing him again if this is just a lucky streak.
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Mar 27, 2014 21:23
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I don't think there will be an increase in kinboshi, Kak is miles ahead of every other rikishi save Hakuho and Harumafuji.
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Mar 27, 2014 22:58
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Also it seems like the maegashira have been really weak lately, generally m1 to m5 get makekochi and get replace by a new batch that does the same thing...
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Mar 28, 2014 01:15
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Kakuryu's first yokozuna dohyo-iri: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=havyMl3HsF4 Looks like he went Unryu.
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Apr 6, 2014 13:17
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Who is the rikishi to the right of Kakuryu during his performance? Ikioi is the one of the left I believe.
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Apr 7, 2014 13:38
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Diplomat posted:Who is the rikishi to the right of Kakuryu during his performance? Ikioi is the one of the left I believe. Kagamio and Ikioi accompanied him, I believe.
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Apr 7, 2014 15:45
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Saw this on Asashoryu's Facebook... pretty awesome.
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Apr 22, 2014 13:36
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what on earth is on hakuho's robe i can't figure it out
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Apr 22, 2014 13:52
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a false posted:what on earth is on hakuho's robe i can't figure it out Looks like a bear's head to me. And a lot of glare.
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Apr 22, 2014 15:02
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Forgive my ignorance - who's the guy in the middle?
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Apr 22, 2014 15:03
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