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Red Country has a backgrounded critique of the effects of industrialisation, too. It's made clear that industrialisation is not an Incontrovertible Good.
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Jun 7, 2014 13:17
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thatbastardken posted:The people in the Union have no more agency or social mobility than those in Gurkhal. We don't know this at all. Also, social mobility happened as a result of forces at play in industrialisation, not prior to. I do admit part of that was due to religious throes. Also please remember the socialist revolution happens (well, in an imaginary land) after industrialisation, according to Marxi1xt theory. Edit: and generally, I am not at all trying to argue industrialisation is inarguably a force for good. However, it does create a great deal of social turmoil that historically has created opportunities for social change. Bayaz will just change his wizard hat in for being a shapeshifting bloodconsuming Jewish reptile though, so it's okay. Neurosis fucked around with this message at 13:39 on Jun 7, 2014 |
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Jun 7, 2014 13:32
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I'm currently listening to the Best Served Cold audiobook. Does Friendly have Aspergers?
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Jun 10, 2014 22:30
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theDOWmustflow posted:I'm currently listening to the Best Served Cold audiobook. Does Friendly have Aspergers? Something approximating that yeah. It was pretty blatant in the novel as well.
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Jun 11, 2014 00:30
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I would have put him further down the spectrum than just Aspergers.
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Jun 11, 2014 00:32
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Grand Prize Winner posted:I would have put him further down the spectrum than just Aspergers. Yeah, he is just barely functional.
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Jun 11, 2014 03:34
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thatbastardken posted:Is it better to be a slave to God or a slave to Capital? The people in the Union have no more agency or social mobility than those in Gurkhal. The "benefits" of industrialization will flow in exactly one direction - due Bayaz, not to the people. The "outdated religious values" of Europe lead directly to the development of moral systems like humanism, but the Union has nothing but the ego of an immortal cannibal tyrant driving or retarding development as he sees fit. That said, the only thing keeping Bayaz from becoming a "shapeshifting lizard ghoul" is pretty much that he was there to see it happen over time to lots and lots of people, and he's obviously too stuck on himself to want to sully his own person if it all possible distance himself from the (personally physical) damage. theDOWmustflow posted:I'm currently listening to the Best Served Cold audiobook. Does Friendly have Aspergers? Not Forrest Gump, but rather Rain Man with a cleaver. Actually come to think of it, the numbers thing screams Rain Man.. coyo7e fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Jun 11, 2014 |
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Jun 11, 2014 06:04
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The Prince Areo plot is the funniest poo poo I've read (er, listened to) in a fantasy novel ever. What a trainwreck.
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Jun 11, 2014 07:45
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Soooooo... just got done with the first First Law book. I was, how to put it, unimpressed? I mean, it was fine, but it had been talked up a lot. I was expecting something like a new Glen Cook. Instead I got a better than average but generic as poo poo fantasy novel. I mean, it was way better than inexplicable goon favorite Sanderson, but nothing really stood out and the novel literally ends with 'well, now we've assembled the Fellowship, let's go actually do something.' Only it's less the fellowship and more a literal DnD party. Plus not Orcs, not Wildlings, not Sauron, not Gandalf, not Molly, not Conan etc. etc. etc. e: What I'm saying is, convince me to try the next novel before I go back to Glen Cook because I haven't finished Instrumentalities of the Night. the JJ fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Jun 17, 2014 |
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Jun 17, 2014 18:14
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the JJ posted:Soooooo... just got done with the first First Law book. I was, how to put it, unimpressed? I mean, it was fine, but it had been talked up a lot. I was expecting something like a new Glen Cook. Instead I got a better than average but generic as poo poo fantasy novel. I mean, it was way better than inexplicable goon favorite Sanderson, but nothing really stood out and the novel literally ends with 'well, now we've assembled the Fellowship, let's go actually do something.' Only it's less the fellowship and more a literal DnD party. Plus not Orcs, not Wildlings, not Sauron, not Gandalf, not Molly, not Conan etc. etc. etc. You're getting out of it exactly what Abercrombie wants you to, but it's because he wrote the First Law trilogy specifically as a way of criticizing and playing with standard fantasy tropes but did it subtly enough that it takes most of the trilogy before you realize what he's doing. The first book is almost completely standard modern fantasy, but in doing it that way he's leading you down a garden path - he's setting up archetypes that you'll be basing a lot of your interpretations of the characters' behavior on so that when he gives you the series of big reveals, you can go back and see all the clues he built in. Avoid spoilers, keep reading, but expect the payoff to wait until the last book.
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Jun 17, 2014 19:23
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Notahippie posted:You're getting out of it exactly what Abercrombie wants you to, but it's because he wrote the First Law trilogy specifically as a way of criticizing and playing with standard fantasy tropes but did it subtly enough that it takes most of the trilogy before you realize what he's doing. The first book is almost completely standard modern fantasy, but in doing it that way he's leading you down a garden path - he's setting up archetypes that you'll be basing a lot of your interpretations of the characters' behavior on so that when he gives you the series of big reveals, you can go back and see all the clues he built in. Avoid spoilers, keep reading, but expect the payoff to wait until the last book. Cool, so long as the pay off is there. e: This is about the only reason I'm sticking with Rothfuss, so it's sorta nice knowing that there's some sort of payoff.
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Jun 18, 2014 03:28
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Those preview chapters for Half a King were great, I just preordered it  Is it just me or does it not seem that much different to his regular style?
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Jun 18, 2014 08:00
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the JJ posted:Cool, so long as the pay off is there. Personally I think some of the payoff comes in Before They Are Hanged, but aye.
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Jun 18, 2014 09:12
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Street Soldier posted:Those preview chapters for Half a King were great, I just preordered it It's not just you. I think Abercrombie could do a First Law edit that would make it YA without a whole lot of effort. Best Served Cold, on the other hand...
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Jun 18, 2014 16:47
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Street Soldier posted:Those preview chapters for Half a King were great, I just preordered it The style's pretty much the same as his First Law books, he just dials back the violence and language a tad and there's only one POV character, so it's a much shorter book. As I mentioned earlier, the plot is a lot more straightforward, but there are some twists and turns that were pretty well done.
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Jun 19, 2014 03:10
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the JJ posted:Soooooo... just got done with the first First Law book. I was, how to put it, unimpressed? I mean, it was fine, but it had been talked up a lot. I was expecting something like a new Glen Cook. Instead I got a better than average but generic as poo poo fantasy novel. I mean, it was way better than inexplicable goon favorite Sanderson, but nothing really stood out and the novel literally ends with 'well, now we've assembled the Fellowship, let's go actually do something.' Only it's less the fellowship and more a literal DnD party. Plus not Orcs, not Wildlings, not Sauron, not Gandalf, Who are you referring to as the not Sauron character? If you mean Bayaz as not-Gandalf, well...right. He's not like Gandalf -- they're both wizards, but Bayaz has a different personality entirely and is hardy and down-to-earth (I pictured him like a bald Liam Cunningham). I saw the shanka more like these guys than big brutish orcs --  I don't know, I guess on paper there are some similarities with LOTR, but the feel of the series is completely different. Sure, you've got a bunch of disparate people traveling in search of something, but that's hardly unique to LOTR.
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Jun 19, 2014 14:05
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Rabbit Hill posted:Who are you referring to as the not Sauron character? If you mean Bayaz as not-Gandalf, well...right. He's not like Gandalf -- they're both wizards, but Bayaz has a different personality entirely and is hardy and down-to-earth (I pictured him like a bald Liam Cunningham). Since someone mentioned it earlier in the thread, I've been imagining Bayaz as Jeff Bridges in Iron Man.
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Jun 19, 2014 14:37
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the JJ posted:Soooooo... just got done with the first First Law book. I was, how to put it, unimpressed? I mean, it was fine, but it had been talked up a lot. I was expecting something like a new Glen Cook. Instead I got a better than average but generic as poo poo fantasy novel. I mean, it was way better than inexplicable goon favorite Sanderson, but nothing really stood out and the novel literally ends with 'well, now we've assembled the Fellowship, let's go actually do something.' Only it's less the fellowship and more a literal DnD party. Plus not Orcs, not Wildlings, not Sauron, not Gandalf, not Molly, not Conan etc. etc. etc.
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Jun 19, 2014 23:20
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Is there going to be an audiobook for Half a King? It would be an instant buy if Stephen Pacey read it.
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Jun 19, 2014 23:53
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LASER BEAM DREAM posted:Is there going to be an audiobook for Half a King? It would be an instant buy if Stephen Pacey read it. Some guy named Ben Elliot is doing it.
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Jun 20, 2014 00:30
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Speaking of audiobooks, is there a way to get the Pacey versions of Best Served Cold and The Heroes on Audible? I know the UK version has it, but I'd like to use my credits.
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Jun 20, 2014 05:07
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Rabbit Hill posted:I saw the shanka more like these guys than big brutish orcs --
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Jun 21, 2014 02:45
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Above Our Own posted:I think you'd enjoy the trilogy because Abercrombie's entire shtick is subverting just about every trope you mentioned in your last sentence there. He does it well and it makes for an amusing read, but the whole first book of the trilogy is just setting things up so the author can turn the genre conventions on their head over the next two books. It's not a great structure but it does get much better. Maybe it's just because the audiobook narrator is so amazing but I found that the characters were written so well in the first book that I didn't even give a poo poo that the plot was perhaps a little sluggish and traditional. Probably the most times I've laughed out loud while reading/listening to any fantasy book ever, particularly at the Jezal stuff. About 3/4 through book 3 now and it's shaping up to be the most entertaining fantasy series I've read so far. My only issue with the trilogy is that things are really starting to feel compacted to make it all fit into 3 books. Maybe I'm just bummed out because it's almost over but this feels like it would have made an absolutely amazing 4 or 5 book series. e: which is to say I mean that I feel like the events of the first 3 books (well, more the last 2) could have easily been filled in more to warrant an additional book or two. Eptar fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Jul 4, 2014 |
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Jul 3, 2014 21:31
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Eptar posted:Maybe it's just because the audiobook narrator is so amazing but I found that the characters were written so well in the first book that I didn't even give a poo poo that the plot was perhaps a little sluggish and traditional. Probably the most times I've laughed out loud while reading/listening to any fantasy book ever, particularly at the Jezal stuff. About 3/4 through book 3 now and it's shaping up to be the most entertaining fantasy series I've read so far. My only issue with the trilogy is that it things are really starting to feel compacted to make it all fit into 3 books. Maybe I'm just bummed out because it's almost over but this feels like it would have made an absolutely amazing 4 or 5 book series. You still have all 3 stand alone books to get through. I felt the same way about the audio books, I kept hearing about how slow the first book was but I loved every minute of it. I will admit the reveal of the bloody nine at the end of book one was hands down the best part of the entire book for me.
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Jul 3, 2014 23:03
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coyo7e posted:I always thought of them as some sort of hybrid between an alligator lizard and some type of simian. Their jaws always sounded like they were colossal on the lines of a snake or saurian, and that was the first thing that stuck with me when I picked up the first novel - getting bitten by one, simply because it was too stupid and aggressive to think about its circumstances past "enemy - BITE! :rome101:" I always saw them as lizard-like with alligatorish heads, because the northmen always refer to them as Flatheads.
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Jul 3, 2014 23:54
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I figured they were just human ancestors with sloped heads and big mandibles.
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Jul 4, 2014 09:15
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Antti posted:I figured they were just human ancestors with sloped heads and big mandibles. Yeah I always figured they were a bit more like Neanderthals but loving savage with scars and big rear end teeth. It's summer so I've started my 4th read through of the original trilogy. I love these god drat books. I work at a bookstore (large retail chain) and any time someone asks me for a fantasy recommendation I immediately suggest the First Law Trilogy.
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Jul 4, 2014 14:22
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SubPress covers are usually pretty iffy, but their editions of Joe's books have been great. Case in point, Half a King:
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Jul 7, 2014 03:42
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Sweet, that's a much better cover than the covers his recent books have been getting, which are just meaty arms holding swords. I liked the original covers for the First Law trilogy, which were maps with swords and coins and stuff spread out on them. But now they've been replaced with meaty rim-lit beef arms.
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Jul 8, 2014 18:09
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The original trade paper covers of the maps have recently changed from the awesome gritty card stock to the soft glossy paper. Still are the same, but way more flimsy.
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Jul 8, 2014 18:25
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Ccs posted:Sweet, that's a much better cover than the covers his recent books have been getting, which are just meaty arms holding swords. I liked the original covers for the First Law trilogy, which were maps with swords and coins and stuff spread out on them. But now they've been replaced with meaty rim-lit beef arms. This is why I started getting the UK editions.
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Jul 9, 2014 02:08
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Wait, he has a new book out? Edit: no kindle edition, what the hell?
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Jul 10, 2014 09:41
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Fellwenner posted:Wait, he has a new book out? It hasn't been released in the US yet.
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Jul 10, 2014 12:33
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I'm watching Valhalla Rising, and this is really close to how I imagine the Northlands. Bands of men roving about, grizzled warriors, vendettas. Extreme violence. The only problem is that anyone with one eye would have major depth perception problems and would be poo poo at fighting, but Shivers has that problem, too.
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Jul 11, 2014 11:42
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Neurosis posted:I'm watching Valhalla Rising, and this is really close to how I imagine the Northlands. Bands of men roving about, grizzled warriors, vendettas. Extreme violence. There are like 14 monocular cues to depth perception and 3 binocular ones, so I'm not sure they would be major problems. Was depth perception in a movie theater a huge issue before the (totally exaggerated and awful) stereopsis craze in film?
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Jul 11, 2014 14:29
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I had no idea there was a new book out! Just got a signed copy on a shelf from waterstones which was a pleasant surprise. Though, I'm having to peel off a bunch of dumb stickers from the cover.  I like the small little figures trudging alongside some mountains but the cover is a bit of a letdown. hemale in pain fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Jul 11, 2014 |
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Jul 11, 2014 21:18
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hemale in pain posted:I had no idea there was a new book out! Just got a signed copy on a shelf from waterstones which was a pleasant surprise. A short thought on the book below: I found the book itself to be a bit of a letdown. I felt it was completely average. Maybe I have too high expectations from his earlier stuff. Or, maybe I'm getting too old and jaded for the young-adult genre.  I'm still a huge fan and he is my favorite current author but I feel that his books have become progressively weaker. Outside of the Bloody Nine and Cosca, I found Red Country to be largely forgettable.
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Jul 11, 2014 21:43
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hemale in pain posted:I had no idea there was a new book out! Just got a signed copy on a shelf from waterstones which was a pleasant surprise. I never noticed the small guys before. That's pretty cool, and gives it a slight edge on the regular US cover. Of course, I'll end up with copies of all the covers so I guess it doesn't matter...
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Jul 12, 2014 02:14
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Hughmoris posted:A short thought on the book below: Yeah, I finished it yesterday and felt the same way. Plus the Great Expectations level coincidence was annoying. Although I am curious to see what direction the next book goes in. Koburn fucked around with this message at 08:34 on Jul 12, 2014 |
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Jul 12, 2014 08:27
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I liked it, especially the ending and the climax. It's more ... shallow... than usually, with things seeming more brisk, scene after scene and less in-depth than the other books, but it's a shortish YA novel after all. Still, delightfully grey characters, good scenes, lots of senseless death and destruction, resulting in no change at all for the commoner except more dead people, bleak as ever.
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Jul 12, 2014 18:05
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