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Now that the results are in from most of the countries, I'm very happy with the elections. Also the person I voted got through, which is always nice!
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May 26, 2014 11:00
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cebrail posted:drat that is a horrible article. Putting Greece and Italy(!) in the same category with France as countries whose governments were punished as if the PD was in any way comparable to the FN. And, as usual, seeing "populism" and anti-EU rhetoric as the only problem with the Front National or the UKIP. Yeah, in Italy the government party got a 42%, the highest consensus ever recorded for a center-left party. Hail your new socialist overlords, Europe!  More serious chat: ok, so now that we have more concrete numbers to crunch... I keep reading how the low turnout showed skepticism towards the EU. But I wonder, as long as EPP+S&D+ALDE+NGL hold a strong majority (~75%?) in the EP, how could the status quo change? It will, at the very least, remain the same - or am I misunderstanding something? I mean, if you really thought you wanted the Council/Commission/Parliament shut down, you should've voted for an antieuropean party. By not voting, aren't you stating "I don't care, do as you wish"? A bunch of countries shown consensus shifting towards isolationism, but it's not a stark majority in the whole Europe. ...so, what I'm saying is: I think that every country used these elections as exhaust vents for their national problems, but the scope was much wider than that and the consequences aren't going to be the expected ones. Where's the fault in my line of thought? edit: or the worry is actually about the position that the French population took? Since it's very likely that when France will be questioned on why they're treading the waters on keeping deficit within 3% of GDP, the French government will ask its people what they think about this aggression on their sovranity, and the EU project will be truly tested to its foundations? Char fucked around with this message at 11:20 on May 26, 2014 |
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May 26, 2014 11:04
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HUMAN FISH posted:Now that the results are in from most of the countries, I'm very happy with the elections. Also the person I voted got through, which is always nice! In what way exactly are you happy with the elections?
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May 26, 2014 11:12
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Well I guess if you're pinning for the coming of the Troisième Empire it's a pretty great result.
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May 26, 2014 11:13
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Postorder Trollet89 posted:Oh yes don't get me wrong. But 8/10 times anti immigration in scandinavia is related to percieved threats to the welfare system by cheap labour and increased unemployment. Then there is the legitimate racists who think muslims and blacks are inferior and don't belong here etc but they are a minority and overrepresentated by young males on the internet. Then theres always young people of my age, 25ish, who spend to much time on the internet looking up militant atheist stuff alongside Geert Wildeers and think they have an informed opinion and just take on islam. Check how many voted for Swedish Democrats (SD) in Almgården, which is the area right next to Rosengård, the most famous immigrant-rich area in Sweden. 40.6% for SD. That is an area consisting of traditionally Social democratic party voters. Another interesting statistic is seen for Sorsele (in the north and middle of nowhere), an area where SD had 1.1% 2009 and now 14.4%. Sorsele have had a large influx of Somalis, I believe. The rise of SD is mainly due to socialconservative voters from the Socialdemocrats and the Moderaterna (the Conservative party) putting immigration as a top priority and voting for the only party in favour of limited immigration. Calling them racists is missing the point, which is that they feel left out by the development in the society. Actually considering Swedens extremely generous immigration policy, it is surprising SD is not larger. The media situation in Sweden is hardly helping either, where 40% of the journalists vote for the Green Party and 20% for the formerly Communist party. A recent investigation showed that there had been no critical articles regarding the Green Party during the first part of the year, which is kinda interesting considering at least one member of the Green Party in Riksdagen believes in chem trails. Also the number of articles invoking Godwin's law is amazing. The Swedish Democrats will continue to grow as long as other parties and media do not take them seriously and starts taking steps to understand why people vote for them (hint: it is not racism). Polls on immigration says that 40% of all Swedes want to reduce immigration, a value that have been more or less constant the last 30 years. As an example, in Landskrona SD got 24% in 2006, mostly due to how the Socialdemocrats neglected issues concerning Kosovo-Albanians. A coalition of parties (excluding SD) ended up ruling the city and managed in some ways to deal with the various issues, and in the election 2010 the percentage for the Sweden democrats went down to ~15%.
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May 26, 2014 11:14
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Tevery Best posted:On 5 AM, the Polish electoral commission has released results from 91% of regional committees, and they seem to go slightly against what the exit polls anticipated. PiS is currently ahead, with about 1% advantage over PO. However, the remaining 9% of the committees are the largest ones, where the vote count takes the longest, i.e. mostly cities, where Kaczynski usually does worse. The results are still up in the air, and it'll be exciting to see who takes the cake in the end - even though there's little chance of either party gaining or losing any seats now, and they'll most likely both be at 19 MEPs, a victory for PiS now may be a shot in the arm for the party, but could also mobilize the supporters of the government to stop the "Kaczynski menace". I want the full results, this is just bullshit.
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May 26, 2014 11:18
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Positive turnouts I can tell from here: http://www.bbc.com/news/events/vote2014/eu-election-results Belgium: 90% Luxembourg: 85.5% Malta: 74.8% Greece: 59% Denmark: 56.3% Sweden: 51% Lol: Slovakia: 13.1% Czech Republic: 18.2% Croatia: 25.2%
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May 26, 2014 11:28
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Clearly mandatory voting is the way to go.Cardiac posted:Check how many voted for Swedish Democrats (SD) in Almgården, which is the area right next to Rosengård, the most famous immigrant-rich area in Sweden. Doesn't change the fact that they're conservative, xenophobic and religious nationalists. The racism some of their members exhibit is just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to lovely opinions within that party. They're anti-unions, pro-tax cuts, pro-increased prison sentences, anti-abortion, anti-HBTQ, pro-christianity and anti-immigration all at the same time. You're right in that they've only been growing because they've been cutting back on the racism but that doesn't change that they're awful. MiddleOne fucked around with this message at 11:40 on May 26, 2014 |
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May 26, 2014 11:31
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DarkCrawler posted:Positive turnouts I can tell from here: Belgium and Luxembourg have compulsory voting though. Pretty funny that 50% gets you into the top 6.
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May 26, 2014 11:33
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Results from France are almost there, just waiting for the Ile de France constituency to be complete now (they coupled it with the French abroad votes and those take forever to arrive, don't think it will change much.)
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May 26, 2014 11:44
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ANIME MONSTROSITY posted:I want the full results, this is just bullshit. Full results won't be announced til 18 this evening, but it looks like PiS won by about 1%. 
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May 26, 2014 11:47
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holy poo poo people actually voted for UKIP 
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May 26, 2014 12:06
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HUMAN FISH posted:Now that the results are in from most of the countries, I'm very happy with the elections. Also the person I voted got through, which is always nice! I'm incredibly unhappy because of this: gently caress. See that darkgrey blotch right over France? This is because Front National, the French fashists, have become the strongest party in the European elections. That's right, 25-26% of the French voters voted for Nazis. I guess this happens when normal people don't go to the election?  Man, the lucky thing is the European Union isn't exclusively French, or we would've been hosed twice over. But sending a couple dozen more Nazis into the European parliament doesn't help either. Thanks France! Libluini fucked around with this message at 12:17 on May 26, 2014 |
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May 26, 2014 12:12
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awesome-express posted:holy poo poo people actually voted for UKIP Yes, but on the other hand the BNP vote collapsed. Though apparently Griffin said, when asked if this was a rejection of his party's racist policies, Theyve voted for Ukips racist policies instead.
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May 26, 2014 12:13
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Can someone explain to me why the turnout was so high for Greece? Did not see that happening. I guess they don't hate *politicians*, just most of them?
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May 26, 2014 12:14
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http://elections.interieur.gouv.fr/ER2014/FE.html This is the people we're sending to Brussels. I'm sorry.
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May 26, 2014 12:16
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Libluini posted:I'm incredibly unhappy because of this: gently caress. I'll be honest here, i can't say if a country that gives nazis a majority is worse than one that grabs an EPP one. The first are just dumb fucks who want change, whichever way it is, the latter looked at the last few years and said "you know what? I think we should keep this path" The Front National won't really give a poo poo about austerity packages to southern Europe, they'll mostly just want to get away from the mess. In a way, they can become decent useful idiots.
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May 26, 2014 12:28
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Libluini posted:Man, the lucky thing is the European Union isn't exclusively French, or we would've been hosed twice over. But sending a couple dozen more Nazis into the European parliament doesn't help either. Thanks France! Hell, for all your Nazi fun Golden Dawn's getting MEPs. ufarn posted:Can someone explain to me why the turnout was so high for Greece? Did not see that happening. I guess they don't hate *politicians*, just most of them? The Euroelections were an opportunity to express discontent towards the government in a form that can't be easily ignored, so both the opposition and the government tried their best to polarise the electorate (plus the Euroelections happened in conjunction with municipal and prefectural elections). The result was that while SYRIZA came first and the government parties lost ~11% of their combined vote compared to 2012, they still add up to a higher % of the vote than SYRIZA so they're going to pretend everything's ok.
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May 26, 2014 12:28
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ufarn posted:Can someone explain to me why the turnout was so high for Greece? Did not see that happening. I guess they don't hate *politicians*, just most of them? Because the stakes were high and the opposition and the government agreed it was a sort of referendum on whether the government could continue ruling. Plus turnout in Greece is traditionally high. Also, no one hates politicians in general, people just hate politicians they don't vote for. Most people like the guys they vote for even if they say they are angry with politics/politicians/whatever.
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May 26, 2014 12:34
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Xoidanor posted:Clearly mandatory voting is the way to go. "Traditional Swedish Values". 
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May 26, 2014 12:46
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Is there any good overview over the different factions in the parliament and any news if and how the new parties will organize themselves. You can puzzle the list together from wikipedia, but with all these interactive maps, it would be nice to see how this election affects them and which parties were members of which factions over the years. I just heard on the news that the German AfD will apparently seek a coalition with the British conservatives. No idea if that is just their idea or if it is based in any actual negotiations. e X fucked around with this message at 12:54 on May 26, 2014 |
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May 26, 2014 12:51
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Ok, here's my day after dissection, with a clearer head and after reading some stuff: First up, PS: as the biggest opposition party, it's interesting that they had everything going for them, and yet their margin vs the coalition was so, so slim. One MEP and 4% against the parties that have been destroying Europe should be grounds for resigning by Seguro, and yet, he won't resign. This will probably force a central bloc next year. PSD&CDS are the most surprising result: after almost a full mandate, they've still got significant strength and are definitely in the running for the next legislatives. This is really bad. PCP got the biggest share of the protest votes, as usual. It's an incredibly showing for them, however, their best results in like 30 years! Only electing 2 MEPs feels underwhelming, but that's what you get when there's that few representatives in the first place. MPT aren't a real party. Having a populist shitlord as your representative does help to sweep up the "people who watch morning TV" segment of the electorate, and this is a phenomenon that won't repeat itself. Maybe if he runs for president... Bloco keeps up their free fall, and are going to die eventually. At least they managed to reelect Marisa Matias, one of the most competent politicians we have. Hey, we're still going to have (one or two) decent MEPs! LIVRE was my personal disappointment of the night, as I was hoping for Rui Tavares's reelection. Sadly, it was not to be. Still, I managed to convince like a dozen people to vote for the party, and there were enough votes in Lisbon and Porto to elect 3 MPs if these were regular elections!  Maybe next year.
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May 26, 2014 13:02
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Haven't seen it mentioned yet, but DIE PARTEI, the self described political arm of a satirical magazine, got one of the German seats. This is going to be good 
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May 26, 2014 13:03
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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e X posted:Is there any good overview over the different factions in the parliament and any news if and how the new parties will organize themselves. You can puzzle the list together from wikipedia, but with all these interactive maps, it would be nice to see how this election affects them and which parties were members of which factions over the years. The AfD got about 7% of the vote, which translates to something like 1-2 MEPs. Also, if British conservatives are like ours, they would essentially end up doing the exact opposite of what they want (which is killing the Euro and all Jews, I think), so I think they should go ahead and do this. I don't know if the British conservatives would accept this new brand of super secret Nazis, though. Maybe the AfD hopes no-one in Great Britain watches German news?
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May 26, 2014 13:09
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I don't get the concern about eurosceptics and right-wing populists getting decent results in this election. While the role of the European parliament has been strengthened, it's still far from the importance of a national parliament. Therefore all those parties people in this thread complain about still don't have enough power to influence the actual politics within Europe to a degree that would justify fears of a resurgence of facism. Furthermore, more extreme parties traditionally have problems with keeping their own house in order and tend to waste a lot of their time on infighting instead of pressing for actual changes. Lastly, people have been saying the political landscape in Europe is changing towards the extreme right since at the very least the late nineties. Yet they are still merely fringe elements and will be for the forseeable future and very likely far beyond that. Besides that, I think some people are being overdramatically when they put mainstream center-right/ring-wing parties in the same pot as eurosceptics and extreme right wing people. I get it, you don't like "conservative" parties, but the political right isn't some monolithic hivemind that speaks with the voice of the capital. And if you consider moving to another country because Europe is now facism country, you'd probably consider every country on earth facism country. 
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May 26, 2014 13:11
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blowfish posted:Haven't seen it mentioned yet, but DIE PARTEI, the self described political arm of a satirical magazine, got one of the German seats. This is going to be good They sound incredible; from the Guardian live blog: quote:More perplexing news from my colleague Philip Oltermann in Germany, where a satirical party has won a seat in the European parliament: Amazing.
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May 26, 2014 13:26
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I like how people in this thread react to democratic reactions (well not only here but in the media as well). It's kinda the idea of a democratic system that the voters can decide which way a country should go. The EU nearly doubled it's size in the last 10 years (from 15 countries in the beginning of 2004 to 28 today) and there might be people that think this is to fast.Libluini posted:The AfD got about 7% of the vote, which translates to something like 1-2 MEPs. Also, if British conservatives are like ours, they would essentially end up doing the exact opposite of what they want (which is killing the Euro and all Jews, I think), so I think they should go ahead and do this. I don't know if the British conservatives would accept this new brand of super secret Nazis, though. Maybe the AfD hopes no-one in Great Britain watches German news? I have no love for the AfD but the people at the top are free-market radicals which are not anti-euro per definition but question details about the process, but it is true that there are partymembers and faction that might have facist tendencies. The AfD will have 7 seats in the EP. I think it is interesting to see how the AfD will develop with regards to their policies once the party gets a bit older and has a real platform. It might become a free-market alternative that takes the place of the old FDP but with more socially conservative ideas.
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May 26, 2014 13:32
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blowfish posted:Haven't seen it mentioned yet, but DIE PARTEI, the self described political arm of a satirical magazine, got one of the German seats. This is going to be good Yes. They've already announced the planned resignation of their delegate Martin Sonnenborn. They plan on having each of their representatives resign after one month. This would allow them to get in 60 different people until the next election and, as a EU MoP gets six weeks of continued pay after resignation, "milk the EU just like a small southern European nation" (Sonnenborn). Seems like their voters are already getting their votes worth in  Edit: Damnit, beat me to it.
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May 26, 2014 13:35
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Getting eurosceptics in the Parliament is a good thing IMO because it increases the likelihood that the Parliament will reject TAFTA-aka-TTIP. However, wankers like the FN, who use the EP elections to achieve points on the national scene, tend to not visit Strasbourg often and they will just abstain from every vote because who cares.Randler posted:the political right isn't some monolithic hivemind that speaks with the voice of the capital. Well no, that's the political left's job. food-rf posted:This would allow them to get in 60 different people until the next election and, as a EU MoP gets six weeks of continued pay after resignation, "milk the EU just like a small southern European nation" (Sonnenborn). Does that mean they're going to go into personal debt in the trillions of euros? Cat Mattress fucked around with this message at 13:38 on May 26, 2014 |
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May 26, 2014 13:36
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Junior G-man posted:They sound incredible; from the Guardian live blog: Oh yes they are. On a national level, they started out campaigning for the final division of Germany with "rebuild the Berlin Wall" stunts (Titanic magazine ran GDR jokes into the ground even before they started DIE PARTEI), moved on to a fake SPD: We Give Up campaign in Bavaria, and have been following the example of Angela Merkel's success in content-free politics ("But we will not form a coalition with joke parties like the FDP") complete with a Hintnerjugend youth arm (Slogan: "Hi Hinter").
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May 26, 2014 13:37
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food-rf posted:Yes. They've already announced the planned resignation of their delegate Martin Sonnenborn. They plan on having each of their representatives resign after one month. This would allow them to get in 60 different people until the next election and, as a EU MoP gets six weeks of continued pay after resignation, "milk the EU just like a small southern European nation" (Sonnenborn). I can still say I supported DIE PARTEI if I abstained from voting, yes? (Every non-vote counts!)
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May 26, 2014 13:37
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Randler posted:I can still say I supported DIE PARTEI if I abstained from voting, yes? (Every non-vote counts!) Yes, you could. But by that logic you supported the NPD 66% more than Die Partei.
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May 26, 2014 13:43
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GaussianCopula posted:Yes, you could. But by that logic you supported the NPD 66% more than Die Partei. And yet they still only got the same amount of seats at the end of the day.  (Which conincidentally is the reason I don't vote in European elections, because the whole number of votes:number of seats relation is hosed up.)
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May 26, 2014 13:48
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KoldPT posted:Ok, here's my day after dissection, with a clearer head and after reading some stuff: There's still four seats to allocate, one of which might go CDU or MPT way. Also gently caress BE. I voted for them 5 years go, my first election year, and while Marisa Matias is a cool cat that party deserves to get burned to the ground. They got into their silly skulls they were a real leftist party like PCP. Except they forgot that PCP was still around, and PCP have been clowning BE for the past elections.
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May 26, 2014 13:50
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Mans posted:I'll be honest here, i can't say if a country that gives nazis a majority is worse than one that grabs an EPP one. The first are just dumb fucks who want change, whichever way it is, the latter looked at the last few years and said "you know what? I think we should keep this path" Yes let's just assume the far right will be useful idiots when has this ever gone wrong
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May 26, 2014 14:15
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Cat Mattress posted:Getting eurosceptics in the Parliament is a good thing IMO because it increases the likelihood that the Parliament will reject TAFTA-aka-TTIP. poo poo-that-wont-happen.txt. Every time you mention 'TTIP' here in Brussels you get five people going JOBS JOBS TRADING BLOCK COUNTER-CHINA It will pass, but probably without the agricultural section.
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May 26, 2014 14:22
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GaussianCopula posted:I like how people in this thread react to democratic reactions (well not only here but in the media as well). It's kinda the idea of a democratic system that the voters can decide which way a country should go. The EU nearly doubled it's size in the last 10 years (from 15 countries in the beginning of 2004 to 28 today) and there might be people that think this is to fast. Democracy is cool as long as people vote the same way I do.
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May 26, 2014 14:23
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HUMAN FISH posted:Democracy is cool as long as people vote the same way I do. And if they don't they are dumb Nazi babies and their vote doesn't matter anyway since they are dumb and don't know their vote doesn't count. gently caress EU gently caress "Democracy" and gently caress this dumb thread.
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May 26, 2014 14:28
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Baron FU posted:And if they don't they are dumb Nazi babies and their vote doesn't matter anyway since they are dumb and don't know their vote doesn't count. gently caress EU gently caress "Democracy" and gently caress this dumb thread. Their vote doesn't matter because they don't have a majority.
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May 26, 2014 14:33
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Baron FU posted:And if they don't they are dumb Nazi babies and their vote doesn't matter anyway since they are dumb and don't know their vote doesn't count. gently caress EU gently caress "Democracy" and gently caress this dumb thread. You seem awfully angry that +- 25% of votes in like 4 countries going to idiots doesn't drag the other 75% of the population in their own country + the 24 other countries down to the 1930's with them.
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May 26, 2014 14:45
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