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Riso posted:Need money? Create a merchant republic. Need all the money? Vassalize the Pope. Seriously, being an Emperor with the Papacy in your pocket leads to mad bank (because most Catholic bishops pay taxes to the Pope, who in turn pays taxes to you) and because the Pope can't refuse requests from their liege you can get claims on pretty much any duchies held by Catholics as long as you have piety.
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May 6, 2014 14:52
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Bitter Mushroom posted:How often does the AI use merc companies? If they have the cash they absolutely should do, every time imo. I'm finding it too easy to use mercs to win the opening battles, disband them and then siege the provinces down. They use them pretty frequently. You can see when one has been hired out if you can't hire them, and there's a little coat of arms below the hire button. Most of the time they don't use them because they can't afford them - it depends on what religion's you're fighting against too. I've seen the AI make use of mercs a lot if they have the 300 gold loan from the Jewry available, but a lot of the time they'll have taken that out and spent it beforehand.
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May 6, 2014 15:12
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Bold Robot posted:Any suggestions on what, if anything, I can do to contribute to HRE vassals in Italy declaring independence? It's about 1110, I've formed the Kingdom of Sicily and the HRE controls almost everything north of my territory. Maybe 15-20 years ago Tuscany formed and I was pretty excited about that because I can deal with them a lot more easily, but the HRE swallowed them back up pretty quickly. I'm kind of at a loss for where to expand. Update on this: almost 70 years have gone by and I'm still totally stuck. A decades-long plan to install my heir as Duke of Lombardy (and thus gain like 5 provinces in Northern Italy) fizzled out when he turned out to be a gay idiot and then lost all of his land in a misguided rebellion against the HRE before he could inherit the rest of Sicily. I've assassinated two Kaisers but the HRE remains strong. My impression is that Apulia --> Sicily is a popular enough country to play. How do people usually deal with the fact that half of Italy is taken up by a huge blob?
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May 6, 2014 16:16
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Bold Robot posted:My impression is that Apulia --> Sicily is a popular enough country to play. How do people usually deal with the fact that half of Italy is taken up by a huge blob? By taking over Greece and North Africa while I wait for the Holy Roman Empire to have one of it's periodic crises.
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May 6, 2014 16:27
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Train all of your daughters as spymasters and marry them off to ambitious young claimants to various Karling thrones. The amount of "unusual circumstances" deaths should increase dramatically, causing quite a bit of unrest.
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May 6, 2014 16:29
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Archaeology Hat posted:By taking over Greece and North Africa while I wait for the Holy Roman Empire to have one of it's periodic crises. Unfortunately the Byzantines and the Fatimids are also both really strong. 
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May 6, 2014 17:19
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Roland Jones posted:Mercs cost money. A lot of money, at that. I know a lot of people advocate upgrading your holdings, but I really do not like that approach until I'm powerful enough not to need mercs (which is at least being an emperor, and depending on size multiple empires). Every last cent going to necessary titles, retinues, and mercs is my preferred strategy by far. Nothing you can otherwise spend money will ever be better than just having a few thousand more troops right when you need them. I think the best return on investment you get for holdings is making a profit after 50 years, which frankly is just not that good. You could have used that money on mercs to get an extra duchy into your kingdom, which snowballs you much harder. I'll often spam mercs early-game then have a few thousand lying around in the early-mid game for emergencies/opportunities, and then have low money again once I'm comfortable. You do eventually want to upgrade your holdings, but not until the immediate loss of power due to losing the gold is much less of a factor IMO. Making money is a little weird in that the size of your kingdom/empire doesn't help you unless you make a merchant republic, tax your feudal vassals, or have an anti-pope/vassal pope. Otherwise there's no difference between being emperor of the world and just being duke of your personal holdings. So best advice I can give is tax your cities to the max, make a merchant republic whenever you can, tax your feudal vassals whenever you have the opinion to do so, and make an anti-pope/vassal pope if you can get away with it.
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May 6, 2014 17:23
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Ratpick posted:Need all the money? Vassalize the Pope. What's the easiest way to vassalize the pope? With him being king level I'm guessing it's not an easy matter.
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May 6, 2014 18:28
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Thrasophius posted:What's the easiest way to vassalize the pope? With him being king level I'm guessing it's not an easy matter. If you've got the empire of Italia you should be able to make a de jure claim on Rome which will vassalize the Papacy rather than just taking over the county.
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May 6, 2014 18:32
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Thrasophius posted:What's the easiest way to vassalize the pope? With him being king level I'm guessing it's not an easy matter. Install an anti-pope if you're an Emperor.
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May 6, 2014 18:34
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Can heresies install anti-popes?
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May 6, 2014 18:35
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Angela Christine posted:Can heresies install anti-popes? No. Heresies have (or don't have) their own religious heads.
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May 6, 2014 18:43
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Bitter Mushroom posted:How often does the AI use merc companies? If they have the cash they absolutely should do, every time imo. I'm finding it too easy to use mercs to win the opening battles, disband them and then siege the provinces down. They do pretty often if they have the money to spare (they often don't, good mercs are expensive) and there's enough of a gap in troop strengths. It's good to be able to strike at your enemy's capital quickly, so if a mercenary group appears you can charge in and crush them before they get enough morale to be a threat. Angela Christine posted:Can heresies install anti-popes? Heresies can't do anything involving the Catholic Pope, but some Catholic heresies can create a Pope for their heresy if they meet certain conditions, such as holding Rome.
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May 6, 2014 18:45
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The Cheshire Cat posted:If you've got the empire of Italia you should be able to make a de jure claim on Rome which will vassalize the Papacy rather than just taking over the county. I would be surprised if this works; using a de jre claim to take a duke-or-above's county, even the last one in his realm, usually gives you the county and does not vassalize them.
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May 6, 2014 18:45
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Thrasophius posted:What's the easiest way to vassalize the pope? With him being king level I'm guessing it's not an easy matter. The easiest way is to use the Imperial Reconquest CB. It auto-vassalizes anyone king level and lower, which includes the Pope.
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May 6, 2014 18:58
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SeaTard posted:The easiest way is to use the Imperial Reconquest CB. It auto-vassalizes anyone king level and lower, which includes the Pope. You can only use the Imperial Reconquest CB if you've reformed the Roman Empire, which requires having control of Rome in the first place. The easiest way is to, as any emperor, create an antipope and press his claim to the papacy against the Pope in Rome. Once your vassal antipope is the Pope in Rome, all future Popes in Rome will be your vassals.
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May 6, 2014 20:23
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Bold Robot posted:Unfortunately the Byzantines and the Fatimids are also both really strong. If any of them have a heretic dwarf or other near-guaranteed-implosion candidate in the line of succession then you know what you must do.  Otherwise you may want to look west, to Spain. Majorca, etc. are often very vulnerable, and the east coast is usually pretty fragmented as well. Also pay attention to religious differences among the North Africans - any Sunnis west of Egypt won't receive support from the Sunnis east of Egypt, so Mauretania is your primary obstacle in conquering most of North Africa. Generally, they will not intervene in a conquest of Tunis, Tripolitania, or Cyrenaica as long as Algiers remains as a buffer, so unless the Fatimids have really gone nuts on the independent emirs you have a nice slice of North Africa sitting there waiting to be taken. You can also take bites out of Algiers whenever they are at war with Mauretania. After that, Dalmatia and Aragon are the areas (speaking generally) that probably still have territory near you that you might want and that you probably won't have to fight very hard for. Once you have all of that you should have the troops to be able to take the Byzantines or Fatimids during a time of weakness, and you can always save up the money for mercs to take them on earlier. Unless the HRE is in a really, really serious civil war (and maybe not even then) you shouldn't go to war with the big grey blob. Feel free to pick off revolters in Italy, of course, but the emperor should not be fought directly until you're an empire as well. Edit: Basically you are the awkward middle power of the Mediterranean and you need to absorb every bit of land that isn't part of a blob to survive. Things like pretty borders must fall by the wayside. Jazerus fucked around with this message at 20:40 on May 6, 2014 |
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May 6, 2014 20:23
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I started in 867 with a lustful, hedonist martial character. He did pretty well other than picking up "the Drunkard" in later life. Fathered loads of kids and made it to King. And then an event fired where one of his mayors caught him kissing a lover and threw him in prison! My elderly king was stuck in a vassal's prison and I didn't have enough gold to ransom him. He was in there for probably two years before buying his way out. First thing I did was assassinate that dickhead mayor.
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May 6, 2014 20:28
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Dick Trauma posted:I started in 867 with a lustful, hedonist martial character. He did pretty well other than picking up "the Drunkard" in later life. Fathered loads of kids and made it to King. How is this even possible? Your vassal shouldn't be able to imprison you. That would be retarded.
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May 6, 2014 20:41
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The Cheshire Cat posted:If you've got the empire of Italia you should be able to make a de jure claim on Rome which will vassalize the Papacy rather than just taking over the county. GO gently caress YOURSELF posted:Install an anti-pope if you're an Emperor. SeaTard posted:The easiest way is to use the Imperial Reconquest CB. It auto-vassalizes anyone king level and lower, which includes the Pope. Oh so there is actually three ways of doing it awesome, thanks chaps. Now all I have to do is get the pope landed again so I can vassalize him because I'm orthodox at the moment and have already taken Rome.
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May 6, 2014 20:59
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What can tank Catholicism's MA really, really hard? I checked the religious map to see what was going on a while ago, and there was heresy all over Europe. I checked the ledger and MA for atholics was at like, 25. I checked a little later and it was at 19, and a little bit after that it was at 8, and then next time I checked just a little later, it was at 98. I don't think they lost any Crusades, or lost to a Jihad in that time frame, but I'm playing as Georgia, so I couldn't check to see why it was so low. Pope had massively negative piety, maybe?
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May 6, 2014 21:05
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A wicked Pope, or an Anti-Pope or two can tak MA pretty fast 
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May 6, 2014 21:13
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Bold Robot posted:Unfortunately the Byzantines and the Fatimids are also both really strong. Like Jazerus mentioned, keep tabs on the ruling families of your big rivals and plot to assassinate the best heirs. Stabbing rulers is pretty tough, but smothering three kids and tossing two out the window so that cruel, craven Shitlord Karling inherits is pretty easy. As was also mentioned, give your daughters Intrigue educations and marry them into the Karling court (the higher the better). They'll be extremely helpful in pulling off assassination plots. Then once the HRE is in civil war, it's your time to strike. For the Fatimids, keep an eye on their decadence. The AI isn't too good at managing Decadence and large Muslim blobs almost inevitably fall to pieces. They may not be nearly as scary as they look, what's more of a pain is trying to Holy War against them as you'll more than likely drag in several other Muslim neighbors. Edit: really the easiest way to tear them apart would be to Swear Fealty, stab heirs until you get a lovely Emperor, and lead an Independence revolt to fracture the HRE. But I think you're a King already so that probably won't work? Pellisworth fucked around with this message at 21:28 on May 6, 2014 |
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May 6, 2014 21:25
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catlord posted:What can tank Catholicism's MA really, really hard? I checked the religious map to see what was going on a while ago, and there was heresy all over Europe. I checked the ledger and MA for atholics was at like, 25. I checked a little later and it was at 19, and a little bit after that it was at 8, and then next time I checked just a little later, it was at 98. I don't think they lost any Crusades, or lost to a Jihad in that time frame, but I'm playing as Georgia, so I couldn't check to see why it was so low. Pope had massively negative piety, maybe? As mentioned Anti-Popes make MA tank pretty hard so there is probably one in your game somewhere. Also losing holy wars lowers MA so Catholicism may have not lost a Crusade or Jihad but they may be being beaten constantly in small holy wars what with the Norse in Germania, Britania and Muslims in Hispania.
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May 6, 2014 21:33
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Pellisworth posted:Edit: really the easiest way to tear them apart would be to Swear Fealty, stab heirs until you get a lovely Emperor, and lead an Independence revolt to fracture the HRE. But I think you're a King already so that probably won't work? Yeah, I really wish I could join the HRE so I could expand within it. If I were to start as an HRE Duke in Italy and then expand to form either Italy or Sicily, would I remain in the HRE as a vassal king, so I could still gently caress with other Dukes? Or would I gain independence upon creating a Kingdom?
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May 6, 2014 21:42
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Bold Robot posted:Yeah, I really wish I could join the HRE so I could expand within it. If I were to start as an HRE Duke in Italy and then expand to form either Italy or Sicily, would I remain in the HRE as a vassal king, so I could still gently caress with other Dukes? Or would I gain independence upon creating a Kingdom? Yes, you could certainly do that. You won't become Independent when you create a Kingdom, however you'll need to make sure the Crown Authority stays low in the HRE to allow you to freely wage war on the other dukes. You could start as an HRE duke or immediately swear fealty, build your power base, then lead an Independence war to fracture the empire.
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May 6, 2014 21:47
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Is there any indication that the EUIV converter will be updated soon for Rajahs? Jainism still doesn't have any support and I don't know if the province conversions are still up to date.
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May 6, 2014 21:48
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Being a vassal of a huge empire is cool. Lots of fun with plotting and factions and you are free to expand without worrying about being invaded by foreign powers.
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May 6, 2014 21:49
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Thrasophius posted:As mentioned Anti-Popes make MA tank pretty hard so there is probably one in your game somewhere. Also losing holy wars lowers MA so Catholicism may have not lost a Crusade or Jihad but they may be being beaten constantly in small holy wars what with the Norse in Germania, Britania and Muslims in Hispania. Well I started in 1111, and the very first Crusade in the game was for Andaluscia, and that got handed over to a holy order, so it probably wasn't that. There might have been an anti-pope around, but I'll check to see if any recent popes have been wicked, it might have been those two in unison.
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May 6, 2014 21:55
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Was the Imperial Reconquest casus belli taken out? I helped push a very very organized Byzantium into reforming it since it was only a few duchy away from doing so. The border gore was annoying so I wanted to fix it and it appears it's missing.
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May 6, 2014 22:05
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You know I've never tried to vassalize the Pope as anyone but a Catholic and I'm not sure it's possible. Let us know how your attempts work out Thrasophius because I'm very curiousto see if it can be done.
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May 6, 2014 22:05
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Spiderfist Island posted:Is there any indication that the EUIV converter will be updated soon for Rajahs? Jainism still doesn't have any support and I don't know if the province conversions are still up to date. no_culture
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May 6, 2014 22:07
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Toadsniff posted:How is this even possible? Your vassal shouldn't be able to imprison you. That would be retarded. I was quite surprised. The Mayor was Zealous so maybe that combined with my sleazy King triggered it.
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May 6, 2014 22:07
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Speaking of mods, any good ones updated and stable for RoI? I'd love something mostly focused on adding more plots, ambitions, RP, flavor stuff. CK2+ isn't updated yet I don't think?
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May 6, 2014 22:40
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Toadsniff posted:How is this even possible? Your vassal shouldn't be able to imprison you. That would be retarded. This was actually not a super crazy practice during medieval times. Natural law was well respected as applying to everyone, from the lowliest freeholder to the Pope or Holy Roman Emperor, who was once imprisoned for his debts by his local butcher for days without anyone objecting.
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May 6, 2014 22:45
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Pellisworth posted:Speaking of mods, any good ones updated and stable for RoI? I'd love something mostly focused on adding more plots, ambitions, RP, flavor stuff. CK2+ isn't updated yet I don't think? The Historical Immersion Project mod (Here) is working with RoI. It's pretty decent, all considered, especially the events.
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May 6, 2014 22:52
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So I'm the Basileus and I have a nice daughter who I matrilineally married off to this nice Karling kid. I made him doux of oultrejordain so their (hopefully greek) babies could take over the place once ol' Bratwurst kicks the bucket. In the meantime however he's got claims on the rump state of East Francia, the tooltip says he'll become my vassal if it's part of my de jure territory or he's part of my dynasty, even if I do press his claims, will he become an independent king, and if he does, will he take the duchy of Oultrejordain with him?
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May 6, 2014 23:07
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Hambilderberglar posted:So I'm the Basileus and I have a nice daughter who I matrilineally married off to this nice Karling kid. I made him doux of oultrejordain so their (hopefully greek) babies could take over the place once ol' Bratwurst kicks the bucket. In the meantime however he's got claims on the rump state of East Francia, the tooltip says he'll become my vassal if it's part of my de jure territory or he's part of my dynasty, even if I do press his claims, will he become an independent king, and if he does, will he take the duchy of Oultrejordain with him? Well, unless you're the HRE yourself (de jure liege of East Francia) the short answers are yes he'll be independent and yes he'll take Oultrejordain and any held titles with him (unless you have High CA in Jerusalem maybe?). If his kids inherit his claims, they'll be of your dynasty and you'd get the lands if pressed in a war.
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May 6, 2014 23:12
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Pellisworth posted:Well, unless you're the HRE yourself (de jure liege of East Francia) the short answers are yes he'll be independent and yes he'll take Oultrejordain and any held titles with him (unless you have High CA in Jerusalem maybe?).
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May 6, 2014 23:17
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ChikoDemono posted:Love this game. I erected a runestone dedicated to my mother. It mentioned that she died peacefully in bed and that I, King Haraldr had nothing to do with it. quote:[Root.GetFirstName] the Hapless, [Root.GetSonDaughter] of [Root.Father.GetFirstName] and [Root.Mother.GetFirstName], somehow managed to see this stone raised in [Root.GetHerHis] own memory. Many said [Root.GetSheHe] was worthless and would amount to nothing, and perhaps they were right. The great Tjudmund, whose skill with women was legendary, took pity and carved these words.
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May 6, 2014 23:18
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