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Polybius91 posted:I'm honestly not sure where to begin with this. What do I say? Look up how many small businesses fail (I'm certain it's a lot), and note that those that survive have owners that put in grueling hours for little pay. Like his friend with the lawncare business who makes $24000/year, which is below the poverty line in my state and roughly a minimum-wage paycheck otherwise. Bill Gates dropped out of Harvard because it bored him, got a perfect score on his SATs, and was supported by his rich as gently caress parents while he started up his business. This wasn't an average guy who revolutionized the tech industry with gumption and elbow grease. He was a genius with more support and opportunity than many could ever dream of having. Jobs was also a genius with college-educated parents (though not nearly as rich as Gates'). He apparently got his first job at Atari by showing off Steve Wozniak's work. So yeah, if you're a super-genius with the right connections and occasionally pass off someone else's work as your own, you might be able to start a massive corporation and get rich. Otherwise, you're probably screwed.
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Apr 24, 2014 17:04
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Yeah, I'm sure hiring managers will be falling all over themselves to hire the dude with the library card and youtube vs. literally any school. Also, Bill Gates was born richer than most people, just not gently caress-off rich; and Steve Jobs was never poor either. Both also happened to be born at the right time in the right place to get in at the ground floor of an industry with explosive growth, and both acted like loving sociopaths to dominate it (and at least Jobs continued to do so until he died). They also dropped out of the colleges that introduced them to the opportunities that they dropped out in order to pursue. edit: Have the guy read "iWoz," Steve Wozniak's autobiography, in which Woz gives credit for his success everywhere it's due. (And an awful lot of that is to the US government.) VideoTapir fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Apr 24, 2014 |
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Apr 24, 2014 17:05
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Yes, guy in the lovely work van, tell me more about how Obama is a SOCIALIST (written in blood drip font) with such policies as:
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Apr 24, 2014 17:35
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Polybius91 posted:I'm almost able to make enough to live off two jobs. This is the most depressing quote, and defines the American experience for me. Why does he think it's an honor and a privilege to work himself to the bone at 3 different jobs while barely make it above the poverty line? Has it never crossed his mind that one job should be enough support himself and a family? A rising tide lifts all ships, things like social services, unions and reducing wealth disparity help everyone. Ask him if he believes in Welfare Queens. There was a study on the crab mentality, something like 'most people would prefer to make $25k while their peers make $15k, as opposed to making $90k when their peers make $100k.' red19fire fucked around with this message at 17:50 on Apr 24, 2014 |
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Apr 24, 2014 17:44
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Here's the part that seems weird to me. starts off saying he is working three jobs but will soon be able to just work 2, and then later says he couldn't find a job so he created his own. So either these are different people and my reading comprehension is just bad right now, or he is lying about one of these things. I know people who have started their own business. You rarely have the ability to work even just a second job while starting up your business. Does this guy have a time turner from harry potter or something?
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Apr 24, 2014 18:11
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You work three jobs? Uniquely American, isn’t it? I mean, that is fantastic that you’re doing that..... Get any sleep?
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Apr 24, 2014 18:18
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red19fire posted:There was a study on the crab mentality, something like 'most people would prefer to make $25k while their peers make $15k, as opposed to making $90k when their peers make $100k.' I don't know about you but I'd happily sleep in a box under a bridge if it meant people I didn't like didn't get a box or a bridge.
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Apr 24, 2014 18:25
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Thanks for the responses, guys. These are definitely useful points you brought up, and I'll be sure to raise them in my post.red19fire posted:Ask him if he believes in Welfare Queens.
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Apr 24, 2014 18:25
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Polybius91 posted:
$500 a week isn't exactly something to brag about.
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Apr 24, 2014 18:30
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red19fire posted:There was a study on the crab mentality, something like 'most people would prefer to make $25k while their peers make $15k, as opposed to making $90k when their peers make $100k.' I've heard people refer to this study a few times, usually with differing numbers, but I don't know if the study has actually been linked. Do you know where I could find that info? I would love to have this as verifiable ammo. Thanks!
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Apr 24, 2014 18:33
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red19fire posted:There was a study on the crab mentality, something like 'most people would prefer to make $25k while their peers make $15k, as opposed to making $90k when their peers make $100k.' I had a run-in with a living example of this last night. I wasn't going to post this, since it's not that entertaining, but now it's topical. Started when she posted this horseshit:  I responded, and we were off to the races. I'm Artie Choke, she's Sal Monella.      We've tangled before; we were classmates in college and hung out with the same crowd. Friendly but we disagree on politics. She's basically bought wholly into the Just World fallacy: if you're poor then you should have done things differently so as to not be poor, so suck it up, and the fact that she's not poor means she's better than you.
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Apr 24, 2014 19:19
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Obsolete posted:I've heard people refer to this study a few times, usually with differing numbers, but I don't know if the study has actually been linked. Do you know where I could find that info? I would love to have this as verifiable ammo. Thanks! I've only heard it as an anecdote as well. I'm starting to think it's some urban legend about how terrible people tend to be. BatteredFeltFedora posted:I had a run-in with a living example of this last night. I wasn't going to post this, since it's not that entertaining, but now it's topical. Started when she posted this horseshit: That kind of blind hero worship is the reason I don't even tell people I'm a veteran unless I have to. Just-Worlders are the loving worst; I know someone who complains about poor people not working hard enough, when she 'earned' her lifestyle by marrying a hedge fund manager. It'll never connect with them. e: vvv Do they not understand that Reid also being a racist piece of poo poo doesn't make Bundy any less of a racist piece of poo poo? Is that even a real quote? I doubt a professional Congressman would say something like that in public. red19fire fucked around with this message at 19:41 on Apr 24, 2014 |
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Apr 24, 2014 19:35
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Apr 24, 2014 19:37
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how can something so new have so many artifacts already
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Apr 24, 2014 19:39
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red19fire posted:I've only heard it as an anecdote as well. I'm starting to think it's some urban legend about how terrible people tend to be. Sorry: http://pss.sagepub.com/content/early/2010/02/17/0956797610362671
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Apr 24, 2014 19:39
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Honest antebellum style racist porch wisdom from a psychopath. Can't imagine why I've heard more about that than a thing Harry Reid said years ago.
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Apr 24, 2014 19:52
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Yep, I'm sure everybody remembers the great family life those slaves had. *breaks up family unit by auctioning them off piecemeal like livestock * *rapes women* *enslaves own bastard child* Goddamn nuclear family right there. SlipUp fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Apr 24, 2014 |
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Apr 24, 2014 20:01
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red19fire posted:I've only heard it as an anecdote as well. I'm starting to think it's some urban legend about how terrible people tend to be. Yeah he did say it but it wasn't in public. http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/01/09/obama.reid/ But yeah just because Reid said something and it makes him racist, it doesn't mean that Bundy ISN'T the same thing. Also how did they hear about that quote if it wasn't reported in the media? Remember you can only be racist against whites. I'm curious how much farther this is going to go as open racists feel less and less fear of being public with their opinions and more and more resentment at being "oppressed." If feels like in the last two years they've been pushing the envelope farther and farther. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 20:12 on Apr 24, 2014 |
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Apr 24, 2014 20:10
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BatteredFeltFedora posted:I had a run-in with a living example of this last night. I wasn't going to post this, since it's not that entertaining, but now it's topical. Started when she posted this horseshit: God drat, she's clearly never worked in fast food. In my life I've been a combat soldier, a fast food worker and a teacher and out of those the hardest one was definitely fast food. I hate the Army but if I had the choice between reenlisting as an infantry private E-1 and working fast food full time my whole life I'd beg the recruiter to take me.
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Apr 24, 2014 20:16
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Don't know the quality or authenticity, but this as well: http://www.michaelshermer.com/2008/01/weird-things-about-money/
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Apr 24, 2014 20:33
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I like how they think that saying "negro" is the bad part
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Apr 24, 2014 20:36
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Section 2 of the constitution of the state of Nevada would look nice on a picture of Cliven Bundy:quote:Sec: 2. Purpose of government; paramount allegiance to United States. All political power is inherent in the people[.] Government is instituted for the protection, security and benefit of the people; and they have the right to alter or reform the same whenever the public good may require it. But the Paramount Allegiance of every citizen is due to the Federal Government in the exercise of all its Constitutional powers as the same have been or may be defined by the Supreme Court of the United States; and no power exists in the people of this or any other State of the Federal Union to dissolve their connection therewith or perform any act tending to impair[,] subvert, or resist the Supreme Authority of the government of the United States. The Constitution of the United States confers full power on the Federal Government to maintain and Perpetuate its existance [existence], and whensoever any portion of the States, or people thereof attempt to secede from the Federal Union, or forcibly resist the Execution of its laws, the Federal Government may, by warrant of the Constitution, employ armed force in compelling obedience to its Authority. http://leg.state.nv.us/Const/NVConst.html
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Apr 24, 2014 20:43
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archangelwar posted:Don't know the quality or authenticity, but this as well: http://www.michaelshermer.com/2008/01/weird-things-about-money/ I'm glad these exist. Thank you both!
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Apr 24, 2014 20:44
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King Metal posted:I like how they think that saying "negro" is the bad part "All right, all right, the African-Americans were better off as slaves. Happy now?"
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Apr 24, 2014 20:45
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Is your friend for real? "My neighbor just got a raise at his job, way to screw working Americans Obama!"  Edit: I mean I've heard credible (but still wrong) arguments against the minimum wage but that's got to be the dumbest one. Her boss pays her for her skills right? We'll now he's not just competing with similar positions, he's competing with everyone to keep her. If he doesn't keep her happy, she could go mop floors at Walmart and not even take a hit to her standard of living VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Apr 24, 2014 |
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Apr 24, 2014 20:51
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SlipUp posted:Yep, I'm sure everybody remembers the great family life those slaves had. That's propaganda, everyone gamboled and danced to Old Fiddler's tune after working for a reasonable length of time each day. And when you jumped the broom, Massa gave the happy couple a chicken!
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Apr 24, 2014 20:54
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VitalSigns posted:Is your friend for real? "My neighbor just got a raise at his job, way to screw working Americans Obama!" Conservatives realise that people judge their own success by being better off than others. They fail to realise this is an awful thing.
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Apr 24, 2014 21:03
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BatteredFeltFedora posted:I had a run-in with a living example of this last night. I wasn't going to post this, since it's not that entertaining, but now it's topical. Started when she posted this horseshit: Sal Monella initially bemoans it's unfair that she worked for 6 years to get her wage and now someone flipping burgers would make almost as much. Then she asks why should everyone else's time mean nothing so we can make other people feel better about their life choices. Maybe Sal Monella should've made better choices in her life instead of wasting 6 years getting an education. Why didn't she choose to work at McDonalds for those 6 years instead? After all, her father started as a lawn mower and got no education and look how well he did. Why should society give two shits about her poor decision making when deciding the minimum wage? Besides, what happened to having pride in her work? She should earn her right to be in the middle class by slaving away at a minimum wage job instead of trying to abuse her apparently worthless choice to spend 6 years "getting an education" aka slacking off in college.  I'm repeatedly and irrevocably stunned that people hold the belief that other people should have to earn the right to not live in abject poverty and hunger. I think the moment I first realized that was what people were actually arguing for years ago I wanted to throw up. It's morally disgusting. gently caress.
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Apr 24, 2014 21:28
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Yea it's not like there was a big section of a major book about Reid's quote met with pretty universal 'yea what a stupid lovely thing to say'.
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Apr 24, 2014 21:44
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Mo_Steel posted:I'm repeatedly and irrevocably stunned that people hold the belief that other people should have to earn the right to not live in abject poverty and hunger. I think the moment I first realized that was what people were actually arguing for years ago I wanted to throw up. It's morally disgusting. gently caress. The right actually doesn't want people to even have the opportunity to work their way out of poverty. They want to dangle that carrot in front of everybody but those born into dynastic wealth. They want nothing short of a caste system.
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Apr 24, 2014 21:50
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From personal experience, people who are just barely above poverty develop a "survivor" mentality as a defense mechanism. When I look back on my leaner years I remember developing very low expectations for life to justify my struggles and poor compensation, and developing a sick sort of pride and belief I was tough for being able to work stressful and ridiculous hours. And staying in the black on such low wages was surely a sign of how disciplined and thrifty I was, not needing frivolous luxuries (any joy at all) to get by like other pampered plebes. It's hard to crack that because it means accepting that things are much easier for others, you're being exploited, and luck is keeping you out of poverty.
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Apr 24, 2014 22:20
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Western culture also gives us this narrative that we're individuals and our problems are our problems and we shouldn't be accepting helps from others to solve them. Like you said it's a matter of pride that we've been conditioned to accept as a way of life.
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Apr 24, 2014 23:02
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My insanely-Catholic cousin is trying so hard to sound like he doesn't hate homosexuals and continues to post Catholic-inspired "we don't hate the gays, honestly!" blog posts. Here's one: "Catholics care about gays? The Myth Debunked" Some choice excerpts: quote:Hate gays? I have friends who are homosexual so when someone says this to me, I can't help but smile in disbelief. The Catholic Church is so loving and accepting of everyone because we're all children of God and made in the image and likeness of God. There may be people within the Church who have acted with hatred toward a person with same-sex attraction, but that does not reflect what the Church as a whole teaches. Ah yes the "I have quote:Do gay people go to hell? Essentially this: you can be attracted to the same sex! No problem! but if you have sex with them prepare for eternal damnation. OPEN THE BLOOD GATES I get it - the Catholic Church is having difficulty keeping newer people around because many of them don't agree with their stance on homosexuality. This massive spin on it is particularly dishonest. Oh, and then he followed up that post with this: 
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Apr 24, 2014 23:18
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See if you're gay, all you have to do is not act on it and be strong in your faith. And what better way to do that than to enter into the priesthood with a vow of celibacy? Totally works. Like all the time.
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Apr 24, 2014 23:25
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BatteredFeltFedora posted:and the fact that she's not poor means she's better than you. This is the bit that always makes me want to scream at people who pull out some variant on that line. "But now a person who I don't think has worked as hard as I did makes the same amount of money as I do!" Who loving cares? Usually the people who say that sort of thing are pretty happy with the amount of money they're making, so even if the poor person in question really is the laziest person on the goddamn planet, gently caress them. Go buy yourself a new TV or something with the exact same paycheck you were getting yesterday and forget about it because seriously who the gently caress cares?
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Apr 24, 2014 23:34
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Ron Jeremy posted:See if you're gay, all you have to do is not act on it and be strong in your faith. And what better way to do that than to enter into the priesthood with a vow of celibacy? This is funny, but I wouldn't want to use that to mock an actual Catholic because you seem to be inadvertently conceding the conservative belief that homosexuality and pedophilia are the same. Content: one of my friends posted this.  Not perfect, but if pro-life people are going to advocate helping pregnant women with health care and child care so they don't feel constrained by poverty to seek abortion, then I'll be on board with that. Anything helps. So...I decided to agree, but slipped in an innocent suggestion that contraception would help as well. It did not disappoint.  Abortion rates have dropped but I'm mad about it anyway!  Why can't we be more like Europe, well known for their hatred of free condoms, their Puritan attitudes about sex, and their small-government values?
VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 23:40 on Apr 24, 2014 |
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Apr 24, 2014 23:38
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Point out that teen birth rates are falling too. Also, his first number on number of abortions per live births is from three years before Roe v. Wade. Between 1970 and 1973, it ballooned from 52 to 196. After the decision, the rise actually slowed. That statistic was at is apex in 1984 at 364 per 1000, and has steadily declined almost every year since. Xombie fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Apr 25, 2014 |
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Apr 25, 2014 00:04
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Xombie posted:Point out that teen birth rates are falling too. Eh, I don't think I need to bother with that. He's already admitted he doesn't actually care about the number of abortions, and is only concerned with the personal responsibility of  certain ethnic groups who can't control their sex drives if you know what I mean and I think you do.
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Apr 25, 2014 00:17
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VitalSigns posted:This is funny, but I wouldn't want to use that to mock an actual Catholic because you seem to be inadvertently conceding the conservative belief that homosexuality and pedophilia are the same. I understand where you're coming from. The rationalization behind Catholic pedophile priests is exactly the same as consenting adult homosexual priests.* So in this manner yes they are the same. The issue is sexual repression using faith doesn't work. The worser issue is that a large bureaucracy like the church hides its offenders to save face. *source from a sex offender treatment professional
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Apr 25, 2014 01:08
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quote:As an excuse, the only thing you really need for an education is access to a library or the internet. You can educate yourself on any topic, at any time if you are willing to work hard and are self-motivated. Now, that doesn't work for everyone (I'm one of those people), but it's an option. One that is just as viable as any school.
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