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Mortimer posted:MM reprint confirmed m15 I defy you to show me people who only play with core set stuff; there's no place that sells core set packs and not expert-level (and beyond) stuff. Even Target sells complex products like Commander right next to blisters of the core set.
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May 7, 2014 22:22
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Tharizdun posted:I really wish they'd give up on the "Advanced/Expert expansion" distinction and just admit that the core set is an expert-level expansion and use it purely to shape the standard format. Magic already has such a high barrier of entry/learning curve that no one is getting in to it that doesn't have a teacher, so there's no reason to have an underpowered set just because "new players can't comprehend multicolored cards" or some poo poo. New players also aren't attracted to "Magic 2014", it sounds super lame. Players want CLANS OF TARKIR or RISE OF THE ELDRAZI cards. M14 says "You're a beginner here's some vanilla cards" not "this card is a giant floating octopus or a sword containing a demon". Get your poo poo together wizards, every new player I talk to says core sets are boring. It's a noob trap that probably turns people off magic more than it attracts them. One M14/M14/M14 draft and that was all I could stomach, even as an experienced player.
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May 7, 2014 22:28
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Core set sealed is the best format.
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May 7, 2014 22:29
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Entropic posted:They're never gonna reprint anything in Standard that's banned in / too good for Modern. It's we'll never get a good one mana blue card filtering cantrip in a core set again, and why Force of Will is never gonna see print outside a supplemental product. So what you're saying is standard is doomed to be bad forever.
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May 7, 2014 22:33
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Tharizdun posted:I really wish they'd give up on the "Advanced/Expert expansion" distinction and just admit that the core set is an expert-level expansion and use it purely to shape the standard format. Magic already has such a high barrier of entry/learning curve that no one is getting in to it that doesn't have a teacher, so there's no reason to have an underpowered set just because "new players can't comprehend multicolored cards" or some poo poo. I don't know what you mean by underpowered. There are plenty of cards printed in M14 being played in standard right now. Besides, the core set is, like you said, used not only as an introductory set but as a place to put standard staples and cards they'd like in the format for just a year. When nearly half the set is reprints it makes it much easier to design a straightforward limited format than a complex one. Besides, it's not like they've never made a fun core set - people absolutely loved M13 limited and even M14 has its fans.
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May 7, 2014 22:39
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I'm a new player that got into Magic via DOTP, but I honestly didn't find learning the game too difficult. Even the advanced mechanics are fairly intuitive, and I imagine they'd be for any of your average person who would get into Magic; a gamer of varying sorts, probably familiar with RPG rulesets and mechanics, turn based gameplay or even other card games. Then again, it's probably not bad to have one set a year devoted to non-gamers or younger people who may not have a whole life time of tempered in poo poo RPG gaming behind them.
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May 7, 2014 22:43
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Core sets should be full of Evergreen and Evergreen-candidate cards that are solid, but not really splashy. M13 and to a lesser extent M14 did a good job of this, but i'd like to see it expanded in complexity a bit instead of pretending that core set players need extremely simple cards.
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May 7, 2014 22:43
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TheKingofSprings posted:So what you're saying is standard is doomed to be bad forever. There was that one era where Urza Block was in Standard. 
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May 7, 2014 22:44
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Loving Life Partner posted:I'm a new player that got into Magic via DOTP, but I honestly didn't find learning the game too difficult. This, I taught my totally clueless friend to play in about half an hour after we got some free "learner decks" from the cafe we were in. Wizards makes little 30 card packs with basic cards and rule sheets that are designed to get people up to speed quickly.
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May 7, 2014 22:45
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Tharizdun posted:I really wish they'd give up on the "Advanced/Expert expansion" distinction and just admit that the core set is an expert-level expansion and use it purely to shape the standard format. Magic already has such a high barrier of entry/learning curve that no one is getting in to it that doesn't have a teacher, so there's no reason to have an underpowered set just because "new players can't comprehend multicolored cards" or some poo poo. They've already done this for all practical purposes. Here's an interesting exercise, make a balanced, printable in today's standard -> modern era path/swords variant. ~ w instant exile target creature. It's controller xxxx I've thought of a few things for xxxx 1) may draw two cards 2) vampiric tutor - search a card and put it on top of their library 3) return a card from the graveyard to the battlefield (probably too variable) What makes it really tough is making so it's not too good to always cast on your own creature...
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May 7, 2014 22:49
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Niton posted:Core sets should be full of Evergreen and Evergreen-candidate cards that are solid, but not really splashy. M13 and to a lesser extent M14 did a good job of this, but i'd like to see it expanded in complexity a bit instead of pretending that core set players need extremely simple cards. Exactly. The Core Set should look much more like Time Spiral and much less like Portal. For younger kids, Kaijudo is a fantastic game, and I don't think it's bad to have a progression of products like that, rather than a set full of stupid cards that no one will play out of a sealed or draft they are forced to do. I like M14 draft a lot, actually, but if you ask me if I want to draft 3xM14 or Zendikar block or something esoteric like Mirrodin/Mirrodin/Legions, I'm always gonna choose the latter.
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May 7, 2014 22:53
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Entropic posted:They're never gonna reprint anything in Standard that's banned in / too good for Modern. It's we'll never get a good one mana blue card filtering cantrip in a core set again, and why Force of Will is never gonna see print outside a supplemental product. Based on one of Stoddard's recent Q&As, you're not getting a good new Modern-legal cantrip for U for a while, full stop. They seem to feel there are enough and/or there's no reason to help out Storm.
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May 7, 2014 22:53
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:Here's an interesting exercise, make a balanced, printable in today's standard -> modern era path/swords variant. You could always slap on a "target creature an opponent controls" clause, not the most elegant design but whatever. Or something like "Exile target creature. Each opponent does X." which would also do double duty as a political card for commander and other multiplayer formats. edit: Chain of Plowshares W Instant Exile target creature. Then that creature's controller may copy this spell and choose new targets for the copy. Ojetor fucked around with this message at 23:00 on May 7, 2014 |
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May 7, 2014 22:57
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I think M14 is really cool, but the last core set I was familiar with before this was 6th edition.  It has some neat cards with good power. It isn't as flashy as Ravnica block, but Ravnica block seems kind of crazy to me.
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May 7, 2014 23:00
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:They've already done this for all practical purposes. Oh, I've got a nice one that hoses toolbox decks but otherwise isn't *too* powerful. Ancestor's Path W Instant Exile target creature. Its controller may search their library for a creature card with the same name as the exiled card and put it onto the battlefield tapped. EDIT: Hmm, the creature card clause makes it a nice Mutavault hoser too. EDIT 2: W Instant Exile target creature. Its controller may return it to the battlefield at the beginning of the next end step. If they do, each other player gains 5 life. Emerson Cod fucked around with this message at 23:09 on May 7, 2014 |
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May 7, 2014 23:01
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Harvest Season W Exile target creature. Place 3 time counters on it. During creature controller's upkeep, remove 1 time counter. When all time counters are removed, return the creature to the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter on it.
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May 7, 2014 23:09
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Is there any precedent for cards that were banned in legacy/vintage being printed in a standard-legal set? The closest I can think of is voltaic key being banned in Urza block constructed. It wouldn't be the worst for them to reprint ponder in standard, since it's already banned in modern.
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May 7, 2014 23:12
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M14 owned because durdling owns. M13 was "here's some bomby horseshit you can't do anything about; get wrecked."
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May 7, 2014 23:17
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Downtime for MTGO today got extended. From the usual time till 5:30 PDT. About 3 extensions were added. 
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May 7, 2014 23:25
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Looking through M14, here are some cards that I think are particularly good designs for new players: Advocate of the Beast: Demonstrates "creature type matters" effects while encouraging players to check the creature types of cards. Bogbrew Witch, Bubbling Cauldron, and Festering Newt: Newt and Cauldron are solid cards on their own, and this vertical cycle makes players wonder what the other cards do the first time they open one. Goblin Diplomats: Goblin Diplomats manages to very silly while also showing off one of the things that Red can do at higher rarities. It's still a bulk rare, but it uses its slot to be part of the story rather than the next Vizzerdrix. Haunted Plate Mail: A very flavorful control win condition that happens to be super powerful in Limited as an equipment. Tenacious Dead: Tenacious D, on top of being a cute pop culture reference, has a twist on Regeneration that made it combo off with a few other M14 cards. Variants that change how a card works are a great choice for core sets. There's a few more, and a bunch more that were originally printed in M13, but I think all of those cards do a particularly good job of engaging new players.
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May 7, 2014 23:25
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Tharizdun posted:Exactly. The Core Set should look much more like Time Spiral and much less like Portal. Time Spiral? Mark Rosewater posted:Future Sight had come out. Time Spiral block had come out. And for the first time, we had this weird statistic. Up until Time Spiral came out, we would look at sales and we’d look at tournament organization, like how many people were playing in tournaments, and they tended to be lockstep. Meaning if tournaments were doing well, sales were doing well, and it showed this tight-knit bond between the two. I started playing in Time Spiral and there was just so much going on in the format, it was hard to learn the fundamentals of strategy. The cards were so complex, that even when I had the pick order down to heart and could 3-0 drafts easily, I learned nothing about card evaluation that carried over to the next block. The current core sets bring what I thought was best about TSP, the classic Magic flavour.
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May 7, 2014 23:25
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What a Judas posted:Core set sealed is the best format. My local shop (Legions: GP Minneapolis/San Antonio folks, sleeves & boxes etc) is doing set core sealed next weekend: Format: 1 - M10 Booster, 1 - M11 Booster, 1 - M12 Booster, 1 - M13 Booster, 2 - M14 Boosters
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May 7, 2014 23:28
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Saeku posted:Time Spiral? Yeah, Time Spiral was terrible because there were too many unique abilities with tons of text. On the other hand, Time Spiral was awesome because it was Dominaria's Greatest Hits. Just keep tweaking the M13/M14 style core sets so their average power level is closer to "playable outside of Core Set limited", but leave the relative complexity the same.
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May 7, 2014 23:28
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So, As an online player looking to get into paper, should I buy this to get some bulk commons/uncommons? http://www.kijiji.ca/v-toys-games/city-of-halifax/magic-the-gathering-lot-mtg/590391061?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
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May 7, 2014 23:29
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Were there any good/notable 11th edition cards...?
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May 7, 2014 23:29
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change my name posted:Were there any good/notable 11th edition cards...? As in M11? There was the titan cycle.
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May 7, 2014 23:34
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change my name posted:Were there any good/notable 11th edition cards...? No because it never existed. 
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May 7, 2014 23:34
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RME posted:As in M11? There was the titan cycle. True but looking through the different versions, most of them were just reprinted the next year in M12.
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May 7, 2014 23:34
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change my name posted:Were there any good/notable 11th edition cards...? Leyline cycle, Hawks, Serra Ascendent, Demon of Death's gate, Viscera Seer, Cultivate, Fauna Shaman, Obstinate Baloth, and of course the Titans. e - steel overseer as well. Bugsy fucked around with this message at 23:48 on May 7, 2014 |
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May 7, 2014 23:40
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Ojetor posted:You could always slap on a "target creature an opponent controls" clause, not the most elegant design but whatever. Except the end result is the person with the most creatures gets to keep a bunch of theirs and the other guys creatures all die.
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May 7, 2014 23:43
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Niton posted:Yeah, Time Spiral was terrible because there were too many unique abilities with tons of text. On this topic, I wish they would be a touch more aggressive about printing old cards that most players have never seen before. Reprisal is a goodie from Alliances, though it made a Core Set before, but weird stuff from Mirage/Visions/Alliances/Exodus is nice to see for older players, and even when the cards themselves are underwhelming, if a new player sees an older player with a 15 year old copy of the same card they just got in their booster, but it's not something that gets put in every other core set, it's kinda cool. (I may just enjoy a lot of weird cards from back then though... reprint Delirium!)
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May 7, 2014 23:50
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Loving Life Partner posted:Harvest Season Extended Otherworldly Vacation
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May 8, 2014 00:03
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"gently caress you got mine"
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May 8, 2014 00:05
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Angry Grimace posted:Except the end result is the person with the most creatures gets to keep a bunch of theirs and the other guys creatures all die. The copy ability says "may" for a reason. Why does the guy with less creatures keep copying it when he's only worsening his position? In most cases, Chain of Smog was just a 1B Mind Rot.
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May 8, 2014 00:12
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mehall posted:On this topic, I wish they would be a touch more aggressive about printing old cards that most players have never seen before. Reprisal is a goodie from Alliances, though it made a Core Set before, but weird stuff from Mirage/Visions/Alliances/Exodus is nice to see for older players, and even when the cards themselves are underwhelming, if a new player sees an older player with a 15 year old copy of the same card they just got in their booster, but it's not something that gets put in every other core set, it's kinda cool. What you're saying is that you want Kookus and Keeper of Kookus in Standard, right?
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May 8, 2014 00:17
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Entropic posted:What's Karn up to now? I'm guessing we won't see him or Koth again until we go back to Hi here are your annual Planeswalker updates: Ajani - Showed up on Theros to help Elspeth. Until the second part of the e-book comes out: ??? Jace - Currently the Guildpact on Ravnica. Recently fought Vraska, might be checking up on Garruk after hearing about his issues. Liliana - 2 for 4 on the Demons she's hunting. She left Innistrad at the beginning of Avacyn Restored. Chandra - If Duels 2014 is legit, she tracked the planeswalker Ramaz around and then kicked his rear end. If not, She hasn't really done poo poo since Rise of the Eldrazi. Garruk - Cursed. Apparently bad times are about to happen with Garruk in M15. Elspeth - Apparently killed Xenagos on Theros. Again, until the second part of that e-book comes out it's a mystery as to how she actually makes out at the end. Tezzeret - Still on New Phyrexia monitoring it for Bolas last we heard. Sarkhan - Left dejected and disillusioned by Bolas since the end of Rise of the Eldrazi. He hasn't shown up since. Nicol Bolas - Has his hands in basically everything still. Last we saw he was loving with Tezzeret and sent him to Mirrodin. Nissa - Supposedly tracking down Sorin. Dumb as hell. Sorin - Kicked Tibalt's rear end. Once everything on Innistrad worked its way out he left again. Gideon - He was doing poo poo with the Boros on Ravnica when he was supposed to be gathering people to help against the Eldrazi. Who the hell knows how that worked out. Venser - Deaaaaaaaaaaaad. Koth - Apparently sacrificed himself to blow up Elesh Norn? Might be dead? Might not? Not killed "on screen" so who knows. Personally I hope we get a card called "Koth, the Last Vulshok" Karn - Karn is retracing his steps throughout the Multiverse trying to isolate, contain and find a way to destroy the Glistening Oil he probably tracked everywhere. Tamiyo - Studying Innistrad's moon. Tibalt - Got his face kicked by Sorin. hosed off somewhere. Vraska - Tried to assassinate Jace & several guildleaders on Ravnica. Failed at it. Domri - Being a punk Gruul kid on Ravnica. Ral Zarek - A gently caress. Still being an Izzet gently caress. Ashiok - Doing poo poo on Theros involving nightmares and also Phenax. Xenagos - Dead? Maybe? E-book. Kiora - In a slap fight with Thassa. She's supposed to be looking for krakens to use against the Eldrazi but whatever I guess. Dack Fayden, the Greatest Thief in the Multiverse - I legit have no idea where the storyline puts him. He's dealing with Ashiok in the comics but then he's in Conspiracy so who the gently caress knows.
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May 8, 2014 00:20
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I may be doing a sealed deck where I'm just handed a 2014 Deckbuilders Toolkit and told to build a sealed deck. Has anyone done this before? Are there any idiosyncrasies I should know about that bizarre format? Looking at the list, it seems like they feed you some pretty amazing blue cards (opportunity, divination, messenger drake, and...some other drake who escapes me at the moment.) they give you some good removal on red, too.
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May 8, 2014 00:24
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RIP Venser, king durdle Planeswalker, awesome cube creature, and guy with a colorless sliver. edit: How awesome would a Phyrexian Venser Planeswalker be though? Or I guess lore wise that's not possible.
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May 8, 2014 00:31
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Chorocojo posted:
So basically he got wasted and is trying to figure out what happened when he was blacked out?
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May 8, 2014 00:37
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Angry Grimace posted:So basically he got wasted and is trying to figure out what happened when he was blacked out? Phyrexia's a hell of a drug.
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May 8, 2014 00:40
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