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Unfortunately I rent, and it's the door to the hallway, so replacing it isn't an option. It's a metal door and frame, if that helps. I've seen it suggested, so I'm not just making poo poo up, but obviously I'm skeptical too.
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Apr 10, 2014 17:25
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i like nice words
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Anne Whateley posted:I have a hollow door that lets in a lot of noise. I'm thinking about drilling a hole in the top and filling it with foam. I of course have no clue exactly how much empty space is inside or how it's laid out. Is this a crazy idea? If not, would that be the best kind of foam for the job, or is there something even more low-expansion/sound-reducing? Maybe if you drill a few dozen holes.  In my last house the previous owners just glued felt to the interior of the laundry door to keep the sound down. It wasn't great, it wasn't awful. E: I'd just hang a blanket on it or something if you are just renting.
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Apr 10, 2014 17:28
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Anne Whateley posted:Unfortunately I rent, and it's the door to the hallway, so replacing it isn't an option. It's a metal door and frame, if that helps. I've seen it suggested, so I'm not just making poo poo up, but obviously I'm skeptical too. If replacing it isn't an option (which is easily reversible if you keep the old door) drilling holes and filling it with crap isn't either.
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Apr 10, 2014 17:43
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They would notice if I replaced the door and it didn't match the 20 others in the hall. They wouldn't notice if I spent half an hour squirting foam into it. I'm open to any other suggestions too. This is a long-term rental, I'll be here for like 10 years, so I don't mind fixing it up in easy/medium ways, but obviously I don't want to gently caress anything up.
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Apr 10, 2014 17:49
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Anne Whateley posted:They would notice if I replaced the door and it didn't match the 20 others in the hall. They wouldn't notice if I spent half an hour squirting foam into it. I'm open to any other suggestions too. This is a long-term rental, I'll be here for like 10 years, so I don't mind fixing it up in easy/medium ways, but obviously I don't want to gently caress anything up. Talk to the owner, and ask if you can replace the door at your own cost. They get a free door out of it. They may ask/require it be done by a licensed contractor, though.
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Apr 10, 2014 17:52
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Cover the inside of the door with cork, that's a noise reducer, right?
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Apr 10, 2014 17:56
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Anne Whateley posted:They would notice if I replaced the door and it didn't match the 20 others in the hall. They wouldn't notice if I spent half an hour squirting foam into it. I'm open to any other suggestions too. This is a long-term rental, I'll be here for like 10 years, so I don't mind fixing it up in easy/medium ways, but obviously I don't want to gently caress anything up. Wait...it's a common hallway door in a multi-tenant building? That's a fire rated door. Absolutely, positively no modifications. Including things as "simple" as a door stop. It has to be replaced with a full door and frame in order to maintain compliance.
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Apr 10, 2014 17:56
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Ok, you need to descibe this door, because there really should be only two options here. 1. Thick, already insualted door that you wouldn't be considering filling with spray foam because it would be very sound-dampening already. 2. A hollow metal door that is still quite solid, but doesn't insulate against sound as well. If it isn't one of the above options, then I think you would probably have a case for having the landlord actually replace all of them in the building as they are probably not up to code.
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Apr 10, 2014 18:22
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Anne Whateley posted:Hypothetically, if someone had done this and caused the paint to be permanently softened, is there any way to re-cure it or would it be best to strip it completely and repaint from scratch? Simple Green EATS the stuff that makes the paint hard. The paint is effectively ruined, there's no way to 'fix' it. I'd strip/scrape the area down and sand over the existing paint edge and repaint. You don't have to strip the entire thing, unless you really want to.
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Apr 10, 2014 18:25
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Blistex posted:Ok, you need to descibe this door, because there really should be only two options here. Easiest thing to do is to open it and look for the fire rating tag on the door of frame along the side with the hinges. If it's not there it's not the correct door.
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Apr 10, 2014 18:33
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It's the latter. The door and frame are both metal. The metal of the door seems thin enough that in the center, you can push on it and the layer you're touching readily flexes. It's a big 1920s apartment building, and many elements are still original, so the doors may be too (no idea). The walls are super thick plaster and lath that transmit almost no sound, so the door problem is especially obvious. I definitely don't want to be a pain in the rear end to the management company. If I can't do anything without involving them, I'll probably skip it, unfortunately. Amykinz posted:Simple Green EATS the stuff that makes the paint hard. The paint is effectively ruined, there's no way to 'fix' it. I'd strip/scrape the area down and sand over the existing paint edge and repaint. You don't have to strip the entire thing, unless you really want to. 
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Apr 10, 2014 18:36
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You can hang this or similar product on the door. They sell something like that at Lowe's by the roll. http://www.audimutesoundproofing.com/sound-deadening-materials-sound-deadener-sound-damping-rubber-sound-insulation.aspx quote:Peacemaker 3.2mm (single layer) - Noise Barriers = 19 db
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Apr 10, 2014 18:57
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Anne Whateley posted:I have a hollow door that lets in a lot of noise. I'm thinking about drilling a hole in the top and filling it with foam. I of course have no clue exactly how much empty space is inside or how it's laid out. Is this a crazy idea? If not, would that be the best kind of foam for the job, or is there something even more low-expansion/sound-reducing? I want to see your door explode
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Apr 10, 2014 21:38
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Please post video of your door blowing up like a popcorn bag.
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Apr 11, 2014 02:32
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If for some really stupid reason that door was actually hollow instead of a paper honeycomb, and there were no fire rating concerns, tiny styrofoam balls would probably work okay to help dampen the sound. I can't believe I'm even posting about this.
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Apr 11, 2014 06:10
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I wasn't pulling this out of my rear end, it's brought up a bunch on the internet. The product we were discussing is called Window & Door with minimal expansion, so it wasn't exactly clear it would expand too much for a door. Anyway, I'd like to see a door explode in slow motion, but not my door. I'll probably go with Nitrox's suggestion unless anyone has anything better. I can take pics if that would help at all. I'm still not sure the door has a chambered interior, or if it does, it doesn't seem to be attached to itself given the way the sides flex. Anyone know what the hell they were putting in 1920s apartment buildings?
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Apr 11, 2014 07:37
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That window and door stuff is for sealing around a newly-installed window or door frame, not for filling a hollow door like so much oreo white stuff.
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Apr 11, 2014 08:05
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Go find a fabric that matches your house roughly and a few feet of a thick dowel rod, and go get 2 rectangles roughly your door shaped but a but smaller. Proceed to lay one of said rectangles down then lay a few old towels down on top of this fabric , then tack them down so they don't slide down but try to keep them loose inside so there are wrinkles, the purpose is to thicken this with dense heavy fabric while keeping mini air pockets and making it squishey. Once all that is done sew the top rectangle on with the dowel rods in both ends on the inside to help it keep it's shape. Now you have something that does not look like poo poo if you worked at it, matches and will act as a major sound dampener on the cheap once it is hung on your door. But I too want to see the door explode.
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Apr 11, 2014 09:08
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Anne Whateley posted:I wasn't pulling this out of my rear end, it's brought up a bunch on the internet. The product we were discussing is called Window & Door with minimal expansion, I don't think you know what minimal expansion means as it relates to these foams. Even with the low-ex you can (and I HAVE) bent a window frame to the point where it wouldn't open/close properly. And that's filling a FRAME that's open on one side. (that was a mess to clean up). This stuff is so strong it is considered structural by code in some EU countries. Yes, meaning windows are only tacked in to level and then the low-ex foam is used to hold them into the building. With those things in mind, filling a door that has large hollow sections rather than honeycomb (as many old doors I've seen do) through a small hole would be a recipe for literally blowing it apart. There are a lot of bad ideas and people who have no idea what they are talking about speaking authoritatively on the internet about all kinds of things. So the fact that it's "brought up a bunch" doesn't mean a whole lot without the context and specifics. It's being "brought up" now as a really, really terrible idea. So there's a data point for you. Most importantly: you should not be messing with a required fire protection feature. Period. You have no idea the kind of poo poo storm that could cause. Let's assume the worst - fire in the hallway, your door is breached/apartment damaged. Here's how the various scenarios go down: It's a fire rated door in proper condition: property owner's insurance pays out, your renters insurance pays out Non fire rated door/not required at time of install: same Non fire rated door/incorrect for location: property owner's insurance tells him to pound sand, your renters insurance pays out and recovers their money from the property owner or their insurance Any of the above three situations but you've messed with the door in any way: property owner's insurance pitches a fit, your renter's insurance doesn't pay you out and probably gets sued (along with you) by the property owner and/or their insurance. Source: I was a municipal Fire Marshal and part-time insurance investigator for over a decade. Putting flammable material on the back of the door is also a bad idea. Doubly so if it has a fire rating tag in the frame.
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Apr 11, 2014 15:43
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Anne Whateley posted:I have a hollow door that lets in a lot of noise. Does your door have gaskets on all four sides? Because if not, a heavier door is still going to let in about as much noise.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:20
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Zhentar posted:Does your door have gaskets on all four sides? Because if not, a heavier door is still going to let in about as much noise. Use high-expansion foam so that the door will seal itself to the frame. Use the window for all future ingress/egress.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:23
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Just fill the door with oily rags and then do the same all around any cracks in the door frame. The oil makes the rags fit better.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:30
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Baronjutter posted:Just fill the door with oily rags and then do the same all around any cracks in the door frame. The oil makes the rags fit better. I do this too and in the winter I light the rags. They're a really good source of supplemental heat.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:50
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I have hardwood floors, it seems easier to start burning there. Will report back next winter.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:10
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Leperflesh posted:That window and door stuff is for sealing around a newly-installed window or door frame, not for filling a hollow door like so much oreo white stuff. Also, the one-part urethane foam in the cans will not cure properly in a sealed space. They react with the air to cure. For a large cavity like a door its basically a sealed container and will only partially cure and the insides will be gooey. You would need a 2-part foam that has its own catalyst to cure in a sealed container like a hollow door.
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Apr 11, 2014 18:01
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sbyers77 posted:Also, the one-part urethane foam in the cans will not cure properly in a sealed space. They react with the air to cure. For a large cavity like a door its basically a sealed container and will only partially cure and the insides will be gooey. Wont there be plenty of air once the door busts?
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Apr 11, 2014 19:01
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Poor Annie 
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Apr 11, 2014 21:34
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From the schadenfreude thread:   No way this was anywhere close to code tho' at first I thought it was all timber, looking closely the arch is maybe rolled steel? So maybe it was the anchoring that failed, not the member.
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Apr 11, 2014 21:56
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It tipped in the direction of the bridesmaids instead of the grooms. I feel certain someone there noticed that detail and will not be letting the bridesmaids live that down, ever. e. oh wait that's prom, isn't it. Anyway it's the ladies' side.
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Apr 11, 2014 22:12
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Tora! Tora! Tora! posted:No way this was anywhere close to code tho' at first I thought it was all timber, looking closely the arch is maybe rolled steel? So maybe it was the anchoring that failed, not the member. It looks like the bridge is still mostly intact, and just laying on its side, so I'd be inclined to agree with your latter comment.
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Apr 11, 2014 22:13
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It's hard to tell exactly what's going on there, but it looks like on the right there's a 4x4 post, but it doesn't have the metal frame resting on top of it. I'd guess that a faster on the front left side sheared, and the momentum from shifting rolled the whole thing over.
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Apr 11, 2014 23:36
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Leperflesh posted:It tipped in the direction of the bridesmaids instead of the grooms. I feel certain someone there noticed that detail and will not be letting the bridesmaids live that down, ever. its not the ladies side dummy. its the side facing all the photographers.
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Apr 12, 2014 06:05
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Looks like a pre-assembled bridge was sorta kinda sat down into the dirt without proper reinforcements. And it's fine for several hundred pounds that it would normally get. But with ~3k lbs of mass moving on one side, it shifted enough to literally flip itself over.
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Apr 12, 2014 08:13
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Motronic posted:Putting flammable material on the back of the door is also a bad idea. Doubly so if it has a fire rating tag in the frame. Speaking of sound insulation, does anyone khave experience with Homasote products? http://www.homasote.com/ I plan on using it on ceilings along with 5/8 drywall in a residential duplex, but not sure whether it's going to do better than soundproofing drywall. Nitrox fucked around with this message at 08:27 on Apr 12, 2014 |
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Apr 12, 2014 08:20
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well, it is a lot of work to dig holes and pour footings and set anchor bolts why bother when you can just plop the bridge down on some dirt?
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Apr 12, 2014 15:44
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Nitrox posted:Every single student housing unit with a shared bathroom has a metric ton of towels hanging on that door already. So that means it's OK? Not sure what yo'ure trying to say here. Also, towels are not the same thing as permanently attached fabric.
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Apr 12, 2014 16:26
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I'm an electrician apprentice who has done a fair share of service work in the industrial sector, including a 50 year old steel mill. I've learned that "code" in those situations usually means a platonic ideal that is unattainable by mortal Man. All we could hope to do is ensure that our install at least matched the existing insanity without being hazardous itself, and make it out alive at the end of the day. Many of these places employed the same types of Jimbob Handyman who would have installed a Folgers Coffee electrical junction box in his own home. One project at the steel mill involved troubleshooting a straight stretch of street lights. 18 lights over about a quarter mile of road. It was April and spring was in full bloom. My foreman and I get in the boom lift to start checking bulbs and ballasts, and immediately discovered that Jimbob Handyman before us had left the 2" holes atop the cobrahead street lights completely uncovered on maybe a quarter of the lights. Every goddamn one of them was crammed full of bird nest, completely rotting out the ballast. Being April, each one of these nests had 2-3 featherless squawking pooping baby birds living in it. I had to pull them all out and scrape out as much of the nest as I could. With the first light, I tried setting the chicks down in the bush hoping against hope that somehow Mamabird would find them and would shelter them and raise them but it only took about 10 minutes for the ants to find them so I ended up just tossing them out over the side of the lift. I killed 14 baby birds that day because the guy before me couldn't be arsed to close the friggin covers on the lights! Once the ballasts and bulbs were replaced, we still had to troubleshoot the circuit continuity itself, because the wiring was crap. The original install was rigid pipe daisy chaining from light to light inside the bases with some kind of 4-conductor underground feeder cable pulled through, but most of those had rotted away over the past 50 years and replaced by a hodgepodge of externally-run PVC.  The #3 AWG wires come out of a 1" conduit under that 4" box (which was full of ant nest), exited out the short length of conduit out the back, then just kinda went into the hole in the base of the pole (which was full of water, rust, ants and wasp nest because the access hatch was not attached) with a short piece of slit air hose kinda wrapped around it. The wires then return to the 4" box and down another pipe to the next light in line. We were entirely unsurprised to discover the insulation on those wires in the 4" box completely thrashed with exposed copper shorting out the light. We ended up having to ditch around that curve and run a new conduit & set another box because that old poo poo didn't budge a microt when we tried to pull it out. Of course, ultimately it was all for naught because 2 months later some idiot trucker ran the pole over (AT NIGHT WHILE PRESUMABLY LIT) and as of my last visit this past December the pole still hasn't been replaced  Bonus pic!  This is why you don't try to cram 42 goddamn #12 AWG regular ol' THHN wires in a single 2" conduit that you've run directly across the top of a furnace that tempers ten ton steel plates. The mill operators were disinclined to turn the oven off for us, so we had to run the replacement conduit around it while it was at full blast 
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Apr 13, 2014 07:43
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Jarp Habib posted:Being April, each one of these nests had 2-3 featherless squawking pooping baby birds living in it. I had to pull them all out and scrape out as much of the nest as I could. With the first light, I tried setting the chicks down in the bush hoping against hope that somehow Mamabird would find them and would shelter them and raise them but it only took about 10 minutes for the ants to find them so I ended up just tossing them out over the side of the lift. I killed 14 baby birds that day because the guy before me couldn't be arsed to close the friggin covers on the lights!
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Apr 13, 2014 20:23
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∆∆∆ why?Motronic posted:So that means it's OK? Not sure what yo'ure trying to say here. It's a sheet of thick (3.2 mm) vinyl/rubber material. Cut a rectangle same size as the door and use double sided tape to attach it. Worst you can do is peel off to layer of paint when removing that tape later. If the door does not close tightly and has wiggle room, use rubber adhesive weather strips around the sash. Everything should be able to come down within a minute if needed. Nitrox fucked around with this message at 20:29 on Apr 13, 2014 |
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Apr 13, 2014 20:27
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Nitrox posted:The word "permanent" should not exist in your vocabulary unless you own the place or have written permission to do anything. The word "permanent" has a very specific meaning in building and fire code, which is pretty obviously the context of my responses in regards to this issue. Nitrox posted:It's a sheet of thick (3.2 mm) vinyl/rubber material. Cut a rectangle same size as the door and use double sided tape to attach it. Worst you can do is peel off to layer of paint when removing that tape later. That's the worst YOU think it could do. When you've spent over 20 years in the fire service, 10 of them as a fire investigator, and see what kind of toxic smoke spread characteristics at surprisingly low temperatures materials like that have and understand fire dynamics and partitioning in a multi unit residential complex your views on attaching materials to fire safety features will change. In fact, you will start to realize just how many things ARE fire safety features that you take for granted because we've been using/requiring them for so long. If you want to modify something that is a required safety feature in a building you do it right or you don't do it at all. Anything in between is foolish and will cause no end to insurance problems should something happen......often times even if it's unrelated. And the insurance problems are nothing compared to what could happen to an occupant. Motronic fucked around with this message at 20:47 on Apr 13, 2014 |
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Apr 13, 2014 20:45
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