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fatherdog posted:A European fighter that's lost to every good grappler he's ever fought gets submitted by a guy from a weight class above him? Clearly the only possible scenario that makes sense is a dive this is my immediate reaction but Askren claimed it was a work as soon as it was announced
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May 18, 2014 22:57
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fatherdog posted:A European fighter that's lost to every good grappler he's ever fought gets submitted by a guy from a weight class above him? Clearly the only possible scenario that makes sense is a dive While I find the former perfectly believable, I find the latter just as much.
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May 18, 2014 23:05
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vainman posted:I could easily believe Bellator would pay someone to take a dive if they thought it would help build another ppv yeah me too. I don't think Tito is incapable of submitting Schlemenko so I'm joking when I call it a work, but I don't think Bellator is above paying for it either.
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May 18, 2014 23:09
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Would it being proven as a work (not saying it is, haven't seen it) be a death blow for bellator though? What would an athletic commissions response be? Fines? Refusal of license? Seems to be an incredibly high risk strategy.
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May 18, 2014 23:12
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If Bellator was into fixing fights Mo wouldn't have lost to Newton twice.
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May 18, 2014 23:28
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There was no down side to that fight: Smeko wins, and it shows how great their middleweight is, and Tito can say he only loses to champions. Tito wins, Tito is back! and Smeko only lost that fight because of size difference. No reason to make it a work.
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May 18, 2014 23:45
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It being a work is so stupid that I find it believable for Bellator
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May 18, 2014 23:50
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I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but the fight was fishy as gently caress. I was not hallucinating when I saw Tito whisper in Shlemenko's ear right before a suspect looking submission finish. People are saying well why would they do that it would hurt Shlemenko's "name value". Guess what, Tito Ortiz is sadly still a bigger name yet he is pretty much incapable of getting a legitimate win on his record at this point if it's not against a complete can. If Bellator want to use him more than once, which is for certain, they need to act like he can still win and that this is "the new motivated Tito". Beating a champ gets people talking. So, he conveniently beats said champ after going 1-1-7 in his past 9 fights. As for Shlemenko, he still has the belt and can claim that going up in weight was a bad idea and it doesn't take much away from him. I know shouting "dive!" looks stupid on the face of it, but I wouldn't put it past Bjorn Fuckin Rebney to do it. I literally watched a TNA wrestler whisper into a dudes ear, lock up a fishy looking sub with very little resistance on a man sponsored by his own clothing company, then cut a Hulk Hogan promo in ring. On top of that I was later treated to Rampage Jackson winning a complete robbery of a decision on Rampage day in Memphis. Add to that Askren and Snowden calling for a dive before the event (though that could be attributed to sour grapes and a dumb man worth ignoring who says stuff for attention respectively) and I can't look at that fight and think, yea that totally looks 100% on the level. At the time I had only heard about the Snowden tweet and thought "he's bullshitting" but then the fight was so loving weird I actually had to rethink it. Basically it could've been real but I certainly think it could've been a work as well; It's Bellator. For the record this is the first Bellator fight I've watched that I've ever questioned the legitimacy of (judging and matchmaking is another story). I tried to track down the .gif of the whisper, but since nobody watched the card I've turned up empty handed so far. Seltzer fucked around with this message at 00:01 on May 19, 2014 |
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May 18, 2014 23:55
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Triticum Guzzler posted:this is my immediate reaction but Askren claimed it was a work as soon as it was announced yeah but askren thought tito was going to take a dive. if it was a work, it was an incredibly short-sighted one. shlemenko is basically the only "name" fighter outside of the lightweight division that bellator can claim any credit in developing, it's real dumb to feed him to a 40-year-old man who's all dick and no back
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May 18, 2014 23:56
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wait, i forgot about joe warren. rino sports would be nothing without him
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May 19, 2014 00:02
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Food Court Druid posted:If Bellator was into fixing fights Mo wouldn't have lost to Newton twice. Nah the angle in that was having Mo fight Newton for an interim title when Attila Vegh was willing to defend the real title. All I'm saying is look at Bjorn Rebney. If you can look at that face and believe he won't do the scummiest poo poo possible then I dunno what to tell you reeg posted:yeah but askren thought tito was going to take a dive. if it was a work, it was an incredibly short-sighted one. shlemenko is basically the only "name" fighter outside of the lightweight division that bellator can claim any credit in developing, it's real dumb to feed him to a 40-year-old man who's all dick and no back It's also real dumb to have that same 40 year old headline your first PPV and cross promote in a pro wrestling show but they tried pulling that one off too
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May 19, 2014 00:04
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Bubba Smith posted:All I'm saying is look at Bjorn Rebney. If you can look at that face and believe he won't do the scummiest poo poo possible then I dunno what to tell you I get the same feeling looking at Dana White too. Combat sport promoters are the scummiest. The willingness to do or say whatever it takes to get you to give them your money.
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May 19, 2014 00:15
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If Bellator was gonna fix Schlemenko/Tito, the smart thing to do would be to fix it so Schlemenko wins. Realistically Tito is 40 years old and falling apart; the main value of him is adding his name to the records of guys who are going to be (hopefully) staying with your company longer and raising their profile. Of course, just because something is incredibly stupid doesn't mean they didn't do it. This is, after all, Bellator.
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May 19, 2014 00:19
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If I was taking a dive I think I would probably elect to tap rather than going unconscious.
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May 19, 2014 00:30
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Tito whispering something is clear evidence of the fight being fixed, as never in the history of MMA have fighters done things like talk to their opponent to taunt or further demoralize and frustrate them. It is an unspoken rule, you let your fists and feet do the talking when you Stand And Bang like a Warrior (that's Bellator in English)
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May 19, 2014 00:34
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Labored Wooting posted:If I was taking a dive I think I would probably elect to tap rather than going unconscious. nah that's how you keep your dignity, at least a little of it
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May 19, 2014 00:39
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It's also not very hard to fake going unconscious, or to fake a submission hold. Unless you're John Cena. And it makes total sense to fix it in favor of Tito over Shlemenko. While it does make the middleweight division look like poo poo, Tito is a much bigger name and his fight with Rampage is going to do the most business that Bellator could possibly manage. Yes it fucks up their credibility but Bellator's not in the business of making credible fights, Bellator is in the business of (attempting to) make money. And hell they even did a hard sell of how out-sized Shlemenko was to drive home the point that hey if he does lose, it's because this isn't really a fair fight. e: ultimately, fixed or not fixed, that fight was stupid through and through, from announcement to Tito's promo, that poo poo was dumb.
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May 19, 2014 00:49
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fatherdog posted:A European fighter that's lost to every good grappler he's ever fought gets submitted by a guy from a weight class above him? Clearly the only possible scenario that makes sense is a dive That's what I assumed, but this thread lead me to assume it looked fishy.
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May 19, 2014 00:59
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regardless of a fix actually happening, when was the last time a fix was even alleged (japanese owned companies excluded)
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May 19, 2014 01:25
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that Ebersole fight in Ohio or whatever
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May 19, 2014 01:47
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maffew buildings posted:that Ebersole fight in Ohio or whatever Wasn't it Shannon Ritch and they alleged he took a dive?
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May 19, 2014 01:51
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i don't remember the exact details but ebersole did a spinning cartwheel chi blast attack and the commission rightly settled on 'nothing ridiculous ever happens in MMA, fight's a work'
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May 19, 2014 02:07
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Ebersole was so awesome once upon a time.
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May 19, 2014 02:23
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Ninja PD posted:Ebersole was so awesome once upon a time. Still is. He's 4-2 in the UFC. The James Head fight was weird and boring, and Story proved he can't compete with a real athlete, but he'll probably still be able to beat up random TUF Brasil guys with no problem.
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May 19, 2014 02:30
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"I just think god put me on this earth as a tool. Im not really a religious person but i believe that being a tool, is showing people that you can achieve stuff when you set your mind to things, that it cannot be accomplished. I have done these things. And I just look at it. This fight was already won before. Shlemenko even called me out. This was what was supposed to happen. All this we're living right now, is all pre played out. And I'm just livin' it the way it should be done." - Tito Ortiz, tool.
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May 19, 2014 05:40
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I must say I am surprised the fight fixing discussion ended up being about Tito rather than Rampage after I saw the reaction to the judges scores. Well, from the people who were still awake.
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May 19, 2014 06:06
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Mo vs Page was a bad fight and although I had it scored for King Mo it's not inconceivable to think the judges awarded whiffing punches and a swollen eye over takedowns and not much else.
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May 19, 2014 06:16
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@StephanBonnar Let's see if @TitoOrtiz can do that to me. He knows his only hope is to hold me down for dear life. #illwhoophisass #titoaintshit Stephan Bonnar's relationship with the UFC must be bad if he is willing to take a fight with Tito.
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May 19, 2014 07:47
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I don't think this is an indication of a bad UFC relationship as much as he wants to go beat up Tito, a thing I very much doubt Dana White would have a problem with
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May 19, 2014 09:28
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even Dana White wanted to beat up Tito but his drat equilibrium went out. Tito is a punk rear end bitch who had to fight a guy going up a weight class on short notice to win.
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May 19, 2014 15:11
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Fozzy The Bear posted:@StephanBonnar Bonnar had a cushy post fighting UFC job lined up then blew up when he juiced to fight Anderson. I'd wager Dana still likes the guy, but the juicing incident most likely ruined his chances for further opportunities in the UFC. Picking up some nice cash to beat up Tito isn't a bad option.
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May 19, 2014 18:00
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http://www.mmafighting.com/2014/5/19/5732116/rampage-jackson-fined-10000-for-shoving-mo-lawal-at-bellator-120quote:When the two were placed face-to-face, Quinton Jackson's shove of Muhammed Lawal at the weigh-ins for Bellator 120 on Friday may have hyped the crowd and been done for dramatic flair. However, the incident cost Jackson $10,000 and nearly cost him his chance to compete on the card. 
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May 19, 2014 23:08
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Panama Red posted:http://www.mmafighting.com/2014/5/19/5732116/rampage-jackson-fined-10000-for-shoving-mo-lawal-at-bellator-120 Thanks MLB threads, I expected the fan falling out of the stands to follow the shove, then the dinger machine and yankeefan.gif.
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May 19, 2014 23:16
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newsflash: Bellator treats their fighters like poo pooBloody Elbow posted:I have been given an opportunity to examine several Bellator promotional contracts and have spoken to several different managers and agents who represent fighters signed to the promotion, each of whom independently verified the details. I have also conferred with several attorneys and law professors, taking advantage of their expert opinions. Bellator: By Far the loving Worst
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May 20, 2014 17:16
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Trying out for TUF two weight classes above your normal competition weight is now an easier way to get into the UFC than signing your indentured servitude papers at Bellator.
Seltzer fucked around with this message at 17:31 on May 20, 2014 |
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May 20, 2014 17:23
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Rampage is ready to step up to steeper competition by wanting to fight James Toney and Darrill Schoonover. http://mmamayhemradio.com/2014/05/bellator-120-interview-with-rampage-jackson-calls-out-james-toney-and-titties-darrill-schoonover/ Aka "I need easy to win fights where I can get paid and not cut weight".
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May 20, 2014 17:29
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any word on the PPV numbers other than LOL?
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May 20, 2014 17:58
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coconono posted:any word on the PPV numbers other than LOL? I saw two dubious sources say ~50k as an early estimate, but I wouldn't trust that this early.
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May 20, 2014 18:10
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SAVE_US.CHR
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All you need to know about anybody giving numbers on this show is that the following monday after the PPV, Dave Meltzer himself wrote an article about what would be considered a good number with absolutely no indication what kind of business it did whatsoever
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May 20, 2014 18:25
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Nothing officialcoconono posted:any word on the PPV numbers other than LOL? Haven't seen anything official, just a lot of "educated" guesses in the 50k range. That probably wouldn't even cover Chandler's pay, far less Tito, Mo and Rampage. And the advertising. And the production costs. Then again, I'm sure Bjorn made a fat wad from the bookies on the Tito fight.
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May 20, 2014 18:38
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