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Lord Hypnostache posted:Crossposting from the oaththread That prince is loving rad, the head/arms aren't stock pieces of the kit, right? Or are they?
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Jul 1, 2014 01:55
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Nixnihil posted:EDIT: Also gotta throw in there -- Jesus gently caress, eighth edition ALREADY? How about make a good loving game and just leave it alone for at least five years? Goddamn. What? Did I miss something?
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Jul 1, 2014 01:59
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Sistergodiva posted:Ok, so I used to dabble in WH fantasy like 12 years ago. This last few days me and an old friend found our old horrible Lizardmen vs Bretonnia start kit dudes and his old wood elf stuff and had a really fun time painting them with way too big brushes and acrylics not made for miniatures. The ally system is "take hwatever you want to". If they're more or less friends they can have better or worse interactions (the "best" allies basically treat each other as being part of the same army, the worst have a chance to skip their turn when they're with X" of the other guys) but there are no requirements for army composition. If you want to have a "battleforged" army then each army you take has to fit a force org chart (so you could have a standard chart for your Tau and a standard for marines or a standard and an allies or a standard for marines, tau, and eldar). If you don't care about battleforged you can take any combination of any units you want including all heavy support and no leader/character models.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:00
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Nixnihil posted:drat, I guess you're right if I may have to make them. I didn't see any riot shields through Kromlech on the War Store. Any suggestions? http://www.anvilindustry.co.uk/index.php?route=product/category&path=60_86
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Jul 1, 2014 02:18
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Nixnihil posted:drat, I guess you're right if I may have to make them. I didn't see any riot shields through Kromlech on the War Store. Any suggestions?  If time is important and you are looking for something like this, I wouldn't go with the super expensive forgeworld options. Those things cost about $6 a shield. Here's an quick and easy plastic card conversion. Or: http://zinge.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&filter_name=shield&product_id=256 http://maxmini.eu/conversion-bits/melee-weapons-shields/anti-riot-gear-bits
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Jul 1, 2014 02:21
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 http://www.frontlinegaming.org/2014/06/28/mob-rule-will-one-of-the-worst-rules-in-40k/Man, the Ork dex is a bloodbath idb. While I'm not super-excited about Mob Rule, I'm still pretty hopeful for this book. It does seem to rule Trukk Boyz right out unless I want to make a model with 1/2 the BS and I the same cost as a space marine by making them all 'Ard Boyz. Truxplosion: 3 wounded boyz; Pinning test: roll Mob Rule, then lose .75 boyz after saves; 25% morale: roll Mob Rule again, lose .75 boyz again.  I can't help but share some of the author's apprehension and desire to wholly bypass Mob Rule. That I get to kill a fistful of boyz myself without the benefit of Fearless irks quite a bit. It'll suck even harder when some spooky MC waltzes right up and the boyz want to run right the gently caress off the board instead of trying to chop it to poo poo for trophies.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:26
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Thanks Peterweller. Those could work, but are still too expensive...I've got some plasticard, maybe I'll just make 'em. :S EDIT: thanks others for the useful suggestions. Definitely got options! EDIT 2: Sorry, 7th edition, not 8th. But still, 6th just came out 2 years ago. It's ridiculous how often this game is "updated". Nixnihil fucked around with this message at 02:29 on Jul 1, 2014 |
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Jul 1, 2014 02:26
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Direwolf posted:The ally system is "take hwatever you want to". If they're more or less friends they can have better or worse interactions (the "best" allies basically treat each other as being part of the same army, the worst have a chance to skip their turn when they're with X" of the other guys) but there are no requirements for army composition. If you want to have a "battleforged" army then each army you take has to fit a force org chart (so you could have a standard chart for your Tau and a standard for marines or a standard and an allies or a standard for marines, tau, and eldar). If you don't care about battleforged you can take any combination of any units you want including all heavy support and no leader/character models. Thanks! I'll just look for something awesome and paint it! Edit: Are Fire Warriors any good? Any good way to find out what kind of units that aren't really worth including in an army? Sistergodiva fucked around with this message at 02:39 on Jul 1, 2014 |
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Jul 1, 2014 02:37
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BULBASAUR posted:Effort vs value certainly makes sense, coming from a company that still has a web page from 2008. I still question the direction of the company, however. hehe they just updated their web page.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:37
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ANAmal.net posted:That's the one, specifically the 6x4 Urban Combat. I like it because a) I didn't have to build and paint a whole table worth of "the ground", and b) the roads are 12" out from the long edges, and 24" from the short ones, so I don't have to measure for deployment zones in either direction. I'm not sure if you noticed, 'cause it's kinda subtle, but that particular mat also has the Vanguard Strike lines marked on it- the flares crossing one direction and the pieces of paper in the other. It's very cool.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:41
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Speaking of 7th. Do barrage weapons still 'ignore' cover?
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Jul 1, 2014 02:52
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You draw your cover save from the center of the barrage, yes.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:59
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Sort of, they don't deny area terrain, but basically yes they do as you test for cover from the blast not the firing weapon. Mob Rule also goes off if you hit them with a Terrify or a other psychic power that causes a Morale Check. The biggest thing though is the loving change to fear ,they're not fearless they'll probably fail a fear check and then be WS1 like he pointed out. Against armies like Tyranids and Chaos Daemons that poo poo is going to suck huge. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 03:02 on Jul 1, 2014 |
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Jul 1, 2014 02:59
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Proletariat Beowulf posted:
I think the Mob Rule complaints are overblown, much like Synapse for tyranids was when it came out. Oh man, remember when people loaded up on all the synapse they could because hormagaunts could lose half a unit to a LD <7 check? Yeah, it can suck when you lose 6 guys. But the odds are you will put 2 wounds on the unit. It's better than running away and only regrouping on double ones. Or being swept in combat. The old mob rule is preferred, yes, but I doubt people have put in enough games to determine the actual impact of the new Mob Rule. EDIT: Everything being basically LD7 does suck. Fear has a fairly limited impact (mostly against TMCs) as you were hitting those daemon princes on 5s anyways. Pinning tests suck, but a lot of things lost the pinning rule by default in 7th. LordAba fucked around with this message at 03:18 on Jul 1, 2014 |
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Jul 1, 2014 03:07
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LordAba posted:I think the Mob Rule complaints are overblown, much like Synapse for tyranids was when it came out. Oh man, remember when people loaded up on all the synapse they could because hormagaunts could lose half a unit to a LD <7 check? You really think synapse isn't total crap? It's screwed me over at least a bit in every game I've played with the new codex. I'll wait and see on Mob Rule but synapse is awful and I hope orks don't have to deal with something like it. Synapse is just a pain in the rear end to work with.
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Jul 1, 2014 03:18
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mmj posted:You really think synapse isn't total crap? It's screwed me over at least a bit in every game I've played with the new codex. I'll wait and see on Mob Rule but synapse is awful and I hope orks don't have to deal with something like it. Synapse is just a pain in the rear end to work with. I've never had to deal with synapse lose unless I leave my biovores in a piece of cover and don't move them up.
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Jul 1, 2014 03:20
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LordAba posted:I think the Mob Rule complaints are overblown, much like Synapse for tyranids was when it came out. Oh man, remember when people loaded up on all the synapse they could because hormagaunts could lose half a unit to a LD <7 check? Yeah, but do you actually ever see Hormagaunts on the table? I don't, because you can't ever afford to be out of Synapse with them for even a turn because the unit will cripple itself half the time. Reecius is certainly speaking from a bad experience there, but I think that Mob Rule is gonna end up being fairly punishing. Lots of armies have the ability to force multiple morale/pinning checks per turn (Tank Shock, etc) and that is gonna end up hurting small squads of Orks pretty badly. Even just the usual "Trukk explodes, take some casualties, take a pinning check, take a morale check" sequence is likely to snipe off 2-3 extra models, which on a small unit like that becomes very painful. Mob Rule is pretty inarguably worse than before, and considering they took several other nerfs alongside it it seems rather gratuitous. That doesn't mean the codex is weak or worthless, but neither does it speak well for its overall design ethos when the defining universal rule for the army ends up being such a major downgrade from its previous version.
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Jul 1, 2014 03:21
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When do the quarterly, or whatever, statements come out? I'd like to see how GW is doing. The Imperial Knight, Guard, Orks, 7E and scrapping Games Day (Which turned from a fun gaming expo, into a large, full retail-price GW store with no fun events of any kind) have made 2014 a pretty bold year so far. But how long can they keep up the break-neck release momentum? An implosion feel inevitable.
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Jul 1, 2014 03:50
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I'm wondering if Power Klaws on Trukk boy Nobs is still worth it these days. I'm thinking jsut use a big Choppa. It lets them still be a threat to most vehicles. With a Big Choppa you're rolling 4 attacks on the charge for Str 7. This can still kill lots of vehicles with low rear armor. Leave the big bads to your dedicated tank killers. Just spit ballin here, it's not like I hardy get chances to play these days.
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Jul 1, 2014 03:51
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Dump_Stat posted:When do the quarterly, or whatever, statements come out? I'd like to see how GW is doing. The Imperial Knight, Guard, Orks, 7E and scrapping Games Day (Which turned from a fun gaming expo, into a large, full retail-price GW store with no fun events of any kind) have made 2014 a pretty bold year so far. But how long can they keep up the break-neck release momentum? An implosion feel inevitable. Supposedly end of July. They'll probably not see a huge dip like everyone thinks, the stock has stayed pretty much the same regardless of what happens it seems plus they got the boost from 7th edition.
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Jul 1, 2014 04:07
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Hollismason posted:BOLS just had a article that there may not in fact be anymore GamesDays, ever. You're not missing out on anything in recent years. A GW exec literally said that the attendees "can do what they love most; buying Games Workshop products". Games Day is nothing but a GW/Forge World/ Black Library store that you have to pay to enter now. The painting competition is held in dimly-lit rooms where you miss details of the models, the display tables have bollards around them so people can't get any closer than 2-3 meters from them when they want to look, and there is nowhere to actually play a game because nobody is allowed within 2-3 meters of said tables.
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Jul 1, 2014 04:07
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I've never gotten to go to a Gamesday.
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CyberLord XP posted:I'm wondering if Power Klaws on Trukk boy Nobs is still worth it these days. I'm thinking jsut use a big Choppa. It lets them still be a threat to most vehicles. With a Big Choppa you're rolling 4 attacks on the charge for Str 7. This can still kill lots of vehicles with low rear armor. Leave the big bads to your dedicated tank killers. Remember for every HQ you can take a mek with a buzzsaw. Not sure if it would be worth the cost, but having a hidden AP2 weapon might not be a bad idea.
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Jul 1, 2014 04:27
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Hollismason posted:Supposedly end of July. They'll probably not see a huge dip like everyone thinks, the stock has stayed pretty much the same regardless of what happens it seems plus they got the boost from 7th edition. They're rearranging the deck chairs pretty furiously for there to be no worrying news at all. I agree that it doesn't seem like we'll see a sudden, sharp crash, but I doubt they're coming up roses either.
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Jul 1, 2014 04:30
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HiveCommander posted:You're not missing out on anything in recent years. A GW exec literally said that the attendees "can do what they love most; buying Games Workshop products". Games Day is nothing but a GW/Forge World/ Black Library store that you have to pay to enter now. The painting competition is held in dimly-lit rooms where you miss details of the models, the display tables have bollards around them so people can't get any closer than 2-3 meters from them when they want to look, and there is nowhere to actually play a game because nobody is allowed within 2-3 meters of said tables. Yeah I am not super upset but out of all the things as a 40k fan and such I've wanted to do is go to a Gamesday and play games and scenarios. I just have fond memories of the old White Dwarfs that featured th Gamesday stuff and it was like "Wow I really want to go" now I'm older and still kind of hold onto that. Just more depressing than anything else. I've never been to a GW or any Con for that matter and now I'll never get to go to one of the cool Gamesday because they turned to poo poo and don't exist anymore. JerryLee posted:They're rearranging the deck chairs pretty furiously for there to be no worrying news at all. I agree that it doesn't seem like we'll see a sudden, sharp crash, but I doubt they're coming up roses either. They're shoring up their projected earnings probably for next year or something like that. That way they can say " Yea we had a bad year but look at this bump here from 7th we're gonna keep that going". The "warning " sign will be when GW looks at their books and shuts down all retail stores that are not making a profit. I mean when you shut down something that at most costs you a couple hundred k at most at at most and you have "8 million" in the bank to pay to investors in dividends, then somethings weird. These last couple of months have been just weird, they shut down social media, then shut down their big events? That to me is a warning sign that something is going down.
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Jul 1, 2014 04:45
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Looking at the Ork codex I just obtained, two things stick out. The buggy profile uses the old as dirt model, so probably no plastic buggy. And Ork boys are now squad size 10 max as opposed to 10-30. Which seems like a huge problem with the new mob rule and other stuff that winnows down your squad as it moves across the board. Or am I missing something here?
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Jul 1, 2014 05:28
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Hollismason posted:Yeah I am not super upset but out of all the things as a 40k fan and such I've wanted to do is go to a Gamesday and play games and scenarios. I just have fond memories of the old White Dwarfs that featured th Gamesday stuff and it was like "Wow I really want to go" now I'm older and still kind of hold onto that. New investor already has gentlemans agreement to buy out company, wants things done differently and/or plans on making money off being patent troll. That's my guess
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Jul 1, 2014 05:29
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That's actually interesting on the patent trolling issue, what patents could GW hold, I'm sure they actually have some patents, but do they hold patents on Game Mechanics?
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Jul 1, 2014 05:41
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Indolent Bastard posted:Looking at the Ork codex I just obtained, two things stick out. The buggy profile uses the old as dirt model, so probably no plastic buggy. And Ork boys are now squad size 10 max as opposed to 10-30. Which seems like a huge problem with the new mob rule and other stuff that winnows down your squad as it moves across the board. Or am I missing something here?
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Jul 1, 2014 05:50
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Indolent Bastard posted:And Ork boys are now squad size 10 max as opposed to 10-30. quote:Options:
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Jul 1, 2014 05:52
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Hollismason posted:That's actually interesting on the patent trolling issue, what patents could GW hold, I'm sure they actually have some patents, but do they hold patents on Game Mechanics? In the US at least, you can't do that with game mechanics outside of specific terms. It's why every card game has to use a different word for turning a dude sideways instead of just stealing "tap" from Magic. You could publish a 40k clone tomorrow if you changed all the rule names.
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Jul 1, 2014 06:37
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Swagger Dagger posted:In the US at least, you can't do that with game mechanics outside of specific terms. It's why every card game has to use a different word for turning a dude sideways instead of just stealing "tap" from Magic. Isn't GW kinda notorious for their protection of SPACE MARINE? I remember hearing something about suing some small time author or something.
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Jul 1, 2014 06:46
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I thought that was the whole deal with Magic the Gathering was that they did in fact patent certain game mechanics, I guess it was just terms then. I dunno , I think we have to wait a month to see what happens. I think them stopping media and stopping Gamesdays is pretty bad, but it may just be US gamesdays. GW literally hosed their own rear end with the lawsuit against Chapter House studios. It was a debacle
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Jul 1, 2014 06:52
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AbusePuppy posted:Yeah, but do you actually ever see Hormagaunts on the table? I don't, because you can't ever afford to be out of Synapse with them for even a turn because the unit will cripple itself half the time. More like a little more than a quarter of the time. The IB tables are lovely, no doubt. But half the time when you fail the Ld check, your dudes are gonna be forced to do what they would do anyway. I still think Tyranids would be hugely improved by just making the tables go 1,2-5,6 instead of the current 1-3,4-5,6. Then losing synapse could possibly cripple you, but your dudes would more likely carry on with their jobs. Mob rule is a hard nerf, but at least you can build your army in a way that mitigates its effects. And I can't help but love how downright fluffy it is. Instead of running or cowering, the boss or the boys in back bust some heads and the mob keeps rolling. It's just so much more flavor and color than simple fearless. Yeah, it's a kick in the nuts, but it's an Orky kick in the nuts. It's synechdoche for GW. Yeah it sucks, but I love it anyway. 
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Jul 1, 2014 07:07
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Well, you'll pass your Instinctive Behavior check less than half the time (Ld6) and then half of those you'll eat your own face off, but even just lacking Fearless is a pretty huge problem as well- Hormagaunts will typically lose combat to most enemies, even the weaker ones, they just tend to triumph in the end by virtue of lots of bodies + Fearless; if you don't have one or both of those things, you're in serious trouble. I don't have a problem with the basic idea of the Mob Rule table at all- it's nice that dropping below 10 bodies doesn't just automatically ruin a unit and the ability to shrug off Pinning is handy. But I feel like it ends up causing more casualties than it should; if the hits had been S3, or if it did d3 hits, or something else, I'd feel a lot better about it.
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Jul 1, 2014 07:13
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It's more than a kick in the nuts when a sniper can kill 7 models with a single bullet.
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Jul 1, 2014 07:16
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Well Sniper and Barrage I believe both lost the pinning rule. So there's that.
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Jul 1, 2014 07:31
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Hollismason posted:That's actually interesting on the patent trolling issue, what patents could GW hold, I'm sure they actually have some patents, but do they hold patents on Game Mechanics? It's hard to patent game mechanics and very hard to defend one once you have it. Creative mediums just have a lot of flexibility opposed to something like, say, making refrigerators. It's possible Wizards of the Coast has trademarked 'tap' as a mark, brand, logo, or other weird descriptor, but most likely it's just done to differentiate other card games from Tragic.
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Jul 1, 2014 07:54
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Just take MANz and laugh at the Mob rule wounds and vehicle explosion wounds with your 2+. Trukkz and MANz, a match made in heaven.
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Jul 1, 2014 08:20
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JerryLee posted:That prince is loving rad, the head/arms aren't stock pieces of the kit, right? Or are they? Thanks! The head and arms are from DEldar Pain Engine kit.
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Jul 1, 2014 08:35
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Sistergodiva posted:Isn't GW kinda notorious for their protection of SPACE MARINE? I remember hearing something about suing some small time author or something. They own the patent on 'Space Marine' in a name, but not the content of a book. And yeah, they sent a Cease and Desist to a charity book, but I'll give them that one, since if you don't protect IP it sets a precedent, and would have allowed other non-charitable enterprises to use it. Back to the Lucky Stix, I can see an errata in their future about taking all the re-rolls you intend to at the same time. So, if you've failed three To-Hit rolls, you can reroll all or some, but can't do them one at a time and stop at 2 fails. Also, I'm faaaairly sure there's no way to get Ghaz in the 'Waaaagh every turn' formation. Which is a pity. but if I'm wrong...
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