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Motronic posted:Yeah, you'll have to go off pressures for this one. Most likely the oil to use is going to be PAG46, but see if you can find a specific model on the compressor and look up what they recommend for weight. Answers I was hoping for! The dryers are $5 on Rockauto, so I don't mind doing a couple test iterations to get everything right.
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May 14, 2014 00:02
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Man why in the world aren't all accumulators like that? It makes a lot more sense.
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May 14, 2014 00:04
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Alright, I thought I could handle not having A/C this summer but I was wrong. I guess its time to start buying the major components, mounting them, and then paying someone who knows what the hell they are doing to make it all work. Which I assume will not be cheap. Are any of the cheap under dash kits decent? The car in question is a SBC swapped first gen RX-7, so the lovely thing is even if the under dash kits work, it would probably kill the leg room on the passenger side.
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May 22, 2014 14:55
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revmoo posted:Man why in the world aren't all accumulators like that? It makes a lot more sense. I was amazed to find that the dryer desiccant bag on my wife's Kia is replaceable, rather than replacing the whole assembly. Desiccant bag was ~$7 on Rock Auto. My mom is a slut posted:Alright, I thought I could handle not having A/C this summer but I was wrong. I guess its time to start buying the major components, mounting them, and then paying someone who knows what the hell they are doing to make it all work. Which I assume will not be cheap. Are any of the cheap under dash kits decent? The car in question is a SBC swapped first gen RX-7, so the lovely thing is even if the under dash kits work, it would probably kill the leg room on the passenger side. Use the inside AC stuff from another first gen. It was all dealer or port installed, so the thing is modular. The heater core is in the middle behind the radio, but the evap assembly is between that and the blower housing. No-AC cars just had a duct there. I successfully transplanted an '84 evaporator and housing in my '79, to get the o-ring fittings (original '79 used [leaky] flare fittings,) so you should be able to use any year evaporator. Ditto for the condenser. Probably not too much of a problem to mount the Nippondenso compressor that most FBs had to the SBC. Custom hoses likely required, but if you can get all the AC bits from one FB, you can just have hoses and lines lengthened or shortened as needed. the factory setup is on the (US) driver's side, if you want to minimize changes needed.
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May 22, 2014 19:03
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So I got the compressor off of the wife's '08 Kia Spectra5, and not only are the freewheel pulley bearings siezed, but the hub has separated from the driven plate. I have no idea what was going on down there. Th compressor turns, but has a "catch" in it as it does. No "black death" anywhere, thank all that's good and holy. I got only a drop or two of oil out of the compressor. Will have to see what's in the drier housing. According to the manual (which is, thankfully, available online from Kia!): Oil total volume in system: 120ｱ10cc (4.05ｱ0.34 fl.oz) Gonna stick this here for my reference: Replacement of component parts: Evaporator 50 cc (1.70 fl.oz) Condenser 30 cc (1.02 fl.oz) Receiver/dryer 30 cc (1.02 fl.oz) Refrigerant line(One piece) 10 cc (0.34 fl.oz) For compressor replacement, subtract the volume of oil drained from the removed compressor from the specified volume, and drain the calculated volume of oil from the new compressor : The specified volume - volume of removed compressor = volume to drain from the new compressor. NOTICE: Even if no oil is drained from the removed compressor, don't drain more than 50cc from new compressor. Soooo, looks like I should drain 50cc from the new compressor, I guess. It only says PAG, I suspect PAG 46, since other online references suggest that. I did have one peasant surprise: the TXV was on the firewall, where the evap lines come through. Reasonably easy to swap out. I was also able to get the old compressor out from under the intake (back side of the engine) by only shifting a few things out of the way. Not too bad.
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May 22, 2014 19:23
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Darchangel posted:Use the inside AC stuff from another first gen. It was all dealer or port installed, so the thing is modular. The heater core is in the middle behind the radio, but the evap assembly is between that and the blower housing. No-AC cars just had a duct there. I successfully transplanted an '84 evaporator and housing in my '79, to get the o-ring fittings (original '79 used [leaky] flare fittings,) so you should be able to use any year evaporator. Ditto for the condenser. Probably not too much of a problem to mount the Nippondenso compressor that most FBs had to the SBC. Custom hoses likely required, but if you can get all the AC bits from one FB, you can just have hoses and lines lengthened or shortened as needed. the factory setup is on the (US) driver's side, if you want to minimize changes needed. I agree with all this except I would use a factory (the newer the better) a/c compressor for the SBC. It will probably be cheaper to make new lines with SBC fittings on one side and rx on the other than to make custom brackets and have the old lines lengthened.
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May 22, 2014 20:11
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mafoose posted:I agree with all this except I would use a factory (the newer the better) a/c compressor for the SBC. Quite possibly. It should be investigated, at least. Also, a parallel-flow condenser would be more efficient than the original serpentine, if your already needing a new one and making hoses. Just thought of that.
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May 24, 2014 23:54
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Question re: my 2005 subaru legacy. I took it to a shop because no garage and lazy. It is a closed system that holds 1lb R134. Car is about 10 years old (built in 2004) with no prior AC service. So today, it only has .2lbs of R134. They pressurized and found no visible leaks. it has been refilled with dyed stuff. The guy who did the change seems to think there's no way to lose that much in 10 years on this system and not have a real leak (rather than very slow loss through a valve or something). I have no clue, but I want to hope that I'll get a few years out of this without spending more money on my money pit. False hope please?
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May 25, 2014 05:14
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That's pretty close to how much refrigerant my Peugeot lost over a period of ~12 years, and I was told that was completely normal. No leaks found either.
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May 25, 2014 07:45
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I have a similar issue with the '99 Forester, I didn't disassemble the A/C system when I swapped the engine, just laid the compressor off to the side. When I got everything buttoned back up the A/C was dead. Compressor will kick on for a minute but it never gets cold. Could having the hoses twisted a bit for several months allow all the refrigerant to escape?
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May 25, 2014 16:55
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Thanks for the information guys. I'll try and find a donor fb for most of the parts. I need to find one with rear discs and the better rear end anyway.
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May 27, 2014 16:11
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Despite it still being apparently legal in Europe until December 2014, it's very difficult to get recycled R12 in the UK! Has anyone heard of the direct replacement refrigerants I'm being offered like RS24 or R49? meltie fucked around with this message at 14:15 on May 29, 2014 |
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May 29, 2014 11:21
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meltie posted:Despite it still being apparently legal in Europe until December 2014, it's very difficult to get recycled R12 in the UK! Use R152a (not mixable, the system will have to be drained). That's what's in most computer duster cans. See the OP(s) for more information on how it works.
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May 29, 2014 21:19
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Motronic posted:Use R152a (not mixable, the system will have to be drained). That's what's in most computer duster cans. Thanks Motronic 
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May 30, 2014 00:29
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OK, I need some expert advice. New install of a Classic Auto Air system in my 1966 Charger. System fully installed, hoses made, buttoned up. Took it to be vacuumed and charged yesterday. Did the vacuum leak check, passed. Hooray! Went to charge the system, and it filled to 8oz (out of the 24oz full charge) and slowed down. It would creep up, and eventually got to 20 oz or so, and the machine gave up. It was late, so we disconnected, and let it go. Before firing up the car, I hand cranked the compressor (as instructed by Classic). Fired up the car, gave the system a try, and the compressor engaged (must be not-freon in there) and.. No cold air. Not even cool. Today, recovered the freon from the system, vacuumed again, and.. Still won't take a charge - it really doesn't want to take more than 10oz before the process really slows down. So, what sayeth the sooth? I'd speculate a blockage somewhere, but where, on a brand new system? Why won't it take the refrigerant, and then cool? Oh, this needs to be functioning, ideally, by next Saturday when I depart for the Hot Rod Power Tour... 3200 miles in 8 days would be more comfortable with AC at least available!
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May 31, 2014 01:27
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Sometimes systems with expansion valves (thermostatic, not a fixed orifice) can be a bastard to charge while running, but that shouldn't be an issue if you/the shop are using a recovery machine, which it sound like. Did you/they get running pressures to see if it was building pressure in the system? Can't really diagnose anything without those.
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May 31, 2014 01:32
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jhcain posted:the machine gave up. Here is your problem. You need someone who knows what they are doing. Like, looking at the high and low sides during charging. If you can tell me what is happening I can give you a direction to look in. Go rent a manifold gauge set from autozone and get some refrigerant and take a video. Don't give money to the chucklefucks at the oil/brake change place that dont' know poo poo about A/C other than how to run the Robinair machine on auto.
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May 31, 2014 01:37
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jhcain posted:OK, I need some expert advice. Did you run the system at all while you were charging it? Depending on what side you're feeding into the pressure in the system can exceed that in the can. So if you're feeding on the high side alone it won't take the whole charge, so you have to feed into the low side til you can run the compressor and get lower pressures in the system. At which point you can charge by your pressure/temp chart. Make sure if you're feeding it in a liquid you do it in shots, so as to not slug the compressor. And you will need a proper set of high and low gauges.
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May 31, 2014 02:01
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ExplodingSims posted:So if you're feeding on the high side There is no reason to do this on a running system. And it's actively hazardous. ExplodingSims posted:so you have to feed into the low side til you can run the compressor and get lower pressures in the system. And if you're in a hurry you jump the low pressure cut out. But you shouldn't need to on a properly working system unless you're a volume shop working on time. ExplodingSims posted:Make sure if you're feeding it in a liquid you do it in shots, so as to not slug the compressor. Feeding liquid into a running system is a seriously special use case/things are already hosed up situation. This is what you do when you have a pressurized machine that is feeding by weight when the system is off (read: nobody here that doesn't own a shop has the equipment to do this). ExplodingSims posted:And you will need a proper set of high and low gauges. This is pretty much the one thing we can actually agree on.
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May 31, 2014 02:16
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Motronic posted:There is no reason to do this on a running system. And it's actively hazardous. I never said you feed into the high side while it's running. Given standard operating pressures you wouldn't be able to do that anyways. You're never going to get a 70psi can to charge into a 130psi line. I mean if he's feeding into a perfectly vacuumed empty system. Cause at that point it really doesn't matter when you're working with vapor, unless you have a TXV. And feeding liquid into the low side really isn't that uncommon, and it's quite simple to do. I've done it plenty of times on on a variety of equipment in the classes I've been taking. You fill the hose with liquid, and only the hose, then cut off from the can, and charge slowly into the suction side. Watch you're pressures, and repeat as necessary. Like I said, you do it in shots, so as not to slug the compressor. E. After a quick Googleing it looks like the Classic system does come with a TXV, so it might be a problem with that not being able to sense the suction line temp and throttle the refrigerant. When you were installing the system, did it tell you where to place the sensing bulb for the TXV? ExplodingSims fucked around with this message at 02:53 on May 31, 2014 |
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May 31, 2014 02:33
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ExplodingSims posted:And feeding liquid into the low side really isn't that uncommon, and it's quite simple to do. I've done it plenty of times on on a variety of equipment in the classes I've been taking. You fill the hose with liquid, and only the hose, then cut off from the can, and charge slowly into the suction side. Watch you're pressures, and repeat as necessary. Like I said, you do it in shots, so as not to slug the compressor. Look no offense, but you've admitted to being class for this. This denotes a lack of real world experience. The only things that need to be charged as a liquid in a running system are azeotropics which, in the opinion of this thread (me), are not worth using because they are half measures that end up costing more than they are worth in the context of automotive AC. Please don't take this is a FU. Contribute as you can, but support your assertions. In this context I'm asking where/why on an automotive AC system you would ever need to add R-12 or R-134a as a liquid into a running system unless you are trying to make time (and that's not what this thread is about....its about teaching newbs how to do this poo poo). If you've read the OP I've already made my case against refrigerant with things in it.......especially sealant, which is typically why one would need to "tip the can" to introduce liquid. Motronic fucked around with this message at 02:56 on May 31, 2014 |
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May 31, 2014 02:53
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Motronic posted:Look no offense, but you've admitted to being class for this. This denotes a lack of real world experience. No offense taken, but my teachers are both techs who've been in the field since they were like 17, so I think it's pretty good info. Plus we do actually do a lot of work on all kinds of systems. And yes, you probably won't be using the liquid charging method much in this context, unless like you said, he's using an azeotropic.
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May 31, 2014 03:08
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Motronic posted:Here is your problem. I've got a manifold gauge set, so I could give that a shot. What I lack is a vacuum pump. Hmm. Meanwhile, what I find odd is that the nearly full system wouldn't produce even cool air? I suppose I should have slapped the gauges on there and watched what was going on. I had them evacuate the system yesterday after the last failed attempt. Time to try again!
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May 31, 2014 12:42
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Thanks to Terrible Robot for pointing my to this thread, 5 pages and I've learned a LOT. The AC in my 2010 Escape stopped blowing cold air. The compressor doesn't kick on (no short cycling), and the running pressure (as checked by one of those self fill cans, the only item I had on hand for diagnosis) is within range. As I await the arrival of the manifold gauge set, I'm wondering if there are any fuses or mechanical components that I can check beforehand?
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Jun 3, 2014 17:06
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If the compressor isn't kicking on at all, then you aren't seeing a running pressure, you're seeing a static pressure. There should be a relay to control the compressor, and a fuse associated with it - look in your owner's manual to figure out which is which. There's also the possibility that the coil on the compressor has an open circuit, which you can typically diagnose with a multimeter by checking the resistance across the terminals on the compressor itself.
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Jun 3, 2014 17:11
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IOwnCalculus posted:If the compressor isn't kicking on at all, then you aren't seeing a running pressure, you're seeing a static pressure. And if it's "in range" on one of those lovely cans on a static reading that means they system is basically empty. Just go get some refrigerant with dye and get ready to put some in, jump the compressor to make it run, and start looking for the leak(s).
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Jun 3, 2014 17:21
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IOwnCalculus posted:If the compressor isn't kicking on at all, then you aren't seeing a running pressure, you're seeing a static pressure. Aah that makes sense about the static pressure. I'll check for fuses this evening, and see if I can check the coil - the compressor is not the easiest to get to. Here's hoping it's not the A/C Evaporator Discharge Air Temperature Sensor
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Jun 3, 2014 17:56
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I'd do what Motronic said first, honestly. A 2010 is too new to have normal refrigerant loss cause the compressor to not cycle on, so if the static pressure is low enough that it's where the running low-side pressure is, it's most likely a leak somewhere.
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Jun 3, 2014 18:28
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So, I have a new AC compressor I have to install on my 2003 Corolla, but the system has been open for a nice while (lines not connected to anything and tucked behind the wash reservoir. What are the chances anything else is t-totally-hosed? Or should everything be fine with the new compressor and a re-charge?
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Jun 3, 2014 22:50
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What are the chances? Pretty low. Why did the compressor go bad? What's a "nice while"? I'd flush and replace any o-ring that is accessible, and you will need a new dryer also. And a very extended vacuuming.
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Jun 3, 2014 22:54
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A nice while being since early May. The compressor makes a hilariously loud knocking noise.
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Jun 3, 2014 22:56
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SlimManFat posted:A nice while being since early May. The compressor makes a hilariously loud knocking noise. That's not terribly long. And if it the compressor was knocking, it very well may have left pieces of itself in the system, which will destroy the new compressor in short order. The safest move is to flush it, and replace the orifice and drier.
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Jun 3, 2014 23:07
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My friend has an old ford truck with factory r12. One of the main lines went bad this year and leaked out the refrigerant. He is mulling over doing the r152 conversion. If there is no sign of the black death, do we just vac and fill? Is r152 compatible with the original mineral oil? Or do we have to flush it and change oil type? Or do we just add oil for the line change? On the Volvo, r134 conversion requires use of ester oil.
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Jun 4, 2014 17:11
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mafoose posted:My friend has an old ford truck with factory r12. One of the main lines went bad this year and leaked out the refrigerant. R152a has about zero miscibility with mineral oil based on the studies I've seen. You'll need to flush and switch to a PAG lubricant.
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Jun 4, 2014 21:56
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Cross post from the chat thread, regarding household A/C:Fucknag posted:First really hot day of the year (got up to like 97 with 50% humidity) and now the loving house A/C is acting up. Compressor seems to be running, "Cool On" indicator on the thermostat lights up (but eventually starts flashing, which worries me) and the air handler gets cold, but the fan won't kick on, even when set to "on" instead of "auto". Could a clogged filter cause the evaporator to ice up on an otherwise good system? We've got the system shut off in the hopes that's all it is, to let it thaw, but I've got my doubts and I'd like some feedback.
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Jun 8, 2014 04:27
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Absolutely, insufficient airflow can and does lead to icing. Same thing happened to my mom once after my parents divorced (less all of the new hardware); my dad had installed cleanable filters and she had never cleaned them. Eventually one of them clogged enough that the evaporator iced up. Badly enough that if you walked on the concrete next to the air handler where the refrigerant lines run through, the concrete was cold
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Jun 8, 2014 04:35
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If the evaporator is good and iced up, you need to defrost it before the system will run properly, even after cleaning the filter. Set the system to off, fan to manual on, and go see a movie or something. If there is an electrical problem causing the air handler fan to not run, (which is what I think you described,) that can also cause evaporator icing.
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Jun 8, 2014 04:52
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MrYenko posted:If the evaporator is good and iced up, you need to defrost it before the system will run properly, even after cleaning the filter. Set the system to off, fan to manual on, and go see a movie or something. Yeah, the fan won't kick on even with manual on. Although I don't know yet if it indicates an electrical issue, or if the control module just disabled the system because it detected icing (???) Like I set, we're letting it defrost, at least overnight, and we'll see where it goes from there. It's not completely blocked, it was kicking on sporadically with plenty of airflow that was at least cold, so it's not like there's a solid block of ice/snow blocking the evaporator vent.
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Jun 8, 2014 04:58
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If the module is intelligent enough to detect icing (I really doubt it), it would shut off the compressor and run the fan. Also  Seriously. There should be a switch or plug near it - turn it off/unplug it for a minute. If not, flip the breaker for the air handler (it won't be the same breaker for the a/c; the outside unit likely has a 2 pole 240V breaker, while the air handler usually runs on 120V - it'll likely be labelled "air handler" or "furnace"). Leave it off for a minute or so, turn it back on. Before you do this, set the thermostat to "off" (and move the fan switch to "auto"). Switch the thermostat back to cool, see if the fan comes on. If it does, there's something going on in the control board.
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Jun 8, 2014 09:01
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Had the most frustrating case the other day. 05 Mazda 626 come in with no cold air comming out however the compressor was kicking on and off. Drained the bitch, didnt get poo poo out of it, like a third of a pound and it would not at all hold a vacuum. Sold the dye service. Filled it up, was blowing cold, for a while and then I hear a hissing from the high side valve. Close and take the line off and poo poo starts blowing out everywhere from the valve. (sorry earth) Threw the line back on and drained what was left. Get a new valve stem. Still will not hold a vacuum. Switch to another machine. Would not hold vacuum. Throw more r134a in that bitch, suck it back out and now whe're holding vacuum!? The whole time I got the UV on her and see no leaks whatsoever. Finally customer is getting antsy and manager tells me to fill her up and pull it around. Now were blowing ice cubes and I pull it around. A clog in the system? lovely machine? What in the honest gently caress?
Preoptopus fucked around with this message at 15:14 on Jun 8, 2014 |
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Jun 8, 2014 15:09
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