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I'm somewhat relieved to see other people have problems with sleep and babies. I don't know what to do or the best method here. My daughter is 15 months old and won't sleep through the night in her own crib. We did a lot of co-sleeping up until this point and I think she's too accustomed. We have a pretty nice bedtime routine and she'll go down pretty easy the first time. However, that'll last anywhere from 15 minutes to maybe 2 hours. Then she'll wake up crying. And it doesn't just peter out, it builds and builds and builds until by the time I go in there after a good 15 minutes she's shaking and wheezing from all the crying and scrabbles towards me like I'm pulling her out of the frigid waters after the sinking of the Titanic. I feel awful. So what we do is when we put her down we sit there and stay in the room. I'll sit down next to the crib and dink around on my phone with one hand through the bars touching her. As long as I'm touching her she'll be fine. Doesn't matter if I'm resting a hand on her back, touching her foot, have a hand on her diaper, she'll be calm. But....if she's not 110% asleep as soon as I remove my hand and get a few steps away she's screaming bloody murder again. I've literally gone up to her, placed my pinky on her back and she calms down and dozes. As soon as I remove it she cries and fusses. This is how bad it is. The thing is, she's tired. If we bring her into bed, she'll pass out immediately. I'm holding her right now and she's out. I'm kind of irritated at my wife because I'm pretty sure at this point we've spoiled her with sleeping in our bed that the only way she'll figure it out is if she cries it out and just become so exhausted she'll stay asleep. Except my wife says "I don't want to hear her cry". I don't either but...I kind of consider it part of parenting and our payment for letting her get accustomed to us. What should I do? Should we maintain the finger-on-leg method to keep physical contact to make her go to sleep? This would take 30 minute sessions every time she woke up. Should we just let her cry herself to sleep and forgo sleep over the three day weekend? Will it take longer to do this? Will she grow out of it? I don't want her to be 11 years old and be afraid to do anything because we babied her to sleep for 2 years.
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May 26, 2014 05:18
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Jastiger posted:I'm somewhat relieved to see other people have problems with sleep and babies. My older son was an avid co-sleeper and I was sure he would never leave our bed. We were very gradual about the process. First, we took one side off his crib and pushed it firmly against our bed so that he would have his own space but still be "co-sleeping." After he got used to that, we put the side back on the crib and kept it right next to the bed. After he got used to that, we moved him and the crib to the end of our bed instead of right next to it. After that, we moved it to his room. He wasn't able to fall asleep on his own so we then chose to move him to a mattress on the floor where we could lie down with him (and at that point, we got a new bed ourselves for other reasons, but it also made it clear that it wasn't a sleeping option anymore). The whole process took several months, but we got there with no tears. As an aside, I don't think it's helpful to be angry with your wife on this. You need to come up with a plan that has both of you on board. I recommend the No-Cry Sleep Solution if you want a resource, too.
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May 26, 2014 05:34
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We did a fair amount of co-sleeping because I do most of the parenting around here and I am a zombie in the middle of the night. So I'd go in, scoop up crying baby, calm her down, and lay down in our bed with her. Then we'd both fall back asleep. If it got uncomfortable, I'd take her back to her room, and if it didn't, we'd sleep there all night. So, to offer some advice, if you don't have any legitimate objections to co-sleeping, then just let her sleep with you. There's nothing wrong with babying... a baby.
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May 26, 2014 07:28
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We never did Co sleeping with either of our boys. It is a trade off your life is hell for the first several months but by 5 to 6 months they are wonderful. I'd rather that than fighting 12+ month old kids they a lot smarter and aware of the world.
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May 26, 2014 10:57
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photomikey posted:This is an odd question, but if the situation were reversed, how would you feel? Thing is, I genuinely don't care (or, rather, I care, but I won't let it factor into my decision) what he feels, because this isn't a family emergency or a trip that can only be taken at that particular time, he just wants to go see family and be alone with the baby for a bit, which I perfectly understand and respect, but not if it costs me my milk supply and spells the end of our nursing relationship. It's a bit frustrating, because he's always been kind of weird about nursing - we have friends who are still nursing their 2,5-year old and I think that has traumatised him to the point where he's adamant that we should quit as soon as possible, so he thinks I'm being unfair when I deny him a solo trip with his daughter because of stupid boobies. But I'm seriously not going to 1. Give up a couple more months of nursing cuddles once a day or 2. Switch to feeding her formula three times a day for the last month before she can swith to regular milk just because he wants to hang out with baby by himself for three days. (she eats tons of normal food and would survive just fine without nursing, so this is just about ease (formula requires effort. boobs do not!) and not wanting to lose that special relationship just yet - she's starting kindergarten August 1., and I don't think the nursing is going to last many months after that, so I don't want to give up those last snuggles)
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May 26, 2014 11:15
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If your baby starts biting the poo poo out of your chest you might wanna give it up. That's what happened with my wife anyway.
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May 26, 2014 11:56
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Sockmuppet posted:Thing is, I genuinely don't care (or, rather, I care, but I won't let it factor into my decision) what he feels, because this isn't a family emergency or a trip that can only be taken at that particular time, he just wants to go see family and be alone with the baby for a bit, which I perfectly understand and respect, but not if it costs me my milk supply and spells the end of our nursing relationship. Oh my god, just let him take the baby and thank your lucky stars you have a husband brave enough to take off with the baby on his own and give you a break. drat, I can barely get my husband to take both kids with him when he does errands. Pump while they're gone and your supply will bounce back when the baby returns. Lyz fucked around with this message at 14:39 on May 26, 2014 |
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May 26, 2014 12:43
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jassi007 posted:We never did Co sleeping with either of our boys. It is a trade off your life is hell for the first several months but by 5 to 6 months they are wonderful. I'd rather that than fighting 12+ month old kids they a lot smarter and aware of the world. That's not really a fair generalization. Every baby is different. Ours slept exclusively in our room until 9 months and pretty much in our bed every night until he was 12-13 months with a few nights here and there in his room and now at 18 months he sleeps fine in his crib without any sort of drama. Whats the lighting in her room? Ours has to sleep with a dim level light on (night light isn't bright enough) or he freaks the gently caress out if he wakes up and its too dark and he's alone.
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May 26, 2014 13:52
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Our babies sleep in our bed now and then, always have, but they sleep just fine in their own beds. Mostly we let them nap during day time in our bed.
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May 26, 2014 14:00
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Lyz posted:Oh my god, just let him take the baby and thank your lucky stars you have a husband brave enough to take off with the baby on his own and give you a break. drat, I can barely get my husband to take both kids with him when he does errands. Pump while they're gone and your supply will bounce back when the baby returns. Just because your husband's an rear end doesn't mean she doesn't have a valid concern. Some people's supplies can handle trips, others will tank. You can't really know until it happens (unless she has prior experience with bringing her supply back up--mine tanked during an illness, but then came back once I started fenugreek, so if she knows she responds well to galactologues, I wouldn't be worried about the trip  )
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May 26, 2014 15:02
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jassi007 posted:We never did Co sleeping with either of our boys. It is a trade off your life is hell for the first several months but by 5 to 6 months they are wonderful. I'd rather that than fighting 12+ month old kids they a lot smarter and aware of the world. I coslept (but not bedshared) for 5 months and switched my little guy over with no issues. He loves his room now and refuses to sleep with us, which makes traveling SO ENJOYABLE AND RESTFUL when we can't bring the crib along and he just wants to play all night!  Every kid has some challenges.
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May 26, 2014 15:04
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Sockmuppet posted:1. Give up a couple more months of nursing cuddles once a day... so I don't want to give up those last snuggles) Anecdotal evidence here but when we stopped nursing our 18 month old he got more cuddly with my wife. We were down to just nighttime feeding before that for a couple months.
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May 26, 2014 15:43
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^^^ That does give me a little hope. Our kid is just...not cuddly at all. There is no baseline of cuddle to go up from, nursing is literally the only time she will lie still in anyones arms. My husband and I have to resort to distracting her with toys to sneak snuggles while she's preoccupied. It's gotten to the point where when she was sick a couple of months back, I felt guilty for being happy when she was so exhausted and poorly that she rested her head on my shoulder when I carried her  Ben Davis posted:Just because your husband's an rear end doesn't mean she doesn't have a valid concern. Some people's supplies can handle trips, others will tank. You can't really know until it happens (unless she has prior experience with bringing her supply back up--mine tanked during an illness, but then came back once I started fenugreek, so if she knows she responds well to galactologues, I wouldn't be worried about the trip Thank you I only know that pumping for me used to bring nowhere near as much as baby did. If this was while she was nursing full-time, I wouldn't be worried about my supply, but since we're already winding down (she'll be 11 months in a week, holy crap!), I don't know if a three day pause is doable. For all I know she'll come back and be all "what, this is all you have to offer me, woman? screw this, I'm done."But yeah. It's hard to be sensible about this, since there are so many feelings mixed in. I actually have a prescription for a nose spray with oxytosin left over from when I had clogged ducts very early on, when we get home I could try the spray and pumping to see how it goes. If it's effective, I'll feel a lot better about the trip (Just to be clear - I've offered to come with if we just leave a few days later, so it's not like I'm holding him and baby hostage at home, he just really wants to go alone with baby.)
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May 26, 2014 16:09
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Why doesn't his family come see you?? Also, why is he traumatized by seeing a 2.5 year old being nursed? If the nursing relationship is important to both you and the child, I stay stick with it for as long as you like. It's not weird to nurse a 2.5 year old. It's weird to nurse an 8 year old.
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May 26, 2014 16:46
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I'm not directly opposed to co sleeping. I'm opposed to not being able to have sexy time with the wife, and having to wake up at 1, then 3, then 5 AM to try to put her back to sleep. She's 15 months she should be able to sleep on her own IF we need her to. I just don't know what to do. I want to let her cry it out and figure out that yes, she can fall asleep without physical touch from mom or dad. I don't know if that'll work though and I don't want to make her fussy unnecessarily.
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May 26, 2014 17:04
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Jastiger posted:I'm not directly opposed to co sleeping. I'm opposed to not being able to have sexy time with the wife, and having to wake up at 1, then 3, then 5 AM to try to put her back to sleep. She's 15 months she should be able to sleep on her own IF we need her to. If you only have one kid, finding sexy time is easy - just pick somewhere other than where the toddler is sleeping. The best part about co-sleeping is you don't have to wake up to get a kid back to sleep because they don't wake up three times at night in a panic. Every kid is different when it comes to sleep issues. Sleep was my highest priority so we co-slept and I nursed on autopilot. My husband didn't even wake up. My first kid was ready to have her own crib in a room apart at about 10 months. My son didn't do that until about 18 months, and he still (he's 5 now) wakes up about 5 a.m. and crawls into our bed. He's been doing that for years and I don't know how to break it but it doesn't wake me up and at least he then sleeps until 7 instead of me having to get up with him, so I figure, why not?
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May 26, 2014 18:09
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Sockmuppet posted:^^^ That does give me a little hope. Our kid is just...not cuddly at all. There is no baseline of cuddle to go up from, nursing is literally the only time she will lie still in anyones arms. My husband and I have to resort to distracting her with toys to sneak snuggles while she's preoccupied. It's gotten to the point where when she was sick a couple of months back, I felt guilty for being happy when she was so exhausted and poorly that she rested her head on my shoulder when I carried her Whatever works for you guys. If you do try galactologues, make sure you know how long it usually takes them to work, so you're not disappointed in the meantime!
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May 26, 2014 19:25
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Jastiger posted:She's 15 months she should be able to sleep on her own IF we need her to. This isn't actually true. Children are ready to put themselves to sleep when they're ready. There isn't a set age. And no offense, but bedtime routines should be the same every night, not just change up when you "need" it to.
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May 27, 2014 00:41
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Jastiger posted:I'm not directly opposed to co sleeping. I'm opposed to not being able to have sexy time with the wife, and having to wake up at 1, then 3, then 5 AM to try to put her back to sleep. She's 15 months she should be able to sleep on her own IF we need her to. My son went through a similar stage at about the same age, even though he'd been in his own room since he was tiny. What worked for me was gradually changing the routine from soothing with touch to soothing with my voice, as I think he just wanted to know that I was there. We started with a few nights of him falling asleep in his cot with my hand on him, then a few nights with no physical contact but me right next to him, then me standing by the door, then me standing outside the door. I found that quietly singing, humming or just saying "shush shush shush" helped. If he woke up when I left I'd move closer and try to calm him with my voice before touching him, but obviously if he got really upset I'd give him a cuddle. It's not an instant fix (though I don't think there is one in this situation) and be warned that you do feel like a doofus standing outside a door singing songs.
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May 27, 2014 00:55
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Lyz posted:Oh my god, just let him take the baby and thank your lucky stars you have a husband brave enough to take off with the baby on his own and give you a break. drat, I can barely get my husband to take both kids with him when he does errands. Pump while they're gone and your supply will bounce back when the baby returns. You asked for opinions, here's mine... your husband also wants some special time alone with the baby, he's unable to nurse so he's taking an ultra-short trip with just him and the kid. I am not the lactating member of my family but I did witness a lot of it, including short 2-3 day trips out of town without the baby, and I concur that your production will survive the weekend with adequate pumping.
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May 27, 2014 00:57
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Jastiger posted:I'm not directly opposed to co sleeping. I'm opposed to not being able to have sexy time with the wife, and having to wake up at 1, then 3, then 5 AM to try to put her back to sleep. She's 15 months she should be able to sleep on her own IF we need her to. It works, it just sucks for a few days / weeks until they figure it out. It is much easier to do when they don't need nighttime feeding, which a 15 month old should be mostly past.
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May 27, 2014 01:14
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Sockmuppet posted:(Just to be clear - I've offered to come with if we just leave a few days later, so it's not like I'm holding him and baby hostage at home, he just really wants to go alone with baby.) Why can't he just wait a few days? It just strikes me as really weird that he's so determined to have the baby to himself. It's one thing to have an afternoon/day with the baby but for several days out of the country? That would be a big NOPE here.
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May 27, 2014 01:22
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Jastiger posted:I just don't know what to do. My 19 month old still wakes up at least once a night. He's in his own crib now. We don't have to hold him to go to sleep anymore though. The way I went about it is putting him down for his naps in his crib. After he could fall asleep alone in his crib for a nap then we started it at night in his crib. The changing it to nighttime part was easier. In the last month I've only had to bring him into our bed once. Typically I can get him back to sleep by finding his pacifier that fell out of his mouth and laying him back down. I try to get to him before he get's too worked up. If I let him get worked up it takes longer for him to settle back down.
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May 27, 2014 01:22
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ghost story posted:Why can't he just wait a few days? It just strikes me as really weird that he's so determined to have the baby to himself. It's one thing to have an afternoon/day with the baby but for several days out of the country? That would be a big NOPE here. Wanting to have some dad and kid time is weird? And the post said another part of the country, not out of the country.
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May 27, 2014 02:01
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AngryRobotsInc posted:Wanting to have some dad and kid time is weird? And the post said another part of the country, not out of the country. No kidding. Even out of the country, who cares, unless your default assumption is that your partner is going to kidnap your kids? If it is, you probably have larger issues to deal with. For context, my wife took both of our kids by herself to meet her parents in Asia before they were 3 months old. Suffice to say my initial reaction didn't include "oh it's weird that you want your parents to meet our kids even though I can't travel due to work". I don't get it.
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May 27, 2014 02:39
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I can't even get my wife to take kids out of town for a weekend. I'm begging her damnit!
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May 27, 2014 02:44
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FishBulb posted:I can't even get my wife to take kids out of town for a weekend. I'm begging her damnit! The key is to make sure you don't live in the same
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May 27, 2014 02:48
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I don't know I have an 11 month old that is still nursing and pumping doesn't get as much milk out as the baby nursing so it may affect her supply AND I wouldn't want to have to pump for three days straight because pumping sucks.
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May 27, 2014 03:04
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You could find an alternate baby to wetnurse for a few days on Craigslist. It happens every day man.
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May 27, 2014 03:26
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AngryRobotsInc posted:Wanting to have some dad and kid time is weird? And the post said another part of the country, not out of the country. Must have misread the country part but still. Wanting time? Not weird. Planning a trip to where she's purposely excluded? And she can come if the days are adjusted? Weird. But thats just my take on it.
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May 27, 2014 07:07
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ghost story posted:Must have misread the country part but still. Well, personally, I think essentially saying "I give roughly zero fucks about my partner's opinion in this" and "My special relationship with our kid is more important than his" (not the exact words, obviously, but pretty clearly spelled out anyway) is pretty drat weird. It honestly sounds like more of a relationship problem with the kid as a factor, than a parenting problem.
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May 27, 2014 07:15
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ghost story posted:Wanting time? Not weird. Planning a trip to where she's purposely excluded? And she can come if the days are adjusted? Weird. I perfectly understand him wanting time with just the baby and his family (he wants to bring his brother, who studies in another country but is home for the holidays, along for the trip as well), because we have been spending 1,5 months of his parental leave in Hungary, out in the countryside with just his grandmother for company, and we'll be travelling around visiting family together during the rest of the summer holiday as well, so a few days apart will do us both good. And he hasn't been able to spend as much time as babys primary caregiver as he otherwise would have, because we have been together here this whole time, so his parental leave has basically been our family holiday, with me working for the last month, but from the house, so I've seen him and baby all the time. BUT, this was his drat idea, and he was the one who pressed for this extended stay here AND for all the family visits we'll be doing for the rest of the summer (apart from 1,5 weeks we'll be spending with my parents). I argued exactly that we'd be alone and on top of eachother AND that he wouldn't be able to parent baby alone since I'd be there all the time, but he insisted that he wanted to go anyway, so we did. So him wanting to solo parent and be apart from me isn't as weird as it sounds, and I have no qualms with neither of those things, but I don't think it's fair if his solo trip (that he wouldn't feel the need for if he hadn't wanted to spend 1,5 months alone with me and baby in a tiny Hungarian village in the first place) should spell an early end to nursing. I've offered to come along and just stay out of their way during the day, but he said that he'd rather not go if he can't go alone. Which I find downright ridiculous, since if he doesn't go on this trip, we'll be together at home anyway. AngryRobotsInc posted:Well, personally, I think essentially saying "I give roughly zero fucks about my partner's opinion in this" and "My special relationship with our kid is more important than his" (not the exact words, obviously, but pretty clearly spelled out anyway) is pretty drat weird. If this was me desperately trying to continue nursing a 2,5 year old or if this trip was a family emergency or something, I'd agree, but we're talking about a holiday visit and an 11 month old baby. It's recommended to nurse or give formula in addition to solids until they're at least one year old. If he wanted to go on an overnight visit (or hell, if he wanted ME to go on an overnight visit somewhere), no problem, but my concern was that a three day trip would kill my supply, even with pumping. So yeah, I think that at this point in time me and my kid's nursing relationship is more important than him being a solo parent for three days in a row at all costs. But this is getting a bit out of hand. Thank you to those who replied about their experiences with keeping up supply during a break from baby (and about baby not being broken by sudden mum absence) I'm going to give pumping a whirl after we come home, and if it's effective, I'll be way more inclined to let him have his trip. Because a weekend alone for the first time in 11 months does sound amazing
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May 27, 2014 09:19
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ghost story posted:Must have misread the country part but still. I think it's a bit odd too, not wanting to go on a trip with the baby but specifying he wants it to just be him and the baby. Just like I would find it weird if the mum said the same thing. With regards to milk, I had to stop breastfeeding for a few days around that age. I pumped and dumped and milk supply wasn't affected but it is going to be different from person to person. Jastiger posted:I'm not directly opposed to co sleeping. I'm opposed to not being able to have sexy time with the wife, and having to wake up at 1, then 3, then 5 AM to try to put her back to sleep. She's 15 months she should be able to sleep on her own IF we need her to. That sounds like our routine and we still manage to have a relatively healthy sex life. It's pretty poo poo not getting a full nights sleep but it won't last forever.
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May 27, 2014 09:22
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Jastiger posted:I'm somewhat relieved to see other people have problems with sleep and babies. We (foolishly?) used to hold our daughters hand while she went to sleep, as it reassured her & it was so cute. I read loads of things (books from relatives, internet articles, etc.) until I kind of saw it as all roughly the same advice: There is a spectrum of sleep training methods ranging from finger-on-leg to completely ignoring, but the thing to recognise is it is a spectrum, so there is no perfect method. I even watched a program that compared the two extremes, and in the long run neither was more effective. So, the common features are: 1) Routine! At a specific time, you start a 30min or so routine with a set song/TV, etc, then brush teeth, change, and maybe a book & a cuddle. Then it is bed time... 2) Put little one down, do whatever to make them calm and settled in bed. Then we diverge: 3a) Cry-it-out: You then kiss, say goodnight, and leave (closing the door). The aim is to not let them think you are there at all for 1 minute. Then you come back, cuddle, do whatever to get them calm again. Then repeat, this time for 2 minutes. Repeat, with increasing time delays until sleep happens, the various patented 'Dr Baby-whisperer' methods tend to vary in the timings - 1,2,3,4,5,6 minutes, or 1,2,5,10,15 minutes, or 1,5,10,15,20 etc. This tends to start having 'results' by the end of about three days, but the first night or two is hell. Prepare by setting up your couch for an all-night movie session or something, as you may be up to the wee hours doing this. However, the next night is usually better - a few hours maybe, and the third night may be even be under an hour of crying. It takes at least 3 days to get them to 'crack' - possibly from exhaustion, but they will get 'better' at going to sleep. 3b) No-tears withdrawal: You do the finger on leg thing (or equivalent), aiming to remove the touch for small periods but making sure they know you are there. Try for less & less contact each night, but plan for a month of long nights in her room. You should get to the stage where you don't need to touch her, but need to be close - maybe shushing if she stirs, but try and keep as quiet as possible. Eventually you back off more and more until after a month or so you might just need to stand in the doorway so she can see & hear you. Then you slowly close the door over another month or so, until eventually they go to sleep quietly & easily (see 5!) 4) Declare success! 5) Have 'sleep reversion' hit every 3-4 days at least, because babies are utterly irrational! Feel free to blame these on growth spurts, eating cheese, phase of the moon etc. as the 'experts' do, but face up that sometimes they will sleep well (once they know how to settle/feel comfortable that you are 'there' even if they can't see you) but very often they won't, and there's truly bugger all you can do about it. It will get better as they grow older - our daughter turns 4 in a week, and 6 days a week I just sit there and tell her a story for 10 minutes & she is asleep, but around once a week she is a right sod & stays awake for an hour or more. Our son spent his first 6 months in hospital and became somewhat institutionalised, so he doesn't care less if we were there or not. That maybe more restful as a parent, but  tl;dr: There are a million methods of varying degrees of crying & success. If you are lucky, then eventually you may get a couple of nights a week where they go to sleep early enough for you to watch a movie! It will naturally get better with time anyway, so who knows if it is all worth it...
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May 27, 2014 09:56
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Every baby is different, and although I tried several methods to get my son to sleep on his own, none of them worked. I find that the cry-it-out method is cruel, at least in his case, since he can cry for at least 30 minutes if not an hour if left alone. The gradual cry and pickup method didn't do anything either, tried it for a month and nothing changed, had to pick him 20-ish times for him to fall asleep out of crying exhaustion. Getting him to sleep by staying with him until he does fall asleep isn't really an issue, and I prefer to take him in our bed if he wakes up in the middle of the night since it soothes him right away instead of trying to get him to sleep in his crib for half an hour.
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May 27, 2014 12:29
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Sort of reading between the lines with what your husband has said about breastfeeding and his weirdness to it, is he trying to take the baby on a trip for a few days in hopes that your supply will dry up and you stop breast feeding because he's worried you'll do it forever?
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May 27, 2014 12:47
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Yeah I'm wondering if the people who think she is being unreasonable have ever dealt with breastfeeding and pumping. Pumps are not as good as a baby at getting milk out. The amount of milk your body produces is a supply and demand relationship. If the demand us decreased for a few days (which it most likely will be if you are solely pumping) the supply your body produces will adjust. If you have a cooperative baby you may be able to bounce back or your baby could just be pissed at not getting the amount they want/need and give up. It's not like he wants to take a three year old, the baby is under a year and all medical organizations say to breastfeed for a bare minimum of a year.
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May 27, 2014 13:15
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Everybody's body is different of course, but my wife went on a 3 day trip to Chicago without the baby, and had to pump and dump. Her supply did feel diminished for a few days and we supplemented with formula for day care but by a week later it was back to normal.
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May 27, 2014 13:45
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My fiance couldn't wait to stop the breastfeeding and did so at 6 months, had problems with the supply and it was never enough for both boys so they've always had to be supplemented by formula. I thought she should have stuck it out longer for the boys sake but I guess it's not my judgement to make. Now they're eating primarily homemade baby food and forumla to go with at 8.5 months, but they've always been on an advanced feeding schedule on doctors orders.
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May 27, 2014 14:02
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| # ? May 15, 2024 21:50 |
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Remember though that recent studies have cast some doubt on the benefits of breastfeeding once you factor in socioeconomic status it looks like that was the main difference all along. So breastfeeding is great but you don't need to feel guilty if you don't do it.
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May 27, 2014 14:11
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