|
Mr. Maltose posted:To be fair, that's sort of the plot of GT. The Shadow Dragon that got formed by the wish for panties must have been picked on so much as a kid ;_;.
|
#
?
May 12, 2014 23:35
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 19:17 |
|
|
Captain Quack posted:Originally yeah... If this is true (I can't remmember) this is the stupidest thing. Bora, the first guy resurrected by the Dragon Balls, would have died again from the hole in his chest that would still be there.
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2014 23:40
|
|
|
I think the original Shenron can heal wounds but can't create a body from thin air.
|
|
#
?
May 12, 2014 23:44
|
|
|
Hey everyone. So I've always loved anime growing up, but I never watched Dragon Ball as a kid. I always kinda knew about it but never experienced it until this year. On a whim, I read through Dragon Ball from the beginning. I was completely immersed in the fantastic tale of Kid Goku and how innocent he was. This wasn't the Goku I imagined from what I had seen in pop-culture, especially since DBZ was marketed as a badass thrill-ride. I loved the tale of Kid Goku and the Dragon Balls. When I got to the Z portion of the manga, I wanted to skip filler and wanted the best experience possible, so I watched all of the Kai Blu Rays and loved them. Is Kai generally regarded as the bad version though? I really enjoyed it for my first viewing experience.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:12
|
|
|
Beautiful Ninja posted:The Shadow Dragon that got formed by the wish for panties must have been picked on so much as a kid ;_;. Wasn't she one of the more powerful ones because of the nature of the wishes or something something? I barely remember GT at all, think i only got the chance to watch it once and even then in a disjointed mess. A water lady dragon, and some HONOURABLE WARRIOR sun dragon that turned good before the end. The rest are just... blank. I liked the entire saga as a concept because it finally gave consequence to all the get out of death free nonsense wishes. But thats all i remember, so if it was horrible i've blanked it.  mechacop posted:Is Kai generally regarded as the bad version though? I really enjoyed it for my first viewing experience. I cant answer your question, BUT! Go forth and watch DBZ Abridged, it should tickle you now that you've got the source material in your head. 
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:14
|
|
|
Thyrork posted:Wasn't she one of the more powerful ones because of the nature of the wishes or something something? I barely remember GT at all, think i only got the chance to watch it once and even then in a disjointed mess. That Shadow Dragon was honorable and nice because he was born from an evil wish, while the good wishes created evil Shadow Dragons. mechacop posted:Is Kai generally regarded as the bad version though? I really enjoyed it for my first viewing experience.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:21
|
|
|
Why would Kai be regarded as bad, exactly? Except for a handful of filler episodes and moments, there's nothing of value lost in telling the same exact story with basically the same exact animation at the pace set by the manga, rather than three to five times longer.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:21
|
|
|
mechacop posted:Is Kai generally regarded as the bad version though? I really enjoyed it for my first viewing experience. Kai is great to get the meat of the plot the way Toriyama intended it. But I myself, and a few others I gather, really prefer to original 291 episode series because nostalgia and some of the filler is hilarious. Plus Kai's soundtrack doesn't hold a candle to Bruce Faulconer's. Kai is best for newcomers though. But if you really enjoyed it I'd recommend watching the original run sometime. EDIT: Also, another reason I prefer the original run is that I'm a sucker for world-building and the filler, despite being non-canon, helps a lot with fleshing out the history and culture of the Saiyans. Esroc fucked around with this message at 01:35 on May 13, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:22
|
|
|
Mr. Maltose posted:Basically after Dende makes the DragonBall+ there are no real rules anymore. What if Vegeta did it off camera which is why he still refers to himself as prince because his dad is now alive again. The reason it never comes up is because Bulma won't let him visit.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:45
|
|
|
A lot of purists disagree, but I prefer Kai better because I don't have time to watch 300 episodes of DBZ. I've mostly been reading the manga though and I probably like that the best. The Vizbig collections are really nice, contain 3 volumes of the manga in a single volume, have some color pages and for a translation, the dialogue is pretty good and witty. There are some oddities though, such as Krillin being called "Kurinrin" but I take it that's a closer translation than the anime. They're also cheap - they're $12-25 each! I read through all of Dragon Ball and loved it, and I got through two volumes of DBZ... and I'm still waiting on that third volume. Volumes 4-7 arrived already... but volume 3 still hasn't. And I ordered it on the 26th. I have most of the Frieza saga and the entire Cell saga sitting there waiting to be read but I can't yet. lovely 3rd party Amazon seller.  Well, now I know to read store reviews first!I've also gotten into the DBZ SH Figuarts, and I have SSJ Goku and Krillin already, with normal Goku and Piccolo on preorder. Cell and Frieza are somewhat reasonable... but Vegeta, Gohan and especially Trunks are insane prices. What have I gotten myself into? 
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:50
|
|
|
Barudak posted:What if Vegeta did it off camera which is why he still refers to himself as prince because his dad is now alive again. The reason it never comes up is because Bulma won't let him visit. I have doubts that any of the surviving Saiyans we are aware of would wish back their race simply because now they know how easy it is to go Super Saiyan once you're aware that it's a real attainable thing. And an entire planet of Super Saiyans would be a scourge on the Universe. That might make for one hell of a future story though.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:51
|
|
|
He calls himself the prince because if he doesn't Tarble probably will and he can't let Tarble have it.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:52
|
|
|
Yeah, bringing back planet Vegeta and all the Saiyans would be the worst thing that could possibly happen. The last thing the universe needs is an army of evil pissed off super saiyans. That would actually make for a really cool storyline, though.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 01:57
|
|
|
Esroc posted:Kai is great to get the meat of the plot the way Toriyama intended it. But I myself, and a few others I gather, really prefer to original 291 episode series because nostalgia and some of the filler is hilarious. Plus Kai's soundtrack doesn't hold a candle to Bruce Faulconer's. How about a best-of list of filler? Not all of it is good. Number one will always be Driving cars though.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 02:00
|
|
|
Rigged Death Trap posted:How about a best-of list of filler? Not all of it is good. Bottom of the list is Garlic Jr.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 02:08
|
|
|
Rigged Death Trap posted:How about a best-of list of filler? Not all of it is good. In series order but not order of quality:
-Yamcha's many careers -Goku falling off Snake Way -The Pendulum Room -Gregory -Human reactions to Vegeta and Nappa's arrival -Bulma's adventures on Namek -General Saiyan lore expansion -Vegeta's siege of Freeza's ship -Frog Ginyu getting more screen time. -King Vegeta's personal history expanded -Ginyu Force on Kai's Planet -Freeza being somewhat of a match for SSj Goku -Vegeta's reaction to seeing SSj Goku the first time -Vegeta knowing Freeza killed the Saiyans (which expands his personal motivations from a certain perspective) -Namekians chillin' at Capsule Corp -Trunks going all Samurai on Freeza's men -3-Year training montage -The Driving Episode -Vegeta's first SSj transformation expanded -Krillian getting his rear end beat by a geriatric android -Cell's first appearance expanded -Vegeta and Trunks' training scenes in the Time Chamber -Episodes before the Cell Games of Goku and Gohan doing everyday stuff -The entire Cell/Goku fight is expanded and has some of the best fight sequences of the entire series -Pikkon/Otherworld Tournament -Gohan in High School extended -Cell Games reenactment (waves and rooooocks!) -Pui Pui extended scenes -Goku vs. Majin Vegeta extended fight scenes -Goku's showcase of SSj3 on Kami's Lookout -Satan/Buu bonding scenes extended -Buu's siege of Kami's Lookout -Buu's absorption powers extended, with more screentime for each form -Vegetto extended scenes -Expansion of Buu's history and siege on the Supreme Kai's homeworld -SSj2 Goku versus Kid Buu (beautifully animated, possibly the best animated scenes in the series imo) -Episodes post-Buu but pre-Uub -Goku and Pan extended scenes -Extended Uub scenes more accurately showcasing his power This is by no means a complete list of the good filler, but it shows the list of chief items that help to expand the lore of the series and/or provide more impact to the actions of certain characters. Esroc fucked around with this message at 02:51 on May 13, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 02:32
|
|
|
Twiddy posted:One thing that kind of always surprised me is that he continued calling himself the Prince of all Saiyans. I mean, there were only 8/2.5/4/? Saiyans alive for much of the series, and none of them were the king. Why didn't he assume the dust particles of the throne floating in space and become the King of all Saiyans? Did he want to kill Freeza first? After that, did he have to prove he was better than Goku? I read somewhere that it was out of respect for his father.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 03:26
|
|
|
Bushmaori posted:I read somewhere that it was out of respect for his father. I always chalked it up to the fact that the Saiyan Kingdom no longer exists so it wouldn't make much sense for him to usurp his father's title. He's Prince simply because that's the last remaining royal title and also the highest surviving title of a dead monarchy. Does a prince automatically become king when his father is killed and the kingdom is taken over by someone else? No. It's the same scenario, mostly. You can't inherit a government that no longer exists.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 03:31
|
|
|
Gammatron 64 posted:
I got Trunks when he was regular priced, then lost ALL his accessories and had to repurchase him at an insane inflated price...but it was worth it. I've got regular Goku on pre-order, and might grab SSJ Goku too, since he's being re- released for about $30. I wish the SDCC SSJ Goku color scheme was the standard one, though. Only other figure I'm somewhat interested in is Gohan , but ffff that price. Esroc posted:[list] You...you rear end in a top hat. You're making me WANT to watch DBZ filler.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 03:39
|
|
|
Esroc posted:-Cell's first appearance expanded Are we talking about Piccolo and Cell's staring contest here, because that is not exactly what I would call quality.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 03:44
|
|
|
Rezzing the Saiyan race would be a bad idea. Without Freeza and crew giving them planets to go literally apeshit on they'd likely try to usurp Vegeta far too many times. Grim dark theory is Vegeta has to kill them all off to keep the menace down. Comedy option is the Saiyans try to kidnap Goten and Trunks to make them real Saiyans and the plot ends with Gotenks accidentally killing off all the Saiyans by showing off.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 03:52
|
|
|
I'm pretty sure that by the time Vegeta could wish them back even Yamcha could punk the strongest Saiyan that wanted to cause trouble on earth.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:02
|
|
|
BlitzBlast posted:Are we talking about Piccolo and Cell's staring contest here, because that is not exactly what I would call quality. No, I'm talking about the scenes depicting Cell's hunt for biomass and sucking up of random civilians. This wasn't shown as much in the manga but in the anime it helps to give Cell a creepy horror vibe and facilitates feelings of dislike for the character. Also, here's a list of what I personally consider the worst filler. Just for the sake of balance. I'd like to point out that the amount of good filler far outweighs the bad.
-Princess Snake -Fake Namek -Extended Body-switch sub-arc -Bulma/Ginyu body-switch -Dende getting weird with Gohan before leaving for New Namek -Everything involving the Garlic Jr. Saga, especially Maron -King Cold being a pussy (he was more regal and badass in the manga) -Constant cuts to Goku lying in bed after his heart attack -Krillin's Destructo Disc failing against Cell -Everyone helping in the beam struggle against Cell (it had more narrative impact when it was only Vegeta) -Everything involving Videl trying to unmask Saiyaman Esroc fucked around with this message at 04:12 on May 13, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:02
|
|
|
Mr. Maltose posted:I'm pretty sure that by the time Vegeta could wish them back even Yamcha could punk the strongest Saiyan that wanted to cause trouble on earth. Not necessarily. It's well established that the only thing keeping every Saiyan from being a Super Saiyan is lack of knowledge that the legend is true and a lack of enemies strong enough to facilitate the transformation. With the exception of Freeza and his highest ranked men, the Saiyans trump nearly everyone else in the Universe. Throw the Saiyans on a planet where they're consistently outmatched and Super Saiyans would start popping up like weeds.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:05
|
|
|
Dabura going to heaven is the best.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:05
|
|
|
Squallege posted:Dabura going to heaven is the best. Yeah, now that I think about it it was kind of amusing. It just didn't sit right with me at first because its such a huge departure from his character. But I guess dying can have that effect on a person. So I'll give that one a pass.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:12
|
|
|
Esroc posted:Not necessarily. It's well established that the only thing keeping every Saiyan from being a Super Saiyan is lack of knowledge that the legend is true and a lack of enemies strong enough to facilitate the transformation. With the exception of Freeza and his highest ranked men, the Saiyans trump nearly everyone else in the Universe. Even if they somehow got a dozen zenkai boosts after coming back, a majority of them would fall hilariously short compared to the Earth's fighters (or even some Nameks, if Nail was anything to go by). None of them could really catch up to the hilariously large difference in power between the average Saiyan and the stuff the Earthers have, powerful enemies or no. Regular Saiyans, at least the ones not like Tarble and Gine, would either fall in line or end up like this:  Although if they do take a more peaceful route, the human/Saiyan hybrids are going to start popping up exponentially. It's every other fanfic writer's dream come true, where all their hybrid OCs can show off and a true Super Saiyan bargain sale can commence!
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:27
|
|
|
Esroc posted:No, I'm talking about the scenes depicting Cell's hunt for biomass and sucking up of random civilians. This wasn't shown as much in the manga but in the anime it helps to give Cell a creepy horror vibe and facilitates feelings of dislike for the character. Bullshit.  It's the only time in the whole drat series where all of the secondary fighters realize, "Oh, poo poo, if the current Best Z Fighter loses this fight then everyone's going to die. There's literally zero reason not to pitch in right now!" Just because their efforts are basically ineffectual doesn't matter. In fact, it's good that it works out that way because it means that Vegeta's contribution is still the only meaningful one.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:35
|
|
|
StrifeHira posted:Even if they somehow got a dozen zenkai boosts after coming back, a majority of them would fall hilariously short compared to the Earth's fighters (or even some Nameks, if Nail was anything to go by). None of them could really catch up to the hilariously large difference in power between the average Saiyan and the stuff the Earthers have, powerful enemies or no. Regular Saiyans, at least the ones not like Tarble and Gine, would either fall in line or end up like this: I disagree. Yes, a lot of them would be outmatched but we're not given much of an idea of the range of power of the average Saiyan. If anything some sequences support Vegeta, and by extension Raditz and Nappa, being on the low end of the spectrum compared to others of their race. An all-out Saiyan invasion of Earth would be like a gauntlet weeding out the weaker members with the strongest surviving long enough to possibly unlock the Super Saiyan. Remember that Trunks and Goten are established in the Yo! Son Goku and Friends special as still being incredibly weak compared to pretty much everyone else, even after the Buu incident. That's why they have to fuse to be of any use. And yet even they are able to attain Super Saiyan. Therefore it's fact that it's not a requirement that a Saiyan already be immensely powerful to achieve SSj. Even Raditz could do it providing the right scenario. All it takes is knowledge of the ability and a "need" (as Goku puts it) to achieve it. This need usually manifesting as an emotional response to suffering. Throw a million Saiyans at the collective warriors of Earth and let them see Super Saiyans are real, and at least several of them will pop Super Saiyan just out of sheer survival instinct during the course of battle. surf rock posted:Bullshit. I will concede your point. I'm just a Vegeta fanboy so to me the anime stole his thunder. It's entirely my opinion. Esroc fucked around with this message at 04:45 on May 13, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:41
|
|
|
Esroc posted:No, I'm talking about the scenes depicting Cell's hunt for biomass and sucking up of random civilians. This wasn't shown as much in the manga but in the anime it helps to give Cell a creepy horror vibe and facilitates feelings of dislike for the character.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:44
|
|
|
Esroc posted:Remember that Trunks and Goten are established in the Yo! Son Goku and Friends special as still being incredibly weak compared to pretty much everyone else, even after the Buu incident. That's why they have to fuse to be of any use. And yet even they are able to attain Super Saiyan. But in that same special they are stated to be at least as strong as Freeza.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:49
|
|
|
WickedHate posted:But in that same special they are stated to be at least as strong as Freeza. Yes. They are as strong as Freeza after fighting Majin Buu, training for years, and discovering Super Saiyan 3 while fused. All of that and they just barely reach Freeza. But they could go Super Saiyan before Buu even showed up. Meaning it's safe to assume that Pre-Buu Saga they were Dodoria/Ginyu/Zarbon levels of power (and that's being generous) but still could go SSj. Meaning SSj is not predicated on already being immensely powerful. SSj has little to do with your base power and everything to do with being in a situation in which you "need" it to happen and the knowledge that it can be done.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:59
|
|
|
Combat Lobster posted:Now I really wished there was an episode where Vegeta applied for an office job somewhere. Be careful what you wish for. (slightly  )
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 04:59
|
|
|
Freakazoid_ posted:Be careful what you wish for. (slightly Squallege fucked around with this message at 05:05 on May 13, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 05:01
|
|
|
Esroc posted:Yes. They are as strong as Freeza after fighting Majin Buu, training for years, and discovering Super Saiyan 3 while fused. All of that and they just barely reach Freeza. But they could go Super Saiyan before Buu even showed up. Meaning it's safe to assume that Pre-Buu Saga they were Dodoria/Ginyu/Zarbon levels of power (and that's being generous) but still could go SSj. Meaning SSj is not predicated on already being immensely powerful. SSj has little to do with your base power and everything to do with being in a situation in which you "need" it to happen and the knowledge that it can be done. Except that before the tournament or any of their followup training Trunks is training at 150x gravity with some difficulty. Even Ginyu probably would have been pasted by that.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 05:06
|
|
|
Esroc posted:Yes. They are as strong as Freeza after fighting Majin Buu, training for years, and discovering Super Saiyan 3 while fused. All of that and they just barely reach Freeza. But they could go Super Saiyan before Buu even showed up. Meaning it's safe to assume that Pre-Buu Saga they were Dodoria/Ginyu/Zarbon levels of power (and that's being generous) but still could go SSj. Meaning SSj is not predicated on already being immensely powerful. SSj has little to do with your base power and everything to do with being in a situation in which you "need" it to happen and the knowledge that it can be done. But Trunks and Goten never "needed" it before the Buu saga, and they didn't even know what it was.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 05:06
|
|
|
StrifeHira posted:(or even some Nameks, if Nail was anything to go by) Ok, so outside of like that arc in Dragon Ball Multiverse, is there anything in the manga or anime that indicates Nail is powerful compared to the Z Fighters? I'm assuming he's stronger than the other Namek warriors that show up, but since they all got one-shotted by Dodoria and Zarbon that's nothing to go by. No indication is made about what the rules are for Namekian fusion powerups, so you can't go by that logically for Piccolo's fusion powerup. The only thing you have is him getting owned by first form Freeza. So seriously, am I missing something here?
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 05:10
|
|
|
WickedHate posted:But Trunks and Goten never "needed" it before the Buu saga, and they didn't even know what it was. Yes they did. They just didn't understand that it's supposed to be a big deal. Which in many ways actually made the transformation easier for them since they weren't weighed down by the myth and legend of it and just perceived it as a regular 'ol power boost.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 05:12
|
|
|
crankdatbatman posted:Ok, so outside of like that arc in Dragon Ball Multiverse, is there anything in the manga or anime that indicates Nail is powerful compared to the Z Fighters? I'm assuming he's stronger than the other Namek warriors that show up, but since they all got one-shotted by Dodoria and Zarbon that's nothing to go by. No indication is made about what the rules are for Namekian fusion powerups, so you can't go by that logically for Piccolo's fusion powerup. The only thing you have is him getting owned by first form Freeza. So seriously, am I missing something here? Well I mean he can sense energy and didn't seem too afraid of Vegeta so maybe he was on Piccolo's level Post Kai 'training'? I mean he probably had his potential unlocked by Guru.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 05:15
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 19:17 |
|
|
crankdatbatman posted:Ok, so outside of like that arc in Dragon Ball Multiverse, is there anything in the manga or anime that indicates Nail is powerful compared to the Z Fighters? I'm assuming he's stronger than the other Namek warriors that show up, but since they all got one-shotted by Dodoria and Zarbon that's nothing to go by. No indication is made about what the rules are for Namekian fusion powerups, so you can't go by that logically for Piccolo's fusion powerup. The only thing you have is him getting owned by first form Freeza. So seriously, am I missing something here? We never see Nail do much of anything except get de-limbed by Freeza, but it's heavily implied he's the most powerful Namek and that's why he is Guru's personal bodyguard. If I was forced to guess I'd place Nail roughly equal to Piccolo, possibly slightly stronger or weaker. But honestly I don't have anything to back this up.
|
|
#
?
May 13, 2014 05:16
|
|