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I personally have no problem with having guns in a Pathfinder game thematically, (though I know others do), its more to do with the fact that RAW, they are terrible, as are the classes that are designed to use them.
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May 15, 2014 00:08
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darth cookie posted:I personally have no problem with having guns in a Pathfinder game thematically, (though I know others do), its more to do with the fact that RAW, they are terrible, as are the classes that are designed to use them.
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May 15, 2014 00:18
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I love playing 40kRP and the like and running around with guns, but when I'm playing Pathfinder I'd prefer it to be straight fantasy (since I really wish I were playing D&D).
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May 15, 2014 00:20
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Pharmaskittle posted:I love playing 40kRP and the like and running around with guns, but when I'm playing Pathfinder I'd prefer it to be straight fantasy (since I really wish I were playing D&D). Pathfinder pretty much is D&D, there's really not much of a distinction. Like I'd use 3.5 for the same stuff I use Pathfinder for, but Pathfinder includes a bunch of fixes that 3.5 doesn't.
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May 15, 2014 00:48
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Edge of The Empire Session 3: Meeting Tybalt the Rodian, "It's not polite to murder slavers in the open," What Sydney Witnessed and Why It Was Important In the previous session, our party had bumbled their way to The Wheel, where their employer, Reom, told them they would be searching for the lost Separatist treasury ship, the Sa Nalaor. Until Reom's sister and business partner, Shira, arrived with something that was going to help point us in the right direction, we had five hours to spend on the Wheel. Being a party of eight, we promptly split up, supposedly so that we could gather more info on the ship. Events, and our own actions, conspired against us, however. Group A, consisting of Kyp Marr, Sydney Twilight, Neuratakk, and Doc, headed to the trade decks to see if they could find any good rumors about the ship. Passing through the crowded stalls and throngs of people, Kyp overheard a couple of Rodians threatening a very distressed shopkeeper. Feeling obligated to help, in the best traditions of the mythical Jedi, the humans of the group, minus Sydney, try to mediate, although the Rodians will have none of that. These two thugs are part of the Yiyar gang, and they don't like anyone who works with Reom, but aren't high up enough to recognize Kyp as being on Reom's payroll. Doc, ever the peaceful one, persuades the Rodians to take this argument into a nearby alley, while the rest of the group is fully prepared to jump these guys. In the alley, there are two more Rodians, one of which is apparently a lieutenant of the Yiyar, by the name of Yav Yiyar. Doc and Kyp walk right into the middle of the four Rodians, who are less than happy that they have interrupted their important racketeering business. Then Yav recognizes Kyp, and, one thing leading to another, weapons are drawn and a fight breaks out. Meanwhile, Group B, with Krussk, the Droid, and the Other Chiss, are on the middle decks, where there are nicer restaurants and generally less gang violence. It was then that we find out who's Obligation got rolled for that session. In Edge of the Empire, every character starts with at least one Obligation, which can be anything from a bounty on their heads, an addiction to a particular narcotic, a debt owed to someone, or a code of ethics or conduct that the character lives by. During each session, our DM would find some way to bring a character's Obligation into play, determining who the lucky person was going to be by rolling for it. And for this session, Krussk came up. Krussk's Obligation was an Oath: Hunt Slavers (to be honest, when I made Krussk, I wanted to see how I might go against the general flow of things, and made a Trandoshan who hated slaving and at least tolerated Wookies). Krussk did not like slavers because his family had been attacked and split apart by a group of them, leaving Krussk with a deep desire to hunt them down. Which is why, as Group B approached an info kiosk to Space-Bing "Sa Nalaor", he was not happy to see those three slavers sitting at a restaurant nearby. And neither were the slavers, as they recognized Krussk as well. However, this was an open area, with lots and lots of people around, and the Imperial presence on the Wheel, while not oppressive, at least regularly patrolled the nicer decks. So Krussk had to grit his teeth and try not to stare while the Droid and the Other Chiss found nothing useful about the Sa Nalaor. While all that was happening, Group C, in other words, Chris the Chiss, was off somewhere else entirely, and I can't really remember what he was doing while Groups A and B were 'investigating.' Going back to Group A, it turns out that Rodian thugs are really weak against a force pike (how Kyp managed to swing that in an alleyway, we just put down to 'the Force') and stun gloves (Doc's Obligation was essentially "Do no harm, protect life no matter what"). They were even more susceptible to Neuratakk's souped up sniper blaster rifle, which downed one of the Rodians right off the bat. Of course, as soon as shots were fired, they knew it was only a matter of time before the fuzz showed up. Yav Yiyar was pissed at Neuratakk, and swore bloody vengeance on him and Reom, although Neuratakk never could remember his name, so he was referred to as Tybalt the Rodian from then on. Then, a large maintenance droid comes up from the end of the alley opposite the marketplace, and states that all violent actions on the Wheel should cease immediately, and that Imperial Security had alr-- --until Tybalt interrupted the droid by shooting it. This did not help his case, as the droid managed to record the whole affair from the moment they had walked into the alleyway, and everyone was surprised when Stormtroopers showed up at both ends of the alley (Surprised more to the fact that they were actually competent than anything, really). After getting everyone to throw down their guns, they reviewed the tapes and saw that the Rodians were already wanted for various crimes and misdemeanors, so Group A got away with a stern warning. Group B became aware that their lizard man was noticeably disturbed at this point, and Krussk explains the problem with the equally nervous men across the hallway. The group gets the idea to track the slavers, however, those slavers have already seen them together, and would know if any of the three of them were tailing them. And since we didn't have any tracking devices, it fell on Krussk to come up with a new plan, which might have been better thought out in retrospect. Krussk decided to call up Chris and get him to find out where the slavers' ship was docked and where it was headed, giving him the name of the ship in question: The Rancor's Head. Chris, understandably, is confused, as Krussk has basically called him up and ordered him to find the ship without actually explaining why, but decides to do it anyway. Chris heads to the docking bay offices, and charms up the Devaronian lady behind the counter, who seems to have a thing for blue men. She tells him right out that giving him that data about the Rancor's Head is a serious offense, but hints that there are other, less conspicuous methods of tracking a ship, like talking to an info broker. Chris decides that his friend he met in the Blasted Asteroid would likely have contacts for just this kind of deal, and Krussk agrees that they should meet their to negotiate. Group A, deciding there isn't much else to do on the trade decks, wanders back over to the Blasted Asteroid. All of Group A, except Sydney, who wanders over to a bar in the lower decks, within sight of the ships docked with the station. While drinking, he notices someone getting in a ship and taking off, and his Perception roll succeeds, but with several Disadvantages. So, Sydney doesn't really think all that much about why Reom had just left the station in a hurry with the hyperspace communication pod.* Back at the Blasted Asteroid, the rest of the party talks it over with the info broker, who says it would be possible if he can find someone skilled enough and if we have enough money to pay for it. Until he could find someone, he would stay in touch. We ended the session with the party waiting to meet Shira and actually learn something about this job. Next time, on Edge of the Empire: Sydney Is Still Oblivious, Meeting IT-3PO, Making Deals With Imperials (What Could Possibly Go Wrong?) *This was both IC and OC, and Sydney's player had no clue why the DM commented on the fact that only one of our party had any important information.
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May 15, 2014 02:18
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Pharmaskittle posted:Yeah, in character creation when the DM was laying out the classes and mentioned that there was a class built around guns, almost all of the players were really down on the idea of having them in the game at all. I don't think he remembered that when my character found them (almost killing himself in the process with the gunpowder, which is also a mystery to our characters). The great DM of my childhood took something of an Occam's Razor approach to it. In our campaigns, all of them (even Forgotten Realms, interestingly), gunpowder just didn't work, period. The laws of physics/chemistry/combustion/whatever were such that gunpowder didn't explode, period. Mind you, we still had the loopy gondsmen who would make horrible death machines "because they could", but no arquebuses or the like. However, I believe that a high-powered crossbow that ran on compressed air was a fairly sizable feature of one campaign, so take that for what you will.
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May 15, 2014 04:34
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JustJeff88 posted:The great DM of my childhood took something of an Occam's Razor approach to it. In our campaigns, all of them (even Forgotten Realms, interestingly), gunpowder just didn't work, period. The laws of physics/chemistry/combustion/whatever were such that gunpowder didn't explode, period.
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May 15, 2014 06:21
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JustJeff88 posted:The great DM of my childhood took something of an Occam's Razor approach to it. In our campaigns, all of them (even Forgotten Realms, interestingly), gunpowder just didn't work, period. The laws of physics/chemistry/combustion/whatever were such that gunpowder didn't explode, period. Mind you, we still had the loopy gondsmen who would make horrible death machines "because they could", but no arquebuses or the like. However, I believe that a high-powered crossbow that ran on compressed air was a fairly sizable feature of one campaign, so take that for what you will. No need for GM fiat when you've got the natural extension of fantasy society to stomp on the dreams of your budding Nerd Rifle Association. You could just say that since the magic creation of metals exists then materials science never advanced enough to make a small, strong, AND precise gun barrel. Cannons and gunpowder might exist, but building up enough of a technology behind the miniaturization of something as imprecise and dangerous as cannons would easily take a far backseat to the nigh-ubiquitous enchanted arrows/bolts and goddamn handheld fireball staves. Waaaay less effort than the industrialization of machine shops. Besides, what if the... dark elves get ahold of guns? I mean RaHoWa gets really complicated when there are so many races in the base book alone.
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May 15, 2014 06:44
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Honestly, as much as I like guns I don't think they need to be included in D&D style fantasy games. Between the high fantasy tone and the prevalence of magic, there's just no real need for it. In a more renaissance or pirate sort of game, sure, bring on the flintlocks, but not in a dungeon crawl. As for stories, I just finished the first session of an Eberron campaign, set during the Last War. We didn't get very far, but next session, we're going to be jumping out of a moving lighting train, sneaking into a besieged city, and freeing a captured general. Eberron is the best.
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May 15, 2014 06:51
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Napoleonic fantasy 
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May 15, 2014 08:25
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AmiYumi posted:Actually, I'm pretty sure that is how it works in Forgotten Realms; that one group of gnomes or w/e that uses "smokepowder" can only do it through the direct intervention of their God. So gunpowder is (technically) a magic item that one works for members of one specific faith. This is actually wrong. Smokepowder can be created in the Realms using minor magic; gunpowder itself cannot be created. Smokepowder has been available for quite awhile, particularly in not-China Kara-Tur; the appearance of the god Gond to his worshipers on the island of Lantan only advanced the sciences around smokepowder to make new weapons available. The peoples of Kara-Tur just used it to make fireworks and rough cannons, for example, but Gond's intervention lead to the creation of arquebuses and similar primitive firearms. Anyone can use or make smokepowder; Gond just made the secret of creating it a lot more open (and then you have some push and pull between Gond's priests and other people who are worried about Gond letting the dragon out of the bottle; see Oghma's entry in Faiths and Avatars.) See Forgotten Realms Adventures, the Revised Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, and Magic of Faerun for more. Beardless posted:Honestly, as much as I like guns I don't think they need to be included in D&D style fantasy games. Between the high fantasy tone and the prevalence of magic, there's just no real need for it. In a more renaissance or pirate sort of game, sure, bring on the flintlocks, but not in a dungeon crawl. D&D isn't really high fantasy normally, or even very fantastic. D&D is pretty mundane, really. And I think your two statements sort of go together - there's absolutely no reason why guns can't fit into D&D, but a reductive view of that is exactly why Eberron is appealing. It isn't necessarily "the best," but it does allow you to break out of the boundaries you've set for yourself. Guns would fit very well into Eberron (think of Cannith Wand Adepts.) The question is, why don't you use them? If you're getting stuck on guns not being right for D&D but dragons and warforged are, the issue is probably with you.
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May 15, 2014 08:32
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SALT CURES HAM posted:Napoleonic fantasy I've run this (well about a century back) and let me tell you, my players loved it. The problem was really more that we were using Pathfinder and eventually the rules bogged down enough that it wasn't fun interacting with the system anymore, but seriously, Napoleonic/Early Modern/Musket and Rapier fantasy is a ton of fun to run.
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May 15, 2014 09:02
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Arivia posted:This is actually wrong. Smokepowder can be created in the Realms using minor magic; gunpowder itself cannot be created. Smokepowder has been available for quite awhile, particularly in not-China Kara-Tur; the appearance of the god Gond to his worshipers on the island of Lantan only advanced the sciences around smokepowder to make new weapons available. The peoples of Kara-Tur just used it to make fireworks and rough cannons, for example, but Gond's intervention lead to the creation of arquebuses and similar primitive firearms. Anyone can use or make smokepowder; Gond just made the secret of creating it a lot more open (and then you have some push and pull between Gond's priests and other people who are worried about Gond letting the dragon out of the bottle; see Oghma's entry in Faiths and Avatars.) See Forgotten Realms Adventures, the Revised Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, and Magic of Faerun for more. Gods attempting to stop one of the most important (and really obvious) technological developments in history is pretty funny. Succeeding indefinitely for *reasons* is funnier yet. When I think on it briefly, the Forgotten Realms are probably more technologically stagnant than 40K, by a magnitude of about a hundred times. On earth, we've had human civilization for about 10,000 years and are now post-atomic. On a quick check, civilization appeared on FR roughly 31,000 years before the present day, and the technology level roughly resembles that of the Hundred Years' War era in actual history (the typical D&D technological setting, or thereabouts). This despite the heavy prevalence of people who can warp reality to their will with almost no conceivable constraints. I suppose you could argue that magic obviates the need to develop firearms, but I don't think that argument would withstand scrutiny for too long. I fear this delves too deeply into "world-building thread" and "LOL Forgotten Realms," though.
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May 15, 2014 09:48
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See also Tamriel, which has held the same level of technology (And even backslid a little, they seem to have forgotten how to forge spears) and also failed to make any significant advances in magic for at least 200 years.
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May 15, 2014 09:57
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......
Nostalgia4ColdWar fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Mar 31, 2017 |
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May 15, 2014 10:30
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Things 50FA is wrong about in the FR: -An equivalent to the Magna Carta was signed by King Foril of Cormyr in 4e. -Senates and republics are not unheard of in the Realms. Many of the Dales are republics, with heads of state that in turn report to the Dales Council, itself a republican body. Other places use republican governments like Amn or the loose democracies of Phlan and other city states. You don't see much examination of political systems in the Realms because much of it is nation states with either loose democracies or monarchies, and many of the laws of the land weren't published until very late 3e (the Heralds section of Power of Faerun, also see Code of the Harpers) -Water clocks have been a product in the Realms for decades, at least since 2e (and I'd be willing to bet 1e, I just don't feel like checking FR1 or FR2 right now.) Neverwinter exports them, see The North. Gears, wheels, and pulleys are all available - see Aurora's Whole Realms Catalogue or the discussion of the Great Rift in Shining South (3e.) -A lot of people focus on metallurgy in the Realms. There's no continental large advances, but that makes sense, See pretty much any writeup of Sundabar, the guilds section of Waterdeep: City of Splendors, the main plotline of Baldur's Gate, probably a bunch of other things I've forgotten right now. Dwarves Deep, maybe? The metals section of Volo's Guide to All Things Magical. -Infrastructure does advance in the Forgotten Realms. Compare Blackstaff and Blackstaff Tower's depictions of Waterdeep; gutters are noted in the Adventurer's Quarter in Waterdeep: City of Splendors, not sure what you mean by rounded streets but those exist; chain-tension bridges exist (see Power of Faerun); for discussions of wall insulation and design (as well as water filtration) see Elminster's Forgotten Realms. Magic applied to warfare: the War Wizards, Force Grey, etc. See the Cormyr Trilogy and Elminster's Daughter. Magic applied to social control: See Skullport, the writeup of Oryndoll in Drizzt Do'Urden's Guide to the Underdark, Ruins of Zhentil Keep and Lords of Darkness (3e). Magic applied to technological advancement: the aforementioned introduction of smokepowder to Lantan by Gond, also a lot of current clack entries (the Forgotten Realms Campaign Set, Waterdeep: City of Splendors, Drizzt Do'Urden's Guide to the Underdark) Magic applied to spell advancement: Pretty much the entire story of Netheril's fall. That also explains how it's been stagnant since then; for details on how magical research works since then see The Temptation of Elminster and Volo's Guide to All Things Magical. Waterdeep and Cormyr don't use magics like that because various deities don't believe in that sort of thing. See Mystra's writeup in Faiths and Avatars and Secrets of the Magister; abuse of magic is a very bad thing in the Forgotten Realms (and see Silverfall for how that abuse is policed.) Oh, and they do know about human rights - see the discussion of the Open Lord of Waterdeep in various supplements, as well as much of Khelben's work in Blackstaff. For Cormyr, Vangerdahast grapples with much of the same in Elminster's Daughter (and Alusair and Azoun IV the same in Death of a Dragon.) The "tyranny of good" is publicly known at this point to be a consequence of the editorial policies in place during much of 2e stating that evil could "never win;" it's not a failing of the setting or the writers so much as BADD and Lorraine Williams.
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May 15, 2014 12:02
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Christ do I hate Forgotten Realms
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May 15, 2014 12:21
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I love that, to see all these points, you're dropping three digits worth of cash in Forgotten Realms supplements. Because that's something everyone is just poised to do, if only there were a good reason to elevate it beyond the impulse buy.
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May 15, 2014 13:47
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Elminster.
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May 15, 2014 13:58
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What are you expecting besides a bunch of citations when someone provides an itemized list of changes they say they've never seen in a twenty-five year old gaming line? I mean you don't need to buy all of that for your game, or any given one game - it adds a lot to the narrative, but it's definitely not required. Sorry for citing a lot of books when asked to survey the entire publishing history of the FR, I guess?
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May 15, 2014 14:01
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It's only an amusing observation. Made all the more amusing by the fact that you weren't asked! You just jumped in, citations at the ready, to make sure not an untrue thing was said about The Forgotten Realms. Most people don't put that much effort into explaining actually interesting settings. It's cool.
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May 15, 2014 14:10
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But that's why I did it! It is an interesting setting!
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May 15, 2014 14:14
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Arivia posted:But that's why I did it! It is an interesting setting! Then why is it Forgotten?
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May 15, 2014 14:15
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So my Paladin and Cleric were fighting Zombie Loch Ness Monster. The day before, The Cleric had successfully resurrected a couple of the NPCs, but it took a lot out of her. They were accompanied by four city guards and an additional Paladin. To start off the battle, one of the guards was chomped on by Nessie and dragged into the water, so they're down to 3 NPCs. One of Nessie's special attacks is a breath weapon that's the equivalent to cloud kill. Surprisingly, everyone makes their fort save and survive. One guy gets dropped, but it was so close that we house ruled it that he was knocked unconscious. That leaves the NPC Paladin, the two other guards and my PCs. Another of Nessie's special attacks is to cast the Fear spell. The two remaining city guards - the ones the cleric had resurrected yesterday - fail their will saves, panic and run right into the toxic cloud which proceeds to instantly kill them. Cleric: "Oh goddamnit, are you kidding me?!" She was pissed for the rest of the game.
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May 15, 2014 14:17
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darth cookie posted:Then why is it Forgotten? Here's the answer from this month's chat thread: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3630400&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=1#post429039381
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May 15, 2014 14:18
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Arivia posted:Here's the answer from this month's chat thread: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3630400&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=1#post429039381 Yeah I don't actually care about the lore of the setting. I was making a half assed joke about the setting being so arcane and undesirable that people deliberately forgot about it. It failed. My bad. Move along citizen.
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May 15, 2014 14:28
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I remember firearms being addressed once or twice in earlier edition corebooks-- I think the 2E DMG and the D&D Companion Set. There were frank admissions that, while the Known World and the 'stock' 2E gear lists assumed a roughly Renaissance level of social and technological development, firearms and explosives might have a deleterious effect on the kind of sword, board and fireball adventuring they were designing for. There were also the perennial arguments over how much damage a bullet did compared to a sword, and what exactly was a hit point, anyway. An Immortals-level adventure that went to modern Earth even stated that while you could import the stuff (military rifles did something like 5d6 damage a shot) it was absurdly unstable under the physical laws that 99% of the D&D cosmology operated within. And that was cool, that was fine-- there's a flavour the designers want to preserve, all kinds of questions and issues that might erupt if gunpowder was developed, we can play 'let's pretend' without guns. I think though, over time, it became an odd kind of gospel. Flintlocks and starwheels showed up in Mystara and Spelljammer, encumbered by clunky mechanics and anxious reiterations that they were completely optional, and over time that aversion became reflexive. I've caught myself rolling my eyes and grogging over Pathfinder or Fantasycraft having firearms, even though they're not written with intent that only swords and arrows need apply. It's something I grew up gaming with, and it's a bitch to shake it. Settings that have reasons for gunpowder or advanced weapons never being developed can be amusing. The Known World kind of short-circuited the whole thing, and I think was retconned with the D&D Cyclopedia. A friend claims the Kara-Tur boxed set says nothing high-tech functions planetside. Not that gunpowder is, but I guess someone was anxious about BD&D's sci-fi goofiness crossing over. GURPS Fantasy (Banestorm now, I think) had cabals of wizards dedicated to eradicating the knowledge of gunpowder and weapons more advanced than the crossbow, because that kind of firepower was their meal ticket, and no jerk from Earth or bored alchemist mixing poop was going to take that away from them. 7th Sea had guns, but not rifling, because the person who discovered it was so horrified by the implications for warfare that they've been trying to keep it buried since.
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May 15, 2014 15:23
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Arivia posted:D&D isn't really high fantasy normally, or even very fantastic. D&D is pretty mundane, really. And I think your two statements sort of go together - there's absolutely no reason why guns can't fit into D&D, but a reductive view of that is exactly why Eberron is appealing. It isn't necessarily "the best," but it does allow you to break out of the boundaries you've set for yourself. Guns would fit very well into Eberron (think of Cannith Wand Adepts.) The question is, why don't you use them? If you're getting stuck on guns not being right for D&D but dragons and warforged are, the issue is probably with you. ...Yes it is? I mean, we may be using different definitions of High Fantasy, but D&D definitely fits. I don't know where you're from, but dragons and elves and magic aren't really mundane to me. It's kind of the definition of fantasy. Arivia posted:D&D isn't really high fantasy normally, or even very fantastic. D&D is pretty mundane, really. And I think your two statements sort of go together - there's absolutely no reason why guns can't fit into D&D, but a reductive view of that is exactly why Eberron is appealing. It isn't necessarily "the best," but it does allow you to break out of the boundaries you've set for yourself. And as for "No guns in D&D", like I said, IMO magic takes the place of guns, both in and out of character, if you will. Again, this is assuming the standard sort of Hundred Years War tech level*. If you want guns in your D&D games, I'm not going to tell you to stop, it's just not what I prefer. I mean if they fit into the setting then sure, in modern-set games I'll sperg about guns all day. Arivia posted:Guns would fit very well into Eberron (think of Cannith Wand Adepts.) I don't think they would, because things like readily available wands would render them pointless. Why make a matchlock musket when you can have a wand of Magic Missile, which always hits, and won't misfire or blow up? Why bother with a cannon when you can use a scroll of Fireball, which won't blow you up and will probably be more effective than any primitive cannon anyways. And why would House Cannith, or any of the others, make something that they can't monopolize? Guns aren't magitech, so any old artificer would make the, dragon mark of not. That's not the kind of thing the houses want. Arivia posted:The question is, why don't you use them? If you're getting stuck on guns not being right for D&D but dragons and warforged are, the issue is probably with you. In traditional settings (IE high fantasy or sword and sandal type of stuff), I feel they're out of place technology wise. In Eberron, I fell like they're not really needed, wands and magitech devices take their place. In a more renaissance-y game, then I absolutely would include guns. And I 'm not exactly sure what you're trying to get at with that last part. *Yes I know that the British used some primitive cannons at Crecy. That's beside the point.
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May 15, 2014 15:54
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This gun talk is pretty interesting, because I have an idea for a campaign that was originally based on generic D&D trappings, where dragons rule the world, and the players along the campaign help develop stable firearms which finally give the humanoid races a way to fight off their oppressors, which are generally resistant to magic and such. I guess if D&D is so adverse to guns I could just switch it to some other system. It's only out in a really basic form so I can still make drastic changes like that.
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May 15, 2014 15:55
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D&D isn't particularly resistant to it, but D&D players often are.
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May 15, 2014 16:00
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Mehuyael posted:This gun talk is pretty interesting, because I have an idea for a campaign that was originally based on generic D&D trappings, where dragons rule the world, and the players along the campaign help develop stable firearms which finally give the humanoid races a way to fight off their oppressors, which are generally resistant to magic and such. See that sounds cool to me, and I would say go for it. The only thing I'm objecting to is dropping guns into a Conan or Lord of the Rings style fantasy world without any real explanation for it. But your idea sounds like a good way of introducing them. Not that some random goon's approval means much.
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May 15, 2014 16:12
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That's good to know, but the discussion did make me decide to look around at other game worlds to see which one seems the most fit for my idea. It means more work, but I think it'll be for the better in the end.
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May 15, 2014 16:17
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Ravenloft is a setting where guns work better for it as it's more low-fantasy/gothic horror (and one domain pretty much is "kills magic through sure staggering power of collective disbelief"), partly because "Kill a werewolf with a silver bullet" is an accepted trope in the genre. But rules for guns just aren't that great in D&D over all. However I know Ravenloft is definitely no everyone's cup of tea.
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May 15, 2014 16:41
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"D&D plus guns and the beginnings of the Industrial Revolution" is basically the setting of Warmachine and it seems to work out all right.
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May 15, 2014 16:47
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4e is fine with guns! Just reskin your ranged weapons and/or powers. Dragonbreath? Nah. That's my SHOTGUN.
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May 15, 2014 16:54
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We've done it before, just turn crossbows into guns. Bows turn into their more modern counterparts like compound bows.
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May 15, 2014 17:10
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The 4e campaign that I played last did just that, and it worked fine. Having said that, 4e is much more explicit in it's gamey-ness, and it's easier to swallow 'this game has these rules for X' over 'these rules attempt to model firearms', which older editions seem to be prone to. e: I read... Mehuyael posted:This gun talk is pretty interesting, because I have an idea for a campaign... petrol blue fucked around with this message at 20:56 on May 15, 2014 |
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May 15, 2014 20:53
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petrol blue posted:The 4e campaign that I played last did just that, and it worked fine. Having said that, 4e is much more explicit in it's gamey-ness, and it's easier to swallow 'this game has these rules for X' over 'these rules attempt to model firearms', which older editions seem to be prone to. I'll take a look at'em, thanks for the suggestions. 
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May 15, 2014 20:58
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Mehuyael posted:I'll take a look at'em, thanks for the suggestions. Yeah, if you're not familiar with FATE or Dungeon World (Or Apocalypse World) and other 'Powered by the Apocalypse' engine games, you should definitely do that. They are good systems which are more concerned with story than modelling anything realistic.
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May 15, 2014 21:18
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| # ? May 14, 2024 02:00 |
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Warhammer Fantasy includes gunpowder weapons alongside bows and magic quite well. In support of some people's arguments, the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay setting makes magic unreliable and dangerous, so Empire folk would much rather develop solid dwarf-engineered muskets than have any truck with magical items. Especially as you would probably end up exploding or summoning daemons or elves or something if you even looked at it the wrong way, Sigmar preserve us.
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May 15, 2014 23:36
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