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Twistys Rapture posted:I'm going to disagree here. The point of Eiji was that he either had no desires or his desires were so big because he cared for everyone. Eiji is similar to Haruto in his regrets. Eiji regrets that he couldn't save that child and Haruto regrets having to save the world. Haruto clearly is Wizard out of guilt, knowing that he, alone, is the last hope of the world to fight the Phantoms. Haruto is interesting in that his burden saddens him and causes him to withdrawal from the world he has chosen to give hope to. His interactions with Shunpei, Rinko, etc show how he engages again with the world. Haruto's backstory of how he was a dickhead before the Sabbat happened was also interesting in that it explains how Haruto is trying to make up for his past life. When Nitou enters the scene, Haruto must cope with how he isn't the only one who can save the world and how his world view is so different from Nitou's. And of course, how Koyomi is so central to Haruto's character was a great plot point and was the most enjoyable part of the Gaim Wizard crossover movie. 
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Jul 5, 2014 17:16
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Man, that's a interesting idea about what Haruto is like. Too bad that's never said or implied at all beyond him just saying I AM THE LAST HOPE as if that's his arc and not his catchphrase.
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Jul 5, 2014 18:09
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Cyphoderus posted:The end block of Black is really, really good.
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Jul 5, 2014 18:36
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Twistys Rapture posted:Haruto is interesting 
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Jul 5, 2014 18:37
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A poster in this thread just thought more about Haruto's character than the people who wrote him ever did.
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Jul 5, 2014 19:06
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Twistys Rapture posted:And of course, how Koyomi is so central to Haruto's character was a great plot point and was the most enjoyable part of the Gaim Wizard crossover movie. I agree completely. Also, the OOO part of Movie War Core was way better than the OOO series, and the Skull part was dull and terrible and should have been cut.
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Jul 5, 2014 19:07
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Black still has possibly the most tragic ending in Kamen Rider. The day is saved, Gorgom is destroyed! His friends are either dead or gone, his home left to ruin, and he had to kill his brother with his own hand. BUT THEN HE GETS ADOPTED INTO A FAMILY AND IT TURNS OUT HIS BROTHER ISN'T DEAD AND THEN HIS BROTHER COMES BACK AND REDEEMS HIMSELF AN DIES AND HE GETS SUPER NEW COOL POWERS AND A LIGHT SABER AND EVERYTHING IS WACKY AND HE GETS LIGHT HEARTED AND ACTS LIKE A DOOFUS UNTIL EVERYTHING DIES AND THEN BULLSHIT I don't like RX.
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Jul 5, 2014 19:20
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Let me tell you all why Goseiger is good and Alata is the best person (angel?) in the world
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Jul 5, 2014 20:11
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Basically his character doesnt really want to do anything but feels a big sense of duty to do things
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Jul 5, 2014 20:13
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Twistys Rapture posted:Basically his character doesnt really
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Jul 5, 2014 20:30
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Twistys Rapture posted:Let me tell you all why Goseiger is good and Alata is the best person (angel?) in the world This is actually true though.
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Jul 5, 2014 20:31
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Twistys Rapture posted:Let me tell you all why Goseiger is good and Alata is the best person (angel?) in the world Actually please do because I watched the first arc of Goseiger and while I thought it was better then what people led me to believe I also have no real ambition to continue watching. Please tell me how good the series becomes.
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Jul 5, 2014 21:34
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The first arc is the worst arc. The second isn't mind blowing but its much better and fun to watch. Gosei Knight is the best.
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Jul 5, 2014 23:20
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Goseiger gets better as it goes on but it also suffers from the (pretty odd) problem of having a lot of surprisingly subtle plot foreshadowing for a show about magical friendship angels who use collectable trading cards to battle monsters. A lot of things they build up to look a lot worse on first viewing when you don't know where they're going. Gosei Knight, for example, comes across as a Beep-Boop I Am A Logical Robot sort of character and do not understand your Hu-Man emotions before you discover that he was actually Brajil's Headder and pretty much everything he is speaking about or doing is straight-up filling in Brajil's characterization before he appears. He isn't an rear end in a top hat because he's a robot, he's an rear end in a top hat because he was the embodied magical sidekick of the world's biggest rear end in a top hat. Pretty much every villain is effectively set up and a lot of what they are doing is silent development for the final arc. The Warstar are the weakest of the villain factions these ways but the UMA and Matrintis both exist to help develop where the plot goes and provide characterization. Alata works as a Red because he is soft but not weak and the emphasis on "you can be soft without being weak" is a central point of the story, and his development leads towards him getting moments of strength. It isn't the Best Show Ever but it's a hell of a lot better than people gave it credit for, and I suspect at least part of that is a combination of lovely TVN subs which missed foreshadowing and mistranslated things combined with the show presenting one thing only to reveal it is another down the line, but which looks a lot more like the first thing at first blush. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 23:35 on Jul 5, 2014 |
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Jul 5, 2014 23:25
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HKR posted:Actually please do because I watched the first arc of Goseiger and while I thought it was better then what people led me to believe I also have no real ambition to continue watching. Please tell me how good the series becomes. I only care about Alata, all the other characters are underdeveloped. Hyde is OK, but like the other characters he could have been fleshed out more. The Warstar arc really just sets up the rest of the story, but the new power ups everyday was freakin cool, oh there was an ostrich too
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Jul 5, 2014 23:25
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ImpAtom posted:Goseiger gets better as it goes on but it also suffers from the (pretty odd) problem of having a lot of surprisingly subtle plot foreshadowing for a show about magical friendship angels who use collectable trading cards to battle monsters. A lot of things they build up to look a lot worse on first viewing when you don't know where they're going. Gosei Knight was OK, but lacked by design the caring and human touch that Alata embodied.
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Jul 5, 2014 23:27
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There was definitely a Oh poo poo, didn't see that coming element of Goseiger that was refreshing to see I think a lot of people didn't like Goseiger just because it came after Shinkenger, and all the nerds loved the samurai crap Saint Twisty fucked around with this message at 23:38 on Jul 5, 2014 |
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Jul 5, 2014 23:28
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I haven't watched a lot of Goseiger, but what I've seen is good and I will definitely be continuing it.
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Jul 6, 2014 00:26
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Twistys Rapture posted:And of course, how Koyomi is so central to Haruto's character was a great plot point and was the most enjoyable part of the Gaim Wizard crossover movie. You're kidding, right? Haruto's arc in WizxGaim is a stellar example of Haruto getting to have his cake and eat it too without doing anything other than what assuages his own conscience and self-image. The movie comes this close to putting him through an actually interesting plot (his refusal to let go of Koyomi is not only unhealthy for him, it is about to literally destroy Japan), and they even let the character admits that it's true. Then he turns around and solves the problem by making a speech about how much he still loves her, completely ignoring all of that dangerously-close-to-development, and then keeping the ring anyway while smugly claiming that it's what she'd want.
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Jul 6, 2014 00:43
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I think one of the main issues of Wizard WAS Koyomi in that she's supposed to be his balancing force and main motive, but she has no personality or motives beyond being a literal object for Haruto and the Phantoms to lust over and/or protect. Compare that to Ankh/Phillip/Kengo and she comes up super short. We DON'T know what she wants because she was a cipher, like everyone else in Wizard. More projections and reflections then both Ryuki AND Dragon Knight.
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Jul 6, 2014 01:34
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Twistys Rapture posted:I only care about Alata, all the other characters are underdeveloped. Hyde is OK, but like the other characters he could have been fleshed out more. The Warstar arc really just sets up the rest of the story, but the new power ups everyday was freakin cool, oh there was an ostrich too I think Pink, whatever her name was, got a little bit of development but all I can remember is that she like Alata (which in sentai terms is meaningless.) You're right that Agri and Moune got nothing. If anything those two, who in theory were supposed to be strong like rocks, came off as being weaker than the Skyic rangers. Hyde was a perfectly serviceable blue but nothing to write home about, certainly the least fun blue of the last five seasons.
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Jul 6, 2014 04:30
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Solaris Knight posted:I think one of the main issues of Wizard WAS Koyomi in that she's supposed to be his balancing force and main motive, but she has no personality or motives beyond being a literal object for Haruto and the Phantoms to lust over and/or protect. Compare that to Ankh/Phillip/Kengo and she comes up super short. We DON'T know what she wants because she was a cipher, like everyone else in Wizard. More projections and reflections then both Ryuki AND Dragon Knight. God, this. Wizard has a lot of things that need fixing, but making Koyomi a more understandable motive for Haruto would have gone miles in making things better. He's devoted to her because he has to be, it feels like. Because that's what he does, as a Wizard. It never seemed as though he particularly loved her, just that he knew she was dependent on him and he's the kind of guy that needs to be needed. I see Haruto more as a guy that lost all purpose in life, had no idea what to do with himself, and then along comes the White Wizard and tells him that he can be a badass hero. He seems very devoted to the idea of being a cool badass hero, when in actuality he is something of a dork and a doofus and really has no business showing off as much as he does. Which plays right into the White Wizard's hands. His devotion to Koyomi is part of playing that role that's been given to him. A better-written show would have taken time to have Haruto grow to see Koyomi as more, which would make the endgame events genuinely dramatic and painful for him. Some of it can probably be blamed on her actress having too much idol stuff to do, but it's like the writers didn't even try.
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Jul 6, 2014 05:32
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A better-written show wouldn't have quite literally given Haruto new powers on a silver
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Jul 6, 2014 10:19
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Twelve by Pies posted:I agree completely. Also, the OOO part of Movie War Core was way better than the OOO series, and the Skull part was dull and terrible and should have been cut. I think Twisty is from the Decade Nega-world.
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Jul 6, 2014 10:44
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FeatherFloat posted:when in actuality he is something of a dork and a doofus and really has no business showing off as much as he does. But that is the opposite of what he was, he was a badass soccer player who was on the verge of going pro. Shunpei was a dork and a doofus and probably would have made a better main rider too, just to see how he'd gently caress everything up. At least that would be interesting.
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Jul 6, 2014 16:50
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Solaris Knight posted:I think one of the main issues of Wizard WAS Koyomi in that she's supposed to be his balancing force and main motive, but she has no personality or motives beyond being a literal object for Haruto and the Phantoms to lust over and/or protect. Compare that to Ankh/Phillip/Kengo and she comes up super short. We DON'T know what she wants because she was a cipher, like everyone else in Wizard. More projections and reflections then both Ryuki AND Dragon Knight. Man, this isn't even about Koyomi. This movie doesn't even have the guts to follow through on a proper character development arc for Haruto even when Koyomi is literally an object for him to angst over.
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Jul 6, 2014 18:07
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 the best supporting characterBurkion posted:Black still has possibly the most tragic ending in Kamen Rider. We knew all along they were going to bring back the guy, everyone who dies by having a building collapse on top of them always comes back. Also I never got why the girls didn't come back to Japan. Possibly the awkwardness of having to deal with Kotaro after the whole business? Or maybe they're having too much fun with Power-kicking CIA Buddy. That's one character who should have come back for the final episodes, he was cool.
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Jul 6, 2014 19:21
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Eiji had PTSD and he was pretty numb. That makes sense both in the context of the show and in the context of people in real life, and he got better. There was a reason for him to be numb to everything and he got better through time through his friendships with Eiji and Hina. There was drama driving the series all the way through. There was no drama in Wizard Haruto just always won and even if he didn't, it all worked out in the end  Wizard's whole series was on auto-pilot and there wasn't the excuse of an earthquake or a typhoon that threw it off the rails, it was always just boring and un-motivated. RealFoxy fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Jul 6, 2014 |
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Jul 6, 2014 19:49
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Cliff Racer posted:I think Pink, whatever her name was, got a little bit of development but all I can remember is that she like Alata (which in sentai terms is meaningless.) You're right that Agri and Moune got nothing. If anything those two, who in theory were supposed to be strong like rocks, came off as being weaker than the Skyic rangers. Hyde was a perfectly serviceable blue but nothing to write home about, certainly the least fun blue of the last five seasons. I'm sorry, the episode devoted to Hyde's love of Dad Jokes disproves this. Also Moune and Agri both got development. Agri got multiple episodes of it (the farmer episode and the one where he befriends the racer, just off the top of my head) while Moune got the episode about her mother at bare minimum, plus a few "we're sibling" episodes
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Jul 6, 2014 19:51
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I... can't even remember any of that. I wanted to like Agri, I liked his look and like black rangers in general, but I don't think he did anything and his actions/effectiveness outside of focus episodes didn't match up with how he was portrayed in them. And its not Hyde's fault that they've been hitting it out of the park with blue rangers recently.
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Jul 6, 2014 21:28
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ImpAtom posted:I'm sorry, the episode devoted to Hyde's love of Dad Jokes disproves this. They had their own episodes. Everyone in every series does but the show failed to make me care about what happens to anyone but Alata
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Jul 6, 2014 21:55
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Cliff Racer posted:I... can't even remember any of that. I wanted to like Agri, I liked his look and like black rangers in general, but I don't think he did anything and his actions/effectiveness outside of focus episodes didn't match up with how he was portrayed in them. On one hand Agri's actor is legitimately terrible and really not good at his job. On the other hand: 
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Jul 6, 2014 22:21
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With the ToQGer mini album #2, Traindorks have surpassed Sambasaurs in music.
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Jul 8, 2014 22:35
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Cross posting this from the Gaim thread, for anyone who could use it. "OK, one quick thing to know about Kamen Rider Black- after the first two episodes, the head writer said screw this and left. This is not a joke about how aimless the first ten or so episodes are-this is the reason. The head writer, for some reason, felt like he was under too much pressure with this all and literally left. Meaning the show had no writer and no direction and it really kinda shows. Also just because something is filler doesn't mean it's BAD. It just has nothing to do with the plot. Black is a fantastic MOTW show, but that is hard to marathon. I am including some questionably filler things, most notably the Bike focus episodes because the bikes have cahracter-but those are important for the end game. You'll understand. Now onto the guide! 1 2 3 is optional but it shows Black in his first big real super hero moment. 5 is total filler but it has some fun atmosphere 7 Battle Hopper 12 ROADSECTOR 17 18 19 21 BATTLE HOPPER 25 ROADSECTOR 28 This requires a bit of explanation- this is technically filler, but it, at the end, changes the dynamic between Black and a certain villain, and pushes things towards the finale in a subtle way 34 35 36 37 44 is utter filler and not a great episode, but it more or less leads straight into the next one thematically. You can skip though 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 There ya go. Kamen Rider Black, distilled to 24 episodes. "
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Jul 8, 2014 22:46
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Burkion posted:Cross posting this from the Gaim thread, for anyone who could use it. Thank you very much, I'm working on Black right now and this should be very helpful to me. I know you've said you don't like it that much but do you think you could make a simmilar guide for RX?
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Jul 9, 2014 01:22
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The classic "he fell into the river" so I guess he's dead bit
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Jul 9, 2014 02:07
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Larryb posted:Thank you very much, I'm working on Black right now and this should be very helpful to me. I know you've said you don't like it that much but do you think you could make a simmilar guide for RX? Honestly? I can't promise it will be as good, because frankly I watched RX over the course of a few years, slowly working my way through, so I don't know it nearly as well, but I will try. 1 2 3 4 14 15 16 17 22 25? 26? 27 28 29 30 42 43 44 45 46 47 As far as I can tell, those 21 are the plot important episodes. May only be 19 though, 25 and 26 are only included because they're a two parter, but they don't actually advance the plot at ALL. Honestly the four parter of 14, 15, 16, and 17 are also SUPER insular and don't affect the greater plot either, except for introducing his new forms. Quick note on those- that four parter nearly gave me faith in RX because it was actually exciting and challenging for the hero and the stakes were super personal and they turned a close family member of his EVIL and he was trying to save them and then I realized, holy poo poo, this is just the plot of Black condensed into a four parter- and then the last episode poo poo the bed and rolled around in it and nothing of note was learned. Honestly and truthfully, most of these do not affect the plot in any serious way. RX is way more episodic than Black was, where even the episodes that seem to move the plot along really do not and never get brought up again. It's far more a MOTW story....only if you notice, lots of people praise Black for its MOTW stuff. Not so much RX.
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Jul 9, 2014 03:10
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Twistys Rapture posted:The classic "he fell into the river" so I guess he's dead bit One of these days someone in japan has to learn how to swim.
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Jul 9, 2014 03:23
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TerminusEst13 posted:One of these days someone in japan has to learn how to swim. Everyone can swim but everyone thinks no one else can
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Jul 9, 2014 03:35
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It's a shame that RX is apparently so bad, because I love its theme song.
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Jul 9, 2014 03:40
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