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I didn't notice on first watch through these episodes because I watch them as they air without subtitles, but after watching the crunchyroll casts -- These subtitles are horrible. Like... blatantly not what is being said. For example, when Joe walked into the gym in episode 6, The subtitles read "Is everyone here?" When he actually is saying "You ordered them, did you?" in reference to the captain talking about ordering the ping pong balls. There's another moment where Smile replies to the coach later "Are you saying I'm selfish?" when in japanese he's actually saying "Do you think I'm arrogant?" I never noticed before but drat these subs are kind of wack. There's also a bunch of quirks with Dragon's dialogue in the bath, where it breaks the sentence at odd places. The subs read something like "Heroes aren't real, only reality is real... [etc]" Whereas in Japanese he just says "Heroes aren't real and people who can't deal with that reality don't deserve to play." I've seen the subs for some of the earlier episodes and I never noticed it being this weird, so the translators must have been really out of it on ep. 6.
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May 23, 2014 08:17
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Butt Frosted Cake posted:Peco's mom looking exactly like him was the best part of the episode and the engrish was great as always. Maybe just maybe Peco's Mum is a hermaphrodite.
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May 23, 2014 14:58
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laplace posted:I didn't notice on first watch through these episodes because I watch them as they air without subtitles, but after watching the crunchyroll casts -- These subtitles are horrible. Like... blatantly not what is being said. Well, that's crunchyroll for you, right?
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May 23, 2014 18:20
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Funimation has the rights for Ping Pong, actually, not Crunchyroll.
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May 23, 2014 18:22
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glomkettle posted:Funimation has the rights for Ping Pong, actually, not Crunchyroll.
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May 23, 2014 18:52
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absolem posted:wow, I didn't know anyone didn't like the art to the tatami galaxy or kaiba Considering how bizarre a style it is, in both art and animation, I can see why someone would be put off by it.
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May 23, 2014 19:14
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Aleksei Vasiliev posted:Crunchyroll has the rights to Ping Pong in a few European areas and subs it in English there. I was not aware of that. Do we know if the subs are significantly different? Or is that something you can't really test without resorting to piracy?
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May 23, 2014 22:02
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ViggyNash posted:Considering how bizarre a style it is, in both art and animation, I can see why someone would be put off by it. I could maybe see that with Kaiba or Mind Game, but Tatami Galaxy? The idea of someone preferring generic anime art over that is pretty baffling, though the guy did say that he knows his taste is bad.
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May 24, 2014 00:38
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I'm not sure who does the subbing, or what gets priority or anything like that. Just that the subs were off really weirdly for episode 6. Episode 7 was fine.
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May 24, 2014 03:20
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I actually miss Peco's shaggy hair. He pulled the look off well.
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May 24, 2014 18:16
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There's some sort of Ping Pong production exhibition on today so here's some shots of the production material! https://twitter.com/honnyaku_blog/status/470387822138896385/photo/1 Ohira's OP storyboard. You can only see some of it in the background but it looks pretty detailed. https://twitter.com/honnyaku_blog/status/470395056944214017/photo/1 For contrast? Yuasa's storyboard from an episode. He was cranking these out 10 days per episode in a real rush, so there's basically minimal detail in the drawing. The notes are important, but this really shows he trusts his staff to get things done without extremely detailed storyboarding.
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May 25, 2014 04:21
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Great show. Lot's of characters but never feels forced or stuffed.
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May 28, 2014 05:37
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Ytlaya posted:I could maybe see that with Kaiba or Mind Game, but Tatami Galaxy? The idea of someone preferring generic anime art over that is pretty baffling, though the guy did say that he knows his taste is bad. It was the same poo poo with Flowers of Evil. Most regular anime fans find generic cookie-cutter anime art style to be "clean" or "pure" looking and it drives them out of their comfort zone to engage with a unique, artistic, or unorthodox style. It's a really unfortunate trend but most anime people really aren't paragons of taste in general so it's not that surprising either.
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May 29, 2014 01:30
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Callick posted:It was the same poo poo with Flowers of Evil. Most regular anime fans find generic cookie-cutter anime art style to be "clean" or "pure" looking and it drives them out of their comfort zone to engage with a unique, artistic, or unorthodox style. It's a really unfortunate trend but most anime people really aren't paragons of taste in general so it's not that surprising either. The scary thing is that all of Yuasa's art is extremely technically good. Compare this to Angel Beats or Clannad, which has incredibly inconsistent anatomy and character design that borders on almost offensively gender dimorphic non-humanoids. People eat that instagram filtered garbage up for some reason and yet Yuasa's art is "bad". Anime fans.  Edit: I say Yuasa's art but I guess I should say his art direction/animation direction, considering how it's not just his own art in his shows, but still. Kaiba is about the closest we get to that, other than the Wakfu special, but then again Choi directed that and Mihara did a lot of actual animation for it so they shine through real hard. laplace fucked around with this message at 09:57 on May 29, 2014 |
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May 29, 2014 09:51
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China is in hell, his hell is always being beaten at Ping Pong and prevented from returning home.
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May 29, 2014 19:28
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Oh man. They couldn't have let Kong have even one game in the match? The guy deserves better than that. 
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May 29, 2014 22:16
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Callick posted:It was the same poo poo with Flowers of Evil. Most regular anime fans find generic cookie-cutter anime art style to be "clean" or "pure" looking and it drives them out of their comfort zone to engage with a unique, artistic, or unorthodox style. It's a really unfortunate trend but most anime people really aren't paragons of taste in general so it's not that surprising either. First, most everyone likes bland cookie cutter poo poo more. Second, I don't think that Aku no Hana's anime had good art. It was terribly inconsistent, didn't convey emotion well, and wasn't aesthetically pleasing. Really, I think it discredits kaiba/tatami galaxy/etc to compare them to Aku no Hana's anime. I don't think its the same issue at all absolem fucked around with this message at 22:40 on May 29, 2014 |
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May 29, 2014 22:38
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Aku no Hana did a great job of conveying emotion, it's just that the only emotions conveyed are awkward longing and sheer terror.
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May 29, 2014 22:51
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So it was true to that part of the manga.Autonomous Monster posted:Oh man. They couldn't have let Kong have even one game in the match? The guy deserves better than that. His existence is to constantly be jobbed. Its uncanny how accurate his first speech was. Cao Ni Ma fucked around with this message at 23:46 on May 29, 2014 |
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May 29, 2014 23:42
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e-Quote not edit.
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May 29, 2014 23:43
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poor kong, shame he had to lose Great episode, loved the reaction montage from when they entered the gym.
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May 29, 2014 23:46
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Aku no Hana was awesome and super visually interesting  . That show is perfectly directed for its insane atmosphere.With the finale coming up I'm curious how the pacing is going to hold up. There is still enough content to play out that it could fall both ways, but Yuasa has been really good at maintaining pacing even amongst his additions that I'm not too worried about it.
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May 30, 2014 01:50
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Wenge, no  A Smile and Peco showdown for the final with Smile throwing the match because of Peco's dreams, his knee, and the fact that Smile doesn't really give a poo poo seems a little too obvious. I just hope Kazama and Wenge do okay at whatever they end up doing if that ends up being the case.  I also hope Akuma doesn't up and vanish now that he's not playing any more.
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May 30, 2014 01:57
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Of all the character development in the show so far, my favorite is Wenge and his team. They're just  as gently caress.
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May 30, 2014 07:45
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Wenge's my favourite character in this as well. I like Akuma a lot too, the way he handled his match with Smile and the aftermath were great. It's an anime about Ping Pong so it's very nice to have characters who do end up treating it as just a game.
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May 30, 2014 09:55
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absolem posted:First, most everyone likes bland cookie cutter poo poo more. Second, I don't think that Aku no Hana's anime had good art. It was terribly inconsistent, didn't convey emotion well, and wasn't aesthetically pleasing. Really, I think it discredits kaiba/tatami galaxy/etc to compare them to Aku no Hana's anime. I don't think its the same issue at all First, that's exactly what I was saying. You're reinforcing my point. People like boring, dull cookie-cutter poo poo because they are dull, boring cookie-cutter people with low level taste that doesn't extend beyond a basic appreciation for something looking like regular anime. Second, I think Aku no Hana's anime had excellent art. It was extremely consistent, conveyed emotion and poignancy very well, and was hugely pleasing to my aesthetic sense. Really, I think it discredits both Yuasa's body of work and the team that produced the AnH anime to not think of them as bold contemporaries in the world of unique, artistic anime production that pushes boundaries and challenges what the common person's perception of what "anime" actually is. I think it is the exact same issue. Much like how a lot of what constitutes modern humor is merely referencing something else with no actual joke setup or punchline, I think that many anime fans simply go down a checklist of tropes and standards when watching a new show to decide if it's "good" or not. Clean, normal looking art style with your average character archetypes and same old setting and story? Good enough, for most people.
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May 31, 2014 01:52
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laplace posted:The scary thing is that all of Yuasa's art is extremely technically good. Compare this to Angel Beats or Clannad, which has incredibly inconsistent anatomy and character design that borders on almost offensively gender dimorphic non-humanoids. People eat that instagram filtered garbage up for some reason and yet Yuasa's art is "bad". Callick posted:First, that's exactly what I was saying. You're reinforcing my point. People like boring, dull cookie-cutter poo poo because they are dull, boring cookie-cutter people with low level taste that doesn't extend beyond a basic appreciation for something looking like regular anime. Second, I think Aku no Hana's anime had excellent art. It was extremely consistent, conveyed emotion and poignancy very well, and was hugely pleasing to my aesthetic sense. Really, I think it discredits both Yuasa's body of work and the team that produced the AnH anime to not think of them as bold contemporaries in the world of unique, artistic anime production that pushes boundaries and challenges what the common person's perception of what "anime" actually is. I think it is the exact same issue. I wish there was more different looking animation too. It bothers me that that the biggest forces in animation, Disney and Pixar, also make the most generic looking stuff. But just because most people prefer refinement over innovation doesn't make them subhuman you gigantic loving baby.
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May 31, 2014 11:25
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Ok nerd, you don't have to get so defensive.
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May 31, 2014 18:58
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Things looking cool is better than things looking like nerd garbage IMO.
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May 31, 2014 18:59
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Heck, a lot of the Aku no Hana/Flowers of Evil backlash was because there was a manga and thus people expected the characters to look a certain way. I love the hell out of that adaption, but I think if there was no manga it would just be something that most people would shrug and ignore instead of going out of their way to bitch about it. (Tho a lot of the hostility was definitely a knee-jerk reaction based on a few frames that didn't look good in still shots)
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May 31, 2014 19:06
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Mercrom posted:Calling generic art "instagram filtered" is the most hipster thing I've read in a while. What do you mean by "technically good" anyway? Yuasa's art and his team's art have a very strong sense of consistency and direction. While it is easy to tell when scenes or episodes are animated by different people in Yuasa anime, the art itself and its construction still maintains itself. Also, Yuasa has a very strong grasp for actual scene placement and cinematography, which most anime art does not. You can be not into its aesthetics it from a personal standpoint all you want but pretty much all Yuasa anime has been super well produced consistent fundamental-focused stuff. Yuasa characters have defined shapes and bodies, with an actual focus on their anatomy and how their bodies would work even under stylization. I'm not singling out Angel Beats for being generic, I'm singling it out for being a very popular show that has really confused art direction in that regard, where the characters anatomies aren't even consistent between character to character. The reason why Aku no Hana was interesting was that unlike things like Kids on the Slope, it actually utilized its rotoscoping as part of its overall direction and tone. It was a specific choice that worked with its presentation instead of just being hastily utilized to add odd 'realism' to certain scenes. A lot of people didn't like the rotoscoping but it was a solid design choice to utilize it the way they did so its hard to fault them for that. Specifically when the rotoscoping itself was pretty good as far as rotoscoping standards go. Also, when I say Angel Beats is Instagram Filtered I actually mean that the show has a post processed filter over it. I am not being a hipster, it is just a fact that the show actually has a red to green filter over it that is extremely visible throughout the show. laplace fucked around with this message at 19:19 on May 31, 2014 |
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May 31, 2014 19:13
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Just watched the first 7 episodes today, and I really love it. I'm not used to the animation style, but right off the bat, I could see how well it fits. And that OP. The first black-and-white segment in there is probably the best animation sequence I've ever seen. And Wenge is probably my favorite, too. The scene when he gets the care package, and remembers leaving his mother, and then being back in the apartment with all that stuff, it just really shows loneliness really well. Plus the scenes with his mom and his team are the most adorable
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May 31, 2014 23:26
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laplace posted:Yuasa's art and his team's art have a very strong sense of consistency and direction. While it is easy to tell when scenes or episodes are animated by different people in Yuasa anime, the art itself and its construction still maintains itself. Also, Yuasa has a very strong grasp for actual scene placement and cinematography, which most anime art does not. You can be not into its aesthetics it from a personal standpoint all you want but pretty much all Yuasa anime has been super well produced consistent fundamental-focused stuff. Yuasa characters have defined shapes and bodies, with an actual focus on their anatomy and how their bodies would work even under stylization. I'm not singling out Angel Beats for being generic, I'm singling it out for being a very popular show that has really confused art direction in that regard, where the characters anatomies aren't even consistent between character to character. On the subjective stuff I agree with you since I think Ping Pong is the most well directed anime I've ever seen.
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Jun 1, 2014 08:52
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Mercrom posted:I haven't seen Angel Beats but the filter thing sounds terrible. Though having seen Tatami Galaxy and Ping Pong I don't see how Yuasa's stuff is more consistent or "technically" well made than what Kyoto Animation does. I'd say both those shows have way more conventual and realistic art styles though, and less of the Japanese stylization of which Clannad is pretty much the most extreme example. Well, there's a lot of good Kyoani stuff. Nichijou, for example, is super well animated and its art is "technically" strong. I guess the big sticking point with stuff like that is even under stylization you need to remain consistent, which is something that admittedly a lot of anime is bad at. Characters randomly changing heights, eyes moving around the face just because the art is lazy, mouths being in weird places even though the anatomy of the character in the art style would need it being elsewhere, stuff like that. There's more to it than that, specifically when you get into animation technicality (Stuff like hesitation, payoff, and weight motion) but yeah. It was sort of unfair to reference Angel Beats in that argument but it's a really good example of something that is relatively popular and sometimes lauded as being pretty/well animated when it is actually really marred in overall strength of its art and art direction. This isn't talking about stylization or whatever, Hyouka has moeblob rear end moeblob people and they still look great -- it's just the overall construction of characters and designs "underneath" those characters in things like Chaos;Head or Angel Beats that is problematic. That's where a lot of Yuasa stuff is excellent. Look at Kemonozume or even Tatami Galaxy, and even though their art styles and direction are "weird" or uncommon, you can actually tell that even under the stylization the characters have skeletons underneath their skin. Kemonozume is astonishing in that regard. Ping Pong is really good about that too, even if the art direction is pretty much "ape matsumoto taiyou's art". I have somewhat mixed feelings about Mind Game (probably my least favorite Yuasa work even though I like it a lot), which he did a similar thing for, which makes me kind of happy that Ping Pong has ended up as strong as it has. Anyway I guess the point of this whole tangent was Style =/= Technicality or Animation. You can animate stick figures extremely well if you want to, or even just white dots on a black background. Tokyo Loop has some interesting examples of that actually. So even if people don't like Yuasa's personal stylization it's really hard to criticize the actual fidelity of his ability to compose animation and "Art". Yuasa of course mostly being shorthand for his entire team but himself as well. Seriously Yuasa anime is some of the only anime where the mise-en-scene actually makes sense at all. So many anime are just bad at scene composition so it's really refreshing to see stuff like Mushishi and Ping Pong actually look like the directors know what they're doing.
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Jun 1, 2014 09:22
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What I use as shorthand for what you're talking about is overall production design. Being able to not just pick an appropriate style for the kind of story you wish to tell, but achieving that look consistently enough that there aren't those moments where the art failures take you out of the moment. KyoAni and Yuasa have very different stylization, but their fundamentals in timing, spacing, follow-through, etc. are strong. A lot of studios have used various AfterEffects techniques to cover up for their bad drawing or animation fundamentals, and unfortunately lots of people will fall for a gradient lighting effect/mask or diffuse glow or chromatic aberration.
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Jun 1, 2014 21:56
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Neeksy posted:A lot of studios have used various AfterEffects techniques to cover up for their bad drawing or animation fundamentals, and unfortunately lots of people will fall for a gradient lighting effect/mask or diffuse glow or chromatic aberration. I really, really hate those. It's the 21st century extension of the pan-over-static-image, digitally enhanced. Especially fake chromatic aberrations get overused in some shows. It's not something I want to see on my own photographs, and not something I want to see in my anime either.
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Jun 1, 2014 22:25
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Some anime I watched years ago had blurred borders. Every scene looked like a flashback. I can't find it, so I probably dropped it because of that bullshit.
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Jun 1, 2014 22:37
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Lurking Haro posted:Some anime I watched years ago had blurred borders. Every scene looked like a flashback. I can't find it, so I probably dropped it because of that bullshit. Boogiepop Phantom and Lain do this, but I actually think that Boogiepop makes it work. Anyway I wasn't singling out Kyoani as much as I was the specific production of Angel Beats for an example. I like Kyoani stuff and they have a lot of good stuff, I was just making a point with one of their more poorly animated series. I could have used Chaos;head or even Naruto or anything else. No hate to Kyoani at all.
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Jun 2, 2014 02:32
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laplace posted:Boogiepop Phantom and Lain do this, but I actually think that Boogiepop makes it work. It really doesn't. Boogiepop is practically unwatchable.
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Jun 2, 2014 02:41
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It really doesn't. Boogiepop is practically unwatchable. Boogiepop looks really weird because the grain on the video destroys its quality and any attempt to increase the quality/rip from higher res stuff has made it clear that it is an unsolveable issue. Boogiepop is strange but that show has decent writing and its visual design is at least a part of its atmosphere. It's been a while since I watched it, and I did so on a CRT TV so I definitely don't know how it'd look on a monitor. If any show is a product of its era it's Boogiepop, though. I have been meaning to rewatch it.
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Jun 2, 2014 03:01
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