|
Gavok posted:Triple posting to point out that this week's What If: Age of Ultron isn't very good. There kinda is, but it doesn't make a lick of sense, because, you know, the story is bad (I am referring to both the What If and AoU here). At the end of the actual AoU story, because of Wolverine loving with time twice by killing Hank Pym then stopping himself from killing Hank Pym, he becomes the figurative straw that broke the camel's back, the camel being space-time itself. In the story, this is shown by everybody getting big acid-trippy flashes where they see flashes of various events in their histories as well as alternate-timeline versions of themselves all at once (funny sidenote: they also show that this is going on across all the multiverse by showing the Ultimate Universe where Miles Morales gets a whammy like that but it's kinda silly because since there are no alternate Miles Moraleses yet, he just sees a bunch of characters totally unrelated to him like Doom 2099). Then it ends with Pym and Stark standing around going "Man, we have truly hosed the timestream up hard this time, huh?" then it shows Galactus got 'ported over to Ultimate and Angela got brought into 616. ANYWAY, getting back to your question, this both works in the story and doesn't. Janet gets hit with the timestream-whammy, which I guess makes sense if you wanna justify it by saying that this What If universe just got hit by the time-breaking effect from the 616 universe like a wave or something at the beginning of the story.... but then that makes it loving dumb as hell because then it's not a What If about Age of Ultron, it's a What If about what would happen if Hank Pym lost his poo poo grieving Jan's death then built Ultron to kill the Avengers, then Ultron went Skynet. This is not an alternate take on the story of AoU at all, this is, dare I say, worse than What If AvX in terms of missing the point of a What If. TwoPair fucked around with this message at 07:08 on Apr 3, 2014 |
#
?
Apr 3, 2014 07:05
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 1, 2024 10:08 |
|
|
The miniseries would redeem itself pretty damned quick if it turned out that one of the OG Avengers not being around from the start turned the entire MU into sunshine and lollipops forever. Probably Tony. "Pepper inherited his shares in Stark Industries and now everything is great."
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2014 07:22
|
|
|
Skwirl posted:
There was actually a glut of time travel stories in the Marvel books not long ago. Hulk and Banner-bot chasing criminals through time, Thor teaming up with Young Thor and Old Thor, Battle of the Atom and the All New X-Men thing in general, etcetera. It was a twist when the story running through the All New X-Men, Superior Spider-Man, and Hulk specials turned out to NOT involve time travel.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2014 14:29
|
|
|
Superior Spider-Man sounds like a What If that somehow assimilated the 616 continuity.
|
|
#
?
Apr 3, 2014 14:54
|
|
|
Question, are any of the Marvel Noir stories worth reading, particularly the X-Men Noir? I was skimming the Wikipedia page for them and they seem like they could be either good or bad.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 00:05
|
|
|
X-Men noir is pretty mediocre but the backup story which is pulpy sci-fi about Sentinels and Morlocks written by Boliver Trask was pretty good. Luke Cage Noir was pretty good, as was Spider-man Noir.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 00:52
|
|
|
The X-Men ones are okay at best, except for the Nightcrawler one-shot, which was very bad. All the other Noir books range from good to great. Deadpool Pulp is worth checking out too.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 02:13
|
|
|
Iron Man Noir was pretty bad and not actually Noir, and Wolverine Noir was just awful and generic. It might as well have just been a regular Wolverine story.
|
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 02:38
|
|
|
Chairman Capone posted:Question, are any of the Marvel Noir stories worth reading, particularly the X-Men Noir? I was skimming the Wikipedia page for them and they seem like they could be either good or bad. Spider-Man Noir was pretty good. Thought the sequel was solid enough as well? Punisher Noir was interesting. Wolverine Noir was kinda odd.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 04:45
|
|
|
Gavok posted:Because they're killing off Uatu and the Age of Ultron What If will probably be dire as hell, here's 20 Uplifting Marvel What If Stories to distract us all. What would you say is the most depressing What If of all time? I'd probably put Punisher kills Daredevil at the top. Also, I find it hilarious that if Spiderman kept the extra four arms, they would let him be able to kick both Thanos AND Mephisto's asses. The irony is delicious.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 18:24
|
|
|
E the Shaggy posted:What would you say is the most depressing What If of all time? I'd probably put Punisher kills Daredevil at the top. Easily the most depressing issue is What If? Starring the Incredible Hulk: The Man, the Monster. It's about a world where Bruce Banner is more like his father, so the Hulk is a peaceful, timid creature. It mostly deals with Banner physically abusing Betty and when she tries to speak out about it, she's thrown into an institution. The issue ends with a "If you know anyone like this, call this number" thing. Other notable depressing issues: - What If Gwen Stacy Had Lived? - What If the Invisible Girl Had Died? - What If Kraven the Hunter Had Killed Spider-Man? - What If the Marvel Superheroes Had Lost Atlantis Attacks? - What If the Fantastic Four's Second Child Had Lived? (first story) - What If Spider-Man's Parents Destroyed His Family? - What If War Machine Had Not Destroyed the Living Laser? (first and last story) - What If Kingpin Owned Daredevil? - What If Magneto Ruled All Mutants? - What If? Starring Juggernaut: Kingdom of Cain - What If? Starring Ghost Rider: Burn, Baby, Burn! - What If? Starring Quicksilver: The Quick and the Dead - What If Karen Page Had Lived? - What If General Ross Had Become the Hulk? - What If? Spider-Man: The Other - What If? Wolverine: Enemy of the State - What If? Age of Apocalypse - What If? Wolverine: Father - What If? Age of Ultron #1 I didn't think What If Punisher Killed Daredevil? was that bad, other than the scene of Frank having to put down Spider-Man. Sure, everybody important died, but it did end with Frank taking out the Kingpin. There are others that are supposed to be depressing, but I had to ignore them. What If Shard Had Lived Instead of Bishop? has a hilariously terrible ending. At the end of the story, she kills Magneto and then accidentally kills (I think) Storm. The final page jumps a few years into the future where mankind has all but eradicated mutants with a statue in the honor of Shard, as her actions somehow made all of this possible/okay. No explanation or anything. Just, "Here's a big pile of dead mutant bodies. Thanks, Shard!" Then there's What If? Fallen Son, where Iron Man dies post-Civil War instead of Captain America. This is supposed to be a horrible thing where everything's supposed to go to poo poo. And yes, Rhodey becomes a gigantic rear end in a top hat while Pepper hits the bottle pretty hard. But it also features Alexander Lukin/Red Skull buying all of Stark's armor and the Skrull invasion happening, all while Uatu's like, "This wasn't supposed to happen." Only this came out before Secret Invasion ended. All things considered, we'd probably be better off with Captain America in place of Iron Man because the whole deal was that Iron Man made it so much easier for the Skrulls to take over. Which also means that Red Skull's armory is completely useless and that "shocking" scene is utterly pointless.
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 19:44
|
|
|
Was Kingdom of Cain the one with the Juggernaut left alone on a dead earth, wanting to die by forever wandering because Nothing Stops The Juggernaut(tm)?
|
|
#
?
Apr 6, 2014 21:29
|
|
|
Was the "Kraven kills Spider-Man" one the one where he's tracked back to his manor by Daredevil and Cap, who find him (implied to be) eating Peter's face or something equally unpleasant?
|
|
#
?
Apr 7, 2014 00:57
|
|
|
Just do us a favor and write all those up into an article.
|
|
#
?
Apr 7, 2014 00:58
|
|
|
Mr. Maltose posted:Was Kingdom of Cain the one with the Juggernaut left alone on a dead earth, wanting to die by forever wandering because Nothing Stops The Juggernaut(tm)? Yeah. Juggernaut's seemingly the last man on Earth, spending decades unable to die or have companionship. Then he finds an elderly Magneto, who reveals that via using the Stranger's technology, he found out that Juggernaut was at fault. He killed the X-Men in his first fight against them, the Sentinels wiped out all powered threats and filled the world with toxic gas. Magneto dies and Juggernaut finds that he had his own underground civilization of survivors. Desperate to have someone to interact with, he bursts in and doesn't realize until he's too late that he let in all the toxic air and has doomed them all. Now all he can do is wander the dead Earth forever, knowing that this is all the result of his boorish behavior. Metal Loaf posted:Was the "Kraven kills Spider-Man" one the one where he's tracked back to his manor by Daredevil and Cap, who find him (implied to be) eating Peter's face or something equally unpleasant? Yep. Despite all the deaths in these comics, this one hit hard just for the scene towards the end of Cap, Daredevil and Human Torch going to MJ's apartment to break the news that her husband isn't coming home. They don't have any dialogue. She just sees their faces and breaks down. Mr. Maltose posted:Just do us a favor and write all those up into an article. Probably not going to happen. I'd feel so lovely once I'm done.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2014 03:45
|
|
|
I think one of my favorite's was What if X-Men lost Inferno, its just so stupidly metal. Also, Wolverine eats a baby.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2014 04:36
|
|
|
Has anyone read the What If where Namor was raised by his human dad rather than his Atlantean mum, is it worth checking out?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2014 14:55
|
|
|
Mind Loving Owl posted:Has anyone read the What If where Namor was raised by his human dad rather than his Atlantean mum, is it worth checking out? It's pretty mediocre. That's from the year where all the What Ifs were really more of an Elseworlds taking place in one reality. Thor became Galactus' herald, Daredevil was a samurai from feudal Japan, the Fantastic Four were commies, Captain America fought in the Civil War, etc. Today's issue was certainly something. Whatever it was, it had absolutely nothing to do with Ultron.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 01:26
|
|
|
Yeah, the only really good Elseworld from "The Watcher is a goon with a Super Gibson" was the Thor one, because the art was awesome. The Daredevil one was alright.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 01:31
|
|
Gavok posted:It's pretty mediocre. That's from the year where all the What Ifs were really more of an Elseworlds taking place in one reality. Thor became Galactus' herald, Daredevil was a samurai from feudal Japan, the Fantastic Four were commies, Captain America fought in the Civil War, etc. That's a shame, because I always thought Namor's relationship with his father (and his human side) was one of his more interesting and under-explored character traits.
|
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 01:36
|
|
|
Of those, I only read the Russian Fantastic Four and Civil War Captain America, but I liked'em.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 01:36
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:That's a shame, because I always thought Namor's relationship with his father (and his human side) was one of his more interesting and under-explored character traits. Basically Namor is mutant discrimination before the 1960s. He and the Human Torch robot are best buds but even the people they directly save during the war are leery of them. After that Namor does wetworks for the US but turns out because he didn't come down to Atlantis it's now taken over by Nazis. Nazis using the Human Torch to power the evil Water Nazi machinery. Namor saves everybody only to have the entire thing hit with a nuclear torpedo.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 01:46
|
|
|
I awlays thought it was weird Namor's last name was the same as his dad's. Wasn't he the result of a one night stand?
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 05:44
|
|
|
No. His dad is literally shot and killed in the process of evading Atlanteans with Namor's mom.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 06:02
|
|
|
Gavok posted:Today's issue was certainly something. Whatever it was, it had absolutely nothing to do with Ultron. Yeah, it looks like What If AoU is gonna consist entirely of "Somebody gets killed from time shockwave, observe fallout"
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 10:13
|
|
|
WickedHate posted:Of those, I only read the Russian Fantastic Four and Civil War Captain America, but I liked'em. Which issue was Civil War Cap?
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2014 22:01
|
|
|
Mycroft Holmes posted:Which issue was Civil War Cap? What If: Captain America. The art was a big asset and a pleasure to look at, even if the story was a bit goofy in spots.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2014 00:35
|
|
|
Mycroft Holmes posted:Which issue was Civil War Cap? It was an arc, v18 #61-65. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2014 16:33
|
|
|
WickedHate posted:What If: Captain America. The art was a big asset and a pleasure to look at, even if the story was a bit goofy in spots. Weirdest thing about the story was that it was coming out during the initial Winter Soldier arc, right after the Bucky reveal but before the "remember who you are!" conclusion. So in this Elseworldian What If issue, Bucky is given the role of the racist Civil War general who later becomes the White Skull.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2014 19:35
|
|
|
Gavok posted:Weirdest thing about the story was that it was coming out during the initial Winter Soldier arc, right after the Bucky reveal but before the "remember who you are!" conclusion. So in this Elseworldian What If issue, Bucky is given the role of the racist Civil War general who later becomes the White Skull. Thinking about it like that, the whole Winter Soldier thing must have been really dark when it first came up. Maybe if there's ever another Marvel vs DC event he and Jason can start a club. Of course, if Marvel does a sequel to that What If, they can do like Smallville and have it turn out the White Skull is the real Bucky's older brother.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2014 19:42
|
|
|
Gavok posted:Weirdest thing about the story was that it was coming out during the initial Winter Soldier arc, right after the Bucky reveal but before the "remember who you are!" conclusion. So in this Elseworldian What If issue, Bucky is given the role of the racist Civil War general who later becomes the White Skull. Yeah I remember that. And did Cap end up meeting a Native American who became the Falcon too? (Not to be confused with the Native American Falcon from Earth X...or the Native American Falcon type character who nearly killed Cap before they became friends during J.M. DeMatties run on Cap, called Blackcrow.) WickedHate posted:Thinking about it like that, the whole Winter Soldier thing must have been really dark when it first came up. Maybe if there's ever another Marvel vs DC event he and Jason can start a club. But yeah the Winter Soldier arc was really dark at the time. In fact it's darker than most people remember. At the time there was one really interesting fan theory floating around (that I think Ed Brubacker had to go "wow I can completely see where you guys are coming from, but that is not what I intended." when it was shown to him.) And I actually re-read the arc after the theory had been pointed out to me and it could have fit. Basically the theory was.... all the memories and flashback Cap has at the start of the arc are an attempt by Lurkin to put him off balance and are artificial constructs created by the Cube. (This was why the flashbacks we were shown were so different to any other telling of the "Cap and Bucky fail to stop Zemo's plan" tale.) The entire Winter Soldier Op was likewise a plan to put Cap off balance, and the Winter Soldier himself wasn't really Bucky. But it was another person who was altered to look like Bucky to give him an edge over Cap. Dark huh? It gets worse. The conclusion of the theory is that when Cap uses the Cube to "remember who you are!" in keeping with how the Cosmic Cube is an evil, malicious, monkey's paw it doesn't restore the Winter Soldiers memories. It just takes this Soviet Agent, erases his actual Identity and makes him just believe that he is Buckey Barnes now alive. Now that was Hella dark.
|
|
#
?
Apr 11, 2014 21:10
|
|
|
You know what we need? Another round of think up elseworld premises for characters who don't get them often! *Gong*
|
|
#
?
Apr 15, 2014 12:37
|
|
|
The Question IRL posted:Yeah I remember that. And did Cap end up meeting a Native American who became the Falcon too? (Not to be confused with the Native American Falcon from Earth X...or the Native American Falcon type character who nearly killed Cap before they became friends during J.M. DeMatties run on Cap, called Blackcrow.) Blackcrow was drat near the new Cap, had Jim Shooter not stepped in.
|
|
#
?
Apr 16, 2014 03:47
|
|
|
Only in What If do you see Microchip save the world in a heartwarming way in a story that doesn't even feature the Punisher.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2014 00:27
|
|
|
I'm not going to lie. I would read at least four issues about Natasha Romanov, Goddess of Thunder. The book could've stood to have explained how she got a mulligan on picking up the hammer, though.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2014 00:29
|
|
|
Wanderer posted:I'm not going to lie. I would read at least four issues about Natasha Romanov, Goddess of Thunder. Clearly Mjolnir just considers firing two rifle shots blindly into the air the worthiest thing of all.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2014 02:14
|
|
|
Mind Loving Owl posted:You know what we need? Another round of think up elseworld premises for characters who don't get them often! *Gong* WHAT IF: James Gordon became a rookie cop... IN BLUDHAVEN?! WHAT WOULD HAPPEN: if Jason Todd survived Death in the Family?! IMAGINE: the REVERSE FLASH...... UNMASKED AS BARRY ALLEN? IN ANOTHER LIFE: Planet EARTH sends its LAST SON to..... KRYPTON?!
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2014 05:38
|
|
|
FilthyImp posted:IN ANOTHER LIFE: Planet EARTH sends its LAST SON to..... KRYPTON?! Pretty sure they actually did that one.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2014 05:41
|
|
|
Gavok posted:Pretty sure they actually did that one. Counting imaginary stories they did it at least twice, once with Lois Lane.
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2014 06:20
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 1, 2024 10:08 |
|
|
Mind Loving Owl posted:You know what we need? Another round of think up elseworld premises for characters who don't get them often! *Gong* WHAT IF: Scrooge McDuck converts to Christianity and begins a populist campaign against the gold standard after a chance encounter with William Jennings Bryan in 1892?
|
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2014 09:42
|
|