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laplace posted:I don't think there's any information on the actual setting yet is there? They've confirmed it is a high school game. Everything else they've said about it has been completely hollow pr talk though. It'll be all new and different while also building on concepts and themes and various things the team has accumulated over the years! Edit: It will focus on people who feel chained by society and yearn to break free. This is definitely a bold new frontier for the Persona series. TurnipFritter fucked around with this message at 06:55 on Mar 31, 2014 |
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Mar 31, 2014 06:53
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Manatee Cannon posted:What makes you think that? The Sega acquisition? Nothing in particular. It's just been in development for a really long time, is their first HD-system JRPG, and is the first one they're making after the franchise is generally considered their big-hit after P3 and P4 back-to-back. It's pretty common for games like that to end up awkward or badly designed for a number of reasons.
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Mar 31, 2014 08:39
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ImpAtom posted:Nothing in particular. It's just been in development for a really long time, is their first HD-system JRPG, and is the first one they're making after the franchise is generally considered their big-hit after P3 and P4 back-to-back. It's pretty common for games like that to end up awkward or badly designed for a number of reasons. They do have some experience working in HD, for what it's worth. A full, Persona-length JRPG is on a whole other level than Catherine was, but it's experience nonetheless.
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Mar 31, 2014 08:52
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King of Solomon posted:They do have some experience working in HD, for what it's worth. A full, Persona-length JRPG is on a whole other level than Catherine was, but it's experience nonetheless. Yeah, but the size is an entirely different scale and a bunch of other Japanese companies got completely blindsided by HD development despite really should have been more careful about it. Even stuff like Tales of Xillia (which came out pretty good) is clearly unfinished and something they apologized for. I'm not saying it will For Sure suck but I've got a bad feeling about it.
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Mar 31, 2014 09:06
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ImpAtom posted:Yeah, but the size is an entirely different scale and a bunch of other Japanese companies got completely blindsided by HD development despite really should have been more careful about it. Even stuff like Tales of Xillia (which came out pretty good) is clearly unfinished and something they apologized for. I'm not saying it will For Sure suck but I've got a bad feeling about it. I don't disagree! That would be why I put in the second sentence, after all. I was just clarifying that they do have some experience working in HD, so they shouldn't be completely blindsided by this, but you never know.
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Mar 31, 2014 09:08
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So I'm actually visiting japan for the first time. It's weird to see places and recognize them from Videogames except that the places have thousands of people packed into a tiny area everywhere, which really makes the post apocalyptic part so much more obvious when it's empty. Policenaut posted:Well give Atlus some time, surely at some point they'll decide they need more money and put out a new version of Nocturne for like the 3DS or PS3 or something. I would buy Nocturne for a portable.
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Mar 31, 2014 09:46
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ImpAtom posted:Nothing in particular. It's just been in development for a really long time, Only about two years which isn't too bad.
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Mar 31, 2014 10:52
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Especially if they're having to recreate every single demon from the ground up.
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Mar 31, 2014 13:29
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It'd be nice to see the Social Link system incorporate more costly features. Like, say you make friends with a delinquent, but in doing so you give up a lot of class standing and you get involved in destructive behavior, like drinking. Sort of like a PSA, except in the end you're basically just sacrificing health in favor of getting better Personas. Or maybe have a friend who disrupts your other friendships, or who is always begging money off you.
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Mar 31, 2014 16:22
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BottledBodhisvata posted:It'd be nice to see the Social Link system incorporate more costly features. Like, say you make friends with a delinquent, but in doing so you give up a lot of class standing and you get involved in destructive behavior, like drinking. Sort of like a PSA, except in the end you're basically just sacrificing health in favor of getting better Personas. Or maybe have a friend who disrupts your other friendships, or who is always begging money off you. >You cannot talk to the Student Council President until you are a member of a culture club. Go talk to the "first year" girl who has daddy issues to join. >Quiet Girl will not talk to you because you are already in a relationship with another girl. That could get ugly really fast. E:It could turn into a Law/Chaos thing where if you become friends with the "Law" students(good grades, top club member, nice to everybody) you get locked out of the "Chaos" students (delinquent, bad grades, skip school) and vice versa. Dehry fucked around with this message at 16:59 on Mar 31, 2014 |
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Mar 31, 2014 16:50
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That could be cool, maybe even in addition to Persona bonuses/choices, have S-Links give you independent bonuses. Like the time you spend with the street gang rolling old ladies for pocket change gives you a Fear chance bonus to normal weapon attacks, or the Pyrotechnics Club boosting Fire damage or what have you. Basically like the S-Link bonuses the Investigation Team members get, but for the MC instead.
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Mar 31, 2014 17:36
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projecthalaxy posted:That could be cool, maybe even in addition to Persona bonuses/choices, have S-Links give you independent bonuses. Like the time you spend with the street gang rolling old ladies for pocket change gives you a Fear chance bonus to normal weapon attacks, or the Pyrotechnics Club boosting Fire damage or what have you. Basically like the S-Link bonuses the Investigation Team members get, but for the MC instead. Oh man if they added in weapon crafting in, like, a home ec class, that would be awesome. Especially if you get unique weapon materials from S-links in addition to Persona levels. Imagine the hours and hours...of crafting. beautiful beautiful crafting
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Mar 31, 2014 17:41
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BottledBodhisvata posted:Oh man if they added in weapon crafting in, like, a home ec class, that would be awesome. Especially if you get unique weapon materials from S-links in addition to Persona levels. Imagine the hours and hours...of crafting. I liked the simple weapon crafting system they had in P3 with the antique shop, shoving Persona into weapons. Making Aigis a gun that shoots Lucifers was fun. Anything crafting based always adds to the game, so I'd love that. Also having it be in a class would be amazing. Everyone else is making birdhouses, you're there with an Evoker to your temple frantically taping a unicorn horn to a rapier handle.
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Mar 31, 2014 17:48
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BottledBodhisvata posted:It'd be nice to see the Social Link system incorporate more costly features. Like, say you make friends with a delinquent, but in doing so you give up a lot of class standing and you get involved in destructive behavior, like drinking. Sort of like a PSA, except in the end you're basically just sacrificing health in favor of getting better Personas. Or maybe have a friend who disrupts your other friendships, or who is always begging money off you. So you are actively trying to make S. Links worse than how they were in Vanilla P3, then? Like if there's one thing the S. Link system does not need, it is more crap to micromanage.
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Mar 31, 2014 18:47
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S. Links really just need to do two things differently: 1). Ditch any Links that don't directly relate to the story. Party members and key story characters, and that's it. Or barring that make the incidental sports club characters more important/versatile in their overall roles. If I ignore any given Link it should feel like something was missing in the story. 2). The level of the Link should have at least have a moderate to large influence upon story events. Not just a throwaway line here or there; if the character went through some life changing events that made them a better person, I want to see it reflected in the main story. Especially if you're dating one of them. Other than that just keep it the same as it was in P4.
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Mar 31, 2014 18:53
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The thought of the Gourmet King being in any way important to the story would make me feel like I'd have to interact with him, which nobody should ever have to do. Plus the MC inevitably socializes with people from different ages and professions during SLs. Needing to mix old lady Hisano or kindergartener Maiko into the main story would be weird. And making all the SLs just people of the MC's age would make them uninteresting. The P4 system works fine, maybe a bit more notice or attention from them after you finished the SL would be nice, like telephone dates actually having some worth even after you max out the link, but I'm not too perturbed by them as is.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:09
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Nate RFB posted:S. Links really just need to do two things differently: Funny, both of those reason are why I hated P4's links. They made a big deal of bonding with your team and family and that amounted for poo poo on the larger plot. Atlus should just use Obsidian's approach for writing plot/s. links 
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Mar 31, 2014 19:20
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I don't think there'd be a need to force them into major story events, but Hisano is pretty much exactly the sort of Link I wouldn't want. She might as well be a figment of the MC's imagination for all the actual presence she has in P4. It amounts to filler/padding in a "well we have to do something for Death" sort of way.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:23
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If you didn't like Akinari's link in P3 I don't know what to tell you. 
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Mar 31, 2014 19:26
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Honestly, the FATE system in Devil Survivor 2 is the best way to handle it, I think. Each character has their own set of events that happens throughout the plot, and it doesn't necessarily matter which events you see, but you do have to see a lot of them to reach the max FATE level. If you max out the link before the end of the game, that's fine! You can still go see the events and see more of that person's story, it just won't necessarily give you any extra benefits.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:27
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My problem with the FATE system is that it doesn't really matter what happens in them; sometimes the event that gets them to level 5 is an incidental or transitional event that was meant to build towards a future event. But you have no incentive to hang out with them any more because hey, they're level 5. So from a story perspective it's even worse than the S. Link system because it literally can not have any sort of impact in the story because there's a disconnect between the FATE level and what actually happened over the course of its events.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:31
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Is a tricky situation though, they can't made the links too important for the larger plot without railroading the players so the plot makes sense or too inconsequential since it comes as padding. As much as I like Alpha Protocol, its system worked because it was meant to be replayed a lot to get the full picture something than isn't realistically viable for a 50-80 hours rpg.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:33
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Well yeah, it's more difficult. That's kind of the point, it's an extra bit of effort that would be needed to take it to "the next level". For my own part, I would be relatively satisified if various conversations sprinkled througout the game could just have S. Link checks. If S. Link is > some level, have the character say/do this, else say/do this, that sort of thing. You wouldn't have to get too wild and crazy unless you got really ambitious.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:37
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I think S.Links/Fate systems in future games would be benefited by getting rid of the points system entirely. The whole "you need [x] points to level up this link" is arbitrary and leads to silly stuff as mentioned above, but also it leads to non-events that just waste your time. "Yeah you hung out with this person, whatever" is annoying when it happens in Persona 3/4 and making it so that you need to see [x] scenes in the link itself would streamline it and make it actually worth going to even when you don't necessarily get a level up then.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:42
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P4G went a long way in making the "point" system unnecessary, since there were so many little events you could do along the way to power up the Links without actually initiating the Link itself. Story events like when you worked on summer homework with Nanako and your teammates, or praying at the shrine or eating lunch with them. As a result it was very rare that in P4G I'd ever hang out with someone and not have it level up. But in principle, I agree, the easiest/best way to get around that entirely is just have them level up every single time no matter what. That's one thing Hisano's Link did right, at least. If you want to make it harder for the player to max out a Link, either prevent them from hanging out with you with some handwave excuse or give them more erratic schedules.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:48
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I just want the S-Link choices to be more meaningful. I've said it before, but the Alpha Protocol/Dragon Age/Fallout system of giving you little passive perks for basically every choice you make has always appealed to me. Basically I feel the outside world choices should affect the dungeon world more. Stat boosts when you and your girlfriend are in the party together, something like that. Optional party members if you are feeling super brave.
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Mar 31, 2014 19:56
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Really I'd say that Social Links are the only part that needs real improvement in the series right now, seeing is that Golden and Mega Ten 4 have been really improving the gameplay front. I agree that interaction with the party should be something more akin to Obsidian's and Telltale's games. Planescape Torment isn't a short game and it takes your relationships with the characters into account well.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:11
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projecthalaxy posted:Stat boosts when you and your girlfriend are in the party together, something like that.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:17
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Endorph posted:But then dating Ai Ebihara would be in optimal, and we can't have that. I'd say the same thing about Yumi, man, but I don't know I'm just brainstorming ideas here.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:22
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Also I don't know, I think there being S. Links that have no affect on the plot is a good thing. Persona 4's ostensibly about SOLVING THE MYSTERY OF THE TV WORLD~~~ but there's a reason most people view it more as a 'being some kid hanging out in a bumfuck nowhere Japanese town' simulator. The S. Links that have nothing to do with the main plot add to that feeling.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:28
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I don't think you would have to rope the inconsequential Links into the TV world plot, just have them feel like real people who live in that town rather than people who may as well not exist if you don't bother to actually initiate their Links. Those special events where Yosuke/Daisuke/Kou hang out on weekends? Maybe make them mandatory story events like when you visit the beach with the team or Operation Babe Hunt 2 (though obviously expanding upon them to make them more interesting). Maybe they get involved in other S. Links as well if they're at a certain level. Anything is better than being the equivalent of Yu Narukami's imaginary friends. To a certain extent the game already does this, like when they hang out with you in the cultural festival, but it's pretty insignificant.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:43
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The last thing the Persona series needs is more forced cutscenes.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:46
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Yeah playing Persona games over is such a god drat chore because there's almost an hour to almost two of not playing the drat game.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:53
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I always picked the MC's girlfriend based off the Christmas gift, it was always Rise cause 50% extra SP is bonkers whereas everyone else would just give you some junk that gave you high res against the girls element. I am glad P4 gave you some benefit for the summer scenarios and stuff, I loving loathed in P3 how the game forced you into crap without any sort of benefit, during summer you always had to do poo poo, the competition, summer school, some other crap I can't remember and your S.links wouldn't benefit from it. If I'm not mistake during summer you get maybe a week off to do whatever you want.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:54
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I think slight line changes in plot cutscenes based on your current S. Link rank with that person could work, with some effort. For example, even though Yosuke grows as a person in his S. Link, he still acts like a grade-A dipshit outside of it. If there's a scene where he would normally act rude but you've hung out with him enough for him to show some restraint on that front, have that happen. Even if the scene ends up at the same spot with the plot, it'd at least reflect Yosuke's growth from time spent.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:56
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Probably not in the form of more forced dialogue (I'm with Endorph on that one) but having some more dynamic dialogue would be good. I don't know, even just one line thrown into the dungeon square-button conversation pool if you finish a major side quest or S-Link. Something like Kasumi from ME 2 or the guards in a Bethesda game.
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Mar 31, 2014 21:57
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The only problem P4/P4G really has with forced story cutscenes is the the intro, which of course had too many and prevented the player from actually playing the game for too long at the start. If you're spacing them out I don't think anyone would notice. Besides this is for a hypothetical new game that can do whatever it wants to begin with (I'm not suggesting a new version of P4G with even more cutscenes added); you could even mix and match and have some of these incidental characters involved in the silly antics cutscenes that normally they wouldn't be involved in. Kashiwagi is an example of what I kind of mean. I mean she's not what I'd call a particularly good character, but she's someone who is not at all involved with the "serious" plot and yet absolutely feels like a "real" character of the town and the MC's life. A far cry from Kou/Yumi/Lonely Mom. Nate RFB fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Mar 31, 2014 |
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Mar 31, 2014 21:57
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I think it will be neat to see where they go with it. Meanwhile, this happened: 
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Mar 31, 2014 22:01
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Nate RFB posted:Kashiwagi is an example of what I kind of mean. I mean she's not what I'd call a particularly good character, but she's someone who is not at all involved with the "serious" plot and yet absolutely feels like a "real" character of the town and the MC's life. A far cry from Kou/Yumi/Lonely Mom. I completely agree with you, Kashiwagi does seem more real or important. The reason for this, I believe, is because other characters were shown talking to our about Kashiwagi, which put her more into the narrative. Serious question, but does any other "main" character ever acknowledge Ai, Yumi, or Ayane's existence or much less your relationship with them? Because it's been some months since I played Golden but I can't remember that happening. It's basically the number one issue I'd like to see fixed in P5. Also that logo is kinda weird and stretched looking, to me.
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Mar 31, 2014 22:40
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projecthalaxy posted:Serious question, but does any other "main" character ever acknowledge Ai, Yumi, or Ayane's existence or much less your relationship with them? Because it's been some months since I played Golden but I can't remember that happening. It's basically the number one issue I'd like to see fixed in P5. As far as I can remember, no. Not outside of scenes where you're dating two girls at once and you run into one while on a date with the other, at least.
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